6 place airplane

[Marval]

Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
pounds with full of fuel.

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[Roy Smith]

In article >,
Marval > wrote:

> Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
> carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
> pounds with full of fuel.

Why with full fuel? A more reasonable requirement is "can carry 1000
pounds plus enough fuel to go X miles with Y minutes reserve".

Let's say I find you an airplane that can carry 6 people with full fuel,
but the tanks are so small you can only go 100 miles with it. Will you
be happy?

Let's say I find you an airplane which can carry 6 people, if you only
fill the tanks half way, but that still leaves you enough fuel to fly
800 miles. Will you be unhappy?

[Mike Rapoport]

I don't think there are any but are you sure that you can find 6 adults who
are willing to sit in a six place single for four to six hours?

Mike
MU-2



"Marval" > wrote in message
...
> Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
> carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
> pounds with full of fuel.
>
> *** Sent via http://www.automationtools.com ***
> Add a newsgroup interface to your website today.

[Paul Sengupta]

A Caravan or PC-12 with some seats taken out?

Paul

"Marval" > wrote in message
...
> Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
> carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
> pounds with full of fuel.

[[email protected]]

Marval > wrote:
> Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
> carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
> pounds with full of fuel.

> *** Sent via http://www.automationtools.com ***
> Add a newsgroup interface to your website today.

Antonov AN-2

Plus you have a potty if fitted for passengers.

--
Jim Pennino

Remove -spam-sux to reply.

[C J Campbell]

"Marval" > wrote in message
...
| Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
| carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
| pounds with full of fuel.
|

If I only fill the fuel to the tabs, I can carry over 1000 lbs payload in my
206 and still have more than five hours endurance.

OTOH, you could just buy a plane that has smaller fuel tanks and lose the
option of flying further if you have only a small load.

[John E. Carty]

The new Piper 6X comes close at 828 pounds with full fuel :-)

"Marval" > wrote in message
...
> Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
> carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
> pounds with full of fuel.
>
> *** Sent via http://www.automationtools.com ***
> Add a newsgroup interface to your website today.

[Ray Andraka]

I beg to differ. I have a 1965 Cherokee Six-260. I have 1050lb payload left
over with full tanks. Full tanks is 84 gallons at 14 GPH doing an honest
125-130 Kts, betcha can't sit that long. I haven't seen any other production
piston single that will match it (excepting PA-32's of course). The thing is a
minivan with wings.

Mike Rapoport wrote:

> I don't think there are any but are you sure that you can find 6 adults who
> are willing to sit in a six place single for four to six hours?

--
--Ray Andraka, P.E.
President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
email
http://www.andraka.com

"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-Benjamin Franklin, 1759

[Mike Rapoport]

OK, so there is one. The real question that I was trying to get at is
whether 1000lb and full fuel are sensible criteria. I would say that an
airplane meeting those specs should have larger tanks. I have nine seats
and I have taken a maximium of 6 people exactly once. I have never taken
more than four (my family) on a long flight >1200nm. My experience (and
most of those I know) is that there is rarely an occasion to fill the 6
seats for a long flight it is usually either/or.

Mike
MU-2


"Ray Andraka" > wrote in message
...
> I beg to differ. I have a 1965 Cherokee Six-260. I have 1050lb payload
left
> over with full tanks. Full tanks is 84 gallons at 14 GPH doing an honest
> 125-130 Kts, betcha can't sit that long. I haven't seen any other
production
> piston single that will match it (excepting PA-32's of course). The thing
is a
> minivan with wings.
>
> Mike Rapoport wrote:
>
> > I don't think there are any but are you sure that you can find 6 adults
who
> > are willing to sit in a six place single for four to six hours?
>
> --
> --Ray Andraka, P.E.
> President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
> 401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
> email
> http://www.andraka.com
>
> "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
> temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
> -Benjamin Franklin, 1759
>
>

[[email protected]]

On 22-Jan-2004, "Mike Rapoport" > wrote:

> The real question that I was trying to get at is whether 1000lb and full
> fuel are sensible criteria.
> I would say that an airplane meeting those specs should have larger tanks.


Exactly!

Many pilots say they don't need “extra” range because they can tolerate only
so many hours on a given flight leg. I'll bet these pilots are mostly
non-instrument rated, because where the “extra” range really makes a
difference is in meeting the IFR alternate and reserve requirements. Knock
a couple of hours off of a seemingly generous 5 hour endurance and IFR range
suddenly becomes a very limiting 3 hours.

Remember, on a flight of 600 nm, a 135 kt. airplane that can make it
non-stop will about as fast as a 175 kt. airplane that can't.

---Elliott Drucker

[Pat Thronson]

TBM- 700

http://www.aerospatiale-socata.ip3.com/Socata%20TBM-700.htm Capacity
"Pilot and one passenger (or copilot) on flightdeck. Main cabin seating for
up to five, or typical accommodation for four in a club arrangement. The
TBM-700 is also offered as a freighter."


This will haul the groceries :)

Pat Thronson

"Marval" > wrote in message
...
> Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
> carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
> pounds with full of fuel.
>
> *** Sent via http://www.automationtools.com ***
> Add a newsgroup interface to your website today.

[Drew Dalgleish]

If you're not in a hurry for it you could build yourself a Murphy
Moose.

>Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
>carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
>pounds with full of fuel.
>
>*** Sent via http://www.automationtools.com ***
>Add a newsgroup interface to your website today.

[BTIZ]

where is your CG with all seats filled and only "reserve" fuel .. or better
yet.. empty tanks..

BT

"Ray Andraka" > wrote in message
...
> I beg to differ. I have a 1965 Cherokee Six-260. I have 1050lb payload
left
> over with full tanks. Full tanks is 84 gallons at 14 GPH doing an honest
> 125-130 Kts, betcha can't sit that long. I haven't seen any other
production
> piston single that will match it (excepting PA-32's of course). The thing
is a
> minivan with wings.
>
> Mike Rapoport wrote:
>
> > I don't think there are any but are you sure that you can find 6 adults
who
> > are willing to sit in a six place single for four to six hours?
>
> --
> --Ray Andraka, P.E.
> President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
> 401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
> email
> http://www.andraka.com
>
> "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
> temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
> -Benjamin Franklin, 1759
>
>

[C J Campbell]

"Drew Dalgleish" > wrote in message
...
| If you're not in a hurry for it you could build yourself a Murphy
| Moose.
|

Aahh. But then I would put in extra large gas tanks, and still be back with
the same 'problem.'

[Peter Hovorka]

Hi Paul,

the PC-12/45 will load about 600 kg ( ~ 1300 lb ) with full fuel and
without seats to be taken out. Correct me if I'm wrong, just iirc-data.

Regards,
Peter

[Paul Sengupta]

It's just that he wanted 6 seats! :-)

1000lb load is all very well, but in my book that doesn't equate
to 6 adults! 600kg would be nearer if "normal" male adults are
called for. Would only be enough for 5 of me! :-)

Paul

"Peter Hovorka" > wrote in message
...
> Hi Paul,
>
> the PC-12/45 will load about 600 kg ( ~ 1300 lb ) with full fuel and
> without seats to be taken out. Correct me if I'm wrong, just iirc-data.
>
> Regards,
> Peter
>

[Ray Andraka]

You have to really work to get the CG out of range. It''ll happen if you fill
the
back seats with big guys and leave the others empty, but otherwise it is pretty
hard
to do. The tanks are not that far forward of the CG, and the airplane is pretty
heavy
(3400# max gross), so the CG change from full to empty is not all that great.
My
W&B spreadsheet doe calculate the zero fuel and anticipated arrival CG's
nonetheless.

BTIZ wrote:

> where is your CG with all seats filled and only "reserve" fuel .. or better
> yet.. empty tanks..
>
> BT
>
> "Ray Andraka" > wrote in message
> ...
> > I beg to differ. I have a 1965 Cherokee Six-260. I have 1050lb payload
> left
> > over with full tanks. Full tanks is 84 gallons at 14 GPH doing an honest
> > 125-130 Kts, betcha can't sit that long. I haven't seen any other
> production
> > piston single that will match it (excepting PA-32's of course). The thing
> is a
> > minivan with wings.
> >
> > Mike Rapoport wrote:
> >
> > > I don't think there are any but are you sure that you can find 6 adults
> who
> > > are willing to sit in a six place single for four to six hours?
> >
> > --
> > --Ray Andraka, P.E.
> > President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
> > 401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
> > email
> > http://www.andraka.com
> >
> > "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
> > temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
> > -Benjamin Franklin, 1759
> >
> >

--
--Ray Andraka, P.E.
President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
email
http://www.andraka.com

"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-Benjamin Franklin, 1759

[Mike Rapoport]

I am waiting on my Moose kit #and is will have the large tanks! With the
large tank option I anticipate being able to go fishing from place to place
for an extended period without returning to an airport. The Moose is
evidently proving very popular since I have been assigned serial number 241.

Mike
MU-2


"C J Campbell" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Drew Dalgleish" > wrote in message
> ...
> | If you're not in a hurry for it you could build yourself a Murphy
> | Moose.
> |
>
> Aahh. But then I would put in extra large gas tanks, and still be back
with
> the same 'problem.'
>
>

[Mike Long]

Marval > wrote in message >...
> Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
> carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
> pounds with full of fuel.
>
> *** Sent via http://www.automationtools.com ***
> Add a newsgroup interface to your website today.

A 206H has just under 1400 lbs useful. If you add Flint Tip Tanks, it
will be 200 lbs additional if you don't put fuel in them. So, roughly,
that leaves 1065 lbs payload with 88 gallons. With small gear, 156-158
kts.

Mike

[Doug]

Cool. Which floats are you putting on it? Straights or Amphibs? I took
my Husky up north with Wipline 2100A's. What a trip!

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message . net>...
> I am waiting on my Moose kit #and is will have the large tanks! With the
> large tank option I anticipate being able to go fishing from place to place
> for an extended period without returning to an airport. The Moose is
> evidently proving very popular since I have been assigned serial number 241.
>
> Mike
> MU-2
>
>
> "C J Campbell" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "Drew Dalgleish" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > | If you're not in a hurry for it you could build yourself a Murphy
> > | Moose.
> > |
> >
> > Aahh. But then I would put in extra large gas tanks, and still be back
> with
> > the same 'problem.'
> >
> >

[Ray Andraka]

I think you either made a math error or mis-typed. 88 gallons of fuel is 520 lbs, so if the useful
load is 1400 lbs, then that leaves 880 lbs payload, not 1065. Maybe you meant adding the flint
tanks gives you an additional 200 lbs useful load, and if you leave them empty it gets you close to
that 1065 lbs. 1065 is only 15 lbs more than I get with my more or less stock Six, although I can
only dream of 150+ kts. What kind of fuel burn do you get at that speed?

Mike Long wrote:

> Marval > wrote in message >...
> > Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
> > carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
> > pounds with full of fuel.
> >
> > *** Sent via http://www.automationtools.com ***
> > Add a newsgroup interface to your website today.
>
> A 206H has just under 1400 lbs useful. If you add Flint Tip Tanks, it
> will be 200 lbs additional if you don't put fuel in them. So, roughly,
> that leaves 1065 lbs payload with 88 gallons. With small gear, 156-158
> kts.
>
> Mike

--
--Ray Andraka, P.E.
President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
email
http://www.andraka.com

"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-Benjamin Franklin, 1759

[Peter Hovorka]

Hi,

> 1000lb load is all very well, but in my book that doesn't equate
> to 6 adults! 600kg would be nearer if "normal" male adults are
> called for. Would only be enough for 5 of me! :-)

Makes me think what the OP plans to do with 6 men in the plane...

*just kidding*

Peter

[Mike Rapoport]

Amphibs. When I was there a few months ago, Murphy was starting a pair of
prototype floats for the Moose. They should be availible later this year.
I also plan to use both wheels and skis. My hanger was engineered to take a
4000lb point load in the center so my plan is to lift the plane with a hoist
and swap gear.

Mike
MU-2

"Doug" > wrote in message
om...
> Cool. Which floats are you putting on it? Straights or Amphibs? I took
> my Husky up north with Wipline 2100A's. What a trip!
>
> "Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
. net>...
> > I am waiting on my Moose kit #and is will have the large tanks! With
the
> > large tank option I anticipate being able to go fishing from place to
place
> > for an extended period without returning to an airport. The Moose is
> > evidently proving very popular since I have been assigned serial number
241.
> >
> > Mike
> > MU-2
> >
> >
> > "C J Campbell" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > "Drew Dalgleish" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > | If you're not in a hurry for it you could build yourself a Murphy
> > > | Moose.
> > > |
> > >
> > > Aahh. But then I would put in extra large gas tanks, and still be back
> > with
> > > the same 'problem.'
> > >
> > >

[Drew Dalgleish]

Welcome to the club Mike. Did you get a quick build? There's a few
choices for amphibs now Montana is building and a guy near me is
working on a composite set. There's a rebel builders list you might
want to join at https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.wcx
It's mostly rebel stuff but some elite and moose chatter as well. My
Rebel is hanging from the rafters right now while I fit a set of wheel
skis of my own design. Changing from wheels to floats takes about a
day.
Drew Dalgleish
Centralia ont.
Murphy Rebel C-FYHO

>Amphibs. When I was there a few months ago, Murphy was starting a pair of
>prototype floats for the Moose. They should be availible later this year.
>I also plan to use both wheels and skis. My hanger was engineered to take a
>4000lb point load in the center so my plan is to lift the plane with a hoist
>and swap gear.
>
>Mike
>MU-2
>
>"Doug" > wrote in message
om...
>> Cool. Which floats are you putting on it? Straights or Amphibs? I took
>> my Husky up north with Wipline 2100A's. What a trip!
>>
>> "Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
. net>...
>> > I am waiting on my Moose kit #and is will have the large tanks! With
>the
>> > large tank option I anticipate being able to go fishing from place to
>place
>> > for an extended period without returning to an airport. The Moose is
>> > evidently proving very popular since I have been assigned serial number
>241.
>> >
>> > Mike
>> > MU-2
>> >
>> >
>> > "C J Campbell" > wrote in message
>> > ...
>> > >
>> > > "Drew Dalgleish" > wrote in message
>> > > ...
>> > > | If you're not in a hurry for it you could build yourself a Murphy
>> > > | Moose.
>> > > |
>> > >
>> > > Aahh. But then I would put in extra large gas tanks, and still be back
>> > with
>> > > the same 'problem.'
>> > >
>> > >
>
>

[Mike Long]

Ray Andraka > wrote in message >...
> I think you either made a math error or mis-typed. 88 gallons of fuel is 520 lbs, so if the useful
> load is 1400 lbs, then that leaves 880 lbs payload, not 1065. Maybe you meant adding the flint
> tanks gives you an additional 200 lbs useful load, and if you leave them empty it gets you close to
> that 1065 lbs. 1065 is only 15 lbs more than I get with my more or less stock Six, although I can
> only dream of 150+ kts. What kind of fuel burn do you get at that speed?
>
> Mike Long wrote:
>

Yes, I meant to imply the 1065 came with the addition of Flint Tanks
but with no fuel in them - only the 88 gallons standard. The Flint's
add 200 lbs to the gross weight. 15-16 gallons is the norm and the
small gear seems to make the airplane faster by more than I would have
thought.

Mike

[Mike Rapoport]

I ordered the quick build kit and the delivery time is about 9 months. I
think that this is actually good for me becasue by the time I have to make
choices on prop, floats ect there will probably be a body of expertise that
doesn't exist yet. Thanks for the link, I will probably start lurking there
over the next few months.

Mike
MU-2


"Drew Dalgleish" > wrote in message
...
> Welcome to the club Mike. Did you get a quick build? There's a few
> choices for amphibs now Montana is building and a guy near me is
> working on a composite set. There's a rebel builders list you might
> want to join at https://www.dcsol.com/public/code/html-subscribe.wcx
> It's mostly rebel stuff but some elite and moose chatter as well. My
> Rebel is hanging from the rafters right now while I fit a set of wheel
> skis of my own design. Changing from wheels to floats takes about a
> day.
> Drew Dalgleish
> Centralia ont.
> Murphy Rebel C-FYHO
>
> >Amphibs. When I was there a few months ago, Murphy was starting a pair
of
> >prototype floats for the Moose. They should be availible later this
year.
> >I also plan to use both wheels and skis. My hanger was engineered to
take a
> >4000lb point load in the center so my plan is to lift the plane with a
hoist
> >and swap gear.
> >
> >Mike
> >MU-2
> >
> >"Doug" > wrote in message
> om...
> >> Cool. Which floats are you putting on it? Straights or Amphibs? I took
> >> my Husky up north with Wipline 2100A's. What a trip!
> >>
> >> "Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
> . net>...
> >> > I am waiting on my Moose kit #and is will have the large tanks! With
> >the
> >> > large tank option I anticipate being able to go fishing from place to
> >place
> >> > for an extended period without returning to an airport. The Moose is
> >> > evidently proving very popular since I have been assigned serial
number
> >241.
> >> >
> >> > Mike
> >> > MU-2
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > "C J Campbell" > wrote in
message
> >> > ...
> >> > >
> >> > > "Drew Dalgleish" > wrote in message
> >> > > ...
> >> > > | If you're not in a hurry for it you could build yourself a Murphy
> >> > > | Moose.
> >> > > |
> >> > >
> >> > > Aahh. But then I would put in extra large gas tanks, and still be
back
> >> > with
> >> > > the same 'problem.'
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >
> >
>

[Tom Sixkiller]

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
hlink.net...
> I ordered the quick build kit and the delivery time is about 9 months. I
> think that this is actually good for me becasue by the time I have to make
> choices on prop, floats ect there will probably be a body of expertise
that
> doesn't exist yet. Thanks for the link, I will probably start lurking
there
> over the next few months.
>

http://www.montanafloat.com

Right in your back yard.

[Doug]

Mike,
If you haven't already, you might want to check out
www.seaplanes.org . It is the quintessential seaplane site.

"Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message et>...
> Amphibs. When I was there a few months ago, Murphy was starting a pair of
> prototype floats for the Moose. They should be availible later this year.
> I also plan to use both wheels and skis. My hanger was engineered to take a
> 4000lb point load in the center so my plan is to lift the plane with a hoist
> and swap gear.
>
> Mike
> MU-2
>
> "Doug" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Cool. Which floats are you putting on it? Straights or Amphibs? I took
> > my Husky up north with Wipline 2100A's. What a trip!
> >
> > "Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
> . net>...
> > > I am waiting on my Moose kit #and is will have the large tanks! With
> the
> > > large tank option I anticipate being able to go fishing from place to
> place
> > > for an extended period without returning to an airport. The Moose is
> > > evidently proving very popular since I have been assigned serial number
> 241.
> > >
> > > Mike
> > > MU-2
> > >
> > >
> > > "C J Campbell" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > >
> > > > "Drew Dalgleish" > wrote in message
> > > > ...
> > > > | If you're not in a hurry for it you could build yourself a Murphy
> > > > | Moose.
> > > > |
> > > >
> > > > Aahh. But then I would put in extra large gas tanks, and still be back
> with
> > > > the same 'problem.'
> > > >
> > > >

[Mike Rapoport]

Thanks. There will be a lot of options by the time I have the airplane
completed. I'm hopeful that the floats from Murphy will be less expensive
than certified floats.

Mike
MU-2

"Tom Sixkiller" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Mike Rapoport" > wrote in message
> hlink.net...
> > I ordered the quick build kit and the delivery time is about 9 months.
I
> > think that this is actually good for me becasue by the time I have to
make
> > choices on prop, floats ect there will probably be a body of expertise
> that
> > doesn't exist yet. Thanks for the link, I will probably start lurking
> there
> > over the next few months.
> >
>
> http://www.montanafloat.com
>
> Right in your back yard.
>
>

[frank]

Marval wrote:

> Can anyone help me out? trying to find a 6 place airplane that can truly
> carry it's load, single engine. looking for a payload of at least 1000
> pounds with full of fuel.
>
CompAir?