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#1
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what's in that air?
Everytime I'm near a BIG and busy airport I start to feel a little
weak and lightheaded. Almost as if I'm going to faint but I don't. I never had a problem with emises or nausea and haven't yet vomited when I thought of sick thoughts and I never get motion/ sea sickness. I think to myself that this only happens in cities up against a major airport like LAX and O'Hare. Could it be the Carbon Monoxide? I have my doubts that it's carbon monoxide but I could be wrong. If it's Carbon Monoxide then why don't I get the same sensation when in a garage with a car idling with the door open for a vent? Why don't I get the same sensation when I'm at the dirty Harbor where all the BIG diesels in the ships, trucks and trains are producing Carbon Monoxide (Co2 is it?) My suspicions is it's got to be something in the air obviously, it's either a gas or some kind of chemical. If my suspicions are correct, even if I've been NKA all my life what I and many others are sensitive to are the unburned gases and chemicals that are spewed into the air from unburned aviation fuel and turbine engines. It must be because those engines turn so fast and tons of air are passed through them while they are taking off and landing. Also there is no such thing as a combustion engine that is 100% efficient. Granted all our engines have advanced over the past 10 years but they are still not 100% efficient and they don't burn 100% of the fuel that are passed through them it's nearly imposible by todays technology. This is what my suspicions are on what I and others are sensitive to. There are other people who are unfazed by whatever is in the air by these major airports. |
#2
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Eastward Bound wrote:
This is what my suspicions are on what I and others are sensitive to. There are other people who are unfazed by whatever is in the air by these major airports. Just on the offhand chance that you're not trolling, maybe a psychiatrist could help. Tim |
#3
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Eastward Bound wrote:
Everytime I'm near a BIG and busy airport I start to feel a little weak and lightheaded. Almost as if I'm going to faint but I don't. Go to http://www.coasttocoastam.com/ search for "Contrails" You may get some answers or end up with more questions. Or be able to start a new topic. FWIW Wearin my foil hat..... WW |
#4
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In article ,
Eastward Bound wrote: I have my doubts that it's carbon monoxide but I could be wrong. CO poisoning doesn't just "go away", the molecules bind to hemiglobin more strongly than O2 and the effects linger. -- Ben Jackson http://www.ben.com/ |
#5
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"James M. Knox" wrote in message ...
(Eastward Bound) wrote in om: Everytime I'm near a BIG and busy airport I start to feel a little weak and lightheaded. Almost as if I'm going to faint but I don't. I never had a problem with emises or nausea and haven't yet vomited when I thought of sick thoughts and I never get motion/ sea sickness. I think to myself that this only happens in cities up against a major airport like LAX and O'Hare. Could it be the Carbon Monoxide? First, I am tempted to say that most of us ont his list get weak and lightheaded when near aircraft that we will never be able to afford. G I think you can fully rule out CO -- just doesn't work that way. Everyone would be suffering. Further, CO levels aren't particularly high near even the biggest airports - they are **MUCH** worse at a congested intersection in a big city on a calm (non-windy) day. Unfortunately, so are most other petro-related combustion byproducts. That rules out most things. What, if anything, does that leave? Not much that I can think of. Fueling of the big aircraft is done through sealed hoses - releasing a lot less fumes than you get when filling up your family car. Further, Jet-A doesn't evaporate anywhere near as quickly as auto gasoline. Perhaps you are having a reaction to the fertilizers that some of them may use on the grass? Or to the grass itself. If you are REAL close you CAN sometimes get a whiff of kerosene as one takes off. This is very brief, but you could be hyper-sensitive. Easy enough to test - go to a service station and get a couple of cents worth of diesel. Whiff it (in very light amounts - we KNOW you can get sick if you sniff enough of it). [This is NOT a recommended practice.] If you do react to it, then stay away from more and more of the newer automobiles, and never ever move to Europe. ----------------------------------------------- James M. Knox TriSoft ph 512-385-0316 1109-A Shady Lane fax 512-366-4331 Austin, Tx 78721 ----------------------------------------------- Wow; thanks for being so informative... It's got to be something in the air. As soon as I open the window of my car and take in the first breath I get the above mentioned symptoms. This doesn't happen when I'm on the Freeway for whatever reason, only when I'm in or around the surrounding areas near the airport. I don't get the symptoms when I'm inside the airport terminal or onboard an airplane. My Aunt who lives close by to LAX said that the tile roof used to be red or bright orange when it was new. Because of the bad air from all the high traffic or aircraft the roof is now green. It must have been some kind of chemical reaction. Once I had to spend two nights nearby LAX at a Hotel. I felt the symptoms the whole time I was there and every time I went outside it got worse. I would think that I got used to the lightheadedness but then it would come back all over again as soon as I stepped outside onto the balcony and I would watch all of those Jumbo Jets fly over my head and over the Hotel. We were situated near a flight path. Aviation fuel isn't the same kind of fuel as gasoline. There must be some kind of chemical in the air that is released when aviation fuel is burned by the jet engines. The family used to own a VW Rabbit Diesel pick up truck. I remember refueling that truck and getting the diesel on my hands from the pump and I know the distinct smell of it. I know that I'm not allergic to it. So that rules out Diesel. Don't parks and stadiums use the aforementioned chemicals you stated was used in Airports? If it's the same then you can rule that out since I highly doubt it having gone to many parks before along with places with treated lawns. Washington DC has a lot of that and I never got the symptoms. Whatever it is I should find out what is causing this. Who knows, maybe I might need to be rushed to the Emergency Room once I get to witness a space shuttle taking off up close and personal for the first time. Maybe whatever is in that Aviation fuel is in Jet fuel used for the space shuttle. Hemoglobin: The iron-containing respiratory pigment in red blood cells of vertebrates, consisting of about 6 percent heme and 94 percent globin. short for hematinoglobulin |
#6
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"James M. Knox" wrote in message ...
(Eastward Bound) wrote in om: My Aunt who lives close by to LAX said that the tile roof used to be red or bright orange when it was new. Because of the bad air from all the high traffic or aircraft the roof is now green. It must have been some kind of chemical reaction. If the tiles are clay, it's probably mold -- a very common allergen and caused primarily by the humidity. BTW, there are LOTS of things in the air around LAX - especially when the wind is from the south (Torrance). Only a few of them are actual things that SHOULD be in the air. Drive south a few miles and look at all the street signs - all rusting away. [Torrance is basically the petro-chemical refinery district.] It sure is. Not too long ago they had a nasty fire in the refinery that put up black smoke that can be seen from miles and miles away. Aviation fuel isn't the same kind of fuel as gasoline. There must be some kind of chemical in the air that is released when aviation fuel is burned by the jet engines. Correct. AVGAS (which is what the small piston-powered general aviation aircraft use) is very similar to auto gasoline. In fact, a number of these small aircraft actually USE auto gasoline. The Jet engines use Jet-A, which is basically kerosene. It's very similar (although not identical) to diesel fuel used in diesel engine cars. I would expecct any reaction to one to also equate to a reaction to the other, but ... You can get kerosene from most any hardware and/or camping store. You might try to see if you react to it. I'm OK with Kerosene. We used to keep Kerosene lamps in the garage just in case of a black out. I have messed with Kerosene lamps before with no reaction at all to the smell of the Kerosene. Don't parks and stadiums use the aforementioned chemicals you stated was used in Airports? If it's the same then you can rule that out since I highly doubt it having gone to many parks before along with places with treated lawns. There are lots of different lawn chemicals, and commercial places (stadiums, airports, etc.) often use things that aren't available to the average homeowner. However, with all the EPA regulations in place, I would expect airports to be much BETTER (less harmful and less of it) than things like stadiums and golf courses. In either event, I believe you said you have this reaction at ALL the major airports you visit. Unlikely to be fertilizers or pesticides. Who knows, maybe the air quality in and around LAX is a lot dirtier then they would like to admit. Maybe money is involved, who knows... Whatever it is I should find out what is causing this. Who knows, maybe I might need to be rushed to the Emergency Room once I get to witness a space shuttle taking off up close and personal for the first time. Maybe whatever is in that Aviation fuel is in Jet fuel used for the space shuttle. Completely different stuff... solid propellants, plus hydrogen and oxygen (makes water when burned). Again, I'd worry more about the fertilizers on the lawn where you are standing. ----------------------------------------------- James M. Knox TriSoft ph 512-385-0316 1109-A Shady Lane fax 512-366-4331 Austin, Tx 78721 ----------------------------------------------- |
#7
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I think I might be onto something.
What's making me sick isn't what's in the air so much as what vibrates it. YES I'm suggesting that the supersonic resonance/sound waves from the jet engines spinning so fast (it's outer propeller edges going supersonic speed) effects people, some people. What I think I am getting is a mild case of "malaise". Not to confuse with "Verdigo". malaise: 1. A vague feeling of bodily discomfort. 2. A general sense of depression or unease. I'm telling you, whatever is affecting me near the major airports starts as sudden as it stops/goes away. Having the problem being sound related makes perfect sense. It's described as a hundred thousand little sonic booms per minute. It must be effecting my inner ear. The whole effect on my body is vague and temporary. This would explain why I'm not effected when I'm inside a building, inside the airport, or inside an airplane. Passenger Jumbo Jets are well sound insulated for passenger comfort. If there were no sound insulation at all, I'll bet that the noise would be so unbearable that people would just keel over everywhere and throw up. So how does this information help people like me? It just all goes to show that some people have no buisness living anywhere near a flight path or an Airport esp. a major Airport. I'm not allergic to anything and I never have been. I have always been NKA as well as NKDA 100%, it's a true blessing... |
#8
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Fueling of the big aircraft is done through sealed hoses - releasing a lot less fumes than you get when filling up your family car. Not true---think about it----while that fuel is going into the tank, something has to come out of the tank. Look into tank vent valves used on large single point refueled aircraft. I remember a vent valve failing on a B-58 and saw the side of the fuselage that was blown out by the pressure build up. Mac At service stations, here is what happens. The car fills, and the coaxial hose catches the car's exiting vapor and pushes it into the tank that now has 20 gallons less liquid than it did before. If there's any extra vapor to vent, there's a sort-of open air water heater on the building roof. It has a pilot light and gets combustion air drafted in from the below-ground tanks vents. (There are other schemes but this got you ""free"" hot H2O...) The tanker arrives. The {say} 8000 gallons of gasoline is drained into the underground tank. That displaces 8000 gallons of vapor which is shoved into the now liquid-empty but vapor-full tanker. The tanker goes back to the marketing terminal and gets refilled. It passes that 8Kgal of vapor to the terminal. There, there is a "vapor recovery unit" - a stripped down micro refinery that mixes the vapor with base stock ("lean oil" I doono why that name), giving you liquid almost-gasoline. Say you get 1 gal of liquid for every 100 of vapor. That a-g is then injected in small fractions into #2 Diesel and/or #2 Heat{ing Oil}. In doing so, it lowers the flash point from oh 120F to 115. That's how vapor recovery works in the car biz. Aircraft? Well, vice automotive volumes, and Jet-A; avgas is a penny vs the DoD budget worth, so skip that. (Even so, Southern Califunny may regulate; I doono..). As for JetA, I never saw V-R in action when I worked on such at CLE but maybe it's now at LAX etc. The basics would be the same. I suspect they would use the recovered vapor in ramp lice, not aircraft, as its characteristics will vary somewhat... -- A host is a host from coast to & no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433 is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433 |
#9
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#10
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Mackfly wrote:
From: "James M. Knox" Fueling of the big aircraft is done through sealed hoses - releasing a lot less fumes than you get when filling up your family car. Not true---think about it----while that fuel is going into the tank, something has to come out of the tank. Look into tank vent valves used on large single point refueled aircraft. I remember a vent valve failing on a B-58 and saw the side of the fuselage that was blown out by the pressure build up. Mac Also, prior to June 1970 (when I retired from the U.S. Air Force) there was a picture on the cover of one of the AF Magazines showing a C-130 (Herc) at Edwards AFB, California with one wing in the usual horizontal position, but the other "broke" between the two engines. That wing tip was resting on the ground. Cause? Some work had been done on the fuel vent system and the vents on the side of the "broken" wing were left plugged or shut for one reason or other. Then they single point refueled the plane. When sufficient pressure built up, the wing failed. Lou. |
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