Corporate jet hourly cost?

[Roger Long]

What's the rough hourly cost of operating a high end corporate jet such as a
Gulfstream?
--
Roger Long

[Tony]

I think its 250,000 to buy in and you get 50 hours a year. If you go
over the 50 hours its 1,200 per hour

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[David H]

Roger Long wrote:

> What's the rough hourly cost of operating a high end corporate jet such as a
> Gulfstream?

If ever the old adage applies, this is it....

"If you have to ask, you probabl;y can't afford it."

(I sure as hell can't!)

David H
Boeing Field (BFI), Seattle, WA
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Visit the Pacific Northwest Flying forum:
http://www.smartgroups.com/groups/pnwflying

[Mike Rapoport]

He asked about a Gulfstream not a CitationJet.

Mike
MU-2

"Tony" > wrote in message
...
> I think its 250,000 to buy in and you get 50 hours a year. If you go
> over the 50 hours its 1,200 per hour
>
> *** Sent via http://www.automationtools.com ***
> Add a newsgroup interface to your website today.

[Mike Rapoport]

About $4-5000/hr not including depreciation. You pay for the time for the
jet to get to where you want to start your trip, then for your trip and then
to return to its base, so you will be paying significantly more than that
for the portion where you are on the airplane.

Mike
MU-2


"Roger Long" m> wrote in
message ...
> What's the rough hourly cost of operating a high end corporate jet such as
a
> Gulfstream?
> --
> Roger Long
>
>

[EDR]

In article >, Roger Long
m> wrote:

> What's the rough hourly cost of operating a high end corporate jet such as a
> Gulfstream?

Roger, see if you can find an August 2003 issue of Business Commercial
Aviation lying around the airport. It is the annual Operations issue
and compares total costs of operating turboprops and jets.

[Tom S.]

In article >, Roger Long
m> wrote:
> What's the rough hourly cost of operating a high end corporate jet such as
a
> Gulfstream?

http://www.jetsales.com/stage/jsftbuyers/aircraft_comparisons.html

This site as cost breakdowns for various types. Use the numbers with a grain
of salt; they use $3.25 @ gallon of Jet-A, $56 an hour for "catering"...

They use $832 an hour for a CitationJet, but I know of some people that are
running about $615 an hour by shopping around.

[Tom S.]

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
.net...
> About $4-5000/hr not including depreciation. You pay for the time for the
> jet to get to where you want to start your trip, then for your trip and
then
> to return to its base, so you will be paying significantly more than that
> for the portion where you are on the airplane.
>
> Mike
> MU-2
>
$2850 for a Gulfstream III, including crew, maint reserve, catering...

http://www.jetsales.com/stage/jsftbuyers/aircraft_comparisons.html

[Rich]

I met a guy at OSH who manages a fleet of high end corporate jets, we
didnt get into the hourly costs but he did throw out some interesting
numbers:

- annual insurance premium on the G-V was $275,000, with a $700
Million liability limit and $54 million hull value. To go to Germany,
some other special liability coverage was required, at an additional
cost of about $40,000
- even G-V owners long for the latest gadgets - he recently installed
the new infrared HUD, at a cost of $600,000. Said the pilots really
startled the controllers one day because two aircraft in front had
flown the missed approach, and the G-V pilots called the runway in
sight at 10 miles out!
- every day it doesn't fly still costs $10,000

Richard

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message >...
> He asked about a Gulfstream not a CitationJet.
>
> Mike
> MU-2

[Mike Rapoport]

Maybe if your fuel is free. They list $1600/hr for a Citation X which burns
over $900 in fuel per hour. There is no way that crew, maintenance,
overhaul reserves ect costs less than $700/hr.

Mike
MU-2


"Tom S." > wrote in message
...
>
> "Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
> .net...
> > About $4-5000/hr not including depreciation. You pay for the time for
the
> > jet to get to where you want to start your trip, then for your trip and
> then
> > to return to its base, so you will be paying significantly more than
that
> > for the portion where you are on the airplane.
> >
> > Mike
> > MU-2
> >
> $2850 for a Gulfstream III, including crew, maint reserve, catering...
>
> http://www.jetsales.com/stage/jsftbuyers/aircraft_comparisons.html
>
>
>

[Tom S.]

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
nk.net...
> Maybe if your fuel is free. They list $1600/hr for a Citation X which
burns
> over $900 in fuel per hour. There is no way that crew, maintenance,
> overhaul reserves ect costs less than $700/hr.
>
> Mike
> MU-2

They quote $1416 for fuel.


From their web site:
http://www.jetsales.com/stage/jsftbuyers/aircraft_comparisons.html

Gulfstream III : Included in Total Cost/Flt. Hour : $2,859.71
Fuel --- 1,416.00
Fuel Additives --- 0.00
Lubricants --- 0.00
Maintenance Labor --- 369.75
Parts Airframe/Eng/Avion --- 378.53
Engine Restoration --- 319.80
Thrust Reverser Overhaul --- 17.00
APU Overhaul --- 31.35
Dynamic Comp/Life Ltd Parts --- 0.00
Landing Parking --- 52.28
Crew Expenses -- 135.00
supplies/Catering --- 140.00
Other --- 0.00
Fractional Cost.Hour + Tax --- 0.00

>
>
> "Tom S." > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
> > .net...
> > > About $4-5000/hr not including depreciation. You pay for the time for
> the
> > > jet to get to where you want to start your trip, then for your trip
and
> > then
> > > to return to its base, so you will be paying significantly more than
> that
> > > for the portion where you are on the airplane.
> > >
> > > Mike
> > > MU-2
> > >
> > $2850 for a Gulfstream III, including crew, maint reserve, catering...
> >
> > http://www.jetsales.com/stage/jsftbuyers/aircraft_comparisons.html
> >
> >
> >
>
>

[CarSalesman]

"Tom S." > wrote in message
...
>
>
>
> From their web site:
> http://www.jetsales.com/stage/jsftbuyers/aircraft_comparisons.html
>
> Gulfstream III : Included in Total Cost/Flt. Hour : $2,859.71
> Fuel --- 1,416.00
> Fuel Additives --- 0.00
> Lubricants --- 0.00
> Maintenance Labor --- 369.75
> Parts Airframe/Eng/Avion --- 378.53
> Engine Restoration --- 319.80
> Thrust Reverser Overhaul --- 17.00
> APU Overhaul --- 31.35
> Dynamic Comp/Life Ltd Parts --- 0.00
> Landing Parking --- 52.28
> Crew Expenses -- 135.00
> supplies/Catering --- 140.00
> Other --- 0.00
> Fractional Cost.Hour + Tax --- 0.00
>

So I guess things like...
- interest
- depreciation
- hangar
- insurance

....are all free? It appears the figures given at jetsales.com are
only for variable costs.

don

[Mike Rapoport]

So is the "crew expense" include their salary and benefits or is it only
meals, hotels. rental car ect? If the plane fly's 500hrs a year that is only
$67.5k for two pilots, their recurrent training (training will cost many
thousand per year and they will need transportation, hotel, meals ect for
the week that they are training) and a flight attendant? Even at 1000hrs/yr
the numbers don't work. The other bugaboo for jets is that on short trips,
fuel burn can be double. I'm not debating the figures since I don't have a
G-III but they seem low compared to aircraft I am familiar with.

When I was a student pilot, I saw an ad for a Commander 114B that claimed a
cost of ownership of $2000/month. I called them to buy one and they
explained that the $2000 figure was after tax if you lived in the highest
tax jurisdiction. It also assumed that you got great deals on fuel and
maintenance. I think it also was net of the airline fares that you saved by
flying yourself. I have been skeptical of suspiciously low cost claims ever
since.

Mike

MU-2


"Tom S." > wrote in message
...
>
> "Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
> nk.net...
> > Maybe if your fuel is free. They list $1600/hr for a Citation X which
> burns
> > over $900 in fuel per hour. There is no way that crew, maintenance,
> > overhaul reserves ect costs less than $700/hr.
> >
> > Mike
> > MU-2
>
> They quote $1416 for fuel.
>
>
> From their web site:
> http://www.jetsales.com/stage/jsftbuyers/aircraft_comparisons.html
>
> Gulfstream III : Included in Total Cost/Flt. Hour : $2,859.71
> Fuel --- 1,416.00
> Fuel Additives --- 0.00
> Lubricants --- 0.00
> Maintenance Labor --- 369.75
> Parts Airframe/Eng/Avion --- 378.53
> Engine Restoration --- 319.80
> Thrust Reverser Overhaul --- 17.00
> APU Overhaul --- 31.35
> Dynamic Comp/Life Ltd Parts --- 0.00
> Landing Parking --- 52.28
> Crew Expenses -- 135.00
> supplies/Catering --- 140.00
> Other --- 0.00
> Fractional Cost.Hour + Tax --- 0.00
>
> >
> >
> > "Tom S." > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > "Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
> > > .net...
> > > > About $4-5000/hr not including depreciation. You pay for the time
for
> > the
> > > > jet to get to where you want to start your trip, then for your trip
> and
> > > then
> > > > to return to its base, so you will be paying significantly more than
> > that
> > > > for the portion where you are on the airplane.
> > > >
> > > > Mike
> > > > MU-2
> > > >
> > > $2850 for a Gulfstream III, including crew, maint reserve, catering...
> > >
> > > http://www.jetsales.com/stage/jsftbuyers/aircraft_comparisons.html
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

[Tom S.]

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
nk.net...
> So is the "crew expense" include their salary and benefits or is it only
> meals, hotels. rental car ect? If the plane fly's 500hrs a year that is
only
> $67.5k for two pilots, their recurrent training (training will cost many
> thousand per year and they will need transportation, hotel, meals ect for
> the week that they are training) and a flight attendant? Even at
1000hrs/yr
> the numbers don't work. The other bugaboo for jets is that on short trips,
> fuel burn can be double. I'm not debating the figures since I don't have a
> G-III but they seem low compared to aircraft I am familiar with.

For a Citation III :
http://www.omnijet.com/database/cit3710/cit3710costs.xls

>
> When I was a student pilot, I saw an ad for a Commander 114B that claimed
a
> cost of ownership of $2000/month. I called them to buy one and they
> explained that the $2000 figure was after tax if you lived in the highest
> tax jurisdiction. It also assumed that you got great deals on fuel and
> maintenance. I think it also was net of the airline fares that you saved
by
> flying yourself. I have been skeptical of suspiciously low cost claims
ever
> since.

Notice they ALWAYS use the caveat "As little as $xxxx per month".

Expect the same hype when dealing with car salesmen as when dealing with
aircraft salesmen.

Or any salesman for that matter, or politicians...

[Tony]

Thats why I put I think.


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[MeanMel18]

As Far As Hourly i don't know but mantance alone is about $6 million for the
first 12 yrs of operation.

[Tom S.]

"Scott" > wrote in message ...
> When they did a little show about corporate jets on the History Channel,
it
> was $2k per hour plus landing fees and taxes.\

Which ones? The gas hogs, G-V's...?

A CJ1, with single pilot/owner flown, will run about $620-750 an hour, and a
Gulfstream will run about $4000-5000 an hour for fixed and variable costs

[Scott]

When they did a little show about corporate jets on the History Channel, it
was $2k per hour plus landing fees and taxes.
"MeanMel18" > wrote in message
...
> As Far As Hourly i don't know but mantance alone is about $6 million for
the
> first 12 yrs of operation.


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