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#21
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"Seeking Foreign Buyers For Osprey"
I recall hearing that the Osprey saw some use in Afghaniland. Or is
that just a bad rumor? |
#22
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"Seeking Foreign Buyers For Osprey"
On Jun 13, 7:55 pm, Vince wrote:
don't worry these china dolls will be kept very far from any real combat. Vince Please clarify "china doll." As we use the term it applies to the fragility or lack of survivability of the platform. Are you now insinuating you know anything about it's combat survivability/susceptibility? Just wondering, because I know that most details of S/S for this platform are classified. And I don't remember you being present during the seven years I was involved with testing those specific systems. BB I guess everybody has some mountain to climb. It's just fate whether you live in Kansas or Tibet... |
#23
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"Seeking Foreign Buyers For Osprey"
Dan wrote:
Vince wrote: Rob Arndt wrote: On Jun 13, 2:46?pm, wrote: On Jun 13, 3:40 pm, "David E. Powell" wrote: On Jun 13, 5:28 pm, wrote: On Jun 13, 12:35 pm, Vince wrote: David E. Powell wrote: Overseas sales are a pipe dream except either to Saudi Arabia as a replacement bribe stream or to someone else subject to US pressure As Japan has considered F-22, maybe they think that Japan might want the Osprey as well. Search and Rescue, moving people about, etc.... it is inferior to helicopters for almost all such purposes. The Osprey is a one trick pony, and the trick is very expensive. It requires the power of a heavy lift helicopter to transport medium lift cargo in a very crowded cabin for such a big heavy vehicle the cabin is 68 inches wide, and 66.23 inches high, that is 5" 6" high and 5 foot 8"' wide Vince At a speed of 214 Kts and ceiling of 26,000 ft. it's going to be an easy shoot-down. I thought it was faster, but going low enough can be an anti-shootdown tactic too. Uh-huh..........that's what got a lot of choppers shot down in 'Nam. Saw one of them buzz a vacation town here in South Jersey a couple days back, did a buzz-over at the local airport, fun!- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Anyone wanna take bets on the Ospreys going to Iraq in September? First loss due to combat, flying accident, or technical malfunction? Rob don't worry these china dolls will be kept very far from any real combat. Vince Just like you and aren't. Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired Can't quite parse it. Most of the deaths in Iraq are due to IEDs. Most of the actual shooting will take place in cities. Neither have much to do with the V-22. It is not well designed for emergency evacuation either. The V-22 will be used as a ferry from safe protected base to safe protected base, or to wide open areas where it will land and deliver fuel and men to waiting vehicles. It will then be touted as "combat proved" Vince |
#24
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"Seeking Foreign Buyers For Osprey"
Vince wrote: Most of the deaths in Iraq are due to IEDs. Most of the actual shooting will take place in cities. Neither have much to do with the V-22. It is not well designed for emergency evacuation either. Remember this mess?: http://awfulcommercials.com/movies/ospreyprint.jpg Pat |
#25
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"Seeking Foreign Buyers For Osprey"
BlackBeard wrote:
On Jun 13, 7:55 pm, Vince wrote: don't worry these china dolls will be kept very far from any real combat. Vince Please clarify "china doll." As we use the term it applies to the fragility or lack of survivability of the platform. Are you now insinuating you know anything about it's combat survivability/susceptibility? Just wondering, because I know that most details of S/S for this platform are classified. And I don't remember you being present during the seven years I was involved with testing those specific systems. BB It will be kept far from anything that might scratch its paint this turkey is a political airplane. It has no clear "combat" mission in Iraq The problems of the V-22 are in its fundamental design. It uses heavy lift horsepower at ultra heavy cost to pick up medium lift cargo which must also fit in its small cabin through a rear door. it's a one trick pony, it's faster in horizontal flight. But tis still a truck Vince |
#26
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"Seeking Foreign Buyers For Osprey"
It will be kept far from anything that might scratch its paint this turkey is a political airplane. It has no clear "combat" mission in Iraq Wonderful, the "Prince Harry" of military a/c!!! Rob |
#27
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"Seeking Foreign Buyers For Osprey"
"Mike" wrote in message oups.com... Dallas Morning News June 12, 2007 that's one for it to kill people from other countries for a charge. |
#28
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"Seeking Foreign Buyers For Osprey"
On Jun 13, 4:18?pm, "Paul J. Adam" wrote:
In message .com, David E. Powell writes I thought it was faster, but going low enough can be an anti-shootdown tactic too. If there's a sufficient density of Bad Guys, then going low exposes you to hundreds or thousands of small-arms rather than handfuls of MR-SAMs. -- The nation that makes a great distinction between its scholars and its warriors, will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting done by fools. -Thucydides Paul J. Adam - mainbox{at}jrwlynch[dot]demon(dot)codotuk Even stray fire that misses the troops or pilots, but hits a critical flight system will probably send the Osprey right into the ground. Transitional flight in a combat zone is gonna be a bitch anyway, but since Iraq is so large, just the regular flight in transit to the target area or base will expose the rotorcraft to small arms and RPG fire at low altitude. To me, it would be better to fly in an unarmed Fa-223 Drache carrying troops into combat in Berlin during the heat of battle with Hanna Reitsch at the controls than to fly over any part of Iraq in an Osprey, even with escort... but that's just me. I pity those poor soldiers whose ride into Iraq will be the Osprey and whose ride home will be in a bodybag inside a C-130 or other transport... Rob |
#29
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"Seeking Foreign Buyers For Osprey"
On Jun 14, 4:28 am, Vince wrote:
BlackBeard wrote: On Jun 13, 7:55 pm, Vince wrote: don't worry these china dolls will be kept very far from any real combat. Vince Please clarify "china doll." As we use the term it applies to the fragility or lack of survivability of the platform. Are you now insinuating you know anything about it's combat survivability/susceptibility? Just wondering, because I know that most details of S/S for this platform are classified. And I don't remember you being present during the seven years I was involved with testing those specific systems. BB It will be kept far from anything that might scratch its paint this turkey is a political airplane. It has no clear "combat" mission in Iraq The problems of the V-22 are in its fundamental design. It uses heavy lift horsepower at ultra heavy cost to pick up medium lift cargo which must also fit in its small cabin through a rear door. The entire aft opens up similar to the C-130. BB I guess everybody has some mountain to climb. It's just fate whether you live in Kansas or Tibet... |
#30
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"Seeking Foreign Buyers For Osprey"
On Jun 14, 10:43 pm, Rob Arndt wrote:
Even stray fire that misses the troops or pilots, but hits a critical flight system will probably send the Osprey right into the ground. And this is different from any other aircraft how? Transitional flight in a combat zone is gonna be a bitch anyway, As in any troop carrying helicopter... but since Iraq is so large, just the regular flight in transit to the target area or base will expose the rotorcraft to small arms and RPG fire at low altitude. Why fly low, it has a higher ceiling than the helo it is meant to replace, and has more counter-measures and survivability systems than those helos. So it has a better chance of surviving if hit. If it is flying low, compare the chances of hitting something going by at 170 knots versus 240+ knots with an RPG. Go ahead and stand off the highway. Try to hit a VW beetle going by at the speed limit with a baseball. Then try that with a speeding Lexus going about 80. You don't get to practice either, they pass once. BB I guess everybody has some mountain to climb. It's just fate whether you live in Kansas or Tibet... |
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