FAI, soaring and Olympic Games

iPilot wrote:
Your fist point is achievable and in theis regard soaring can compete (I
don't say it currently does) with many other sports. At least I do not know
anyone who wants to watch 8days of constant swimming.

Your second point is good information, but in order to succeed soaring needs
to have a successful monoclass before and PW-5 just isn't that. We have to
get our own things ok before we jump to the IWGA. Otherwise we're just
another wannabies.

Why a single class? To say its needed for the Olympics implies, to me,
that there is something wrong or unfair with current FAI classes. Any
racing is expensive, so I don't buy that as a valid argument. Lots of
people race Standard and 15 m class all over the world, the FAI has
experience with it, and one class racing doesn't occur naturally in the
international soaring world (WC is contrived, and 1-26 is US only). If
gliders are to be raced in the Olympics, our best bet is to propose a
class that's already established, with gliders already racing.

Shawn

At least the archers need strong enough arms to pull back their bows.
How bout the air rifle events? I bet they have really buff trigger
fingers.

While soaring is a sport, and it is competitive, I have a real hard time
viewing the participants as athletes. If you can sit in a lounge chair
for hours on end, playing Nintendo with a joystick, you've got the
athletic stamina and dexterity to be a gold medal soaring pilot.

I don't think you will get a single serious racing pilot in the world to agree
with this assessment.

Curt Lewis - 95 USA

Curtl33 wrote:
While soaring is a sport, and it is competitive, I have a real hard time
viewing the participants as athletes. If you can sit in a lounge chair
for hours on end, playing Nintendo with a joystick, you've got the
athletic stamina and dexterity to be a gold medal soaring pilot.


I don't think you will get a single serious racing pilot in the world to agree
with this assessment.

I think a lot of them would agree, but they'd all point out that
"stamina" and "dexterity" aren't on the list of things it takes to be a
good racing pilot.

And because of this, I don't think of soaring as an Olympic sport. It is
primarily a very mental/intellectual sport, not a primarily physical one
like most (all?) the olympic sports I'm familiar with. It isn't about
flying a sailplane well, for example (like an aerobatic pilot), it's
about guiding the glider to the right place at the right time, meaning
where the lift is.


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Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

Eric Greenwell
Washington State
USA

Eric Greenwell wrote:

Curtl33 wrote:

While soaring is a sport, and it is competitive, I have a real hard
time viewing the participants as athletes. If you can sit in a lounge
chair for hours on end, playing Nintendo with a joystick, you've got
the athletic stamina and dexterity to be a gold medal soaring pilot.


I don't think you will get a single serious racing pilot in the world
to agree
with this assessment.


I think a lot of them would agree, but they'd all point out that
"stamina" and "dexterity" aren't on the list of things it takes to be a
good racing pilot.

And because of this, I don't think of soaring as an Olympic sport. It is
primarily a very mental/intellectual sport, not a primarily physical one
like most (all?) the olympic sports I'm familiar with. It isn't about
flying a sailplane well, for example (like an aerobatic pilot), it's
about guiding the glider to the right place at the right time, meaning
where the lift is.

I agree, but to paraphrase another poster, if it can be sold, and more
importantly can sell, it'll be good enough for the IOC.

Shawn

P.S. I've known a very good Laser racer who was decidedly un-athletic.
Curling, archery, and shooting are pretty light on athleticism as well

Most people think that all the Olympic sailing classes are one design,
which simply isnt true. The most competitive class, the Finn, is
similar to our 15m or Std class with designs within a rule.
Kevin Chrisnter 2c

I don't buy that argument.

1. If you look at the recent winners in any soaring title championship, you can hardly find any
fatman. Actually, in order ta win, one has to mantain full concentration in long flights during hot
days and long competitions. Therefore one has to be in a very good physical form. Partly for same
reasons why no fatman can win in top car racing league.
2. All shooting activities (incl. archery, clay pigeon shooting, pistol and rifle events) in
olympics require far less physically from athletes. The same applies to Equestrian disciplines where
physical health does not make the difference. The same applies to sailing.


Regads,
Kaido


"nafod40" wrote in message ...
iPilot wrote:
It's been under discussion for several times, but I want to bring it up again.

While soaring is a sport, and it is competitive, I have a real hard time
viewing the participants as athletes. If you can sit in a lounge chair
for hours on end, playing Nintendo with a joystick, you've got the
athletic stamina and dexterity to be a gold medal soaring pilot.

Why isn't chess an Olympic sport? Or playing Doom on a Nintendo GameCube?

Beacuse otherwise it's a tehnical sport where money invested in equipment can make a difference and
this is what is avoided generally by IOC. The examples you made are just bad. Reasons? WC is flawed
in design philosophy and class requirements. I do not really see who it was made for - pilots who
hav necessary skills to compete have the skills to fly more complex aircraft than the oversimplified
WC design. 1-26 is morally and physically aged and US only.

Last but not least. Sailing wouldn't be represented in Olympics when they wouldn't have made
monoclass rules long time ago. And I do not think that there's possible to launch 3 different glider
monoclasses from day one. BTW monoclass does not equal single class. Monoclass is a class where only
one particular glider (like PW-5) is allowed to participate. 3 different monoclasses in olympics
would be super, but i do not believe that it is achievable in any foreseeable future. Maybe we shall
have monoclasses based on one standard class design and one 18 meter design. Maybe just to declare
one current design from both classes a standard and make the drawings available to everyone (that
doesn't answer the cost needs however).

There's nothing wrong with current FAI classes. Just the principles of competition are different. In
it's current form soaring is a form on technical sport. And to expect a techical sport to achieve
IOC accept is the same as to expect F1 racing to make it to the Olympics - never happens.



"scurry" wrote in message
...
iPilot wrote:
Your fist point is achievable and in theis regard soaring can compete (I
don't say it currently does) with many other sports. At least I do not know
anyone who wants to watch 8days of constant swimming.

Your second point is good information, but in order to succeed soaring needs
to have a successful monoclass before and PW-5 just isn't that. We have to
get our own things ok before we jump to the IWGA. Otherwise we're just
another wannabies.

Why a single class? To say its needed for the Olympics implies, to me,
that there is something wrong or unfair with current FAI classes. Any
racing is expensive, so I don't buy that as a valid argument. Lots of
people race Standard and 15 m class all over the world, the FAI has
experience with it, and one class racing doesn't occur naturally in the
international soaring world (WC is contrived, and 1-26 is US only). If
gliders are to be raced in the Olympics, our best bet is to propose a
class that's already established, with gliders already racing.

Shawn

I do not think that soaring competes badly in this regard towards sailing, shooting and horse
raiding. The argument just doesn't stand. Weirdest sport, one ca find in olympic programme (though,
winter programme) in this regard is curling imho.


"Eric Greenwell" wrote in message
...
Curtl33 wrote:
While soaring is a sport, and it is competitive, I have a real hard time
viewing the participants as athletes. If you can sit in a lounge chair
for hours on end, playing Nintendo with a joystick, you've got the
athletic stamina and dexterity to be a gold medal soaring pilot.


I don't think you will get a single serious racing pilot in the world to agree
with this assessment.

I think a lot of them would agree, but they'd all point out that
"stamina" and "dexterity" aren't on the list of things it takes to be a
good racing pilot.

And because of this, I don't think of soaring as an Olympic sport. It is
primarily a very mental/intellectual sport, not a primarily physical one
like most (all?) the olympic sports I'm familiar with. It isn't about
flying a sailplane well, for example (like an aerobatic pilot), it's
about guiding the glider to the right place at the right time, meaning
where the lift is.


--
Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

Eric Greenwell
Washington State
USA

On example of the current olympians. Athlethic ain't it :-)
http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Oly.../1195527_b.jpg




"Mark James Boyd" wrote in message news:412259a4$1@darkstar...
Olympics are athletic. Soaring has avoided (for the most part) having
medals or awards for endurance (long hours = crash).

I dunno, the sailing olympians all look like they're in great shape.
Pretty physical, that sport. And bosled even. I dunno if
soaring really meets the hardbody "Olympic" concept.

But hey, I guess there's no harm trying...I suppose an Olympic
"cluster ballooning" event would be nice too...

In article , iPilot wrote:
It's been under discussion for several times, but I want to bring it up again.

There have been several pro's and con's towards soaring in Olympics, but nobody argues that it'd
rise the popularity of the sport. So it is important for soaring community. Therefore my question
is
following:

Wich way is soaring worse than sailing?

None of the cities that have organised Olympic games in the past would have any geographic
troubles
on organising soaring competitions (Moscow had troubles with organising sailing competition which
had to be held in Tallinn - 900 km away).
None of the latest summer games that I remember have had such miserable weather that the
competition
would have to be left unheld.

The main argument against soaring is the fact that equipment can make a difference here. Well.
Here
is the challenge for igc. They have to face that their first trial of monoclass failed and they
have
to try again. This time with relatively high-performing, yet still not expencive standard or 15m
class design.

As a matter of fact I don't believe that sailing deserves to have 9 different classes on Olympics
and soaring none. I personally think that FAI has failed bigtime to find the concensus amongst
all
air sports to get air sports represented on Olympic games. It shall be the biggest argument
towards
Olympic Commety - there's no air sports in Olympics nowadays. And the most suitable sport would
be
soaring because it's competitive, not so dependent on equipment and directly measurable. Making
soaring TV-friendly shall not be a problem as well today. And with racing tasks only allowed on
olympics it shall be understandable for general public as well.

How can we do it?

Regards,
Kaido




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Mark Boyd
Avenal, California, USA