Avoid head-on collision? Forward facing LED strobe?

So how many of us have flown along close to cloudbase under a cloud street, and suddenly seen another glider pass us on the opposite heading?

It's obviously hard to see a glider that is coming straight at you.

So what about a narrow beam LED strobe aligned with the glide path vector... would the other glider see it? Would it be legal? Could you shine it through the canopy with a baffle to block internal reflections?

Has anyone done this?

I once saw another glider coming towards me on a ridge with wing tip strobes. It really got my attention and in plenty of time. So I kinda think that this would work.

LED strobe may be a good idea.
FLARM is good at the head on case.
Tom



At 00:14 25 July 2012, son_of_flubber wrote:
So how many of us have flown along close to cloudbase under a cloud
street,
and suddenly seen another glider pass us on the opposite heading?

It's obviously hard to see a glider that is coming straight at you.

So what about a narrow beam LED strobe aligned with the glide path
vector... would the other glider see it? Would it be legal? Could you
shine it through the canopy with a baffle to block internal reflections?

Has anyone done this?

I once saw another glider coming towards me on a ridge with wing tip
strobes. It really got my attention and in plenty of time. So I kinda
think that this would work.

On 7/24/2012 8:55 PM, Tom Claffey wrote:
LED strobe may be a good idea.
FLARM is good at the head on case.
Tom

It's my understanding that head-on collisions are very small part of the
mid-air collisions; if so, the narrow beam strobe won't make much
difference. Flarm finds the gliders coming from all sides, the ones you
can't see before they hit you.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to
email me)
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm
http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation Mar/2004" Much of what
you need to know tinyurl.com/yfs7tnz

FLARM tells you that there is another glider. It does not really
tell you where it is - you need to look and find it. Week ago I got
FLARM warning, without seeing the another plane.

LED strobe is not a bad idea. Compared to FLARM the cost is
very small, and installation easy. If you have LED strobe, all
other planes will see you, not only those with FLARM.

At 04:18 25 July 2012, Eric Greenwell wrote:
On 7/24/2012 8:55 PM, Tom Claffey wrote:
LED strobe may be a good idea.
FLARM is good at the head on case.
Tom

It's my understanding that head-on collisions are very small
part of the
mid-air collisions; if so, the narrow beam strobe won't make
much
difference. Flarm finds the gliders coming from all sides, the
ones you
can't see before they hit you.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to
".us" to
email me)
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS,
Flarm
http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation Mar/2004"
Much of what
you need to know tinyurl.com/yfs7tnz

Am 25.07.2012 02:14, son_of_flubber wrote:
So how many of us have flown along close to cloudbase under a cloud street, and suddenly seen another glider pass us on the opposite heading?

It's obviously hard to see a glider that is coming straight at you.

So what about a narrow beam LED strobe aligned with the glide path vector... would the other glider see it? Would it be legal? Could you shine it through the canopy with a baffle to block internal reflections?

Has anyone done this?

I once saw another glider coming towards me on a ridge with wing tip strobes. It really got my attention and in plenty of time. So I kinda think that this would work.


Good idea, several solutions exist, partly professional, partly home
made. A few links:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=VRkcJjKEdKE

A solution like this can be integrated into the fin (done at
Schleicher), the additional price will be around 1200 EURO. One glider
at our airport is equipped with this, visibility is excellent.
------------------

http://www.irl-shop.de/advanced_sear...e7f4f&x=15&y=5

This is much cheaper, and can be attached quite easily to any glider.
-------------------------

http://forum.segelflug.de/attachment...d=13 40716667

There was a discussion in the segelflug.de forum some time ago, this is
a selfmade solution from Wolfgang Schmidt.
---------------------

If you run this all day in flash mode, you'll probably need an extra
battery.
--
Peter Scholz
ASW24 JE

At 08:14 25 July 2012, Kimmo Hytoenen wrote:
FLARM tells you that there is another glider. It does not really
tell you where it is - you need to look and find it. Week ago I got
FLARM warning, without seeing the another plane.

Kimmo,

It does if you have the right equipment and set it up properly. LX8000 /
9000 with voice shows you and tells you where the other glider is.

Link your Flarm to any navigation display, for example LK8000, you can
maintain awareness of other gliders and will have a vey good idea where to
look if a glider triggers a warning. This works very much better than the
standard Flarm display, and IMO better than the various Flarm analogue
displays (though I have one fitted as belt and braces).

Mike

At 10:11 25 July 2012, Michael Clarke wrote:
At 08:14 25 July 2012, Kimmo Hytoenen wrote:
FLARM tells you that there is another glider. It does not
really
tell you where it is - you need to look and find it. Week ago I
got
FLARM warning, without seeing the another plane.

Kimmo,

It does if you have the right equipment and set it up properly.
LX8000 /
9000 with voice shows you and tells you where the other glider
is.

Link your Flarm to any navigation display, for example LK8000,
you can
maintain awareness of other gliders and will have a vey good
idea where to
look if a glider triggers a warning. This works very much better
than the
standard Flarm display, and IMO better than the various Flarm
analogue
displays (though I have one fitted as belt and braces).

Mike



I agree Mike. Therefore I was involved in development of
Soartronic devices, to make FLARM / PDA connections easy &
low cost. Voice warning might be a good idea, but transferring
information takes time?
FLARM systems seem to have blind points. I would like to have a
system, that helps maintaining awareness of nearby planes,
even when FLARM signal is temporally lost. LK8000 seems to
have some fresh ideas.

At 10:11 25 July 2012, Michael Clarke wrote:
At 08:14 25 July 2012, Kimmo Hytoenen wrote:
FLARM tells you that there is another glider. It does not
really
tell you where it is - you need to look and find it. Week ago I
got
FLARM warning, without seeing the another plane.

Kimmo,

It does if you have the right equipment and set it up properly.
LX8000 /
9000 with voice shows you and tells you where the other glider
is.

Link your Flarm to any navigation display, for example LK8000,
you can
maintain awareness of other gliders and will have a vey good
idea where to
look if a glider triggers a warning. This works very much better
than the
standard Flarm display, and IMO better than the various Flarm
analogue
displays (though I have one fitted as belt and braces).

Mike



I agree Mike. Therefore I was involved in development of
Soartronic devices, to make FLARM / PDA connections easy &
low cost. Voice warning might be a good idea, but transferring
information takes time?
FLARM systems seem to have blind points. I would like to have a
system, that helps maintaining awareness of nearby planes,
even when FLARM signal is temporally lost. LK8000 seems to
have some fresh ideas.

On Wednesday, July 25, 2012 12:18:02 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:

It's my understanding that head-on collisions are very small part of the
mid-air collisions;

If you aggregate all pilots and all collisions, that's true.

As a rule, I avoid gaggles and crowded landing patterns. But I share the short local ridge and the cloud streets near the airport and I've had several head-on fly-bys.

Universal PowerFlarm is a much better solution.

At 11:28 25 July 2012, Kimmo Hytoenen wrote:
At 10:11 25 July 2012, Michael Clarke wrote:
At 08:14 25 July 2012, Kimmo Hytoenen wrote:
FLARM tells you that there is another glider. It does not
really
tell you where it is - you need to look and find it. Week ago I
got
FLARM warning, without seeing the another plane.

Kimmo,

It does if you have the right equipment and set it up properly.
LX8000 /
9000 with voice shows you and tells you where the other glider
is.

Link your Flarm to any navigation display, for example LK8000,
you can
maintain awareness of other gliders and will have a vey good
idea where to
look if a glider triggers a warning. This works very much better
than the
standard Flarm display, and IMO better than the various Flarm
analogue
displays (though I have one fitted as belt and braces).

Mike



I agree Mike. Therefore I was involved in development of
Soartronic devices, to make FLARM / PDA connections easy &
low cost. Voice warning might be a good idea, but transferring
information takes time?
FLARM systems seem to have blind points. I would like to have a
system, that helps maintaining awareness of nearby planes,
even when FLARM signal is temporally lost. LK8000 seems to
have some fresh ideas.



Flarm blind spots are mostly about the aerial placement: you will not see
anyone directly below or above due to signals not going through fuselage.
It works well on the head on case. With the above/below blindspot you would
have been alerted earlier as the other glider approached out of blindspot.
They are not perfect and need to be used along with good lookout. With
Flarm you get a directed lookout which is very effective.
Mandatory Flarm in comps and preferably in all gliders/tugs is a small
price to pay for the increased safety, but : YOU STILL NEED TO LOOK OUT!
Tom