Cessna 172H

[Gordon Rich-Phillips]

I am shortly to buy a 172H and would like to hear from owners of their
experiences and any problems.

cheers

Gordon

[Roger Long]

We have a 172 N but many things should be similar.

You can anticipate a sudden difficulty concentrating on work when the sky is
clear and the winds calm.

You may find that there is a sudden degradation in the neatness of your yard
and increased clutter in basement and garage.

You will certainly notice a steady and continual decrease in your check book
balance.

Every time you pull out your car keys and see that little key on the ring,
you'll smile.

--
Roger Long

[Rosspilot]

>
>I am shortly to buy a 172H and would like to hear from owners of their
>experiences and any problems.
>

I have owned my 172-H for more than 5 years. I have never been happier and our
love affair continues passionately.

After hundreds of hours intimately connected by inertial shoulder harness,
headset, heartbeat, and soul, we have been all the way from Wichita to New
York, to and from Mt Rushmore, to and from Florida 3 times, and to and from
Atlanta once. We have been in the hottest hot, and the coldest cold. Day and
night, IFR, across water and mountains. We've touched down at airports from
Boston Logan to tiny grass strips in rural Iowa.

Most of our time is spent doing left turns around various sites within the
world's most exciting and exhilerating airspace . . . New York, where we take
pictures and earn our livelihood together.

I have spent lots of money on her. What is money for except to spend it on the
things you love?


www.Rosspilot.com

[Tony Roberts]

> I am shortly to buy a 172H and would like to hear from owners of their
> experiences and any problems.

Hi Gordon

I have owned my 172H since January and I love it.
there are a couple of things that I think you should be aware of though.

The Continental 0300D carburettor likes ice. It isn't a problem - it just
means that you have to be more aware, and use carb heat more often. In
fact, although everyone appears to agree that the 0300D carb is more prone
to icing than the Lycoming installed after 1967, if you read the stats on
accidents due to carb ice you will find that the Lycoming has more than
the Continental. Continental pilots are more conscious of carb icing, and
use carb heat to check for icing more often.

The 0300D does not like 100ll - it was designed to run on 87. To avoid
lead problems and build ups on the valve seats the engine should be leaned
aggressively while on the ground and leaned correctly all of the time that
it is in the air. They like to keep some power on on approach, to avoid
shock cooling. I also run the engine aggressively leaned for one minute
prior to shut down.

Also (stand by for controversy :) I add Avblend to the oil. They claim
that it helps prevent sticking valves. I cannot say that it does or it
doesn't. What I can say is that 2 months after buying the plane we had a
stuck valve - since then we have used Avblend and had no problems. Yes,
it may be a placebo - but at $25.00 per oil change it is one that I am
prepared to buy.

Hope this helps

--
Tony Roberts )
PP-ASEL
VFR-OTT - Night
Cessna 172H

[David Megginson]

(Tony Roberts) writes:

> In fact, although everyone appears to agree that the 0300D carb is
> more prone to icing than the Lycoming installed after 1967, if you
> read the stats on accidents due to carb ice you will find that the
> Lycoming has more than the Continental. Continental pilots are more
> conscious of carb icing, and use carb heat to check for icing more
> often.

Can you give a reference for the stats for carb-icing accidents? Are
they simply counting accidents, are they comparing the number of
accidents to the number of aircraft registered, or are they comparing
the number of accidents to the number of flight hours?

According to a rough count at the FAA database, about two thirds of
the 172's currently registered in the U.S. are models that shipped
with Lycomings. Furthermore, in my (still limited) experience, the
Continental 172's tend to be people's babies, flying somewhere between
25-100 hours/year, while a good number of the 172M/N/P/R/S planes are
flying hundreds of hours/year in flight school lines and FBO rental
fleets (unfortunately, I don't know any source for actual flight hours
per model type).

Taking all of this into account, I'd guess that Lycoming 172's fly
many times as many hours/year as Continental 172's do, so they would
need many times as many carb icing accidents/year just to be even with
the Continentals, not to mention more dangerous.

[snipped out section on ground leaning]

> Also (stand by for controversy :) I add Avblend to the oil. They claim
> that it helps prevent sticking valves. I cannot say that it does or it
> doesn't. What I can say is that 2 months after buying the plane we had a
> stuck valve - since then we have used Avblend and had no problems.

Were you ground leaning as aggressively before the stuck valve as you
are now? If so, the more obvious explanation would be the leaning,
not the oil additive.


All the best,


David

[Gordon Rich-Phillips]

Thanks for the reply Tony. I have a fair bit of experience flying behind
Continental O-470s so I am all too familiar with the carb ice problems.

What has been your experience in finding parts and having maintenance done
on the now long-out-of-production O-300??

The particular machine I am soon to take on has 4300 total with 480 left to
run to TBO, new prop. She is VFR only and I will keep her that way to
contain costs - doesn't even have a vac pump - two zero maintenance venturis
instead!

cheers

Gordon



Tony Roberts > wrote in message
...
> > I am shortly to buy a 172H and would like to hear from owners of their
> > experiences and any problems.
>
> Hi Gordon
>
> I have owned my 172H since January and I love it.
> there are a couple of things that I think you should be aware of though.
>
> The Continental 0300D carburettor likes ice. It isn't a problem - it just
> means that you have to be more aware, and use carb heat more often. In
> fact, although everyone appears to agree that the 0300D carb is more prone
> to icing than the Lycoming installed after 1967, if you read the stats on
> accidents due to carb ice you will find that the Lycoming has more than
> the Continental. Continental pilots are more conscious of carb icing, and
> use carb heat to check for icing more often.
>
> The 0300D does not like 100ll - it was designed to run on 87. To avoid
> lead problems and build ups on the valve seats the engine should be leaned
> aggressively while on the ground and leaned correctly all of the time that
> it is in the air. They like to keep some power on on approach, to avoid
> shock cooling. I also run the engine aggressively leaned for one minute
> prior to shut down.
>
> Also (stand by for controversy :) I add Avblend to the oil. They claim
> that it helps prevent sticking valves. I cannot say that it does or it
> doesn't. What I can say is that 2 months after buying the plane we had a
> stuck valve - since then we have used Avblend and had no problems. Yes,
> it may be a placebo - but at $25.00 per oil change it is one that I am
> prepared to buy.
>
> Hope this helps
>
> --
> Tony Roberts )
> PP-ASEL
> VFR-OTT - Night
> Cessna 172H
>
>

[Tony Roberts]

> What has been your experience in finding parts and having maintenance done
> on the now long-out-of-production O-300??

Hi Gordon

When we had our valve problem we had a new valve installed in one day.
Other than that I have only had routine maintenance to the engine and
haven't had any problems.
Instruments are another matter - So far I have had to install a new tach,
and a new turn & bank. Now the attitude indicator is not levelling until I
develop full RPM. I also installed a graphic engine monitor from
International Electronics. I love it - it gives a continuous readout of
CHT and EGT for all 6 cylinders, + carb temp, and there is still room to
add 3 more functions. Fuel flow will be next.
>
> The particular machine I am soon to take on has 4300 total with 480 left to
> run to TBO, new prop. She is VFR only and I will keep her that way to
> contain costs - doesn't even have a vac pump - two zero maintenance venturis
> instead!

No vac pump would be good.
Mine is IFR (I'm not :). One thing that I did do, after a scary aborted
landing on a short mountainous strip at 38C was to have my prop repitched
from 73 to 71. It cost me C$180 and gave me shorter takeoff and better
climb in return for a cost of 2 knots airspeed. For me that was a good
trade.

--
Tony Roberts )
PP-ASEL
VFR-OTT - Night
Cessna 172H

[Tony Roberts]

Hi David

> Can you give a reference for the stats for carb-icing accidents?

Here is a quote fron Gene Whitt -

On average there have been 35 unexplained 'engine failures'
per year. Most of these have been Lycoming and attributed
to carburetor icing. Where POHs do not recomment heat unless
required, pilots lose the Continental sensitivity to pick up
on an unexplained rpm drop. Solution: Fly Lycomings as
though they were Continentals. The forementioned 35 are due
to complacency in the use of C.H.


> Were you ground leaning as aggressively before the stuck valve as you
> are now? If so, the more obvious explanation would be the leaning,
> not the oil additive.

I was, but at that time I had a partner, so I cannot say for sure what he
was doing.
But the oil additive is cheap - and FAA approved. The valve job was
$650.00, so I see it as buying insurance.
I really don't want to try flying without it and then end up with another
stuck valve. That is probably why these guys sell so much additive -
people don't want to risk it :)

--
Tony Roberts )
PP-ASEL
VFR-OTT - Night
Cessna 172H

[James Blakely]

"Roger Long" m> wrote in
message ...
>
> You may find that there is a sudden degradation in the neatness of your
yard
> and increased clutter in basement and garage.
>

<snicker>

Man, this is so true. I'm a renter and about 2 months ago, I had a falling
out with the management of the FBO. I decoded that I wasn't going to rent
anymore and that I would buy a plane. Before I buy the plane, however, I
have to get some other affairs in order.

Since this unexpected hiatus, my yard has never looked so good.

[Al Gilson]

Gordon: I also fly a C-172 with the Continental 0-300D. Mine is a 1964 E
model. No problem with parts or maintenance. As a complete wimp when it
comes to carb ice, I'm well aware of it and ready at all times. I'll also
run the carb heat for a while during the run up just to make sure I didn't
pick up any during my taxi.

Tony: Glad to see you're back in circulation. Drop me an e-mail with the
house details if you get time. I still have your hat and I owe you some
cold ones. Now....talk to me about this oil additive that you have been
using. ???

Al Gilson
KSFF/Spokane, WA USA
1964 C-172E
1970 VW Bug Convertible
(Nothing but aircooled engines for me)

in article ,
Tony Roberts at wrote on 10/18/03 5:31 PM:

>> What has been your experience in finding parts and having maintenance done
>> on the now long-out-of-production O-300??
>
> Hi Gordon
>
> When we had our valve problem we had a new valve installed in one day.
> Other than that I have only had routine maintenance to the engine and
> haven't had any problems.
> Instruments are another matter - So far I have had to install a new tach,
> and a new turn & bank. Now the attitude indicator is not levelling until I
> develop full RPM. I also installed a graphic engine monitor from
> International Electronics. I love it - it gives a continuous readout of
> CHT and EGT for all 6 cylinders, + carb temp, and there is still room to
> add 3 more functions. Fuel flow will be next.
>>
>> The particular machine I am soon to take on has 4300 total with 480 left to
>> run to TBO, new prop. She is VFR only and I will keep her that way to
>> contain costs - doesn't even have a vac pump - two zero maintenance venturis
>> instead!
>
> No vac pump would be good.
> Mine is IFR (I'm not :). One thing that I did do, after a scary aborted
> landing on a short mountainous strip at 38C was to have my prop repitched
> from 73 to 71. It cost me C$180 and gave me shorter takeoff and better
> climb in return for a cost of 2 knots airspeed. For me that was a good
> trade.