Building chasing airport lights -- Attn: Jim Weir?

[Jay Honeck]

Today a pilot-guest had the coolest idea for the side-entrance to our lobby:
"Chasing" lights recessed in the drop-ceiling tiles, leading to the main
lobby area, that look just like the "rabbit" lights that lead to the
approach end of a runway!

(Background: Over half of our guests come in the "wrong" door to our lobby,
which leads more directly to the pilot's lounge than to the reservation
desk. As a result, we've often got people milling around looking "lost" in
the pilot's lounge. These chasing lights would "lead" them to the correct
area, and be really cool looking, too.)

So, I stopped at the local Rat Shack, and found the perfect little 12 volt
blue lights, 1/2 inch in diameter. (Blue would be a bit toned-down from
white strobes!) It would be a simple matter to drill 1/2 inch holes in the
ceiling tiles, every 12 inches or so, and push them through the tiles from
above so that only the blue "dome" was sticking out through the hole. I
think 12 volt lighting would be safer in the ceiling than 120 volt Christmas
lights, as a couple of people have suggested...

Here's the problem: How to sequence them? The guys at Radio Shack had NO
advice at all -- they were all stumped. The lights should flash
sequentially pretty fast, but I think they'd look pretty stupid if they
weren't coordinated properly. I'd also want to incorporate a motion
detector on/off switch, so that they weren't running all the time.

Anyone got any ideas? Are there affordable electronic "sequencers"
available? Is this something RST Engineering could build for me, Jim?

Thanks!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Ron Natalie]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message news:GBCPb.117569$xy6.376015@attbi_s02...

>
> Anyone got any ideas? Are there affordable electronic "sequencers"
> available? Is this something RST Engineering could build for me, Jim?
>
Shouldn't be very hard. How many of these bulbs you going to use?

[Roy Smith]

In article <GBCPb.117569$xy6.376015@attbi_s02>,
"Jay Honeck" > wrote:
> Here's the problem: How to sequence them? The guys at Radio Shack had NO
> advice at all -- they were all stumped.

The guys at most radio shacks these days can't change the batteries in a
flashlight without a training video and a map.

25 years ago, I would have grabbed a 555 timer, a 4-bit counter, and a
4-to-16 demux out of my TTL collection and built a sequencer in an
afternoon for about $10 in parts. The breadboard it was built on would
have cost more than the chips. Of course, if I told you I was going to
use it to drive a series of blue LED's, you'd look at me like I was nuts
(everybody in those days knew it was theoretically impossible to build a
blue LED).

I wish I knew were all that stuff went. I can only guess it got tossed
when mom sold the house a few years back.

[Jay Honeck]

> Shouldn't be very hard. How many of these bulbs you going to use?

Not sure, but I'd guesstimate between 20 and 30.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jim]

You mentioned Christmas lights, some of those have sequencers attatched.
Maybe you can adapt the controller off of something like that.
--
Jim Burns III

Remove "nospam" to reply

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:GBCPb.117569$xy6.376015@attbi_s02...
> Today a pilot-guest had the coolest idea for the side-entrance to our
lobby:
> "Chasing" lights recessed in the drop-ceiling tiles, leading to the main
> lobby area, that look just like the "rabbit" lights that lead to the
> approach end of a runway!
>
> (Background: Over half of our guests come in the "wrong" door to our
lobby,
> which leads more directly to the pilot's lounge than to the reservation
> desk. As a result, we've often got people milling around looking "lost"
in
> the pilot's lounge. These chasing lights would "lead" them to the correct
> area, and be really cool looking, too.)
>
> So, I stopped at the local Rat Shack, and found the perfect little 12 volt
> blue lights, 1/2 inch in diameter. (Blue would be a bit toned-down from
> white strobes!) It would be a simple matter to drill 1/2 inch holes in
the
> ceiling tiles, every 12 inches or so, and push them through the tiles from
> above so that only the blue "dome" was sticking out through the hole. I
> think 12 volt lighting would be safer in the ceiling than 120 volt
Christmas
> lights, as a couple of people have suggested...
>
> Here's the problem: How to sequence them? The guys at Radio Shack had NO
> advice at all -- they were all stumped. The lights should flash
> sequentially pretty fast, but I think they'd look pretty stupid if they
> weren't coordinated properly. I'd also want to incorporate a motion
> detector on/off switch, so that they weren't running all the time.
>
> Anyone got any ideas? Are there affordable electronic "sequencers"
> available? Is this something RST Engineering could build for me, Jim?
>
> Thanks!
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"
>
>

[Don Tuite]

On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 21:57:58 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
> wrote:

>Today a pilot-guest had the coolest idea for the side-entrance to our lobby:
>"Chasing" lights recessed in the drop-ceiling tiles, leading to the main
>lobby area, that look just like the "rabbit" lights that lead to the
>approach end of a runway!

You might search on rope lights. Here's an example:

http://www.all-lights.com/IBS/SimpleCat/Shelf/ASP/Hierarchy/0401.html

Don

[C J Campbell]

This sounds like a horrible idea, actually. Someone is going to have a grand
mal seizure right there in the lobby.

[plumbus bobbus]

Here is my very brilliant idea of the week: why don't you send Jim Weird
(Mr. Fantastic) a private e-mail?
I need to take a ****, everyone! I just thought I would let the whole world
know.


"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:GBCPb.117569$xy6.376015@attbi_s02...
> Today a pilot-guest had the coolest idea for the side-entrance to our
lobby:
> "Chasing" lights recessed in the drop-ceiling tiles, leading to the main
> lobby area, that look just like the "rabbit" lights that lead to the
> approach end of a runway!

[C J Campbell]

OK. Back when I was in college I worked part time for a company called
Coastal Sales NW. They manufactured and distributed sign parts. Their rotors
were especially good. What you want is called a "chaser." These devices were
once very expensive, but now they can be had for less than $100. Digital
Lighting Systems makes good ones. http://digitallighting.com/index.html You
probably want the BC series for your low voltage system. A guy could go nuts
wandering through their on-line catalog. Christmas light chasers are
probably too low voltage for your application, although blue LED Christmas
lights might work well and the whole string only uses 5 volts.

If the lights are too bright they will indeed induce seizures in the
susceptible. Red lights and white lights are worse than the blue lights you
propose. This is a problem at theme parks where a lot of rides have flashing
and chasing lights. You will often see signs warning epileptics of the
danger, but under the right circumstances these lights have induced seizures
in persons not known to have had epilepsy. I suspect that having the lights
overhead will increase the level of discomfort.

[C J Campbell]

"plumbus bobbus" > wrote in message
news:MbEPb.97212$Rc4.586923@attbi_s54...
|
| Here is my very brilliant idea of the week: why don't you send Jim Weird
| (Mr. Fantastic) a private e-mail?
| I need to take a ****, everyone! I just thought I would let the whole
world
| know.
|

Yes, we can all see that you are full of it.

[Blanche]

Jay:

Take back those expensive RS bulbs and everything else. Then find
a store (possibly online) that sells "chaser lights". Any
theatrical shop carries them (but will likely be more expensive)
or the local hardware store.

There are also very expensive versions that you can program to
do whatever you want.

[G.R. Patterson III]

C J Campbell wrote:
>
> ...... but under the right circumstances these lights have induced seizures
> in persons not known to have had epilepsy.

And if that person is a pilot and has to explain things at his next medical, he's
not going to like you very much. How 'bout a simple arrow or sign pointing the
way?

George Patterson
Great discoveries are not announced with "Eureka!". What's usually said is
"Hummmmm... That's interesting...."

[Jay Honeck]

> I need to take a ****, everyone! I just thought I would let the whole
world
> know.

Well, it couldn't hurt, and it *might* be an improvement.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck]

> And if that person is a pilot and has to explain things at his next
medical, he's
> not going to like you very much. How 'bout a simple arrow or sign pointing
the
> way?

Crikey, you guys are like hanging out with my great aunt, when it comes to
fun.

I suppose someone might cut themselves on the P-51 parts in our Mustang
suite, and I'll bet someone else could choke on one of our bagels, too. But
I ain't getting rid of that stuff, either.

I think the chasing lights would look cool! :-) (And I can always turn 'em
off if they get too annoying...)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck]

> Take back those expensive RS bulbs and everything else. Then find
> a store (possibly online) that sells "chaser lights". Any
> theatrical shop carries them (but will likely be more expensive)
> or the local hardware store.
>
> There are also very expensive versions that you can program to
> do whatever you want.

Are these 110 volt? Shouldn't I be concerned that they will generate too
much heat up there in the enclosed ceiling? (Not to mention, having the
bulbs sticking through the foam-core tiles?)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"
"Blanche" > wrote in message
...
> Jay:
>
>

[Martin Kosina]

"plumbus bobbus" > wrote in message news:<MbEPb.97212$Rc4.586923@attbi_s54>...
> Here is my very brilliant idea of the week: why don't you send Jim Weird
> (Mr. Fantastic) a private e-mail?
> I need to take a ****, everyone! I just thought I would let the whole world
> know.
>

ROTFL! PB can be an obnoxious son of a bitch, but sometimes he hits it
right on, you have to admit. Kind of like Donald Rumsfeld at some of
his press briefings (whom I otherwise truly abhor as a public
official, for the record).

Anyways, no hard feelings, Jay ;-) I for one don't mind the mild
spamming, and don't consider it abusive. Besides, I think Jay posts
here because he loves what he is doing, not for a direct profit
motive. Member galleries like his are very common with IRC groups,
BTW, that's nothing new under the sun. I *am* mildly annoyed at the
occasional cheerleading for our eternally righteous leader, but even
that is within parameters, any time you have a group of real people,
politics will eventually come up. Besides, they are more interesting
to bounce off of people you have something else in common than bunch
of strangers in soc.politics.* who think VOR is a an '80s metal band
;-)

Martin

[Greg Burkhart]

Hi Jay,

Have you found a solution for your chase lights? Maybe instead of
flashing lights in the ceiling, you should have yellow 'taxi stripe' on the
floor on where you want people to go and the 'X' where they shouldn't.
Scatter around some taxiway signs and give a hotel 'Alexis layout' to your
guests with the hold short bars at the room doors. If done right, it can
look good...

Do you make your guests do a standard pattern to get to the check in
desk??? ;-)

I'll probably get flamed for this idea -- oh well.

[Jay Honeck]

> I'll probably get flamed for this idea -- oh well.

Nope, still no solutions. But I like your ideas!

We've always got to walk the fine line between kitsch and cool. Sometimes
it's hard to discern the line, and women have a completely different concept
of "cool" than men do, especially regarding aviation.

Mary and I actually agree on the chasing lights, which is sort of amazing to
me.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Ron Wanttaja]

On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 14:55:56 GMT, "Jay Honeck" >
wrote:

>We've always got to walk the fine line between kitsch and cool. Sometimes
>it's hard to discern the line, and women have a completely different concept
>of "cool" than men do, especially regarding aviation.
>
>Mary and I actually agree on the chasing lights, which is sort of amazing to
>me.

One thing that occurs to me is that you were talking about indoor use of
the lights. The flicker of the lights might be a bit irritating if it's
visible to your lobby or the pilot's lounge. It's always a distraction to
have lights flashing in the corner of your eye. Hooking them up to a
motion detector might be an alternative.

Also, your options for these might be a bit more restrictive if there's any
sort of electrical code you have to abide by. I suspect they're more
stringent on enforcement for a commercial enterprise than a private home.

You might consider a big "ARRIVALS" sign, coupled with the elephant "JUMBO
TURN" sign some airports use.

Ron Wanttaja

[Tom Pappano]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>> I'll probably get flamed for this idea -- oh well.
>
>
> Nope, still no solutions. But I like your ideas!
>
> We've always got to walk the fine line between kitsch and cool. Sometimes
> it's hard to discern the line, and women have a completely different concept
> of "cool" than men do, especially regarding aviation.
>
> Mary and I actually agree on the chasing lights, which is sort of amazing to
> me.

I have a design for exactly what you need!
Making a proper looking "rabbit" can be done with one "chip" (well,
really two). Using a small "mixed signal" microcontroller will
let you:

1. control the overall brightness
2. control the speed the rabbit "runs"
3. control the rate the sequence repeats
4. control the percentage of "on" time for each light

These adjustments should let you find just the effect
that you want. The whole controller would be about 2" X 3".
The whole system would run off a small wall transformer.
I believe the Electrical Code does not prohibit
this type arrangement. If you have an "air-plenum"
ceiling, however, you must use proper cable, such as
"plenum rated" telephone cable.

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA,
obsessive-compulsive embedded applications designer 8-)

ps: I shall consult the AIM to see just how a MRALS
(Medium intensity Resevation desk Approach Lighting System)
should be configured

[Ray Andraka]

Jay,

There are inexpensive christmas light sequencers available. They generally use
3 circuits with every third bulb on the same circuit. I had one a few years ago
that had a switch to select chase, random or all on, and a knob to vary the
rate. Cost no more than 3 or 4 bucks and came with the lights.

That is a little bit different than the rabbit, which has only one light on at a
time, so it may not achieve the effect you are looking for. A possible low
tech solution would be a motor driving a cam that closes a series of
microswitches in sequence...easy enough to produce by someone with a little bit
of mechanical talent and not much electrical know-how. A higher tech solution
would be to use electronics consisting of a programable logic device and a set
of solid state switches to switch the current. Could also be done with a
computer with a relay card plugged into it, but would need a little bit of
programming to make it work (such relay cards are available from electronics
firms like Jameco). The computer solution would be a bit of overkill, but could
be done with off the shelf stuff.

Jay Honeck wrote:

> Today a pilot-guest had the coolest idea for the side-entrance to our lobby:
> "Chasing" lights recessed in the drop-ceiling tiles, leading to the main
> lobby area, that look just like the "rabbit" lights that lead to the
> approach end of a runway!
>
> (Background: Over half of our guests come in the "wrong" door to our lobby,
> which leads more directly to the pilot's lounge than to the reservation
> desk. As a result, we've often got people milling around looking "lost" in
> the pilot's lounge. These chasing lights would "lead" them to the correct
> area, and be really cool looking, too.)
>
> So, I stopped at the local Rat Shack, and found the perfect little 12 volt
> blue lights, 1/2 inch in diameter. (Blue would be a bit toned-down from
> white strobes!) It would be a simple matter to drill 1/2 inch holes in the
> ceiling tiles, every 12 inches or so, and push them through the tiles from
> above so that only the blue "dome" was sticking out through the hole. I
> think 12 volt lighting would be safer in the ceiling than 120 volt Christmas
> lights, as a couple of people have suggested...
>
> Here's the problem: How to sequence them? The guys at Radio Shack had NO
> advice at all -- they were all stumped. The lights should flash
> sequentially pretty fast, but I think they'd look pretty stupid if they
> weren't coordinated properly. I'd also want to incorporate a motion
> detector on/off switch, so that they weren't running all the time.
>
> Anyone got any ideas? Are there affordable electronic "sequencers"
> available? Is this something RST Engineering could build for me, Jim?
>
> Thanks!
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"

--
--Ray Andraka, P.E.
President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
email
http://www.andraka.com

"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-Benjamin Franklin, 1759

[C J Campbell]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:7hHPb.118019$I06.863908@attbi_s01...
| > And if that person is a pilot and has to explain things at his next
| medical, he's
| > not going to like you very much. How 'bout a simple arrow or sign
pointing
| the
| > way?
|
| Crikey, you guys are like hanging out with my great aunt, when it comes to
| fun.
|
| I suppose someone might cut themselves on the P-51 parts in our Mustang
| suite, and I'll bet someone else could choke on one of our bagels, too.

Well, since we are relegated to the "roll" of great aunt, let's talk about
those bagels...

You don't want any signs pointing the way to bagels, as noted in today's
Wall Street Journal (Jan 22, 2004). You could get arrested for having such
signs, at least in Redmond, WA. Seems the bagel shop committed the horrible
felony of having an employee stand out in front wearing a sign pointing the
way to the shop, which is located on a side street and hard to find. WSJ
dryly pointed out that America has finally become a place where Larry
Flynt's porno magazines have more constitutional protection to free speech
than a guy who just wants to sell bagels.

I suppose next I will be arrested on the streets of Redmond for wearing my
ball cap that says "Waddling Eagle, World Famous CFI" on it, or maybe for
wearing a shirt with a Cessna logo. Of course, Redmond is the city that
bills itself "The Bicycle Capital of the World" and bans bicycles from
nearly all of its parks and watershed areas. It is the sort of town that
would build an airport just so they could ban airplanes from using it.

[Jay Honeck]

> You don't want any signs pointing the way to bagels, as noted in today's
> Wall Street Journal (Jan 22, 2004). You could get arrested for having such
> signs,

We've already got laws like that on the books, here in the "Republik of Iowa
City".

It seems the "green" folks don't want big signs visible anywhere, because it
would mar the view. (Of what, no one will say.) Because of this law, we
were not allowed to put up a "Grand Opening" banner when we opened in August
of 2002.

I am not kidding.

And people wonder why China is kicking our ass in the business world.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[John Galban]

"C J Campbell" > wrote in message >...
>
> If the lights are too bright they will indeed induce seizures in the
> susceptible. Red lights and white lights are worse than the blue lights you
> propose. This is a problem at theme parks where a lot of rides have flashing
> and chasing lights. You will often see signs warning epileptics of the
> danger, but under the right circumstances these lights have induced seizures
> in persons not known to have had epilepsy. I suspect that having the lights
> overhead will increase the level of discomfort.

The city of Las Vegas must require one whoppin' big disclaimer
before they let you off the plane :-)

John Galban=====>N4BQ (PA28-180)

[Jim Weir]

I missed the original post on this one...can anybody repost it for me?

And to those of you who want to use microcontrollers and fancy
logic...THWPPTTTTT. One fifty cent CMOS chip and a fe bipolar transistor
drivers will do just fine, thank you.


Jim



Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
http://www.rst-engr.com

[Jay Honeck]

Here's the short version, Jim:

I want to build/install a line of blue "chasing" lights, like the "rabbit"
lights that lead to the arrival end of the runway, in our hallway ceiling.
They will lead people from our over-used "wrong" door (the one that goes
into the pilot's lounge, if you recall) directly to our lobby front desk.
They will be activated by a motion sensor, so they don't run 24/7.

These lights will be installed in the ceiling tiles, one every couple of
feet or so. I've found some perfect blue ones at Rat Shack, 1/2 inch
diameter, 12 volt, that would be simple to push through a 1/2 inch hole
drilled in the ceiling tiles. (Others have suggested LEDs instead.)

The problem in a nutshell: How to sequence them?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"
"Jim Weir" > wrote in message
...
> I missed the original post on this one...can anybody repost it for me?
>
> And to those of you who want to use microcontrollers and fancy
> logic...THWPPTTTTT. One fifty cent CMOS chip and a fe bipolar transistor
> drivers will do just fine, thank you.
>
>
> Jim
>
>
>
> Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
> VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
> http://www.rst-engr.com

[Tom Pappano]

Jim Weir wrote:
> I missed the original post on this one...can anybody repost it for me?
>
> And to those of you who want to use microcontrollers and fancy
> logic...THWPPTTTTT. One fifty cent CMOS chip and a fe bipolar transistor
> drivers will do just fine, thank you.
>
>
> Jim
>
>
>
> Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
> VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
> http://www.rst-engr.com

Basically, Jay wants to implement a "rabbit" in his hotel
with some small bulbs in the ceiling.

Well, ok but the little mcu I'm thinking of will run at 8 mips,
needs no xtal, has 16 i/o lines, has an 8 chan 10 bit a/d,
2 high speed pwm channels, timers, power supply monitoring,
is a 20 pin dip, costs $1.50,
can be programmed "in situ", and will support high level
language!

Even for really simple devices, it seems the days of
discrete logic are over! 8-)

(Not to mention the relative ease of making changes in
software vs. hardware)

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA

[Roy Smith]

Tom Pappano > wrote:
> Well, ok but the little mcu I'm thinking of will run at 8 mips,
> needs no xtal, has 16 i/o lines, has an 8 chan 10 bit a/d,
> 2 high speed pwm channels, timers, power supply monitoring,
> is a 20 pin dip, costs $1.50,
> can be programmed "in situ", and will support high level
> language!


Sounds cool. Is that price for Qty 1? Got a part number?

[Jay Honeck]

> Well, ok but the little mcu I'm thinking of will run at 8 mips,
> needs no xtal, has 16 i/o lines, has an 8 chan 10 bit a/d,
> 2 high speed pwm channels, timers, power supply monitoring,
> is a 20 pin dip, costs $1.50,
> can be programmed "in situ", and will support high level
> language!
>
> Even for really simple devices, it seems the days of
> discrete logic are over! 8-)

You call this "relative ease," Tom? I don't even know what the hell you're
talking about!

Tell you what -- you build this thing, and when you bring it to Iowa City,
your night in any suite (whichever era you prefer) is free!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jim Weir]

WAIT A MINNITT...

I just told them how to do it. Somebody said they can follow my plans and they
can do it.

And you give THEM a free room?

What is wrong with this picture?




"Jay Honeck" >
shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

-
->
->Tell you what -- you build this thing, and when you bring it to Iowa City,
->your night in any suite (whichever era you prefer) is free!

Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
http://www.rst-engr.com

[Tom Pappano]

Jay Honeck wrote:

>>Well, ok but the little mcu I'm thinking of will run at 8 mips,
>>needs no xtal, has 16 i/o lines, has an 8 chan 10 bit a/d,
>>2 high speed pwm channels, timers, power supply monitoring,
>>is a 20 pin dip, costs $1.50,
>>can be programmed "in situ", and will support high level
>>language!
>>
>>Even for really simple devices, it seems the days of
>>discrete logic are over! 8-)
>
>
> You call this "relative ease," Tom? I don't even know what the hell you're
> talking about!
>
> Tell you what -- you build this thing, and when you bring it to Iowa City,
> your night in any suite (whichever era you prefer) is free!


Whoo Hoo! Methinks I'll have to take you up on that! If you would,
drop me an email with the Radio Shack part# of the lamps you bought
so I can check one out, and we can work out some technical details
of the MRALS configuration.

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA

[Tom Pappano]

Jim Weir wrote:

> WAIT A MINNITT...
>
> I just told them how to do it. Somebody said they can follow my plans and they
> can do it.
>
> And you give THEM a free room?
>
> What is wrong with this picture?
>
>
>
>
> "Jay Honeck" >
> shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:
>
> -
> ->
> ->Tell you what -- you build this thing, and when you bring it to Iowa City,
> ->your night in any suite (whichever era you prefer) is free!
>
> Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
> VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
> http://www.rst-engr.com

HeHeHe...

[C J Campbell]

"John Galban" > wrote in message
om...
| "C J Campbell" > wrote in message
>...
| >
| > If the lights are too bright they will indeed induce seizures in the
| > susceptible. Red lights and white lights are worse than the blue lights
you
| > propose. This is a problem at theme parks where a lot of rides have
flashing
| > and chasing lights. You will often see signs warning epileptics of the
| > danger, but under the right circumstances these lights have induced
seizures
| > in persons not known to have had epilepsy. I suspect that having the
lights
| > overhead will increase the level of discomfort.
|
| The city of Las Vegas must require one whoppin' big disclaimer
| before they let you off the plane :-)
|

Presumably someone who was that susceptible to flashing lights would know
enough to stay away from Las Vegas, or Times Square, or the Ginza district
of Tokyo, etc. Actually, there is so much light there that I would think all
the flashing tends to even itself out.

Back in the late '70s I remember reading in an Air Force safety magazine
about a pilot who was watching the setting sun through the windmilling prop
of a C-130. He had a seizure on the ramp. He never suspected that he had
epilepsy.

[Jay Honeck]

> I just told them how to do it. Somebody said they can follow my plans and
they
> can do it.
>
> And you give THEM a free room?

Hmmm. I've checked and re-checked the thread, and all I see here is Tom's
post detailing the construction of said chasing lights.

Did my ISP eat your post, Jim?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck]

> Whoo Hoo! Methinks I'll have to take you up on that! If you would,
> drop me an email with the Radio Shack part# of the lamps you bought
> so I can check one out, and we can work out some technical details
> of the MRALS configuration.
>
> Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA

Haven't bought 'em yet, pending the final design specifications. If you
have a way to use LEDs instead (and remember, the prime directive is that
they must be easily installed so that they stick out below - and through -
the suspended ceiling tiles.), all the better!

So when do you plan to do the installation? :-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Tom Sixkiller]

"John Galban" > wrote in message
om...
> "C J Campbell" > wrote in message
>...
> >
> > If the lights are too bright they will indeed induce seizures in the
> > susceptible. Red lights and white lights are worse than the blue lights
you
> > propose. This is a problem at theme parks where a lot of rides have
flashing
> > and chasing lights. You will often see signs warning epileptics of the
> > danger, but under the right circumstances these lights have induced
seizures
> > in persons not known to have had epilepsy. I suspect that having the
lights
> > overhead will increase the level of discomfort.
>
> The city of Las Vegas must require one whoppin' big disclaimer
> before they let you off the plane :-)
>
Can someone have a seizure watching the wheels spin in the slot machines?

[C J Campbell]

"Tom Sixkiller" > wrote in message
...
| >
| Can someone have a seizure watching the wheels spin in the slot machines?

Do slot machines even have wheels any more? I don't know; I haven't taken a
close look at a slot machine in 20 years.

[[email protected]]

C J Campbell > wrote:

> "Tom Sixkiller" > wrote in message
> ...
> | >
> | Can someone have a seizure watching the wheels spin in the slot machines?

> Do slot machines even have wheels any more? I don't know; I haven't taken a
> close look at a slot machine in 20 years.

Only on old machines, all the new ones are video displays, though it will
be years before all the mechanical machines go away.

The trend seems to be away from the classic 3 wheel machine to more
interactive games.


--
Jim Pennino

Remove -spam-sux to reply.

[Tom Pappano]

Roy Smith wrote:
> Tom Pappano > wrote:
>
>>Well, ok but the little mcu I'm thinking of will run at 8 mips,
>>needs no xtal, has 16 i/o lines, has an 8 chan 10 bit a/d,
>>2 high speed pwm channels, timers, power supply monitoring,
>>is a 20 pin dip, costs $1.50,
>>can be programmed "in situ", and will support high level
>>language!
>
>
>
> Sounds cool. Is that price for Qty 1? Got a part number?

Hi Roy,

This particular one is an Atmel ATTINY26, 1pc $2.58 from
Digi-Key. Much less in quantity from more major suppliers.
Atmel has a large family of these things in 8 pin to 64
pin packages, with internal flash memory from 1 to 128k.
They call them "AVR" RISC controllers. Atmel provides free
development software, really cheap development and programming
hardware, and freeware "C" compiler suites are available that
support the devices and the programmers. These things are
much faster while requiring less power than 8031 products.
They can be programmed "in system" so the devices do not need
to be socketed to allow program development or upgrading.
Check them out at www.atmel.com

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA

[Maurice Givens]

Ray, I'm shocked!! 1 timer, 2 16-bit shift registers, and 32 LED's

Maurice


Ray Andraka > wrote in message >...
> Jay,
>
> There are inexpensive christmas light sequencers available. They generally use
> 3 circuits with every third bulb on the same circuit. I had one a few years ago
> that had a switch to select chase, random or all on, and a knob to vary the
> rate. Cost no more than 3 or 4 bucks and came with the lights.
>
> That is a little bit different than the rabbit, which has only one light on at a
> time, so it may not achieve the effect you are looking for. A possible low
> tech solution would be a motor driving a cam that closes a series of
> microswitches in sequence...easy enough to produce by someone with a little bit
> of mechanical talent and not much electrical know-how. A higher tech solution
> would be to use electronics consisting of a programable logic device and a set
> of solid state switches to switch the current. Could also be done with a
> computer with a relay card plugged into it, but would need a little bit of
> programming to make it work (such relay cards are available from electronics
> firms like Jameco). The computer solution would be a bit of overkill, but could
> be done with off the shelf stuff.
>
> Jay Honeck wrote:
>
> > Today a pilot-guest had the coolest idea for the side-entrance to our lobby:
> > "Chasing" lights recessed in the drop-ceiling tiles, leading to the main
> > lobby area, that look just like the "rabbit" lights that lead to the
> > approach end of a runway!
> >
> > (Background: Over half of our guests come in the "wrong" door to our lobby,
> > which leads more directly to the pilot's lounge than to the reservation
> > desk. As a result, we've often got people milling around looking "lost" in
> > the pilot's lounge. These chasing lights would "lead" them to the correct
> > area, and be really cool looking, too.)
> >
> > So, I stopped at the local Rat Shack, and found the perfect little 12 volt
> > blue lights, 1/2 inch in diameter. (Blue would be a bit toned-down from
> > white strobes!) It would be a simple matter to drill 1/2 inch holes in the
> > ceiling tiles, every 12 inches or so, and push them through the tiles from
> > above so that only the blue "dome" was sticking out through the hole. I
> > think 12 volt lighting would be safer in the ceiling than 120 volt Christmas
> > lights, as a couple of people have suggested...
> >
> > Here's the problem: How to sequence them? The guys at Radio Shack had NO
> > advice at all -- they were all stumped. The lights should flash
> > sequentially pretty fast, but I think they'd look pretty stupid if they
> > weren't coordinated properly. I'd also want to incorporate a motion
> > detector on/off switch, so that they weren't running all the time.
> >
> > Anyone got any ideas? Are there affordable electronic "sequencers"
> > available? Is this something RST Engineering could build for me, Jim?
> >
> > Thanks!
> > --
> > Jay Honeck
> > Iowa City, IA
> > Pathfinder N56993
> > www.AlexisParkInn.com
> > "Your Aviation Destination"
>
> --
> --Ray Andraka, P.E.
> President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
> 401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
> email
> http://www.andraka.com
>
> "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
> temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
> -Benjamin Franklin, 1759

[C J Campbell]

> wrote in message
...
| C J Campbell > wrote:
|
| > "Tom Sixkiller" > wrote in message
| > ...
| > | >
| > | Can someone have a seizure watching the wheels spin in the slot
machines?
|
| > Do slot machines even have wheels any more? I don't know; I haven't
taken a
| > close look at a slot machine in 20 years.
|
| Only on old machines, all the new ones are video displays, though it will
| be years before all the mechanical machines go away.
|
| The trend seems to be away from the classic 3 wheel machine to more
| interactive games.

That's what I thought. We were on the Maasdam in December and when strolling
through the casino it looked to me that all the slot machines were actually
some sort of card playing video game. Frankly, they look unbelievably boring
compared to a real game of cards.

[Ray Andraka]

I was basically thinking of that very circuit in a small PLD (you wield a hammer long
enough and everything starts to look like a nail). You also need at least an inverter to
realize a counter. For one light on at a time, which I think is what the 'rabbit' does,
you'd need a little bit more, especially if you wanted it to recover should it hiccup. A
johnson counter (last register output inverted and fed back to the first) would make the
all the lights go on in sequence before any started going off. So, to your timer and
shift registers, add a package with a gate. For the cost and circuit board complexity,
you'd probably come out ahead using a small PLD (there are several in the $1-2 range that
would suffice) , assuming you had a way to program it. You could also use a 4 bit
counter, timer and 16 line decoder (7493, 74154 and 555). 16 Leds is probaby enough for a
Rabbit, I think most only have about 10 strobes. I'd be tempted to use white LEDs.

In any event, since he was asking, I presumed that working with logic chips was probably
beyond his capability, so I was trying to come up with solutions that would not require
any logic design. (I guess that means a CPLD would be even further out of reach of
course).

If he could live with orange lights(or perhaps green if you can still find the green neon
lamps), you could also do it with NE-2 bulbs and resistor and capacitor for each bulb. It
is a ladder network of relaxation oscillators that depends on the neon lamp's high off
resistance and low on resistance to make it flash, and the ladder network makes them flash
in sequence.

Maurice Givens wrote:

> Ray, I'm shocked!! 1 timer, 2 16-bit shift registers, and 32 LED's
>
> Maurice
>
> Ray Andraka > wrote in message >...
> > Jay,
> >
> > There are inexpensive christmas light sequencers available. They generally use
> > 3 circuits with every third bulb on the same circuit. I had one a few years ago
> > that had a switch to select chase, random or all on, and a knob to vary the
> > rate. Cost no more than 3 or 4 bucks and came with the lights.
> >
> > That is a little bit different than the rabbit, which has only one light on at a
> > time, so it may not achieve the effect you are looking for. A possible low
> > tech solution would be a motor driving a cam that closes a series of
> > microswitches in sequence...easy enough to produce by someone with a little bit
> > of mechanical talent and not much electrical know-how. A higher tech solution
> > would be to use electronics consisting of a programable logic device and a set
> > of solid state switches to switch the current. Could also be done with a
> > computer with a relay card plugged into it, but would need a little bit of
> > programming to make it work (such relay cards are available from electronics
> > firms like Jameco). The computer solution would be a bit of overkill, but could
> > be done with off the shelf stuff.
> >
> > Jay Honeck wrote:
> >
> > > Today a pilot-guest had the coolest idea for the side-entrance to our lobby:
> > > "Chasing" lights recessed in the drop-ceiling tiles, leading to the main
> > > lobby area, that look just like the "rabbit" lights that lead to the
> > > approach end of a runway!
> > >
> > > (Background: Over half of our guests come in the "wrong" door to our lobby,
> > > which leads more directly to the pilot's lounge than to the reservation
> > > desk. As a result, we've often got people milling around looking "lost" in
> > > the pilot's lounge. These chasing lights would "lead" them to the correct
> > > area, and be really cool looking, too.)
> > >
> > > So, I stopped at the local Rat Shack, and found the perfect little 12 volt
> > > blue lights, 1/2 inch in diameter. (Blue would be a bit toned-down from
> > > white strobes!) It would be a simple matter to drill 1/2 inch holes in the
> > > ceiling tiles, every 12 inches or so, and push them through the tiles from
> > > above so that only the blue "dome" was sticking out through the hole. I
> > > think 12 volt lighting would be safer in the ceiling than 120 volt Christmas
> > > lights, as a couple of people have suggested...
> > >
> > > Here's the problem: How to sequence them? The guys at Radio Shack had NO
> > > advice at all -- they were all stumped. The lights should flash
> > > sequentially pretty fast, but I think they'd look pretty stupid if they
> > > weren't coordinated properly. I'd also want to incorporate a motion
> > > detector on/off switch, so that they weren't running all the time.
> > >
> > > Anyone got any ideas? Are there affordable electronic "sequencers"
> > > available? Is this something RST Engineering could build for me, Jim?
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > > --
> > > Jay Honeck
> > > Iowa City, IA
> > > Pathfinder N56993
> > > www.AlexisParkInn.com
> > > "Your Aviation Destination"
> >
> > --
> > --Ray Andraka, P.E.
> > President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
> > 401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
> > email
> > http://www.andraka.com
> >
> > "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
> > temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
> > -Benjamin Franklin, 1759

--
--Ray Andraka, P.E.
President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
email
http://www.andraka.com

"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-Benjamin Franklin, 1759

[Jim Weir]

Something is getting et, that's for sure. I didn't see your ORIGINAL post, so I
can only infer from the answers you are getting that you want some sort of
miniaturized "find the runway" strobe system (rabbit). How many lights? LEDs
would be find; white ones are down to a couple of bucks in onesies these days
and those suckers are BRIGHT.

One wall wart power supply, one small piece of CMOS (simple counter) and your
lights. Even YOU could do this, Jay.

So, how many lights and what kind of sequence. I'll send you the parts for free
and instructions to go with them. I'll do it for a free beer at Oshkosh.

Jim



"Jay Honeck" >
shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

->> I just told them how to do it. Somebody said they can follow my plans and
->they
->> can do it.
->>
->> And you give THEM a free room?
->
->Hmmm. I've checked and re-checked the thread, and all I see here is Tom's
->post detailing the construction of said chasing lights.
->
->Did my ISP eat your post, Jim?

Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
http://www.rst-engr.com

[Jay Honeck]

> So, how many lights and what kind of sequence. I'll send you the parts
for free
> and instructions to go with them. I'll do it for a free beer at Oshkosh.

Well, after further consideration, we've decided to run TWO rows of LEDs
down the hall leading from the "wrong" door to the lobby front desk area.
This is a distance of about 30 feet. (The center ceiling panel sections are
being replaced with faux pounded-tin-look panels, leaving the original
little "half" panels on either side -- which would work perfectly for these
lights.)

Figuring one light every couple of feet, I suppose we'd need 15 per side, so
30 total? They'd need to be sequenced so that they "chase" properly, both
rows together. And I'll need to wire this into a motion sensor of some
sort, so it's not running 24/7...

This is so crazy, I think it will be GREAT. :-)

Tell you what : Help me make this goofy idea work, and I'll throw in your
night's stay for the 2nd Annual Oshkosh Pool Party!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"
"Jim Weir" > wrote in message
...
> Something is getting et, that's for sure. I didn't see your ORIGINAL
post, so I
> can only infer from the answers you are getting that you want some sort of
> miniaturized "find the runway" strobe system (rabbit). How many lights?
LEDs
> would be find; white ones are down to a couple of bucks in onesies these
days
> and those suckers are BRIGHT.
>
> One wall wart power supply, one small piece of CMOS (simple counter) and
your
> lights. Even YOU could do this, Jay.
>
>
> Jim
>
>
>
> "Jay Honeck" >
> shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:
>
> ->> I just told them how to do it. Somebody said they can follow my plans
and
> ->they
> ->> can do it.
> ->>
> ->> And you give THEM a free room?
> ->
> ->Hmmm. I've checked and re-checked the thread, and all I see here is
Tom's
> ->post detailing the construction of said chasing lights.
> ->
> ->Did my ISP eat your post, Jim?
>
> Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
> VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
> http://www.rst-engr.com

[Jim Weir]

"Jay Honeck" >
shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

->

->Figuring one light every couple of feet, I suppose we'd need 15 per side, so
->30 total? They'd need to be sequenced so that they "chase" properly, both
->rows together. And I'll need to wire this into a motion sensor of some
->sort, so it's not running 24/7...

Not a problem. A bit more efficient of design if you can use 10 or 20, but if
15 is your choice, 15 we can design.

You want TWO rows running in parallel? Not a problem; just a bit more
complexity, but damned little.

What's the problem running 24/7? It uses less power than a flashlight. Best
calculation shows running 24/7 to be less than $0.50 a year in power bill.

Jim


->
->This is so crazy, I think it will be GREAT. :-)
->
->Tell you what : Help me make this goofy idea work, and I'll throw in your
->night's stay for the 2nd Annual Oshkosh Pool Party!



Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
http://www.rst-engr.com

[Tom Pappano]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>>Whoo Hoo! Methinks I'll have to take you up on that! If you would,
>>drop me an email with the Radio Shack part# of the lamps you bought
>>so I can check one out, and we can work out some technical details
>>of the MRALS configuration.
>>
>>Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA
>
>
> Haven't bought 'em yet, pending the final design specifications. If you
> have a way to use LEDs instead (and remember, the prime directive is that
> they must be easily installed so that they stick out below - and through -
> the suspended ceiling tiles.), all the better!
>
> So when do you plan to do the installation? :-)

Well, I may not actually be able to *do* the installation but the
controller will be easy to hook up by connecting the wires from
the lamps to a terminal block. I'll be able to send it to you
sooner than I'll be able to visit 8-) The thing will drive up to 16
stages, and handle incandescents (up to 12 volts) or leds. I looked
into some blue leds, and they may need to be "pointed" somewhat
toward the oncoming traffic, due to their 30 degree viewing
angle, to show up best. Should work fine though.

Brightness and timing settings are with four "pots" you adjust
with a small screwdriver.

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA

[Jay Honeck]

Sounds GREAT, Jim. Thanks!

> What's the problem running 24/7? It uses less power than a flashlight.
Best
> calculation shows running 24/7 to be less than $0.50 a year in power bill.


The problem is that the array will be visible from the pilot's lounge area.
This area becomes rather populated with pilots, on occasion, and I doubt
they'll want to have a string of strobes winking in their peripheral vision
for hours on end.

A directionally-oriented motion sensor, with an automatic shut-off after a
minute or two, would be best, methinks.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck]

> >>Whoo Hoo! Methinks I'll have to take you up on that!

Uh oh. We've got two competing systems now, Tom. (See Jim's posts.)

Perhaps I can put one system in the day lobby, and one in the night lobby?
:-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Tom Sixkiller]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:mhmQb.135335$xy6.574091@attbi_s02...
>
> Figuring one light every couple of feet, I suppose we'd need 15 per side,
so
> 30 total? They'd need to be sequenced so that they "chase" properly,
both
> rows together. And I'll need to wire this into a motion sensor of some
> sort, so it's not running 24/7...
>
> This is so crazy, I think it will be GREAT. :-)

Uh, Oh!!!

[Tom Pappano]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>>>>Whoo Hoo! Methinks I'll have to take you up on that!
>
>
> Uh oh. We've got two competing systems now, Tom. (See Jim's posts.)
>
> Perhaps I can put one system in the day lobby, and one in the night lobby?
> :-)

No problem, I'm happy to build you this little controller because
it will allow a little prototype from another project to go on living a
useful life, where otherwise it would be a sad little orphan
forced to watch other microcontrollers frolicking and doing
useful work 8-)

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA, "Live to program, program to live!"

[Jim Weir]

Oh, Jay, no. If Tom's already got one done, let him run with it. I was going
to do the design from scratch, but one that's already built...GO FOR IT.

Jim



Tom Pappano >
shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

->Jay Honeck wrote:
->>>>>Whoo Hoo! Methinks I'll have to take you up on that!
->>
->>
->> Uh oh. We've got two competing systems now, Tom. (See Jim's posts.)
->>
->> Perhaps I can put one system in the day lobby, and one in the night lobby?
->> :-)
->
->No problem, I'm happy to build you this little controller because
->it will allow a little prototype from another project to go on living a
->useful life, where otherwise it would be a sad little orphan
->forced to watch other microcontrollers frolicking and doing
->useful work 8-)
->
->Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA, "Live to program, program to live!"



Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
http://www.rst-engr.com

[Jay Honeck]

Okay, guys. I'm not picky! :-)

So, Tom, can we incorporate your stuff into the "Two-row-of-lights" plan? I
did some measuring this afternoon, and it looks like the optimal number of
lights in either row is now TEN (not 15) -- so I'll need 20 lights, total,
in two rows of ten.

They need to be sequenced together, so that they "chase" from the door
toward the lobby reservation desk like the airport "rabbit." The two rows
should be sequenced together, so that they blink as one unit.

Need any other info?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"
"Jim Weir" > wrote in message
...
> Oh, Jay, no. If Tom's already got one done, let him run with it. I was
going
> to do the design from scratch, but one that's already built...GO FOR IT.
>
> Jim
>
>
>
> Tom Pappano >
> shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:
>
> ->Jay Honeck wrote:
> ->>>>>Whoo Hoo! Methinks I'll have to take you up on that!
> ->>
> ->>
> ->> Uh oh. We've got two competing systems now, Tom. (See Jim's posts.)
> ->>
> ->> Perhaps I can put one system in the day lobby, and one in the night
lobby?
> ->> :-)
> ->
> ->No problem, I'm happy to build you this little controller because
> ->it will allow a little prototype from another project to go on living a
> ->useful life, where otherwise it would be a sad little orphan
> ->forced to watch other microcontrollers frolicking and doing
> ->useful work 8-)
> ->
> ->Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA, "Live to program, program to live!"
>
>
>
> Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
> VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
> http://www.rst-engr.com

[Tom Pappano]

Jay Honeck wrote:
> Okay, guys. I'm not picky! :-)
>
> So, Tom, can we incorporate your stuff into the "Two-row-of-lights" plan? I
> did some measuring this afternoon, and it looks like the optimal number of
> lights in either row is now TEN (not 15) -- so I'll need 20 lights, total,
> in two rows of ten.
>
> They need to be sequenced together, so that they "chase" from the door
> toward the lobby reservation desk like the airport "rabbit." The two rows
> should be sequenced together, so that they blink as one unit.
>
> Need any other info?

Hi Jay,

Two lights per "stage" no problem. Just connect each pair in series,
then to the proper controller output. With 10 stages, you will have
11 leads coming back to the controller. One positive "bus" tying the
+ ends of each stage together, and one lead from the - end of each
stage. You mentioned maybe having a motion detector trigger the system.
The previous tennant of my office left behind a passive infrared
detector from his security system. I probably can integrate that into
the system as well, and adding a pot to set "turn off delay" will
give you an "auto start with time delayed off" function.
There will be outputs to drive up to 16 stages, so you would just
use the first 10 for your setup. Should be pretty cool!

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA

[G.R. Patterson III]

Tom Pappano wrote:
>
> The previous tennant of my office left behind a passive infrared
> detector from his security system. I probably can integrate that into
> the system as well, and adding a pot to set "turn off delay" will
> give you an "auto start with time delayed off" function.

The detectors I've seen used in security systems have been low voltage units. If
you need 110v, the heat/motion detectors used for outdoor lights work well and
can be purchased separately from the lights. These usually have primitive adjustable
timers. Many of them also have photocells to keep them from operating during the
day, so, if you go this route, disable that.

George Patterson
Great discoveries are not announced with "Eureka!". What's usually said is
"Hummmmm... That's interesting...."

[Jay Honeck]

> There will be outputs to drive up to 16 stages, so you would just
> use the first 10 for your setup. Should be pretty cool!

A true story: This morning I was excitedly describing this "rabbit light"
system to some poor, unsuspecting hotel guests. We were in the lobby, and I
spent a good five minutes explaining how it was going to look just like the
lights leading to the approach end of a runway, and how it would be
sequenced, and how it would look really cool...

These people were clearly NOT pilots, nor even aviation buffs, and I
obviously chose the *wrong* audience -- cuz this woman and her husband just
looked at me like I was absolutely out of my mind. They smiled politely,
but clearly thought the whole idea was simply beyond bizarre...

Luckily, Mary was there to divert the conversation into more productive
directions.

*sigh* Dj'a ever wonder why some people just aren't "into" aviation, like
we are? What's *wrong* with them, anyway? :-)

Oh well -- I am really looking forward to this thing, Tom. What's next?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[G.R. Patterson III]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>
> These people were clearly NOT pilots, nor even aviation buffs, and I
> obviously chose the *wrong* audience -- cuz this woman and her husband just
> looked at me like I was absolutely out of my mind.

Like I said.... Better go with signs and arrows.

George Patterson
Great discoveries are not announced with "Eureka!". What's usually said is
"Hummmmm... That's interesting...."

[Jay Honeck]

> Like I said.... Better go with signs and arrows.

But George -- the poor people just don't *understand* how cool it will be!

It's up to me to "educate" them...

;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[G.R. Patterson III]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>
> > Like I said.... Better go with signs and arrows.
>
> But George -- the poor people just don't *understand* how cool it will be!

Well, that's your business. Literally.

George Patterson
Great discoveries are not announced with "Eureka!". What's usually said is
"Hummmmm... That's interesting...."

[Dennis O'Connor]

Ramp check, anyone?
denny
"Tom Pappano" > wrote in message
m...
> Jay Honeck wrote:
> > Okay, guys. I'm not picky! :-)

[Margy Natalie]

but if you just have the rabbits they still won't know where to go and will
wonder what's wrong with the lights.

Margy

Jay Honeck wrote:

> > Like I said.... Better go with signs and arrows.
>
> But George -- the poor people just don't *understand* how cool it will be!
>
> It's up to me to "educate" them...
>
> ;-)
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck]

> but if you just have the rabbits they still won't know where to go and
will
> wonder what's wrong with the lights.

You think?

I think it will lead them right to where I want them to go...

Oh well. Even if it doesn't have the desired effect, they will still be
cool!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Tom Pappano]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>>but if you just have the rabbits they still won't know where to go and
>
> will
>
>>wonder what's wrong with the lights.
>
>
> You think?
>
> I think it will lead them right to where I want them to go...
>
> Oh well. Even if it doesn't have the desired effect, they will still be
> cool!

Maybe the lights will trigger a deep instinct to try and
chase the rabbit, just as a puppy would!

A little progress report...

The rabbit does indeed rabbit!

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA

[Newps]

How about a whole little airport up there on the ceiling? You'll need
runway and taxiway lights too.

Jay Honeck wrote:

>>but if you just have the rabbits they still won't know where to go and
>
> will
>
>>wonder what's wrong with the lights.
>
>
> You think?
>
> I think it will lead them right to where I want them to go...
>
> Oh well. Even if it doesn't have the desired effect, they will still be
> cool!

[Margy Natalie]

Well, I've been up in the tower at the museum and folks couldn't figure out
what the rabbits for 1R were. Of course, I would use the opportunity to
teach a bit of aviation.

Margy

Jay Honeck wrote:

> > but if you just have the rabbits they still won't know where to go and
> will
> > wonder what's wrong with the lights.
>
> You think?
>
> I think it will lead them right to where I want them to go...
>
> Oh well. Even if it doesn't have the desired effect, they will still be
> cool!
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"

[David Lesher]

I suspect you'll find the epilepsy threat strongly related to the
repetition rate used; you should be able to dodge that bullet easily.

I agree it should be easy to build with some CMOS clocks and counters,
but I suspect that's not Jay's forte...


--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

[David Lesher]

BTW, I think it might be more striking to have an inverse rabbit; i.e.
all the LED's are on, but one..You chase the dark one...


--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

[Jay Honeck]

> A little progress report...
>
> The rabbit does indeed rabbit!

So when's the installation date, Tom?

:-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Tom Pappano]

Jay Honeck wrote:

>>A little progress report...
>>
>>The rabbit does indeed rabbit!
>
>
> So when's the installation date, Tom?
>
> :-)
Just need to tie in the infrared and give it a thorough checkout.
Should be able to send it up before next Friday!

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA

[Jay Honeck]

> > So when's the installation date, Tom?
> >
> > :-)
> Just need to tie in the infrared and give it a thorough checkout.
> Should be able to send it up before next Friday!

What, you're not coming for a weekend in the Memphis Belle suite?

:-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"
"Tom Pappano" > wrote in message
y.com...
> Jay Honeck wrote:
>
> >>A little progress report...
> >>
> >>The rabbit does indeed rabbit!
> >
> >
>
> Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA
>

[john smith]

G.R. Patterson III wrote:

> Like I said.... Better go with signs and arrows.

Anyone know any good "BurmaShave-like" aviation jingles?

[Tom Pappano]

Jay Honeck wrote:

>>>So when's the installation date, Tom?
>>>
>>>:-)
>>
>>Just need to tie in the infrared and give it a thorough checkout.
>>Should be able to send it up before next Friday!
>
>
> What, you're not coming for a weekend in the Memphis Belle suite?
>
> :-)

Much as I would like to come up, my schedule won't let me for at least
a few weeks. Waiting on me would cause needless delay in your
(and the world's) enjoyment of the MRALS system installation 8-)
Maybe I can get a "rain check" for the stay?
I did test 3 leds available from Radio Shack. Two blue ones
and a white one. The white one looked best due to its 90 degree
viewing angle, and the the higher priced of the two blue ones
was next. The blue one only has a 30 degree viewing angle, however.
That means only 15 degress on each side of center, 45 each side
for the white one. With these high intensity leds, the systems
will look pretty spiffy, if I do say so myself 8-)

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA

[Jay Honeck]

> That means only 15 degress on each side of center, 45 each side
> for the white one. With these high intensity leds, the systems
> will look pretty spiffy, if I do say so myself 8-)

Geez, Tom, this is sounding better all the time!

I'm really looking forward to it -- and you can "use" your "Memphis Belle"
rain-check anytime, if you can't make it up for the "grand install!"
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Tom Pappano]

G.R. Patterson III wrote:
>
> Tom Pappano wrote:
>
>>The previous tennant of my office left behind a passive infrared
>>detector from his security system. I probably can integrate that into
>>the system as well, and adding a pot to set "turn off delay" will
>>give you an "auto start with time delayed off" function.
>
>
> The detectors I've seen used in security systems have been low voltage units. If
> you need 110v, the heat/motion detectors used for outdoor lights work well and
> can be purchased separately from the lights. These usually have primitive adjustable
> timers. Many of them also have photocells to keep them from operating during the
> day, so, if you go this route, disable that.
>
> George Patterson
> Great discoveries are not announced with "Eureka!". What's usually said is
> "Hummmmm... That's interesting...."


How wierd! George's post just now showed up several days late! I'm not
sure I even want to know how that happens. 8-)
Anyhoo, the passive infrared works great. Runs off the 12 volt "system"
supply, and has relay contacts that I tied into a "port" pin on the CPU.
A pot gives a 0-256 second off-delay adjustment. The MRALS system
controller has passed hardware and software testing, and just needs
to be mounted in a small box and shipped!

And Jay, I do hope to "cash in" that rain check soon! 8-)

Tom Pappano, PP-ASEL-IA

[G.R. Patterson III]

Tom Pappano wrote:
>
> How wierd! George's post just now showed up several days late! I'm not
> sure I even want to know how that happens. 8-)

I just switched to Verizon DSL from Comcast. Verizon has their own news server
(Comcast sub-contracts that). Being a former part of the old Bell Telephone
System, Verizon is real big on doing things their own way. I suspect their ideas
about connecting to external networks are, shall we say, unique.

George Patterson
Love, n.: A form of temporary insanity afflicting the young. It is curable
either by marriage or by removal of the afflicted from the circumstances
under which he incurred the condition. It is sometimes fatal, but more
often to the physician than to the patient.

[Paul Sengupta]

"G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message
...
>
> Tom Pappano wrote:
> >
> > How wierd! George's post just now showed up several days late!

> Being a former part of the old Bell Telephone
> System, Verizon is real big on doing things their own way. I suspect their
ideas
> about connecting to external networks are, shall we say, unique.

Saw it here no problem at somewhere around the correct time.

Paul

[G.R. Patterson III]

Paul Sengupta wrote:
>
> Saw it here no problem at somewhere around the correct time.

Well, I'm not an expert on the net, but as I understand it, a post is relayed from
the server that accepts it to one or more other servers in the net, who relay the
data on as well as storing it for their users. The time between my posting the info
and someone else having it available is directly proportional to the number of links
the post has to go through before reaching the reader. In addition, if there is a
"critical" node in the path between the two, and that server is down at the time,
the post may be lost or some time may elapse before it arrives over a more roundabout
path. Users on other servers may see the post immediately because the server which
is down is not a critical node in the path to their server.

One way to avoid this is for each server to send postings which it receives to
several other servers, rather than just one. This is, however, somewhat of a foreign
concept in telephony, so I theorized that Verizon may not be doing this in the best
manner. Then again, they may. In any case, that post was made in the first day or
so that I began using the Verizon account, and that may be the reason behind the
delay.

Of course, if Tom's server was down at the time my post would have reached it,
that would certainly count as a "critical node".

George Patterson
Love, n.: A form of temporary insanity afflicting the young. It is curable
either by marriage or by removal of the afflicted from the circumstances
under which he incurred the condition. It is sometimes fatal, but more
often to the physician than to the patient.

[Paul Sengupta]

"G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message
...
> I theorized that Verizon may not be doing this in the best
> manner.

Ah. Funny that it gets to a Dutch or Swedish server, wherever this
is, quicker! :-)

Paul

[Jay Honeck]

> Ah. Funny that it gets to a Dutch or Swedish server, wherever this
> is, quicker! :-)

It is amazing how we have come to take this "world-wide" web for granted,
no?

I push this here button, and Paul is reading it in Great Britain --
instantly! Who'd ever have believed it?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Greg Burkhart]

Jay,

What's the status of this???

[Jay Honeck]

> What's the status of this???

The last I heard, they were "on the way!"
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"