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JS-1C vs EB 29 ASH31



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 14th 15, 03:12 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default JS-1C vs EB 29 ASH31

Why is it that the JS-1C seem to be the open class ship? One would think the 3 choices of wing span for the EB-29 and the extra wing span would make this the best hands down open ship. I noticed that the JS-1C-18 is equal to the ASG-29-18. One would think the ASH-31 with the same outer tips as the ASG-29 would be similarly equal to the JS1C but that does not seem to be the case. Can anyone explain?
  #2  
Old September 14th 15, 03:35 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Mark628CA
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Default JS-1C vs EB 29 ASH31

Because the JS-1 normally comes with 18 meter tips and can also be fitted with (optional) 21 meter tips. Naturally, the short tips put it in the 18 Meter class while the long tips place it in the Open class.

Of course, if you really wanted to, you could enter anything in the Open Class- an ASW-27 or even a PW-5 could be entered in Open. Assuming a certain level of mental derangement.

As far as the EB-29 being the "hands down" Open ship, the handling and roll rate definitely hamper this marvelous aircraft in weak conditions. It smokes when the cloudstreets align and running outweighs grinding around in tight 4 kt thermals.

I will take one of each (except the PW-5) when I win the Lottery.
  #3  
Old September 14th 15, 03:36 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
J. Nieuwenhuize
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Default JS-1C vs EB 29 ASH31

Price is one factor... few pilots can afford an eb29, many more can afford the Jonkers.

Doesn't the ash31 have a much bigger wing and much lower max wing loadings?
  #4  
Old September 14th 15, 08:53 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default JS-1C vs EB 29 ASH31

The Open class at world level allows for changes of span during a competition. The EB 29 at the maximum allowed weight with its shortest of 3 available tips can match the wing max loading of the JS 1C for the strong days and with its longest tips will have a better climb rate and Max LD for the weak days. That's what the winner of the recent Open class wirlds did. Of the other open class gliders only the Quintus and Antares 23m can acheive similar max wing loading of the JS1c and the 23m tipped EB29. So if cost, ease of handling, and being restricted to one class are not deterrents then the EB29 is the one to go for.

The JS1 aerofoil seems to be extremely good. Under 18m class rules the ASG 29, with its smaller wing area, has a higher maximum wing loading than the JS1 and glides as well or marginally better at high speed. In the recent GP, with a defined maximum wing loading rather than weight, it looked to me that the JS1 EVOs had a definite edge over the 29s in the final glides.

  #5  
Old September 15th 15, 02:52 AM
Ventus_a Ventus_a is offline
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The Open class at world level allows for changes of span during a competition. The EB 29 at the maximum allowed weight with its shortest of 3 available tips can match the wing max loading of the JS 1C for the strong days and with its longest tips will have a better climb rate and Max LD for the weak days. That's what the winner of the recent Open class wirlds did. Of the other open class gliders only the Quintus and Antares 23m can acheive similar max wing loading of the JS1c and the 23m tipped EB29. So if cost, ease of handling, and being restricted to one class are not deterrents then the EB29 is the one to go for.

The JS1 aerofoil seems to be extremely good. Under 18m class rules the ASG 29, with its smaller wing area, has a higher maximum wing loading than the JS1 and glides as well or marginally better at high speed. In the recent GP, with a defined maximum wing loading rather than weight, it looked to me that the JS1 EVOs had a definite edge over the 29s in the final glides.

Actually the EB 29 when flown in competition at 25.3m (it's smallest span not 23m) it gets 55.2 kg/m² at the 850kg MAUW open class limit as opposed to the JS1 at 58.7 kg/m²

At the EB 29's MAUW (900kg) it gets to 58.5 kg/m² wing loading in 25.3m span

:-) Colin

Last edited by Ventus_a : September 15th 15 at 09:34 PM.
  #6  
Old September 15th 15, 02:58 AM
Ventus_a Ventus_a is offline
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Originally Posted by Mark628CA View Post
Because the JS-1 normally comes with 18 meter tips and can also be fitted with (optional) 21 meter tips. Naturally, the short tips put it in the 18 Meter class while the long tips place it in the Open class.

Of course, if you really wanted to, you could enter anything in the Open Class- an ASW-27 or even a PW-5 could be entered in Open. Assuming a certain level of mental derangement.

As far as the EB-29 being the "hands down" Open ship, the handling and roll rate definitely hamper this marvelous aircraft in weak conditions. It smokes when the cloudstreets align and running outweighs grinding around in tight 4 kt thermals.

I will take one of each (except the PW-5) when I win the Lottery.

Climbing in tight thermals is what big span ships do best in my experience. This advantage goes away somewhat if the thermals are also gusty and turbulent requiring more control input. (I fly a Nimbus 3D and a Ventus a)

:-) Colin
  #7  
Old September 15th 15, 07:48 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
krasw
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Default JS-1C vs EB 29 ASH31

Didn't know that picking best glider is this easy: just check highest wingloading from specs.
  #8  
Old September 15th 15, 09:08 AM
Ventus_a Ventus_a is offline
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Why is it that the JS-1C seem to be the open class ship? One would think the 3 choices of wing span for the EB-29 and the extra wing span would make this the best hands down open ship. I noticed that the JS-1C-18 is equal to the ASG-29-18. One would think the ASH-31 with the same outer tips as the ASG-29 would be similarly equal to the JS1C but that does not seem to be the case. Can anyone explain?

The ASH 31 has a MAUW of 700kg and 13.2 m² of wing area in 21m giving it a wing loading of 53 kg/m² which is just too low to be properly competitive except in weak conditions. In the 2014 Worlds in Poland the Swiss pilot Daniel Rossier won Day 6 in an ASH 31, a day where there were no finishers so a 1000 point distance day

The JS1C-21 has a MAUW of 720kg and 12.25 m² of wing area giving it a wing loading of 58.7 kg/m², a decent advantage in stronger weather against the ASH 31

:-) Colin

Last edited by Ventus_a : September 15th 15 at 09:25 AM.
 




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