Best Overall Motorglider available today?

On Thursday, 15 October 2020 at 00:27:59 UTC+3, Ramy wrote:
I couldn’t agree less with the notion that you need a top racer to go anywhere. It may be the case in contest racing where every small performance advantage is significant, but the performance difference is insignificant for the rest of cross country flights. You May fly few miles less or few mph slower. I agree it wouldn’t matter for those who fly locally, but a significant number of pilots such as myself don’t fly contests or records but fly aggressive cross country as you can see on OLC. The AS34 should be marketed for this significant segment of soaring pilots, not for clubs and local fliers.

Ramy

I own and fly LS8-st. I fly "agressively" OLC, national records, nationals and occasionally worlds. Did my FAI 1000k badge in it. There is nothing wrong with 18m/std. class racers designed in mid to late 90's, they are wonderful ships. You can do a lot things with them. My point was, that if performance is important, you should consider more modern flapped designs than differences between these designs. No matter what the handicaps are, if you fly LS8 side by side with V3 you start to cry in 3 minutes.

And then the marketing. Factories start building them and pilots buy them. Yes they have websites, they try to put latest designs in to a hands of good pilots (who have ordered the first serial numbers 10 years earlier anyway) and some even offer test flights. I have not witnessed anything that I would even remotely call "marketing to a segment".

Kawa comments on the ASH 25Mi

http://www.sebastiankawa.pl/13127/ko...je-przelotowe/

" . . .whenever possible, I chose the winch, because . . "

krasw wrote on 10/14/2020 11:08 PM:
On Thursday, 15 October 2020 at 00:27:59 UTC+3, Ramy wrote:
I couldn’t agree less with the notion that you need a top racer to go anywhere. It may be the case in contest racing where every small performance advantage is significant, but the performance difference is insignificant for the rest of cross country flights. You May fly few miles less or few mph slower. I agree it wouldn’t matter for those who fly locally, but a significant number of pilots such as myself don’t fly contests or records but fly aggressive cross country as you can see on OLC. The AS34 should be marketed for this significant segment of soaring pilots, not for clubs and local fliers.

Ramy

I own and fly LS8-st. I fly "agressively" OLC, national records, nationals and occasionally worlds. Did my FAI 1000k badge in it. There is nothing wrong with 18m/std. class racers designed in mid to late 90's, they are wonderful ships. You can do a lot things with them. My point was, that if performance is important, you should consider more modern flapped designs than differences between these designs. No matter what the handicaps are, if you fly LS8 side by side with V3 you start to cry in 3 minutes.

And then the marketing. Factories start building them and pilots buy them. Yes they have websites, they try to put latest designs in to a hands of good pilots (who have ordered the first serial numbers 10 years earlier anyway) and some even offer test flights. I have not witnessed anything that I would even remotely call "marketing to a segment".

Perhaps it is remarks like these on the AS website that Ramy is thinking about:

"Our new entry in the area of independent electric power

This affordable 18/15m sailplane with all its normal quality and safety features, combined with
a powerful electrical propulsion system, opens new possibilities for casual pilots and clubs."

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1

Eric, exactly! This comment on their web site seriously dumped my enthusiasm!
If I decide to buy the 34 they will need to remove this comment first

Ramy

On Thursday, October 15, 2020 at 6:25:32 PM UTC-7, Ramy wrote:
Eric, exactly! This comment on their web site seriously dumped my enthusiasm!
If I decide to buy the 34 they will need to remove this comment first

Ramy
Based on a 28 with possible 18m wing options. How does that sound?

On 10/13/20 10:11 AM, Dave Walsh wrote:
Not sure how many EB29E actually exist? There was one at Sisteron
2018, the rear seat was tiny, really a one and a half seater?
It was taking aerotows, some problem with the battery charger and
smoke production? Reputed cost north of 400K€.....


Strange that they took the normally single seat EB29 and squeezed in a
small second seat on the electric version.

On Wednesday, October 14, 2020 at 8:55:27 PM UTC+1, Eric Greenwell wrote:
Maybe it says something about Namibia flying, but it says nothing about the Parowan motorglider
event I've been going to for over 10 years. We discuss the flights, rarely the motors. Ditto
for when I fly at Ely following the Parowan event.

I remember arriving at Parowan for a contest immediately after the motorglider meet there and found a bunch of them on the apron working on engines. I distinctly remember someone welding a silencer together and another rebuilding a carburetor. Eric probably missed this because he was busy flying!

Mike

Mike the Strike wrote on 10/16/2020 3:03 AM:
On Wednesday, October 14, 2020 at 8:55:27 PM UTC+1, Eric Greenwell wrote:
Maybe it says something about Namibia flying, but it says nothing about the Parowan motorglider
event I've been going to for over 10 years. We discuss the flights, rarely the motors. Ditto
for when I fly at Ely following the Parowan event.

I remember arriving at Parowan for a contest immediately after the motorglider meet there and found a bunch of them on the apron working on engines. I distinctly remember someone welding a silencer together and another rebuilding a carburetor. Eric probably missed this because he was busy flying!

Mike

They are not maintenance free, and no one suggests that. The remark I countered was the one
suggesting we talked about motors more than the flying. Had you been there a few days before,
you would have noticed that, and enjoyed the stories.

We (ASA - Auxiliary-powered Sailplane Association) always have a towplane at our Parowan event.
It serves the sustainer motorgliders that can not self-launch, and 8 or so "gravity gliders"
that we invite to help support the towplane (and to enjoy their company, of course!). Often,
our biggest issue for event has been getting the towplane and pilot for the event. So,
ironically, a lot of the ASA board chatter is about towplanes! But not at dinner...

We (ASA - Auxiliary-powered Sailplane Association) always have a towplane at our Parowan event.

Not sure if it has been mentioned yet, but self launch motor gliders often have a release.
So should the motor have some issue and the tow plane is around, you can get a tow so as not to miss out on good conditions.
I wouldn't get a motorglider without a release. Not a bad idea to remain current on aerotow anyways.

On Friday, October 16, 2020 at 11:31:39 AM UTC-7, Darren Braun wrote:
We (ASA - Auxiliary-powered Sailplane Association) always have a towplane at our Parowan event.

Not sure if it has been mentioned yet, but self launch motor gliders often have a release.
So should the motor have some issue and the tow plane is around, you can get a tow so as not to miss out on good conditions.
I wouldn't get a motorglider without a release. Not a bad idea to remain current on aerotow anyways.


Just curious: what is 'current on aerotow'? Last time I had a long layoff from gliding (2 years due to business) I found no difficulty in aerotowing.