Viable alternatives for serious aviation discussion

Mxsmanic wrote in
:

writes:

By the government.

By anyone. Freedom of speech is independent of the venue.

You're confusing laws that guarantee or eliminate freedom of speech
with the freedom itself.

You have no right to say anything to any individual or group of
individuals who don't wish to listen to you.

Oh yes, you do. They don't have to listen. If nobody had the right
to speak unless everyone else within earshot approved of what he said,
the world would be a very sad and bizarre place.

Your ability to "say" something facilited by privately owned
facilities, whether it be a supermarket bulletin board or an ISP, is
at the pleasure and discretion of the facilities owner.

If the owner provides the medium, yes. Many owners are strong
supporters of freedom of speech and will not interfere. In some
cases, non-interference also protects them legally.

You can rant all day on any subject you want in a public park, but
not in a mall parking lot if the mall owner doesn't want you there.

And if the mall owner doesn't care, you can rant all you want in the
parking lot, and other people have to hear you.


No, they don't.


Fjukkwit.


Bertie

Mxsmanic wrote in
:

Dudley Henriques writes:

Try standing in front of most anyone on this forum and saying "You
don't have the guts to slam me in the teeth". If you like I'll pick
out somebody for you.

Smart people don't want to go to prison, so I'd probably pick someone
smart.

You can spend years in prison for hitting someone; only very stupid
people disregard that risk.

No jury would convict them.



Bertie

Mxsmanic wrote in
:

Nomen Nescio writes:

Then you're living in the wrong country, Dip****.

There isn't any country that guarantees unfettered freedom of speech.
There just aren't enough people around who believe in the freedom that
strongly. Most are eager to enjoy freedom of speech themselves, but
extremely opposed to granting it to others with whom they
disagree--and often they cannot see the parallels between the two.


Nope, wrong.


Bertie

Mxsmanic wrote:
Dudley Henriques writes:

A great deal of what either makes a "driver" or a "pilot" depends
heavily on the initial CFI experience. I've had pilots come through my
aerobatic program with 20K hours who couldn't fly their way out of a
paper bag. Conversely, I've had comparatively low time pilots trained by
extremely good instructors who could fly the airplane while blowing up
the paper bag. Almost everything in flying is relative to that initial
training curve.

With large amounts of experience, the personality of the student is more
important than the influence of the instructor. Some people will continue to
learn on their own without any prodding, others will immediately stop learning
as soon as the instructor is gone and they've learned enough to do the job.

Sorry, this is incorrect. It's instruction 101 for the instructor to
evaluate and ascertain the personality of the student as the student's
personality will interface with their flying. If this is done correctly,
the student's "personality" is molded and/or changed as necessary to
develop into what is needed to have the student do exactly as you have
said they need to do after leaving the instructor; continuing the
learning process. That process exists for the "pilot" all through their
careers in aviation.
On the other hand, if the instructor fails to instill whatever
"personality" change is needed during the time of exposure with the
student, the student will become the "driver" we are discussing.

Either way, the responsibility lies with the instructor. The student is
the workpiece the instructor must complete.



--
Dudley Henriques

Mxsmanic wrote:
Dudley Henriques writes:

Obviously, moderated forums are not for you. I know a WHOLE lot of
people who will deeply appreciate that fact :-)

I can't recall ever encountering competent moderators, and incompetent ones
inevitably clash with me. I was not satisfied with my own performance as a
moderator, either (although I was better than the run of the mill), and I
didn't like the job.

Then Usenet is your best bet. Many people find it difficult to have
their input moderated. You are simply expressing a preference to which
you are entitled.

--
Dudley Henriques

Dudley Henriques wrote:
It's instruction 101 for the instructor to
evaluate and ascertain the personality of the student as the student's
personality will interface with their flying. If this is done
correctly, the student's "personality" is molded and/or changed as
necessary to develop into what is needed to have the student do
exactly as you have said they need to do after leaving the instructor;
continuing the learning process. That process exists for the "pilot"
all through their careers in aviation.
On the other hand, if the instructor fails to instill whatever
"personality" change is needed during the time of exposure with the
student, the student will become the "driver" we are discussing.

Hey - how did this on-topic subthread get in this thread!? I demand a
refund!

Anyway, you are probably correct, but I'm always a little suspicious of
anything that suggests changing of "personality". Sounds like a mistake
some people make when they get married. ;-)

Mxsmanic wrote:
Dudley Henriques writes:

Try standing in front of most anyone on this forum and saying "You don't
have the guts to slam me in the teeth". If you like I'll pick out
somebody for you.

Smart people don't want to go to prison, so I'd probably pick someone smart.

Remember, you aren't picking this person, I AM!! :-) You won't have any
idea what the reaction will be when you speak. This is what makes this
an experiment in the possible consequenses of exercising your "right" to
speak. In the experiment, you might very well get away with telling
someone they don't have the guts to slam you in the teeth.......but in
your case I wouldn't bet on it :-))

You can spend years in prison for hitting someone; only very stupid people
disregard that risk.

Happens every day my friend, and people get away with it every day.
Are you telling me you are willing to bet that I couldn't pick someone
from this forum to stand in front of you while you tell them they don't
have the guts to slam you in the chops? :-)

Instant example that there are consequences for total unrestrained
freedom of speech that might stay with you for awhile.

More like an example of how people resort to metaphors of violence when they
are angered by opinions that differ from their own. It's very common among
men, far less common among women.

Hardly. Simply an everyday example of possible consequences vs your
"right" to speak.


--
Dudley Henriques

Jim Logajan wrote:
Dudley Henriques wrote:
It's instruction 101 for the instructor to
evaluate and ascertain the personality of the student as the student's
personality will interface with their flying. If this is done
correctly, the student's "personality" is molded and/or changed as
necessary to develop into what is needed to have the student do
exactly as you have said they need to do after leaving the instructor;
continuing the learning process. That process exists for the "pilot"
all through their careers in aviation.
On the other hand, if the instructor fails to instill whatever
"personality" change is needed during the time of exposure with the
student, the student will become the "driver" we are discussing.

Hey - how did this on-topic subthread get in this thread!? I demand a
refund!

Anyway, you are probably correct, but I'm always a little suspicious of
anything that suggests changing of "personality". Sounds like a mistake
some people make when they get married. ;-)

You're right. We can't have aviation talk on this forum. Something will
have to be done :-))

That "personality change" is nothing more than the instilling in a
student of the proper habit patterns necessary to develop further into
an "attitude" about flying that will be conducive to the continuing
learning curve that must exist in a "pilot", but can be found to be
missing in an airplane "driver" as they say.
The development of this state of mind in a pilot is the direct
responsibility of the CFI and should be considered job one for the
instructor.

--
Dudley Henriques

Jim Logajan wrote:
Dudley Henriques wrote:
It's instruction 101 for the instructor to
evaluate and ascertain the personality of the student as the student's
personality will interface with their flying. If this is done
correctly, the student's "personality" is molded and/or changed as
necessary to develop into what is needed to have the student do
exactly as you have said they need to do after leaving the instructor;
continuing the learning process. That process exists for the "pilot"
all through their careers in aviation.
On the other hand, if the instructor fails to instill whatever
"personality" change is needed during the time of exposure with the
student, the student will become the "driver" we are discussing.

Hey - how did this on-topic subthread get in this thread!? I demand a
refund!

Anyway, you are probably correct, but I'm always a little suspicious of
anything that suggests changing of "personality". Sounds like a mistake
some people make when they get married. ;-)

I have to agree "personality" is a **** poor choice of words.

"Attitude towards learning" is the shortest I can think of that might
be more appropriate.


--
Jim Pennino

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Mxsmanic wrote:
writes:

By the government.

By anyone. Freedom of speech is independent of the venue.

You're confusing laws that guarantee or eliminate freedom of speech with the
freedom itself.

Without laws you have mob rule and there is no freedom for anyone other
than the leader of the mob.

You have no right to say anything to any individual or group of
individuals who don't wish to listen to you.

Oh yes, you do. They don't have to listen. If nobody had the right to speak
unless everyone else within earshot approved of what he said, the world would
be a very sad and bizarre place.

That is NOT what I said.

Try going into the nearest church and making a speech about the insanity
of religion and see how far you get.


--
Jim Pennino

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