2008 Hawk Display Aircraft - 6592-W.jpg (1/1)

"RustY©" wrote in message
53...

Awesome low level shots. Did you get these yourself?

Wouldn't it be great if the Canadian Government actually bought some of
these aircraft for the Snowbirds? Currently, they are doing some sort of
leasing/sharing thing for training purposes but the Snowbirds soldier on
with obsolete aircraft not used by any other branch of the Canadian
military. GRRRR!!!!

Nick

"Canuck" wrote in message
...

"RustY©" wrote in message
53...

Awesome low level shots. Did you get these yourself?

Wouldn't it be great if the Canadian Government actually bought some of
these aircraft for the Snowbirds? Currently, they are doing some sort of
leasing/sharing thing for training purposes but the Snowbirds soldier on
with obsolete aircraft not used by any other branch of the Canadian
military. GRRRR!!!!

It's all a matter of cost-benefit analysis, airframe life and spares. The
aircraft is not obsolete, given that it fits its assigned role, sufficient
airframe life remains, as do necessary spares. The benefit derived from the
Snowbirds is questionable; their effect on recruitment has never been proven.
The people who say, "I wanted to join ever since I saw the Snowbirds as a
kid," would likely still join.

If Canada were to equip the Snowbirds with Hawks, they would be difficult to
distinguish from the Red Arrows.
--
Andrew Chaplin
SIT MIHI GLADIUS SICUT SANCTO MARTINO
(If you're going to e-mail me, you'll have to get "yourfinger." out.)

Andrew Chaplin wrote:
"Canuck" wrote in message
...
"RustY©" wrote in message
53...

Awesome low level shots. Did you get these yourself?

Wouldn't it be great if the Canadian Government actually bought some of
these aircraft for the Snowbirds? Currently, they are doing some sort of
leasing/sharing thing for training purposes but the Snowbirds soldier on
with obsolete aircraft not used by any other branch of the Canadian
military. GRRRR!!!!

It's all a matter of cost-benefit analysis, airframe life and spares. The
aircraft is not obsolete, given that it fits its assigned role, sufficient
airframe life remains, as do necessary spares. The benefit derived from the
Snowbirds is questionable; their effect on recruitment has never been proven.
The people who say, "I wanted to join ever since I saw the Snowbirds as a
kid," would likely still join.

If Canada were to equip the Snowbirds with Hawks, they would be difficult to
distinguish from the Red Arrows.

Why? They don't have to be painted red!

"Canuck" wrote in message
...

"RustY©" wrote in message
53...

Awesome low level shots. Did you get these yourself?

You must be new. He's been braving the Welsh hills (where men are men and
sheep are scared) for years to bring us these. ;-)


Wouldn't it be great if the Canadian Government actually bought some of
these aircraft for the Snowbirds? Currently, they are doing some sort of
leasing/sharing thing for training purposes but the Snowbirds soldier on
with obsolete aircraft not used by any other branch of the Canadian
military. GRRRR!!!!

Nick


It's a tricky one. Personally I never quite forgave the Red Arrows for
switching from the Gnat, as I found it a far more attractive aeroplane than
the Hawk.

"Andrew Chaplin" wrote in message
...
"Canuck" wrote in message
...

"RustY©" wrote in message
53...

Awesome low level shots. Did you get these yourself?

Wouldn't it be great if the Canadian Government actually bought some of
these aircraft for the Snowbirds? Currently, they are doing some sort of
leasing/sharing thing for training purposes but the Snowbirds soldier on
with obsolete aircraft not used by any other branch of the Canadian
military. GRRRR!!!!

It's all a matter of cost-benefit analysis, airframe life and spares. The
aircraft is not obsolete, given that it fits its assigned role, sufficient
airframe life remains, as do necessary spares. The benefit derived from
the Snowbirds is questionable; their effect on recruitment has never been
proven. The people who say, "I wanted to join ever since I saw the
Snowbirds as a kid," would likely still join.

Really? The airforce does not use the Tutor any longer for training
purposes. The airframe has been around for a very long time and should be
retired as soon as possible. If it wasn't good enough for training purposes,
how can it possibly be good enough for an aerobatic team? The benefit from
the Snowbirds is far from questionable. It is one of the few symbols of the
Canadian armed forces that all Canadians and people around the world can
identify. If I were making the decisions, I'd get some Hawks and hold a
national colour scheme contest and allow people to submit their own new
colour scheme for the Snowbirds. It would get people interested and excited
about being Canadian. We have far too few symbols which bind this nation
together.

If Canada were to equip the Snowbirds with Hawks, they would be difficult
to distinguish from the Red Arrows.

Hardly. The colour scheme would be different and the manouvers would be
different. How often have you seen the Red Arrows in Canada or the United
States? I've been going to air shows for years and have yet to see them
other than on a DVD. Just because they would fly the same aircraft does not
mean it would have an identical effect.

Nick

"Neil Hoskins" wrote in message
...
You must be new. He's been braving the Welsh hills (where men are men
and
sheep are scared) for years to bring us these. ;-)

Yeah, I'm a bit of a newbie on here. I've posted before and shared some of
my photos. Those photos are very impressive. I wonder if he has any Typhoon
shots of a similar quality.....

Wouldn't it be great if the Canadian Government actually bought some of
these aircraft for the Snowbirds? Currently, they are doing some sort of
leasing/sharing thing for training purposes but the Snowbirds soldier on
with obsolete aircraft not used by any other branch of the Canadian
military. GRRRR!!!!

Nick


It's a tricky one. Personally I never quite forgave the Red Arrows for
switching from the Gnat, as I found it a far more attractive aeroplane
than the Hawk.

People often have a soft spot for a particular aircraft and/or version of a
display team and it is difficult to accept the changes that occur. In the
case of the Snowbirds, the Tutor has served them well but I really do think
it is time to move on. Ultimately, it would be nice to see them in either
Hawks or to take those mothballed CF-18s out of storage and slap some paint
on them and get them back up and flying. I hate to see such a fine aircraft
rotting away.

Nick

Your Joking right?

Andrew Chaplin wrote:


If Canada were to equip the Snowbirds with Hawks, they would be difficult to
distinguish from the Red Arrows.

"Canuck" wrote in message
...


Those photos are very impressive. I wonder if he has any Typhoon
shots of a similar quality.....


These shots are not particularly good but it is a rare beast at low level.
One of the display aircraft took a bird a few years ago so now these are not
tasked for low level until after the show season. Typhoons are also quite
rare at l/l but I have posted a few. Today it was German tonkas - I'll post
those soon.

"Canuck" wrote in message
...

"Andrew Chaplin" wrote in message
...
"Canuck" wrote in message
...

"RustY©" wrote in message
53...

Awesome low level shots. Did you get these yourself?

Wouldn't it be great if the Canadian Government actually bought some of
these aircraft for the Snowbirds? Currently, they are doing some sort of
leasing/sharing thing for training purposes but the Snowbirds soldier on
with obsolete aircraft not used by any other branch of the Canadian
military. GRRRR!!!!

It's all a matter of cost-benefit analysis, airframe life and spares. The
aircraft is not obsolete, given that it fits its assigned role, sufficient
airframe life remains, as do necessary spares. The benefit derived from the
Snowbirds is questionable; their effect on recruitment has never been
proven. The people who say, "I wanted to join ever since I saw the
Snowbirds as a kid," would likely still join.

Really? The airforce does not use the Tutor any longer for training
purposes. The airframe has been around for a very long time and should be
retired as soon as possible.

Why? Your point isn't proven.

If it wasn't good enough for training purposes, how can it possibly be good
enough for an aerobatic team?

Because an aerobatic team's purpose is distinct from that of a training
system.

The benefit from the Snowbirds is far from questionable. It is one of the
few symbols of the Canadian armed forces that all Canadians and people
around the world can identify.

You are missing out on the idea of _benefit_!

If I were making the decisions, I'd get some Hawks and hold a national
colour scheme contest and allow people to submit their own new colour scheme
for the Snowbirds. It would get people interested and excited about being
Canadian. We have far too few symbols which bind this nation together.

If Canada were to equip the Snowbirds with Hawks, they would be difficult
to distinguish from the Red Arrows.

Hardly. The colour scheme would be different and the manouvers would be
different. How often have you seen the Red Arrows in Canada or the United
States? I've been going to air shows for years and have yet to see them
other than on a DVD. Just because they would fly the same aircraft does not
mean it would have an identical effect.

The aircraft is the basis of the show; it is the stage on which the pilots
perform. Paint scheme is irrelevant. To suggest that it matters is... well...
stupid.

You haven't shown any relevance in the Snowbird show that relates to the
current operational environment for CF pilots. What do Snowbirds do that
enhances operational capability? Quantify it!

Snowbirds are pretty, but they are militarily irrelevant -- useless, even.
**** 'em. Let's spend the fuel on CF-188 ops.

(Geez, Nick, have you ever been paid to wear a uniform, or are you a wannabe?)
--
Andrew Chaplin
Anti-Aircraft Artilleryman
(If you're going to e-mail me, you'll have to get "yourfinger." out.)