Implications of.....keeping the speed up

So let's say I'm inbound to Teterboro from the west, doing 250 kias
below 10,000 in descent. Atc gives me a radar vector, and clears me
to maintain 4000 feet.

1, Do I need to slow to 200 kias at some time?

2. I'm considering that I may well be less than 3000 feet AGL (or is
2500 the magic number?). Does this have any bearing?

3. Do I need to worry about being underneath a class B, and thus have
a 200 kias speed limit? Or does atc somehow take care of this for me.

Thanks for all inputs. Stan

On 01/04/07 13:40, wrote:
So let's say I'm inbound to Teterboro from the west, doing 250 kias
below 10,000 in descent. Atc gives me a radar vector, and clears me
to maintain 4000 feet.

1, Do I need to slow to 200 kias at some time?

2. I'm considering that I may well be less than 3000 feet AGL (or is
2500 the magic number?). Does this have any bearing?

3. Do I need to worry about being underneath a class B, and thus have
a 200 kias speed limit? Or does atc somehow take care of this for me.

Thanks for all inputs. Stan


The FARs spell out the speed limits. Are you asking what they say, or
are you asking if you can violate the FARs if ATC asks you to maintain
your speed?

In article ,
wrote:

So let's say I'm inbound to Teterboro from the west, doing 250 kias
below 10,000 in descent. Atc gives me a radar vector, and clears me
to maintain 4000 feet.

1, Do I need to slow to 200 kias at some time?

Almost certainly, yes, at some point prior to when you flare :-)

I suspect you're thinking of the restrictions imposed by 14 CFR 91.117. It
imposes three basic speed limits:

A) 250 KIAS below 10,000 MSL

B) 200 KIAS below 2500 AGL or within 4 NM of a Class C or D airport.

C) 200 KIAS beneath Class B airspace.

A requires the administrator to waive. B requires ATC to waive. C is
non-waivable. Minimum safe airspeed trumps all those. That's usually only
a factor for a heavy jet right after takeoff.

In your case, B is probably what applies. If you want to exceed 20 KIAS,
make a request of the controller.

On Thu, 04 Jan 2007 18:57:19 -0500, Roy Smith wrote:

If you want to exceed 20 KIAS,
make a request of the controller.

Generally in the form of "Request takeoff, departure to..."

Thanks Roy. I don't have a US licence, so hence my questions. My
thoughts we

200 below class B. So will atc vector me below class B, possibly? In
which case, do pilots normally have a class B airspace chart out, tune
in the EWR VOR, and carefully monitor radials, dme's, altitudes, in
order to slow to 200 prior to being under class B? Somehow, I don't
think most actually do this.

250 below 2500 agl within 4 nm of C or D. Again, does anyone monitor
a low level chart and crosscheck their radial/dme with local vor's in
order to ascertain whether they meet this criteria? Again, I think
most of us are starting to tune in the localizer at this point.

Secondly, if this is reference the elevation of the primary airport,
who really continuously looks up airport elevations as they go (and
airports may be 3 or 4000 msl west of Teb in the appalachians I
presume) adds 2500, and ensures they are above this altitude.
Further, if I'm descended early into TEB, as expected for an arrival
into the NE, and am at 6000 msl 60 miles to the west, is atc really
expecting a sudden decrease to 200 this far out? Somehow I'd expect a

"CFxxx say speed, ...and this aint Dallas so pick it back up to 250
please"

So I guess I'm asking, what would you use in a situation like this to
decide when to slow to 200?

..On Thu, 04 Jan 2007 18:57:19 -0500, Roy Smith wrote:

In article ,
wrote:

So let's say I'm inbound to Teterboro from the west, doing 250 kias
below 10,000 in descent. Atc gives me a radar vector, and clears me
to maintain 4000 feet.

1, Do I need to slow to 200 kias at some time?

Almost certainly, yes, at some point prior to when you flare :-)

I suspect you're thinking of the restrictions imposed by 14 CFR 91.117. It
imposes three basic speed limits:

A) 250 KIAS below 10,000 MSL

B) 200 KIAS below 2500 AGL or within 4 NM of a Class C or D airport.

C) 200 KIAS beneath Class B airspace.

A requires the administrator to waive. B requires ATC to waive. C is
non-waivable. Minimum safe airspeed trumps all those. That's usually only
a factor for a heavy jet right after takeoff.

In your case, B is probably what applies. If you want to exceed 20 KIAS,
make a request of the controller.

"Roy Smith" wrote in message
...

B) 200 KIAS below 2500 AGL or within 4 NM of a Class C or D airport.


Slight correction...... delete the word "or".

writes:

In which case, do pilots normally have a class B airspace chart out, tune
in the EWR VOR, and carefully monitor radials, dme's, altitudes, in
order to slow to 200 prior to being under class B? Somehow, I don't
think most actually do this.

If you have RNAV capability and moving maps (like a GPS unit), you
don't need to, since your instruments will show you the controlled
airspaces and tell you if you are within them. If you don't have
that, you might or might not have time to check in real time, but you
certainly need to know whether or not you're in Class B, for example.
You can also plan your flight in advance and check all of these
details so that you will know where you are at all times without
having to check charts in flight. If you have no idea at all how
close you are to controlled airspace, you need to work on your
navigation and planning skills before you go anywhere near airports of
significant size.

250 below 2500 agl within 4 nm of C or D. Again, does anyone monitor
a low level chart and crosscheck their radial/dme with local vor's in
order to ascertain whether they meet this criteria? Again, I think
most of us are starting to tune in the localizer at this point.

You might well be flying below that altitude in some cases without
necessarily being on an approach for landing, albeit probably not in a
757.

Also, if you're preparing to intercept a localizer, you're already
slowing down considerably, and in many cases below 200 kts. Even
heavy jet aircraft can stay below 200 kts with flaps.

Secondly, if this is reference the elevation of the primary airport,
who really continuously looks up airport elevations as they go (and
airports may be 3 or 4000 msl west of Teb in the appalachians I
presume) adds 2500, and ensures they are above this altitude.

It's above the ground below you. And some areas are quite flat. And
you may have a radar altimeter that lets you know how far you are
above the ground. If you are VFR, you may be able to judge your
altitude well enough by visual means alone.

Further, if I'm descended early into TEB, as expected for an arrival
into the NE, and am at 6000 msl 60 miles to the west, is atc really
expecting a sudden decrease to 200 this far out?

Why would it be sudden? If it comes as a surprise to you while you
are flying along, there's something wrong. And if you are flying below
2500 AGL, you're probably either in the military or you have a small
plane that can't do much better than 200 kts, anyway. If you are
below Class B, you're pretty close to a major airport (much closer
than 60 nm). Also, since Class B normally extends only to 10,000, the
space below it is rarely more than a few thousand feet high, so you're
no more likely to be below it than you are to be at 2500 AGL. Unless
you're in a small plane that flies at these altitudes normally, of
course.

So I guess I'm asking, what would you use in a situation like this to
decide when to slow to 200?

Your position and altitude, which you should always know with a fair
degree of accuracy.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

wrote:
So let's say I'm inbound to Teterboro from the west, doing 250 kias
below 10,000 in descent. Atc gives me a radar vector, and clears me
to maintain 4000 feet.

1, Do I need to slow to 200 kias at some time?

2. I'm considering that I may well be less than 3000 feet AGL (or is
2500 the magic number?). Does this have any bearing?

3. Do I need to worry about being underneath a class B, and thus have
a 200 kias speed limit? Or does atc somehow take care of this for me.

Does it seem odd that a guy flying something doing 250 knots is asking
about basic FARs?
-Robert

Robert M. Gary writes:

Does it seem odd that a guy flying something doing 250 knots is asking
about basic FARs?

I think it better for him to ask than to roll dice.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

Mxsmanic wrote:

Robert M. Gary writes:


Does it seem odd that a guy flying something doing 250 knots is asking
about basic FARs?


I think it better for him to ask than to roll dice.

It would be better to do neither.