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2020 Mackay, Idaho Regatta



 
 
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  #11  
Old November 10th 19, 11:32 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default 2020 Mackay, Idaho Regatta


Oxygen is Oxygen. There is no difference between aviation and commercial welding oxygen except for liability insurance.


For a given tank, there is likely no physical difference, but the fill procedure appears different.
For welding, just fill is ok.
For medical and PBO, evacuate first is required.

If the previous user left the tank open for a while, there is a small chance of moisture but probably nothing else harmful.

I can get a big tank of pbo for a month from the welding shop for $35. The problem is I have to give them a week's notice so they will have it. And I can't go to a random Tractor Supply to get it.

For me, the extra hassle is worth not having to think about such an easily avoided 'probably'.





  #12  
Old November 11th 19, 12:05 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default 2020 Mackay, Idaho Regatta

For welding, just fill is ok.
For medical and PBO, evacuate first is required.

If the previous user left the tank open for a while, there is a small chance of moisture but probably nothing else harmful.


The above protocol is true at the supplier, but not necessarily in the field. The reason for evacuation of the cylinders for medical and PBO (or ABO) is that the O2 refill has a lot number that is recorded by the supplier.

I doubt that many pilots run their tanks to zero pressure before refilling, and then it is unlikely that the valve is left open and the regulator exposed to ambient atmosphere (and thus possible moisture contamination.)

Also, just in case you haven't noticed, medical cylinders generally use the CGA-870 post-type filling port as opposed to the CGA-540 outlet found on welding and Aviator's Breathing Oxygen cylinders. A special adapter will be required to transfill the medical cylinder from a typical CGA-540 fitting.
  #13  
Old November 11th 19, 06:21 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default 2020 Mackay, Idaho Regatta

On Sunday, November 10, 2019 at 10:54:29 AM UTC-8, Matt Herron (Sr) wrote:
On Thursday, October 31, 2019 at 8:43:34 AM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
In the past, at another location, a friend and I on safari rented a
large O2 bottle from the local medical supplier.Â* Cost was $42 for a
month though we only needed it for a week.Â* We brought our own
trans-fill hose and, at the end of the week, offered free O2 for anyone
who wanted it.

On 10/31/2019 8:40 AM, Brian wrote:
On Thursday, October 31, 2019 at 6:41:46 AM UTC-6, John DeRosa OHM Ω http://aviation.derosaweb.net wrote:
I must ask about the lack of "nearby" oxygen refills.

The regatta is 10 days long. The field elevation is 5892ft. So oxygen use would be expected and refills would be needed.

The limiting factor is then how far away would one have to travel to get a quick turnaround refill?

Thanks, John
He is just saying that commercially available oxygen is not available close by, so don't plan on coming and then filling up your oxygen bottles because the supply is limited. If you are coming and can bring extra please do, If you need oxygen please coordinate with Tom, a number of us bring extra, But availability is a bit potluck, if you don't bring your own. So far we have always had enough, and just want to keep it that way.


--
Dan, 5J


Oxygen is Oxygen. There is no difference between aviation and commercial welding oxygen except for liability insurance. I once ran a welding business so I have a large bottle of welding Oxygen that I use to refill my glider bottle. Done it for years. no problem.
And it's easy to rent a welding bottle from any commercial supplier for far less bucks.
Matt Herron


I spoke to an O2 supplier about this once. He agreed that "oxygen is oxygen", but he said that there is a cleanliness standard for medical and PBO bottles. Contamination from a bottle may cause a system malfunction which in a welding application is no big deal, but in PBO or medical could be fatal..
  #14  
Old November 11th 19, 07:26 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Dan Marotta
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Default 2020 Mackay, Idaho Regatta

Good info about evacuating.Â* Only idiots would leave a bottle open to
the environment, but the world does seem to be populated by them in
increasing numbers.Â* I keep my bottle closed and blow out the trans fill
hose with O2 before closing the system to fill the aircraft bottle.Â* In
my original post I only mentioned medical oxygen because that was the
only supplier in town.Â* Locally, I simply go to the gas supplier and get
"oxygen".Â* I own my bottle but rather than hang on to it for 5 years and
then get a hydrostatic test, I just swap it out for another bottle.

On 11/10/2019 3:32 PM, wrote:
Oxygen is Oxygen. There is no difference between aviation and commercial welding oxygen except for liability insurance.

For a given tank, there is likely no physical difference, but the fill procedure appears different.
For welding, just fill is ok.
For medical and PBO, evacuate first is required.

If the previous user left the tank open for a while, there is a small chance of moisture but probably nothing else harmful.

I can get a big tank of pbo for a month from the welding shop for $35. The problem is I have to give them a week's notice so they will have it. And I can't go to a random Tractor Supply to get it.

For me, the extra hassle is worth not having to think about such an easily avoided 'probably'.






--
Dan, 5J
  #16  
Old November 12th 19, 06:13 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Brian[_1_]
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Default 2020 Mackay, Idaho Regatta

It would seem to me that contaminated oxygen used to weld the airplane together could be Fatal also.

  #17  
Old November 12th 19, 04:54 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Eric Greenwell[_4_]
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Default 2020 Mackay, Idaho Regatta

Brian wrote on 11/11/2019 9:13 PM:
It would seem to me that contaminated oxygen used to weld the airplane together could be Fatal also.

I was told many years ago by a gas supplier, that welding oxygen has strict
contamination requirements, and that we can safely breathe oxygen that a welder
would reject.

Concerns over water freezing in the regulator seem exaggerated: even if a bottle
had only humid air in it before filling, that air will be only 15psi/2000psi =
0.0075 = 0.75% of the bottle after filling, reducing the humidity by over a 100.
The dewpoint is then well below -30F, so it's not going to freeze in the regulator.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1
 




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