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#11
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Roy Smith wrote:
Gord Beaman wrote: Well, CJ, I wouldn't want you to pass up a good thing because of incorrect info so perhaps you should check out about this 'illegal' thing. They have cell phones installed in the seat backs of some commercial airliners for the use of passengers (I've seen them but haven't used one) so they sure aren't illegal, These are not cell phones. They are attached to a ship-board communications system which uses a satellite link (or possibly dedicated ground stations) to patch you through to the terrestrial phone network. Different system completely from cell phones. Yes...dedicated ground stations...as I said Roy...actually I believe that they utilize regular cel towers some of which are equipped with somewhat different receiver systems...also there's many fewer of them than regular cel service because of the generally much longer range of the airbourne units. It's quite a large budding service...there was a big writeup about it in...?...'life' maybe?...awhile ago... -- -Gord. (use gordon in email) |
#12
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Gord Beaman wrote:
Roy Smith wrote: Gord Beaman wrote: Well, CJ, I wouldn't want you to pass up a good thing because of incorrect info so perhaps you should check out about this 'illegal' thing. They have cell phones installed in the seat backs of some commercial airliners for the use of passengers (I've seen them but haven't used one) so they sure aren't illegal, These are not cell phones. They are attached to a ship-board communications system which uses a satellite link (or possibly dedicated ground stations) to patch you through to the terrestrial phone network. Different system completely from cell phones. Yes...dedicated ground stations...as I said Roy...actually I believe that they utilize regular cel towers some of which are equipped with somewhat different receiver systems...also there's many fewer of them than regular cel service because of the generally much longer range of the airbourne units. I would not be surprised if they used some of the same towers, but just because they're on a cell phone tower doesn't make them a cell phone. Towers are a limited resource and most of them are shared by all sorts of unrelated servics (often even direct competitors). The terrestrial cell phone infrastructure is optimized for phones on the surface which are either stationary or moving at relatively low speeds (i.e. highway speed or less). The antenna coverage, cell overlap, signal propigation patterns, and switching algorithms are all designed around these assumptions. Using a cell phone in an airplane not only gives the phone line of sight to many more cells than the system was designed for, but the high speed motion also causes it to switch from cell to cell faster than normal. Both of these break design assumptions and degrade the system. That's why the FCC bans cell phone use from airplanes. Systems designed for aviation use may share some of the basic cell system ideas (and even some of the physical infrastructure like towers), but the ground station grid and switching algorithms are optimized for their intended use. |
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#14
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#15
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David Lesher wrote:
(Roy Smith) writes: Gord sed: Yes...dedicated ground stations...as I said Roy...actually I believe that they utilize regular cel towers some of which are equipped with somewhat different receiver systems...also there's many fewer of them than regular cel service because of the generally much longer range of the airbourne units. I would not be surprised if they used some of the same towers, but just because they're on a cell phone tower doesn't make them a cell phone. Towers are a limited resource and most of them are shared by all sorts of unrelated servics (often even direct competitors). Well, in reality, the towers and sometimes the RF gear is owned by a company such as American Tower, Inc. and oh yes, they stack as many carriers as they can on one piece of iron. (And it's more than tower space; co-location means they can share generator backup, fiber feeds, etc..) As for if airborne is "cellular" -- that depends on whose definition you want to use. Is it Jill Winecooler 'cellular'? Nope. But can it share the name? You decide. Of course...and the term is no longer 'cellular' anyway it seems, they now seem to prefer 'Mobile phones' so I guess it's a moot point, but ISTM that the aircraft cel system is a helluva lot closer to the terrestrial cel system than anything else. -- -Gord. (use gordon in email) |
#16
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On Fri, 31 Dec 2004 16:09:21 -0500, C. J. Clegg
wrote: We have a small consulting company that owns an airplane that is used for business trips. From time to time it would be useful to be able to contact the airplane from our office which is not located on any airport. What do we need to do to get authorization to install an aircraft band radio at our office and use it to contact the company airplane? Thanks... We've got one in our office. Long story short, you can review the myriad of regulations and sub-agencies involved, obtain/complete all the required paperwork and apply to the FCC for an assigned operating frequency and a license. Or, you can contact AIRINC. They are in the business of obtaining all the necessary information, filling out all the required paperwork, and getting you a frequency and a site license. Their fees are reasonable (but not cheap), both initially, and annually. Through AIRINC, you also can set up a system that will allow you to contact your aircraft virtually anywhere, however, it is much more expensive. The system we have in place is as you describe, a licensed aviation band transceiver that allows two-way communication with our company aircraft that are in the vicinity of the radio station. Regards; TC |
#17
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{posted at Jer's request; he has ...an oil leak on his server, yea, that's it..} Of course...and the term is no longer 'cellular' anyway it seems, they now seem to prefer 'Mobile phones' so I guess it's a moot point, but ISTM that the aircraft cel system is a helluva lot closer to the terrestrial cel system than anything else. No. "Mobile phones" is an entirely separate service, running in the 152 Mhz and 450 Mhz bands... this is what we had BEFORE cell phones. :-) I was a "Mobile phone" dispatcher when I was at university... 1970 - 1974. :-) Best regards, Jer/ "Flight instruction and mountain flying are my vocation!" Eberhard -- Jer/ (Slash) Eberhard, Mountain Flying Aviation, LTD, Ft Collins, CO CELL 970 231-6325 EMAIL jer'at'frii.com WEB http://users.frii.com/jer/ C-206 N9513G, CFII Airplane&Glider, FAA-DEN Aviation Safety Counselor CAP-CO Mission&Aircraft CheckPilot, BM218 HAM N0FZD, 221 Young Eagles! -- A host is a host from coast to & no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433 is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433 |
#18
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The most often used ruse is to have somebody in the office get some sort of
instructor license...the most often used is the "basic ground instructor" and the exam is like a private exam on steroids. There is no practical; pass the written and you am one. Then you file the appropriate form with the FCC for an "aviation school" frequency, either 123.3 or 123.5, whichever is the least used frequency in your area. If you don't abuse the privilege and start yakking uselessly on the frequency, you will be good to go for a long time. Jim wrote in message ... On Fri, 31 Dec 2004 16:09:21 -0500, C. J. Clegg wrote: We have a small consulting company that owns an airplane that is used for business trips. From time to time it would be useful to be able to contact the airplane from our office which is not located on any airport. What do we need to do to get authorization to install an aircraft band radio at our office and use it to contact the company airplane? |
#19
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On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 15:57:42 -0800, "RST Engineering"
wrote: The most often used ruse is to have somebody in the office get some sort of instructor license...the most often used is the "basic ground instructor" and the exam is like a private exam on steroids. There is no practical; pass the written and you am one. Then you file the appropriate form with the FCC for an "aviation school" frequency, either 123.3 or 123.5, whichever is the least used frequency in your area. If you don't abuse the privilege and start yakking uselessly on the frequency, you will be good to go for a long time. Honestly, I don't remember what exactly our station license consists of. Basically, it states that we will use the assigned frequency for inter-company communication-such as passenger/manifest info, fuel requests, pilot/ground communication, etc. Everybody in the office has at least a PPL, not being a radio guy, I would assume that eliminates the need for a licensed "operator" on the ground. In our area, it ended up being a pretty "quiet" freq, with very little communication other than ours. Not saying that the way we did was the only way it can happen, just that it was the easiest way to do it "officially", and we expected to pay AIRINC for making it easier. Regards; TC |
#20
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David Lesher wrote:
{posted at Jer's request; he has ...an oil leak on his server, yea, that's it..} Of course...and the term is no longer 'cellular' anyway it seems, they now seem to prefer 'Mobile phones' so I guess it's a moot point, but ISTM that the aircraft cel system is a helluva lot closer to the terrestrial cel system than anything else. No. "Mobile phones" is an entirely separate service, running in the 152 Mhz and 450 Mhz bands... this is what we had BEFORE cell phones. :-) I was a "Mobile phone" dispatcher when I was at university... 1970 - 1974. :-) Best regards, Jer/ "Flight instruction and mountain flying are my vocation!" Eberhard Yes, you're quite correct in what you say about the old 'Mobile phones'. I was the chief (only) tech for a small communications company where we installed 'Key telephone systems' and Mobile Car Phones', BUT I was just pointing out that the cellular phone companies 'now' call them 'mobile phones' (again?). I have a brand new handout sheet here for the kind of cel phone that I'm interested in exchanging for my present one...remember that I said NEW handout...it calls them 'mobile phones'...I'll scan it and email it to you if you cannot take my word for it... -- -Gord. (use gordon in email) |
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