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#102
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#103
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From: (ArtKramr)
Date: 9/5/2004 7:10 PM Central Daylight Time Message-id: Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard? From: (B2431) Date: 9/5/2004 3:42 PM Pacific Standard Time Message-id: From: (ArtKramr) Date: 9/5/2004 2:26 PM Central Daylight Time Message-id: Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard? From: (BUFDRVR) Date: 9/5/2004 11:52 AM Pacific Standard Time Message-id: ArtKramr wrote: How come you didn't join the Marines and volunteer for the Pacific? The Army Air Corps was a tougher outift that took higher losses. When you joined this was not only uncertain, but being touted as highly unlikely, so don't give us this line of crap about joining because you knew where the toughest action was going to be. The USAAF may have taken more caualties in gross numbers, but the USMC in the Pacific had a much higher percentage rate. Do a google on Tarawa. BUFDRVR Get back to me after you have fought in a real war. You are all ****ed up. The Army AIr Corps had the highest percentage But you fought in neither the AAC or the Mairnes. so what the hell do you know about anything? . Arthur Kramer You weren't in the AAC either, art. It went out of business in 1941. You were in the USAAF. Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired Bull****. I have in front of me my report of separation of service dated 16 August 1946 and under Branch it is clearly marked Army Air Corps. Can't you get anything right? Arthur Kramer Maybe they did, but the USAAF was established 20 June 1941. http://www.af.mil/history/overview.asp Unless you want to say they are liars and neocons too. Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired |
#104
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How the Hell would you know Art - you obviously don't have any direct
experience with history books... Jack G. A very distant and impersonal route to knowledge. Arthur Kramer 344th BG 494th BS England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany Visit my WW II B-26 website at: http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer |
#105
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From: (ArtKramr)
Date: 9/5/2004 6:16 PM Central Daylight Time Message-id: Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard? From: (B2431) Date: 9/5/2004 3:41 PM Pacific Standard Time Message-id: From: (ArtKramr) Date: 9/5/2004 3:56 PM Central Daylight Time Message-id: Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard? From: "Kevin Brooks" Date: 9/5/2004 1:09 PM Pacific Standard Time Message-id: "George Z. Bush" wrote in message ... Jack G wrote: OK Art, tell that to a combat Marine - face to face. If all that happens is he asks you where you fought - and then laughs in your face when you tell him you will be a very lucky man. Jack G. Just for the record, Jack, during WWII, the 8th Air Force sustained more casualties over Europe than the entire United States Marine Corps did world-wide throughout the entire war. If you don't believe me, just ask Google the right questions and they'll provide the same answer that I just did....I know because I've already done it. You must have done it wrong. "Half of the U.S. Army Air Forces' casualties in World War II were suffered by Eighth Air Force (more than 47,000 casualties with more than 26,000 dead)." (http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...y/usaf/8af.htm ) USMC casualties for the war totalled some ninety thousand, out of some 669K who served in the USMC. Last I heard 90K was more than 47K. True, more 8th AF personnel *died* in combat than Marines, but that is not what you said. Your use of "casualty" is normally inclusive of wounded, deaths due to other than combat causes, and MIA. Brooks George Z. And exactly what is your combat experience wannabee? Marines? Air Corps? A desk in the states? Anything at all? Arthur Kramer I get it now, being a passenger on a B-26 makes you an expert on WW2 casualties and an expert on all things 8th AF? Get over yourself, art, the facts and figures in print are derived from official records. Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired The guys who wrote the records weren't there. And neither were you.. Arthur Kramer The guys who wrote the records WERE there. They were admin personnel is your unit and all the other units that served. Do you seriously suggest all the records, forms and documents that exist from those units were made up by people who weren't there? Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired |
#106
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From: (ArtKramr)
Date: 9/5/2004 6:14 PM Central Daylight Time Message-id: ubject: Why did Bush join the national guard? From: "Steven P. McNicoll" Date: 9/5/2004 3:33 PM Pacific Standard Time Message-id: et "ArtKramr" wrote in message ... It wasn't an opinion. Anybody that knows anything about the Martin B-26 knows it had the lowest loss rate. But don't take my word for it, look it up yourself. Any B-26 reference will show it. You are confusing losses in combat and losses in training. I'm not confusing anything. Obviously you're no expert on the B-26. Why, you're just a wannabe! Neocon logic. Arthur Kramer It's the same logic you use. Are you a neocon? Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired |
#107
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In article ,
(ArtKramr) writes: Subject: Why did Bush join the national guard? From: "Steven P. McNicoll" Date: 9/5/2004 2:47 PM Pacific Standard Time Message-id: et "Thomas J. Paladino Jr." wrote in message . .. And as far as I know, nobody was flying B26's during the Vietnam era. Well, not Martin B-26s. And the highest rate of killing its crews.One a day in Tampa Bay. The widowmaker, The B-dash-Crash.The flying Prostitute, The Flying Coffin. Got it now wannabee? Art, The Army Air Force Statistical Digest disagrees with you. While the Martin B-26 had the highest accident rate of any _Medium_ Bomber (Medium being the B-25, B-26, and the Lockheed B-34), it never approached the accident rate of the A-20, which had roughly twice teh number lost per 100,000 Flight Hours, and all of the various Fighter/Pursuit types. Those aren't subjective impressions - they're hard facts, backed up by the cold, unfeeling numbers. -- Pete Stickney A strong conviction that something must be done is the parent of many bad measures. -- Daniel Webster |
#108
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Why did you join the Army Air Corps instead of the infantry, Navy, Coast
Guard, or Marines? ArtKramr wrote: Why did Bush join the National Guard instrae do the Army, Navy or Air Force? why? Arthur Kramer 344th BG 494th BS England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany Visit my WW II B-26 website at: http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer |
#109
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"Bob Coe" wrote in message news:tVN_c.18423$ni.10541@okepread01... "ArtKramr" wrote Neocon logic. What's a neocon? Has he ever answered that? |
#110
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"Bob Coe" wrote in message news:bhO_c.18433$ni.15821@okepread01... "ArtKramr" wrote Everything about Bush is a non issue right? How about everything about Kerry? Also a non issue? You can't have it both ways. As far as their service to the country 35 years ago, yes, it's a non-issue, you are correct. It is of course a non issue. Or at least it should be. Unfortunately, Kerry chose to make his three months in Vietnam the foundation of his campaign, so here we are discussing things that have basically no bearing on todays world. I am far more interested in what Kerry did in the senate for the last 20 years, but I have yet to hear him mention that in any kind of detail even once. Kinda makes one think he has something to hide, no? |
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