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#81
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wrote in message news:cf%xd.6954$rL3.3392@trnddc03... On 21-Dec-2004, "Matt Barrow" wrote: I find two on ASO for just under $5M, a 1999 and a 2001 model. Whatever...it's still way outside my budget. I'm not impressed with the present market for the Cessna 441's I see on the market. I can pick up a Commander 840 or even a 900 for less than $1M, which is more akin to the budget and still suites the mission just fine. Just remember that operating and maintenance costs for a 20 year old twin turboprop will be the same or higher than for a brand new one. Probably the same, and insurance probably will be less. Many of the ones I saw have been refurbished, and some have been completely restored. One has virtually new TFE331-10T engines (20 hours) and another, has an all new Garmin/Meggitt panel. Purchase price is only part of the story. The real question is, how much can you afford in total hourly cost to fly the plane? Oh, and don't forget the cost and time for recurrent training, which your insurance carrier is bound to require. Well, if I save a half million or more, I can afford a lot of training :~) Like I said, I've got a couple months to keep digging. -- Matt --------------------- Matthew W. Barrow Site-Fill Homes, LLC. Montrose, CO |
#82
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On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 04:47:18 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
wrote: Mary gets the right leading edge, and beer/pop. What about the rest of the wing? What about the horizonta and vertical stabilizors and rudder? These parts get "The Pledge" treatment occasionally, when we're feeling especially ambitious. They don't really get dirty -- only dusty. (As long as your plane is hangared, of course.) Yah, but how do you get the bugs to stick if you put pledge on the wings? My son gets the empennage Does this include the belly? Our new M20 air/oil separator has basically put my son out of business. I used to pay him $.50 per wingspan foot (30 feet = $15) to clean the bottom of the plane once a month. Now, he hasn't had to do it since August. Air oil separator on the Deb (IO-47N) with no oil filter and it has a wet vacuum pump, has no noticeable oil use in 25 hours. Engine is nearing TBO. The belly would stay clean if I'd only fly in nice weather and stay off the grass farm strips. Bugs on the wings and cowl are another matter. Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member) (N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair) www.rogerhalstead.com :-) |
#83
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Roger wrote:
On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 04:47:18 GMT, "Jay Honeck" wrote: Mary gets the right leading edge, and beer/pop. What about the rest of the wing? What about the horizonta and vertical stabilizors and rudder? These parts get "The Pledge" treatment occasionally, when we're feeling especially ambitious. They don't really get dirty -- only dusty. (As long as your plane is hangared, of course.) Yah, but how do you get the bugs to stick if you put pledge on the wings? Fly faster, of course. Matt |
#84
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Matt, stepping up to an all weather turboprop aircraft is a whole new
world... Until you have a year or two of flying one on a gotta-be-there schedule, you need someone in the cockpit who's major skill set is pushing aluminum from point A to point B in any weather, not building houses in any weather... No, the hired pilot doesn't 'have' to be ATP rated but he/she needs to be commercial, CFII, with real world experience - military flying, or bush pilot time, air taxi time, UPS, etc... This will help you tremendously in the cost of insurance which is going to be a big ticket item if you are the named pilot and just moving into turbine aircraft - having a propilot with turbine experience as the named pilot initially will save you money up front and get you (almost) free instruction time until you can satisfy the insurance minimum turbine time requirement... Look in Trade-A-Plane for guys wanting a job... There are folks with both technical education and turbine time looking for work... Monster.com is a resource also.. While I suggested a full time employee who is available on demand, there are folks who will work just for the flying, also... Denny Denny |
#85
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"Denny" wrote in message oups.com... Matt, stepping up to an all weather turboprop aircraft is a whole new world... Probably not as bad as the Baron I used to own. Until you have a year or two of flying one on a gotta-be-there schedule, you need someone in the cockpit who's major skill set is pushing aluminum from point A to point B in any weather, not building houses in any weather... I've been managing to push aluminum around for all these years, including the eight that I've spent building my business, I imagine that it can't be worse than getting there in my Bonanza. No, the hired pilot doesn't 'have' to be ATP rated but he/she needs to be commercial, CFII, with real world experience - military flying, or bush pilot time, air taxi time, UPS, etc... This will help you tremendously in the cost of insurance which is going to be a big ticket item if you are the named pilot and just moving into turbine aircraft - having a propilot with turbine experience as the named pilot initially will save you money up front and get you (almost) free instruction time until you can satisfy the insurance minimum turbine time requirement... Look in Trade-A-Plane for guys wanting a job... There are folks with both technical education and turbine time looking for work... Monster.com is a resource also.. While I suggested a full time employee who is available on demand, there are folks who will work just for the flying, also... Thanks for your comments. -- Matt --------------------- Matthew W. Barrow Site-Fill Homes, LLC. Montrose, CO |
#86
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On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 04:51:53 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
wrote: Flying on paved strips only helps a lot. My airplane was based on a grass/dirt strip for several years and pledge and a diaper just wouldn't cut it! We fly into a grass strip half a dozen times per year, and it takes Pledge, diapers, and Simple Green (on the fiberglass parts) to clean up after those excursions... Likewise, I have a 1700' gravel driveway and my cars definitely need a water bath before washing or I'd have my paint ground away in a few washings. Gravel driveways are the norm in rural Iowa. You can really tell the We have a lot of "dirt" driveways in rural Michigan as well. Although I don't see it much any more, at one time you could purchase a car with a "chip guard" right from the factory, which was a kind of plastic coating on the bottom foot of so of the doors and fenders. The stuff really worked. At that time I had nearly a mile and a half of gravel road going into town. It was gravel right up to the village limits. Of course that is the same town where my 40 acre field (on which I used to land the Piper Colt) was within the city limits. One of the guys who lived about 15 miles out actually brought his equipment up and mowed a strip full length of the field. He could fly up to the field and walk the rest of the was faster than he could drive it. Of course that didn't work if he needed to carry a lot. Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member) (N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair) www.rogerhalstead.com "out-of-towners" by the beaters they drive into town. I'm sure they don't see much point in buying an expensive car when you basically trash it without ever leaving your property. (Of course, crushing rural poverty has something to do with this, too...) |
#87
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On 22 Dec 2004 06:00:54 -0800, "Denny" wrote:
Matt, stepping up to an all weather turboprop aircraft is a whole new world... Until you have a year or two of flying one on a gotta-be-there schedule, you need someone in the cockpit who's major skill set is pushing aluminum from point A to point B in any weather, not building houses in any weather... No, the hired pilot doesn't 'have' to be ATP rated but he/she needs to be commercial, CFII, with real world experience - military flying, or bush pilot time, air taxi time, UPS, etc... This will help you tremendously in the cost of insurance which is going to be a big ticket item if you are the named pilot and just moving into turbine aircraft - having a propilot with turbine experience as the named pilot initially will save you money up front and get you (almost) free instruction time until you can satisfy the insurance minimum turbine time requirement... Look in Trade-A-Plane for guys wanting a job... There are folks with both technical education and turbine time looking for work... Monster.com is a resource also.. While I suggested a full time employee who is available on demand, there are folks who will work just for the flying, also... I've been doing research into buying a plane. I have about 300 hours and have considered everything from a T182RG to a T210 to making the jump straight into a 400-series Cessna. I talked to a guy who has a 421, and the insurance company wanted him to pay $30,000/yr for his first year, PLUS (something like) 200 hours DUAL! If for no other reason than the insurance cost, you could hire a guy full time to be instructor/SIC, and the difference in insurance cost would probably pay for the salary. You'd also have an experienced person teaching you while you build time. John Szpara Affordable Satellite Fiero Owner 2-84 Indy Pace cars, 86 Coupe, 88 Formula 3.4, 88 Coupe, 88GT |
#88
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On 20-Dec-2004, A Lieberman wrote: My A&P took a look, sure enough, said I have never seen anything like this. The Sundowner doesn't have any access panels to the fuel tanks! Everything is riveted tight as a drum. So.... now do I have a leaky fuel tank, or do I have a fuel line problem. I don't know squat about Sundowners, but I'm wondering how it could be that here are NO access/inspection holes on the wings. Certainly, there has to be access to the wing attach bolts. Also, how does the fuel line get connected after a wing is installed if there are no access points? I've seen some remarkable snorkeling periscope tools that allow one to "peek" around corners inside a wing when the inspection hole isn't where the problem it. Have you considered that Beech technical support might be able to help on this problem? Good luck, and let us know what happens. -- -Elliott Drucker |
#89
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I have access to a 20 ft fiberoptic borescope. I'm here in San Diego.
Wouldn't mind playing with it as long as we don't break it. I could never afford to replace it... wrote in message news:YUNyd.5511$h.2950@trnddc04... On 20-Dec-2004, A Lieberman wrote: My A&P took a look, sure enough, said I have never seen anything like this. The Sundowner doesn't have any access panels to the fuel tanks! Everything is riveted tight as a drum. So.... now do I have a leaky fuel tank, or do I have a fuel line problem. I don't know squat about Sundowners, but I'm wondering how it could be that here are NO access/inspection holes on the wings. Certainly, there has to be access to the wing attach bolts. Also, how does the fuel line get connected after a wing is installed if there are no access points? I've seen some remarkable snorkeling periscope tools that allow one to "peek" around corners inside a wing when the inspection hole isn't where the problem it. Have you considered that Beech technical support might be able to help on this problem? Good luck, and let us know what happens. -- -Elliott Drucker |
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