Robert M. Gary wrote:
> No, not strickly speaking. Actual CAP missions are paid 100% by the
> AirForce. However, they often run out of money for training so you may
> end up spending money getting checked out in the plane, etc. However,
> when you get paged asking if you can fly a Search and Rescue mission,
> if you have a commercial ticket, its 100% paid for. You can also get
> free flying time moving planes from place to place for missions as well
> as giving orientation rides to cadets (although those seem to run out
> of money pretty quick).
>
> -Robert
>

I guess this doesn't apply to me, but out of curiosity - if you don't
have a commercial, you have to pay to fly missions?

Unless the FAA regs have changed, CAP has an exemption that allows their
to be reimbursed for the CAP missions. Note, I didn't say "paid" (as in
a paycheck), but reimbursed for the costs. See CAPR 60-1 for details.

Chris

Rachel wrote:
> Robert M. Gary wrote:
>
>> No, not strickly speaking. Actual CAP missions are paid 100% by the
>> AirForce. However, they often run out of money for training so you may
>> end up spending money getting checked out in the plane, etc. However,
>> when you get paged asking if you can fly a Search and Rescue mission,
>> if you have a commercial ticket, its 100% paid for. You can also get
>> free flying time moving planes from place to place for missions as well
>> as giving orientation rides to cadets (although those seem to run out
>> of money pretty quick).
>>
>> -Robert
>>
>
> I guess this doesn't apply to me, but out of curiosity - if you don't
> have a commercial, you have to pay to fly missions?

"And that is why I'm happily pushing paper as a non-wrenching A&P while

most of my friends are living 8 to an apartment and flying CRJ's.
Maybe
I don't have a severe enough case of the flying disease, I don't
know... "

I left commuter flying 10 years ago when I went for a ground job
(dispatcher) for financial survival. Are commuter pilots still making
next to nothing today still? Even with those nice new CRJ's ??

wrote:
> "And that is why I'm happily pushing paper as a non-wrenching A&P while
>
> most of my friends are living 8 to an apartment and flying CRJ's.
> Maybe
> I don't have a severe enough case of the flying disease, I don't
> know... "
>
> I left commuter flying 10 years ago when I went for a ground job
> (dispatcher) for financial survival. Are commuter pilots still making
> next to nothing today still? Even with those nice new CRJ's ??

I have a friend who is a captain (can't remember which airline right
now) and is making somewhere around $40,000, which isn't too bad. The
other guys I know who are flying right seat in turboprops are making
$17,000-$22,000. I don't know if that's next to nothing, but I know I'd
have to give up a lot on that kind of money.

Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will vary, but
a Captain for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000 annually
and a co-pilot about half of that as a starting salary.
Corporate jobs may even pay more but require more hours and
extra certificates such as A&P.

Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper or
plastic" at the market. Pilots need to learn to insist on a
proper wage, but damn it is so much fun to fly.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

"Rachel" > wrote in message
. ..
| wrote:
| > "And that is why I'm happily pushing paper as a
non-wrenching A&P while
| >
| > most of my friends are living 8 to an apartment and
flying CRJ's.
| > Maybe
| > I don't have a severe enough case of the flying disease,
I don't
| > know... "
| >
| > I left commuter flying 10 years ago when I went for a
ground job
| > (dispatcher) for financial survival. Are commuter
pilots still making
| > next to nothing today still? Even with those nice new
CRJ's ??
|
| I have a friend who is a captain (can't remember which
airline right
| now) and is making somewhere around $40,000, which isn't
too bad. The
| other guys I know who are flying right seat in turboprops
are making
| $17,000-$22,000. I don't know if that's next to nothing,
but I know I'd
| have to give up a lot on that kind of money.

Jim Macklin wrote:
> Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will vary, but
> a Captain for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000 annually
> and a co-pilot about half of that as a starting salary.
> Corporate jobs may even pay more but require more hours and
> extra certificates such as A&P.
>
> Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper or
> plastic" at the market. Pilots need to learn to insist on a
> proper wage, but damn it is so much fun to fly.

LOL, no, yearly. I think I should have clarified that my captain friend
is making 40K a year flying CRJ's for a regional, and he just upgraded
(why can't I remember the airline???). The guys I know making 20K are
just out of school commercial pilots with 300 hours.

And don't get me started on the CFI's I know. I hate that most don't
take instructing seriously enough to demand enough money to make a
career out of it.

Rachel wrote:

> Jim Macklin wrote:
>
>> Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will vary, but a Captain
>> for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000 annually and a co-pilot
>> about half of that as a starting salary. Corporate jobs may even pay
>> more but require more hours and extra certificates such as A&P.
>>
>> Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper or plastic" at
>> the market. Pilots need to learn to insist on a proper wage, but damn
>> it is so much fun to fly.
>
>
> LOL, no, yearly. I think I should have clarified that my captain friend
> is making 40K a year flying CRJ's for a regional, and he just upgraded
> (why can't I remember the airline???). The guys I know making 20K are
> just out of school commercial pilots with 300 hours.
>
> And don't get me started on the CFI's I know. I hate that most don't
> take instructing seriously enough to demand enough money to make a
> career out of it.

My first job flying (other than CFI) paid $800 / month (early 70s). It
was a right seat job and required loading / unloading cargo five + days
or nights a week. The job gave me experience and hours but there was
little joy flying that way.

My college roomate went into the Air Force and got his hours that way.
After a successful airline career, he retired.

Inflation since the 70's makes $800 equal about $2,000
today.


"Cal Vanize" > wrote in message
...
| Rachel wrote:
|
| > Jim Macklin wrote:
| >
| >> Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will
vary, but a Captain
| >> for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000 annually and
a co-pilot
| >> about half of that as a starting salary. Corporate jobs
may even pay
| >> more but require more hours and extra certificates such
as A&P.
| >>
| >> Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper
or plastic" at
| >> the market. Pilots need to learn to insist on a proper
wage, but damn
| >> it is so much fun to fly.
| >
| >
| > LOL, no, yearly. I think I should have clarified that
my captain friend
| > is making 40K a year flying CRJ's for a regional, and he
just upgraded
| > (why can't I remember the airline???). The guys I know
making 20K are
| > just out of school commercial pilots with 300 hours.
| >
| > And don't get me started on the CFI's I know. I hate
that most don't
| > take instructing seriously enough to demand enough money
to make a
| > career out of it.
|
| My first job flying (other than CFI) paid $800 / month
(early 70s). It
| was a right seat job and required loading / unloading
cargo five + days
| or nights a week. The job gave me experience and hours
but there was
| little joy flying that way.
|
| My college roomate went into the Air Force and got his
hours that way.
| After a successful airline career, he retired.
|

I would not do that job for $2000 / month even if it meant flying. The
flying part did not offset the awful working conditions.


Jim Macklin wrote:
> Inflation since the 70's makes $800 equal about $2,000
> today.
>
>
> "Cal Vanize" > wrote in message
> ...
> | Rachel wrote:
> |
> | > Jim Macklin wrote:
> | >
> | >> Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will
> vary, but a Captain
> | >> for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000 annually and
> a co-pilot
> | >> about half of that as a starting salary. Corporate jobs
> may even pay
> | >> more but require more hours and extra certificates such
> as A&P.
> | >>
> | >> Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper
> or plastic" at
> | >> the market. Pilots need to learn to insist on a proper
> wage, but damn
> | >> it is so much fun to fly.
> | >
> | >
> | > LOL, no, yearly. I think I should have clarified that
> my captain friend
> | > is making 40K a year flying CRJ's for a regional, and he
> just upgraded
> | > (why can't I remember the airline???). The guys I know
> making 20K are
> | > just out of school commercial pilots with 300 hours.
> | >
> | > And don't get me started on the CFI's I know. I hate
> that most don't
> | > take instructing seriously enough to demand enough money
> to make a
> | > career out of it.
> |
> | My first job flying (other than CFI) paid $800 / month
> (early 70s). It
> | was a right seat job and required loading / unloading
> cargo five + days
> | or nights a week. The job gave me experience and hours
> but there was
> | little joy flying that way.
> |
> | My college roomate went into the Air Force and got his
> hours that way.
> | After a successful airline career, he retired.
> |
>
>

("Rachel" wrote)
> I have a friend who is a captain (can't remember which airline right
> now) and is making somewhere around $40,000, which isn't too bad. The
> other guys I know who are flying right seat in turboprops are making
> $17,000-$22,000. I don't know if that's next to nothing, but I know I'd
> have to give up a lot on that kind of money.


40 hours/week x 50 weeks (the extra 2 weeks are ...extra)

= 2,000 hrs/yr at $1.00/hr ....$2k
= 2,000 hrs/yr at $0.50/hr ....$1k

So, every 50 cents is 1,000 bucks of yearly salary.

(roughly)
$17k ...= $8.50/hr
$20k ...= $10/hr
$22k ...= $11/hr
$40k ...= $20/hr at 40 hrs/week

Or the other way around (approx)
$25/hr ...= $50k
$17/hr ...= $34k
$6/hr ..... = $12k
$5/hr ..... = $10k per year

The extra 2 weeks out of the year are gravy :-)


Montblack

Montblack wrote:
> ("Rachel" wrote)
>
>> I have a friend who is a captain (can't remember which airline right
>> now) and is making somewhere around $40,000, which isn't too bad. The
>> other guys I know who are flying right seat in turboprops are making
>> $17,000-$22,000. I don't know if that's next to nothing, but I know
>> I'd have to give up a lot on that kind of money.
>
>
>
> 40 hours/week x 50 weeks (the extra 2 weeks are ...extra)
>
> = 2,000 hrs/yr at $1.00/hr ....$2k
> = 2,000 hrs/yr at $0.50/hr ....$1k
>
> So, every 50 cents is 1,000 bucks of yearly salary.
>
> (roughly)
> $17k ...= $8.50/hr
> $20k ...= $10/hr
> $22k ...= $11/hr
> $40k ...= $20/hr at 40 hrs/week
>
> Or the other way around (approx)
> $25/hr ...= $50k
> $17/hr ...= $34k
> $6/hr ..... = $12k
> $5/hr ..... = $10k per year
>
> The extra 2 weeks out of the year are gravy :-)
>
>
> Montblack

When you put it that way, it's even worse!

"Rachel" > wrote in message ...
> Jim Macklin wrote:
>> Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will vary, but a Captain for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000
>> annually and a co-pilot about half of that as a starting salary. Corporate jobs may even pay more but require more
>> hours and extra certificates such as A&P.
>>
>> Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper or plastic" at the market. Pilots need to learn to insist on a
>> proper wage, but damn it is so much fun to fly.
>
> LOL, no, yearly. I think I should have clarified that my captain friend is making 40K a year flying CRJ's for a
> regional, and he just upgraded (why can't I remember the airline???). The guys I know making 20K are just out of
> school commercial pilots with 300 hours.
>
> And don't get me started on the CFI's I know. I hate that most don't take instructing seriously enough to demand
> enough money to make a career out of it.
>

Used to be at the airport 6 days a week for roughly 12 hours each day. Flew 6 or so hours/day. Loved it but only lasted
a couple years...

Read an article about some feeder line that paid the newbie pilots something like $12,500 the first year...and the
pilots paid them something like $10,000 for the type rating.

How do you propose that CFIs demand enough money to make a career out of it? CFIs are paid what the market will bear, no
more...

wrote:


>
> I left commuter flying 10 years ago when I went for a ground job
> (dispatcher) for financial survival. Are commuter pilots still making
> next to nothing today still? Even with those nice new CRJ's ??

RJ pilots are being paid what they are worth.

Rachel wrote:


>
> I have a friend who is a captain (can't remember which airline right
> now) and is making somewhere around $40,000, which isn't too bad. The
> other guys I know who are flying right seat in turboprops are making
> $17,000-$22,000. I don't know if that's next to nothing, but I know I'd
> have to give up a lot on that kind of money.

A friend of a friend is the number one seniority copilot at ASA, based
out of SLC. He stayed a copilot until just recently because of the
schedule. Now that ASA is going to merge he told them he will be a
captain for the last 3 years of his career. He was making $60K as a
copilot and will be making $90K as a captain.

..Blueskies. wrote:
> "Rachel" > wrote in message ...
>
>>Jim Macklin wrote:
>>
>>>Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will vary, but a Captain for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000
>>>annually and a co-pilot about half of that as a starting salary. Corporate jobs may even pay more but require more
>>>hours and extra certificates such as A&P.
>>>
>>>Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper or plastic" at the market. Pilots need to learn to insist on a
>>>proper wage, but damn it is so much fun to fly.
>>
>>LOL, no, yearly. I think I should have clarified that my captain friend is making 40K a year flying CRJ's for a
>>regional, and he just upgraded (why can't I remember the airline???). The guys I know making 20K are just out of
>>school commercial pilots with 300 hours.
>>
>>And don't get me started on the CFI's I know. I hate that most don't take instructing seriously enough to demand
>>enough money to make a career out of it.
>>
>
>
> Used to be at the airport 6 days a week for roughly 12 hours each day. Flew 6 or so hours/day. Loved it but only lasted
> a couple years...
>
> Read an article about some feeder line that paid the newbie pilots something like $12,500 the first year...and the
> pilots paid them something like $10,000 for the type rating.
>
> How do you propose that CFIs demand enough money to make a career out of it? CFIs are paid what the market will bear, no
> more...

Yeah, and that's because most people view instructing as a necessary
evil instead of a possible career.

"Rachel" > wrote in message ...
> .Blueskies. wrote:
>> "Rachel" > wrote in message ...
>>
>>>Jim Macklin wrote:
>>>
>>>>Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will vary, but a Captain for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000
>>>>annually and a co-pilot about half of that as a starting salary. Corporate jobs may even pay more but require more
>>>>hours and extra certificates such as A&P.
>>>>
>>>>Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper or plastic" at the market. Pilots need to learn to insist on
>>>>a proper wage, but damn it is so much fun to fly.
>>>
>>>LOL, no, yearly. I think I should have clarified that my captain friend is making 40K a year flying CRJ's for a
>>>regional, and he just upgraded (why can't I remember the airline???). The guys I know making 20K are just out of
>>>school commercial pilots with 300 hours.
>>>
>>>And don't get me started on the CFI's I know. I hate that most don't take instructing seriously enough to demand
>>>enough money to make a career out of it.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Used to be at the airport 6 days a week for roughly 12 hours each day. Flew 6 or so hours/day. Loved it but only
>> lasted a couple years...
>>
>> Read an article about some feeder line that paid the newbie pilots something like $12,500 the first year...and the
>> pilots paid them something like $10,000 for the type rating.
>>
>> How do you propose that CFIs demand enough money to make a career out of it? CFIs are paid what the market will bear,
>> no more...
>
> Yeah, and that's because most people view instructing as a necessary evil instead of a possible career.

Just like the teachers at the local schools - who is going to pay them what they are worth? Maybe someday...

..Blueskies. wrote:
> "Rachel" > wrote in message ...
>
>>.Blueskies. wrote:
>>
>>>"Rachel" > wrote in message ...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Jim Macklin wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will vary, but a Captain for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000
>>>>>annually and a co-pilot about half of that as a starting salary. Corporate jobs may even pay more but require more
>>>>>hours and extra certificates such as A&P.
>>>>>
>>>>>Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper or plastic" at the market. Pilots need to learn to insist on
>>>>>a proper wage, but damn it is so much fun to fly.
>>>>
>>>>LOL, no, yearly. I think I should have clarified that my captain friend is making 40K a year flying CRJ's for a
>>>>regional, and he just upgraded (why can't I remember the airline???). The guys I know making 20K are just out of
>>>>school commercial pilots with 300 hours.
>>>>
>>>>And don't get me started on the CFI's I know. I hate that most don't take instructing seriously enough to demand
>>>>enough money to make a career out of it.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Used to be at the airport 6 days a week for roughly 12 hours each day. Flew 6 or so hours/day. Loved it but only
>>>lasted a couple years...
>>>
>>>Read an article about some feeder line that paid the newbie pilots something like $12,500 the first year...and the
>>>pilots paid them something like $10,000 for the type rating.
>>>
>>>How do you propose that CFIs demand enough money to make a career out of it? CFIs are paid what the market will bear,
>>>no more...
>>
>>Yeah, and that's because most people view instructing as a necessary evil instead of a possible career.
>
>
> Just like the teachers at the local schools - who is going to pay them what they are worth? Maybe someday...

I don't know, none of my teachers were worth anything until I got to the
university level..

"Rachel" > wrote in message ...
> .Blueskies. wrote:
>> "Rachel" > wrote in message ...
>>
>>>.Blueskies. wrote:
>>>
>>>>"Rachel" > wrote in message ...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Jim Macklin wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will vary, but a Captain for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000
>>>>>>annually and a co-pilot about half of that as a starting salary. Corporate jobs may even pay more but require more
>>>>>>hours and extra certificates such as A&P.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper or plastic" at the market. Pilots need to learn to insist
>>>>>>on a proper wage, but damn it is so much fun to fly.
>>>>>
>>>>>LOL, no, yearly. I think I should have clarified that my captain friend is making 40K a year flying CRJ's for a
>>>>>regional, and he just upgraded (why can't I remember the airline???). The guys I know making 20K are just out of
>>>>>school commercial pilots with 300 hours.
>>>>>
>>>>>And don't get me started on the CFI's I know. I hate that most don't take instructing seriously enough to demand
>>>>>enough money to make a career out of it.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Used to be at the airport 6 days a week for roughly 12 hours each day. Flew 6 or so hours/day. Loved it but only
>>>>lasted a couple years...
>>>>
>>>>Read an article about some feeder line that paid the newbie pilots something like $12,500 the first year...and the
>>>>pilots paid them something like $10,000 for the type rating.
>>>>
>>>>How do you propose that CFIs demand enough money to make a career out of it? CFIs are paid what the market will
>>>>bear, no more...
>>>
>>>Yeah, and that's because most people view instructing as a necessary evil instead of a possible career.
>>
>>
>> Just like the teachers at the local schools - who is going to pay them what they are worth? Maybe someday...
>
> I don't know, none of my teachers were worth anything until I got to the university level..
>

Well, I guess you gets what you pays for! ;-)

..Blueskies. wrote:
> "Rachel" > wrote in message ...
>
>>.Blueskies. wrote:
>>
>>>"Rachel" > wrote in message ...
>>>
>>>
>>>>.Blueskies. wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>"Rachel" > wrote in message ...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Jim Macklin wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Are those monthly salaries? Seriously, wages will vary, but a Captain for an airline should earn $40,000-75,000
>>>>>>>annually and a co-pilot about half of that as a starting salary. Corporate jobs may even pay more but require more
>>>>>>>hours and extra certificates such as A&P.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Bag boys make over $20,000 stuffing bread into "paper or plastic" at the market. Pilots need to learn to insist
>>>>>>>on a proper wage, but damn it is so much fun to fly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>LOL, no, yearly. I think I should have clarified that my captain friend is making 40K a year flying CRJ's for a
>>>>>>regional, and he just upgraded (why can't I remember the airline???). The guys I know making 20K are just out of
>>>>>>school commercial pilots with 300 hours.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>And don't get me started on the CFI's I know. I hate that most don't take instructing seriously enough to demand
>>>>>>enough money to make a career out of it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Used to be at the airport 6 days a week for roughly 12 hours each day. Flew 6 or so hours/day. Loved it but only
>>>>>lasted a couple years...
>>>>>
>>>>>Read an article about some feeder line that paid the newbie pilots something like $12,500 the first year...and the
>>>>>pilots paid them something like $10,000 for the type rating.
>>>>>
>>>>>How do you propose that CFIs demand enough money to make a career out of it? CFIs are paid what the market will
>>>>>bear, no more...
>>>>
>>>>Yeah, and that's because most people view instructing as a necessary evil instead of a possible career.
>>>
>>>
>>>Just like the teachers at the local schools - who is going to pay them what they are worth? Maybe someday...
>>
>>I don't know, none of my teachers were worth anything until I got to the university level..
>>
>
>
> Well, I guess you gets what you pays for! ;-)

I don't know about that....I went to high school in a VERY well paying
district (teachers STARTING at $60,000) and they still sucked. But this
isn't a thread about that. :-)

"Rachel" > wrote

> I don't know about that....I went to high school in a VERY well paying
> district (teachers STARTING at $60,000) and they still sucked. But this
> isn't a thread about that. :-)

Where? I may have to consider a move!
--
Jim in NC