40,000 Plus Hits. Thank you all.

In article ,
Mike Marron writes:
(Longtailedlizard) wrote:

Mike,
If I may offer why I don't think "Art" and "Auto" are not, one and the same,
First off, I'm a regular reader but not much of a participant. I enjoy
reading the different posts, offering many different veiwpoints and opinions.
"Art" has been posting here for some years now, although I don't agree with
him at times, I enjoy reading about his life and times at war.
Many WWII veterans are departing us, its not only important for US history
but World history to hear it first hand from someone who was there. I knew many
WWII veterans, most are departed, including dad and my uncle. But like most
WWII veterans, they never talked about it, most I heard was from mom, "daddy
seen alot of bad stuff", or yes or no answers from dad and uncle themselves.
Its only "after" its to late do you hear about what they did or what
happened.
How many times I picked up the paper only to read so and so passed away, and a
"oh! wow" I did'nt know he was a paratooper, Marine, gunner aboard the Gamblier
Bay, etc, etc.
Also, these are old men, technology is sometimes daunting to them. I remember
writing down specific instructions on how to turn on the computer, do this, do
that, just so they could download e-mails with pictures of there grandchildren.
Art is one of the very few, that not only talks about it, but maintains his
own webpage.
Art is extremely pround of what he has done, and rightfully so. And anybody
that has been apart of this newsgroup, has to admit that, lets face it, if you
don't agree with Art, things seem to turn south real quick. Art is very
opinionated, pretty much, that if you have'nt flown in WWII, the soldiers,
sailors, Marines, infantrymen, gunners, submariners, cooks, supply personnel,
etc, etc, etc, aren't worthy somehow.
But anyway, no big deal, we all have faults.
So!!, to offer my proof that Art and Auto are not the same, Auto replied:

Your stuff is the most interesting on this NG. You can't beat being there no
matter what. I look for your posts every time I log on. Keep 'em flying.

Mike, KEEP 'EM FLYING, is strictly and aircraft mechanics saying, no way in
God's green earth would Art ever stoop slow low as to quote the saying of a
lowlife, yellow, uneducated enlisted aircraft mechanics qoute or as Art calls
them Poogies or something like that.

Great post Liz, much appreciated! This is the one and only RATIONAL
response I've read yet, however, perhaps we should give Kramer a bit
of credit where credit's due here. In other words, simply because he
used a mechanic's saying (e.g: "keep 'em flying") doesn't mean squat.
He may have utilized the saying just to help furthur disguise himself
precisely for the reasons you so astutely pointed out (e.g: make it
seem like "Autocollimator" is some "low life yellow, uneducated
enlisted aircraft mechanic" ain't him).

Mike - You're really getting more than a bit thin here.
Next thing you know, you'll be rattling a pair of Ball Bearings in
your hand, reliving the Cheese Incident, and proving, by Geometric
Logic, that the Messboys didn't eat the strawberries.

Are we ging to have to refer to you a "Old Yellowstain?"

Odd thread tie-in here - The Caine Mutiny Court Martial scenes had,
as one of the principal characters, a Pilot acting as a JAG Officer.
A story so twisted, it could only have been written by Art Kramer...
of Herman Wouk.
(Hmm. Maybe Art is actually Herman Wouk? We know he's not Joe Heller
- They've been seen in the same place at the same time.)

--
Pete Stickney
A strong conviction that something must be done is the parent of many
bad measures. -- Daniel Webster

(Peter Stickney) wrote:

But that's just his online persona - who knows what he (or any of us) are
in real life.

Exactly right. Based on your online persona, you would most definitely
would NOT be on my short list of candidates to fly an IFR approach
with OR plop an ultralight down onto a helicopter landing pad (much
less fly into combat!) Stick to posting aviation stats and figures on
RAM, Pete. Everything else is beneath ya.

"Mike Marron" wrote in message
...
(ArtKramr) wrote:
"Dudley Henriques" wrote:

I'll let you in on a little secret. If there's ANYTHING at all that
people
in professional aviation, especially military aviation, covet more than
picking the people with whom they choose to drink, I don't know what the
hell it might be!!

Lemme let YOU in on a little secret, Dud. Like I told ya' before the
REAL military aviators I've drank with would just as soon kick your
*phony* ass as get up in the morning.

Well , all I can say to this is that I'm certainly glad these "military
aviators" you're talking about aren't among the hundreds of Air Force, Navy,
Marine, and Civilian Test Pilots I deal with all year long. But then again,
no one, not even you, can expect to be liked and respected by
everyone...........can they Mike? :-)))
I'll just have to settle for what little "respect" I've managed to conger up
for myself through the years if it's ok with you.
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/ CFI Retired
For personal email, please replace
the z's with e's.
dhenriquesATzarthlinkDOTnzt

"Dudley Henriques" wrote:
"Mike Marron" wrote:

Lemme let YOU in on a little secret, Dud. Like I told ya' before the
REAL military aviators I've drank with would just as soon kick your
*phony* ass as get up in the morning.

Well , all I can say to this is that I'm certainly glad these "military
aviators" you're talking about aren't among the hundreds of Air Force, Navy,
Marine, and Civilian Test Pilots I deal with all year long.

Huh? I thought you said that you were retired? Damn, just when
you almost had me convinced that "Autocollimator" wasn't Kramer
afterall!

But then again, no one, not even you, can expect to be liked and
respected by everyone...........can they Mike? :-)))

Don't get me wrong, Dud. I do envy ya' your peacetime test-pilot
experience in high performance fighters and all that. It's just that
you and 99-percent of the most prolific posters on this happy group
assembled ("Autocollimator" included!) don't have the first clue
nor do you give a **** how actual combat kinda' royally ****s things
up forever thereafter.

I'll just have to settle for what little "respect" I've managed to conger up
for myself through the years if it's ok with you.

Fine by me, Dud. Ya' don't have to be a combat experienced fighter
pilot to gain my repect. The greatest compliment I've ever gotten was
from a self-employed ground courier whom witnessed me grease one
in at JAX just 10-minutes after the previous guy augered in killing
himself and all passengers onboard. Respect is a 2-way thing: you
respect me and I'll respect you, OK?

Lemme let YOU in on a little secret, Dud. Like I told ya' before the
REAL military aviators I've drank with would just as soon kick your
*phony* ass as get up in the morning.

Telling statement there as well, Mike. Your audience is dwindling, fast.

Gordon

nt (Gordon) wrote:
Mike Marron wrote:

Lemme let YOU in on a little secret, Dud. Like I told ya' before the
REAL military aviators I've drank with would just as soon kick your
*phony* ass as get up in the morning.

Telling statement there as well, Mike. Your audience is dwindling, fast.

Frankly, Scarlett....

Subject: 40,000 Plus Hits. Thank you all.
From: (Peter Stickney)
Date: 11/1/03 4:36 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

In article ,
Mike Marron writes:
(Longtailedlizard) wrote:

Mike,
If I may offer why I don't think "Art" and "Auto" are not, one and the
same,
First off, I'm a regular reader but not much of a participant. I enjoy
reading the different posts, offering many different veiwpoints and
opinions.
"Art" has been posting here for some years now, although I don't agree
with
him at times, I enjoy reading about his life and times at war.
Many WWII veterans are departing us, its not only important for US
history
but World history to hear it first hand from someone who was there. I knew
many
WWII veterans, most are departed, including dad and my uncle. But like most
WWII veterans, they never talked about it, most I heard was from mom,
"daddy
seen alot of bad stuff", or yes or no answers from dad and uncle
themselves.
Its only "after" its to late do you hear about what they did or what
happened.
How many times I picked up the paper only to read so and so passed away,
and a
"oh! wow" I did'nt know he was a paratooper, Marine, gunner aboard the
Gamblier
Bay, etc, etc.
Also, these are old men, technology is sometimes daunting to them. I
remember
writing down specific instructions on how to turn on the computer, do this,
do
that, just so they could download e-mails with pictures of there
grandchildren.
Art is one of the very few, that not only talks about it, but maintains
his
own webpage.
Art is extremely pround of what he has done, and rightfully so. And
anybody
that has been apart of this newsgroup, has to admit that, lets face it, if
you
don't agree with Art, things seem to turn south real quick. Art is very
opinionated, pretty much, that if you have'nt flown in WWII, the soldiers,
sailors, Marines, infantrymen, gunners, submariners, cooks, supply
personnel,
etc, etc, etc, aren't worthy somehow.
But anyway, no big deal, we all have faults.
So!!, to offer my proof that Art and Auto are not the same, Auto replied:

Your stuff is the most interesting on this NG. You can't beat being there
no
matter what. I look for your posts every time I log on. Keep 'em flying.

Mike, KEEP 'EM FLYING, is strictly and aircraft mechanics saying, no way in
God's green earth would Art ever stoop slow low as to quote the saying of a
lowlife, yellow, uneducated enlisted aircraft mechanics qoute or as Art
calls
them Poogies or something like that.

Great post Liz, much appreciated! This is the one and only RATIONAL
response I've read yet, however, perhaps we should give Kramer a bit
of credit where credit's due here. In other words, simply because he
used a mechanic's saying (e.g: "keep 'em flying") doesn't mean squat.
He may have utilized the saying just to help furthur disguise himself
precisely for the reasons you so astutely pointed out (e.g: make it
seem like "Autocollimator" is some "low life yellow, uneducated
enlisted aircraft mechanic" ain't him).

Mike - You're really getting more than a bit thin here.
Next thing you know, you'll be rattling a pair of Ball Bearings in
your hand, reliving the Cheese Incident, and proving, by Geometric
Logic, that the Messboys didn't eat the strawberries.

Are we ging to have to refer to you a "Old Yellowstain?"

Odd thread tie-in here - The Caine Mutiny Court Martial scenes had,
as one of the principal characters, a Pilot acting as a JAG Officer.
A story so twisted, it could only have been written by Art Kramer...
of Herman Wouk.
(Hmm. Maybe Art is actually Herman Wouk? We know he's not Joe Heller
- They've been seen in the same place at the same time.)

--
Pete Stickney

Yes we have.(grin)

Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

(Peter Stickney) wrote:

Mike - You're really getting more than a bit thin here.

Er um, let's play "Where in the World is Carmen San Diego"
eg: (substitute "Autocollimator" for "Carmen San Diego"
if you wish).

If Art uses a sock puppet, its his choice. If he does, I see it as an online
kink (small 'K') that would make me shake my head, and not anything close to
the behavior Mike has been displaying since he started posting here. I am not
on Art's Christmas list, but the two of us respect each other enough to not
spend outrageous amounts of time wasting bandwidth doing nothing but ****ing
each other (and regular posters) off. Art and other military posters in this
newsgroup are here generally to share memories or clean up small details that
we have direct knowledge about: ego gets into it sometimes but thats not why
we're here. I come here to learn and discuss military aviation topics and
instead, I get to read your non-military personal attacks and daily attempts to
belittle just about everyone. You wrote to Peter, saying you'd show respect to
him if he did the same. What do you want us all to do, in exchange for you
stopping your insults?

Gordon

In article ,
Mike Marron writes:
(Peter Stickney) wrote:

But that's just his online persona - who knows what he (or any of us) are
in real life.

Exactly right. Based on your online persona, you would most definitely
would NOT be on my short list of candidates to fly an IFR approach
with OR plop an ultralight down onto a helicopter landing pad (much
less fly into combat!) Stick to posting aviation stats and figures on
RAM, Pete. Everything else is beneath ya.

I don't get into Boasting Games, sport. If I were you, my posts would
be full of being conceived in a J-3 Cub, Soloing at 14, learning
mountain flying in some of the most unpredictable weather in the world
- you Floridians have absolutely no idea - looking at the Earth's
curvature from 50,000', or watching the jump-up on the Airspeed/Mach
Indicator as the shockwave formed. Or spending 4 hours above 35,000',
watching a strong Aurora Borealis play along the entire Northern
Horizon. Or the incredible greenness of North America after a year in
the Stinking Desert. Of feeling the heavy feel, but crisp reponse of the
De Havilland Vampire, or the instant response of the SGS 1-26, the
concnetration and precision needed to get the best out of an Mu-2.
Yeah, I don't fly much any more - UV at high altitude roasts your
eyes, and for some of us with the right genes, you've got screwed up
eyes for the rest of your life. I've managed to have some great
experiences, though. I've had the pleaser of being shot at and
shooting back, of flying an airplane faster than sound, of going to
exotic places to do dangerous things, and, best of all, holding my
newborn daughter in my arms.

But, you see, I'm not anything special, in that regard. nor have I
really done any great things. But I know folks who have, and I'm glad
to sit and listen to them any time.

--
Pete Stickney
A strong conviction that something must be done is the parent of many
bad measures. -- Daniel Webster