So what happens when 100LL is gone anyway?

ISTR there's only one company that still makes TEL (I think it's in the
UK?) When they decide the cost isn't worth it, what then? Sure, the
lower HP Lyc's and Cont's can probably run mogas without issue, but the
higher HP turbo'd engines won't be so happy without lead. The FADEC mod
being developed by Aerosance might be a solution for some engines by
computerized ignition retarding, but that's not a cheap fix. Anyone
read anything more about the coming end of avgas?

wrote:
ISTR there's only one company that still makes TEL (I think it's in the
UK?) When they decide the cost isn't worth it, what then?

Going to Oshkosh? There's usually a seminar there with reps from the fuel
companies and researchers.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

wrote in message
oups.com...
ISTR there's only one company that still makes TEL (I think it's in the
UK?) When they decide the cost isn't worth it, what then? Sure, the
lower HP Lyc's and Cont's can probably run mogas without issue, but the
higher HP turbo'd engines won't be so happy without lead. The FADEC mod
being developed by Aerosance might be a solution for some engines by
computerized ignition retarding, but that's not a cheap fix. Anyone
read anything more about the coming end of avgas?

Don't know about the small airplane folks, but the warbird guys are going
to be mad as hell. We have the power back on a P51 now to 45 inches on
takeoff because of the fuel restriction. Any lower and the damn airplane
will be taking off at cruise power!! :-)
Dudley henriques

Interesting.. a month or so ago at the Corsairs over Connecticut
weekend at Sikorsky Airport I spoke to the owner of one of the F4Us
about just that. With 115/130 being long gone they're limited to 50in
on takeoff to keep the engine from making bad sounds.

- Diesel/Jet-A as made by Thielert
- Small turbines as made by Innodyn
- Ignition systems as made by Gami (Prism)

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

That's fine for new production & some retrofits, but what about all the
Navajos/Twin Cessnas/Barons/etc. where re-engining would cost more than
the aircraft?

That's fine for new production & some retrofits, but what about all the
Navajos/Twin Cessnas/Barons/etc. where re-engining would cost more than
the aircraft?

wrote:

ISTR there's only one company that still makes TEL (I think it's in
the
UK?) When they decide the cost isn't worth it, what then?

Don't see a problem there. Anything we must have, we will pay for,
until the price becomes so high.... Think addictive illegal drugs and
sex from better than your usual skank entrepreneur. I suspect the
profits of the UK company on this are enormous. It's one company
because of a low volume product and for whatever reason competitors
anywhere can't or don't wish to come in. It's UK (or could be
anywhere else) because of our EPA rules here, but not their similar
rules on exports of such products. The main problem is the EPA keeps
pushing for the big players to come up with a plan. Like a low-cost
way to modify/recertify existing engines.

Fred F.

wrote in message
oups.com...
ISTR there's only one company that still makes TEL (I think it's in the
UK?) When they decide the cost isn't worth it, what then? Sure, the
lower HP Lyc's and Cont's can probably run mogas without issue, but the
higher HP turbo'd engines won't be so happy without lead. The FADEC mod
being developed by Aerosance might be a solution for some engines by
computerized ignition retarding, but that's not a cheap fix.

http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/189994-1.html

Motor Head 7: Are We Making It Harder Than It Needs To Be?
June 19, 2005
By Marc Cook,

....
"I have carefully studied the Aerosance-produced FADEC for the Continental
engines -- but, in the interests of full disclosure, have not flown it yet
(more on why later) -- and I believe I have a good understanding of how the
system works. It does a couple of things that I would not do to my own
engine. For one, it strives to set the mixture for best power on takeoff and
climb. That's fine for performance, and I would expect the airplanes powered
by the new FADEC to have slightly better takeoff and initial climb
performance; not by a lot, but it would be noticeable.

The trouble with best-power mixture at high power settings is that it puts
the engine right near the point of highest cylinder pressure and, therefore,
will create very high CHTs. The whole point of running extra fuel during
takeoff -- and why so many savvy owners of big-bore Continental engines
insist that the redline-gauge fuel flow is a minimum not a maximum value --
is to slow down the combustion process and reduce cylinder pressures. The
result is moderated CHTs. Well, shouldn't the computer take care of that?
Sure, it does; but my reading of the specs (confirmed by the published
reports) is that the FADEC doesn't start to respond until one of the
cylinders has reached 435 ºF, when it then starts adding fuel and/or
retarding ignition timing. Unless that installation is dramatically well
cooled for takeoff and initial climb -- thus making it way over-cooled for
cruise and descent -- I'm fairly sure one or more of the cylinders will
reach that threshold in the initial climb and the computer will have to
respond. "

Anyone
read anything more about the coming end of avgas?

http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182149-1.html

----------------

Lead in the Hogwash

April 27, 2002
By John Deakin

Tetraethyl lead has been gone from automobile gasoline for two decades, and
it's only a matter of time before leaded avgas goes away as well. Despite a
huge amount of industry research, nobody yet has a suitable replacement
fuel, and nobody's yet quite sure what will happen to today's piston-powered
fleet when the supply of 100LL dries up. AVweb's John Deakin dispels a bunch
of myths about TEL, explains what it does and why it's so indispensable in
high-performance recips, and talks about one solution to the coming
unleaded-avgas crisis that actually works
---------
Hopefully this: http://www.gami.com/prism.html

Unfortunately, the page is 3 1/2 years old and still no STC. A year and a
half ago they said they were HOPING for 2nd half of 2005.


--
Matt
---------------------
Matthew W. Barrow
Site-Fill Homes, LLC.
Montrose, CO

On 19 Jul 2005 07:39:01 -0700, wrote:

ISTR there's only one company that still makes TEL (I think it's in the
UK?) When they decide the cost isn't worth it, what then? Sure, the
lower HP Lyc's and Cont's can probably run mogas without issue, but the
higher HP turbo'd engines won't be so happy without lead. The FADEC mod
being developed by Aerosance might be a solution for some engines by
computerized ignition retarding, but that's not a cheap fix. Anyone
read anything more about the coming end of avgas?

So what happened when the 100/115 green gas went away?

One of the scariest times in my life was having green gas all over me
when the pilot of the A-26 asked me to put just a little more gas in
it.

Mike Weller