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#121
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Dave A. wrote:
It is only the FSS or DUATS weather report for that time that determines if you are legally allowed to be flying based on your restrictions, whatever they may be. I'd say it's the fact of the actual weather at the time and place that you are flying that determines whether you are legally allowed to be flying, regardless of what FSS or DUAT says. In some kind of legal proceeding, you might use the reports from FSS or DUAT to substantiate that the weather is/was what you say, but it's the actual weather conditions that determine whether your flying is legal. Dave |
#122
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In some kind of legal proceeding, you might use the reports from FSS or
DUAT to substantiate that the weather is/was what you say, but it's the actual weather conditions that determine whether your flying is legal. I agree, and I believe that is the point. I am told the reasons are anecdotal. Bear in mind that I am passing the standing of the instructors of my flight school. Lawyers and pilot advocates look at how the FAA rules and how the FAA interprets the regulations for those rules. Based on the history of FAA rulings (the sole interpreter and judge of such rules, similar to the FCC in authority) lawyers determine that the FAA does in fact consider the regulation to mean that a pilot is required to check with FSS or DUATS, give a tail number and use that interaction as proof in a legal proceeding. a random example I made up off the top of my head; You land VFR in less than 3 miles visibility. This alerts an FAA representative and he spot checks you for an IFR ticket. You have none. The only recourse you have is the FAA's weather reporting stations and did you check it. The local news forecast is of no use because you can't prove you checked it and it has no legal bearing on the situation even if you could prove it. So the wording may no be there but that is cold comfort when you have your license suspended with no recourse. -- Dave A Aging Student Pilot -I can gather all the news I need on the weather report- "Dave Butler" wrote in message news:1117119150.93476@sj-nntpcache-5... Dave A. wrote: It is only the FSS or DUATS weather report for that time that determines if you are legally allowed to be flying based on your restrictions, whatever they may be. I'd say it's the fact of the actual weather at the time and place that you are flying that determines whether you are legally allowed to be flying, regardless of what FSS or DUAT says. Dave |
#123
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"Dave A." wrote in message news:HEkle.274$zb.28@trndny02... We are taught for the Oral exam that the only way you can prove you took off into legal minimums for VFR flight is to obtain a weather briefing from the FSS or DUATS. How does FSS or DUATS know what the conditions are at the thousands of airports without weather reporting? It is only the FSS or DUATS weather report for that time that determines if you are legally allowed to be flying based on your restrictions, whatever they may be. Actual conditions outrank FSS or DUATS. Think about it. Your local tower or TV station might tell you the weather is one thing, but if the FSS says it isn't you could be in violation. I don't know what kind of documentation you are looking for, but I have been told that I will be wrong if I don't answer the question with the FAA examiner this way. -- Dave A Aging Student Pilot |
#124
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Actual conditions outrank FSS or DUATS. Think about it.
I did. Then I remembered lawyers. -- Dave A Aging Student Pilot -I can gather all the news I need on the weather report- "Dave Stadt" wrote in message ... "Dave A." wrote in message news:HEkle.274$zb.28@trndny02... We are taught for the Oral exam that the only way you can prove you took off into legal minimums for VFR flight is to obtain a weather briefing from the FSS or DUATS. How does FSS or DUATS know what the conditions are at the thousands of airports without weather reporting? It is only the FSS or DUATS weather report for that time that determines if you are legally allowed to be flying based on your restrictions, whatever they may be. Your local tower or TV station might tell you the weather is one thing, but if the FSS says it isn't you could be in violation. I don't know what kind of documentation you are looking for, but I have been told that I will be wrong if I don't answer the question with the FAA examiner this way. -- Dave A Aging Student Pilot |
#125
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"Dave A." wrote in message news:fcwle.3544$zb.3181@trndny01... Actual conditions outrank FSS or DUATS. Think about it. I did. Then I remembered lawyers. So you would launch if actual conditions were below minimums but FSS said things were OK. Interesting, but not condusive to a long life. -- Dave A Aging Student Pilot -I can gather all the news I need on the weather report- |
#126
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Dave Stadt wrote:
So you would launch if actual conditions were below minimums but FSS said things were OK. Interesting, but not condusive to a long life. I think he meant the other way 'round. When I was based at Kupper, the nearest reporting station was Newark. Newark's on the coast and frequently has IMC when Kupper is VFR. I remember an FAA inspector telling a safety meeting group that we were technically illegal if we flew VFR when EWR was IFR. I don't think any of us changed our habits as a result of that statement. I certainly didn't. George Patterson Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry, and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing? Because she smells like a new truck. |
#127
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In article x2xle.2405$Lb.1000@trndny05, George Patterson wrote:
Kupper is VFR. I remember an FAA inspector telling a safety meeting group that we were technically illegal if we flew VFR when EWR was IFR. I don't think any of us changed our habits as a result of that statement. I certainly didn't. Well, quite possibly because the FAA inspector was technically wrong. Whether you're legal VFR or not depends on the conditions at your point in space and time, not what some weather station several miles away might be reporting. Otherwise, the corollary of what the FAA inspector says is that you are technically LEGAL if it's 200 and 1/2 so long as EWR is reporting VFR. -- Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net "Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee" |
#128
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So you would launch if actual conditions were below minimums but FSS said
things were OK. Interesting, but not condusive to a long life. No no, other way around. -- Dave A Aging Student Pilot -I can gather all the news I need on the weather report- "Dave Stadt" wrote in message ... "Dave A." wrote in message news:fcwle.3544$zb.3181@trndny01... Actual conditions outrank FSS or DUATS. Think about it. I did. Then I remembered lawyers. -- Dave A Aging Student Pilot -I can gather all the news I need on the weather report- |
#129
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Well, quite possibly because the FAA inspector was technically wrong.
Whether you're legal VFR or not depends on the conditions at your point in space and time, not what some weather station several miles away might be reporting. The question was, what is a legal briefing and where is it stated in the regulations. If you take off in the conditions stated by George Patternson you are technically flying illegal. The philosophizing on the subject aside, all indications given by the FAA is that the FSS and DUATS weather and NOTAMS are your only proof should legal proceedings take place that you followed 91.103. Being that the FAA is the regulatory body, they will impose the fine based on their judgments. -- Dave A Aging Student Pilot -I can gather all the news I need on the weather report- "Dylan Smith" wrote in message ... In article x2xle.2405$Lb.1000@trndny05, George Patterson wrote: Kupper is VFR. I remember an FAA inspector telling a safety meeting group that we were technically illegal if we flew VFR when EWR was IFR. I don't think any of us changed our habits as a result of that statement. I certainly didn't. Otherwise, the corollary of what the FAA inspector says is that you are technically LEGAL if it's 200 and 1/2 so long as EWR is reporting VFR. -- Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net "Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee" |
#130
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"George Patterson" wrote in message
news:x2xle.2405$Lb.1000@trndny05... Dave Stadt wrote: So you would launch if actual conditions were below minimums but FSS said things were OK. Interesting, but not condusive to a long life. I think he meant the other way 'round. Thanks George, thought I was going crazy. -- Dave A Aging Student Pilot -I can gather all the news I need on the weather report- When I was based at Kupper, the nearest reporting station was Newark. Newark's on the coast and frequently has IMC when Kupper is VFR. I remember an FAA inspector telling a safety meeting group that we were technically illegal if we flew VFR when EWR was IFR. I don't think any of us changed our habits as a result of that statement. I certainly didn't. George Patterson Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry, and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing? Because she smells like a new truck. |
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