Owner Change/rotate spark plugs?

I just did a google search on the subject of copper annealing, and I
found this article.

http://www.evergreengardenworks.com/copperwi.htm

I can say that I used to rebuild motorcycle engines, and most of them
had solid copper head gaskets. I would anneal them by heating to red
hot and then dropping in a water bucket. They seemed to be much softer
afterward and did not leak so I guess that is a proper way to do it
(whatever works, right?). According to the article, you can use either
method, but he recommends water quenchung to minimize oxidation.

Regards,
Bruce Cunningham
N30464 C177A

("Jürgen Exner" wrote)
Oh, please, for the love of God, don't do this. This is how you
HARDEN them, not soften them for the annealing process. Heat them
red hot with a torch and let them cool in ambient air to soften them.

Well, I guess this depends upon if your gaskets are made of copper or of
iron/steal.
Although, I've never seen gaskets made of iron but of course nothing is
impossible.


Saw this link after a few Googles.
It shows that others have had this same discussion.

http://www.steamengine.com.au/ic/faq...ng-copper.html
It made into their FAQ's :-)


Montblack

John Clonts wrote:
wrote in message oups.com...

Jon A. wrote:


And you're posting this during a discussion of the question whether or

not an owner can change their own plugs.

Horse - - - Cart
Cart - - - Horse

So that means that means that wheher the gaskets are annealed or
reused without annealing is irrelevant? That the owner wouldn't benefit
by knowing about using new or annealed gaskets? Come on.

Dan



Well, I have learned from elsewhere in this thread that NEW gaskets are DEFINITELY the way to go since there is
debate as to whether the proper treatment of used gaskets is to include cold water quenching or ambient air
cooling...

Debate aside, the fact is that annealing non-ferrous metals is different
than ferrous metals. Heating and quenching is the way to go for
non-ferrous metals. I have several loading manuals that show this
technique for annealing brass cases (which is mostly copper). You stand
them upright in a tray of water, heat them with a torch and then tip
them over into the water.

Search around on your own and you will find this to be true.

Matt

On 11 Feb 2005 16:56:01 -0800, wrote:

Jon A. wrote:

And you're posting this during a discussion of the question whether or

not an owner can change their own plugs.

Horse - - - Cart
Cart - - - Horse

So that means that means that wheher the gaskets are annealed or
reused without annealing is irrelevant? That the owner wouldn't benefit
by knowing about using new or annealed gaskets? Come on.

Dan

No, look at the **** it's started. That's exactly what I predicted.

On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 22:45:53 -0600, "John Clonts"
wrote:


wrote in message oups.com...
Jon A. wrote:

And you're posting this during a discussion of the question whether or

not an owner can change their own plugs.

Horse - - - Cart
Cart - - - Horse

So that means that means that wheher the gaskets are annealed or
reused without annealing is irrelevant? That the owner wouldn't benefit
by knowing about using new or annealed gaskets? Come on.

Dan


Well, I have learned from elsewhere in this thread that NEW gaskets are DEFINITELY the way to go since there is
debate as to whether the proper treatment of used gaskets is to include cold water quenching or ambient air
cooling...

Cheers!
John Clonts
Temple, Texas
N7NZ

And you never know how many times they've been ann - - - , well,
subjected to various types of torture and by whom! ;-)

Of course, these days folks would rather argue ad nauseum about trivia,
rather than get two spark plug gaskets. Anneal one correctly (red heat,
quench in water) and the other incorrectly (red heat and air cool). See
which one comes out clean and soft, and which one comes out black and hard.

Matt Whiting wrote:
John Clonts wrote:

wrote in message
oups.com...

Jon A. wrote:


And you're posting this during a discussion of the question whether or


not an owner can change their own plugs.


Horse - - - Cart
Cart - - - Horse


So that means that means that wheher the gaskets are annealed or
reused without annealing is irrelevant? That the owner wouldn't benefit
by knowing about using new or annealed gaskets? Come on.

Dan



Well, I have learned from elsewhere in this thread that NEW gaskets
are DEFINITELY the way to go since there is debate as to whether the
proper treatment of used gaskets is to include cold water quenching or
ambient air cooling...


Debate aside, the fact is that annealing non-ferrous metals is different
than ferrous metals. Heating and quenching is the way to go for
non-ferrous metals. I have several loading manuals that show this
technique for annealing brass cases (which is mostly copper). You stand
them upright in a tray of water, heat them with a torch and then tip
them over into the water.

Search around on your own and you will find this to be true.

Matt

Rip wrote:
: No, copper is annealed by quenching rapidly.


OK, you got me there. As it turns out, copper may be annealed by aircooling
or quenching. To harden copper requires a temperature decrease of about
10,000 degC per second which isn't going to happen if you drop 'em in water.

By the way, you'll never get copper hot enough to anneal with a propane torch.
Oxy-propane, yes.
--
Aaron C.

You don't want to melt the gaskets, just get them red hot. A propane
torch works just fine. And the water quench flakes the oxide off of the
copper, leaving the gaskets nice and clean.

Aaron Coolidge wrote:
Rip wrote:
: No, copper is annealed by quenching rapidly.


OK, you got me there. As it turns out, copper may be annealed by aircooling
or quenching. To harden copper requires a temperature decrease of about
10,000 degC per second which isn't going to happen if you drop 'em in water.

By the way, you'll never get copper hot enough to anneal with a propane torch.
Oxy-propane, yes.

On Sat, 12 Feb 2005 09:44:06 -0500, Matt Whiting
wrote:

John Clonts wrote:
wrote in message oups.com...

Jon A. wrote:


And you're posting this during a discussion of the question whether or

not an owner can change their own plugs.

Horse - - - Cart
Cart - - - Horse

So that means that means that wheher the gaskets are annealed or
reused without annealing is irrelevant? That the owner wouldn't benefit
by knowing about using new or annealed gaskets? Come on.

Dan



Well, I have learned from elsewhere in this thread that NEW gaskets are DEFINITELY the way to go since there is
debate as to whether the proper treatment of used gaskets is to include cold water quenching or ambient air
cooling...

Debate aside, the fact is that annealing non-ferrous metals is different
than ferrous metals. Heating and quenching is the way to go for
non-ferrous metals. I have several loading manuals that show this
technique for annealing brass cases (which is mostly copper). You stand
them upright in a tray of water, heat them with a torch and then tip
them over into the water.

Search around on your own and you will find this to be true.

Matt

Matt is right on that one. You stand rifle cases in a pan of water.
The water keeps the bottom of the case at a lower temp so the bottom
doesn't heat/soften. You heat the neck and shoulders of the case with
a torch and then tip them over into the water. It softens the neck
and shoulders without changing the hardness of the base (which has to
be hard to contain the pressure).

Chuck

Thanks for saying what I was thinking.

All I want to do is change/rotate the plugs (after sufficient oversight -
one time)

I'll buy bulk gaskets. All I need is a fire for trying to save a few bucks.

Thx, {|;-)

Victor J. (Jim) Osborne, Jr.