Survival Gear

[EDR]

As long as we are on the topics of putting lists together, Survival
Gear is another topic we haven't covered.

I have three "kits". One that wear, another is a daypack, the third is
a dedicated first aid kit in a lumbar pack.

The one I wear is a fishing vest with immediate essentials stuffed in
the interior and exterior pockets. "If it isn't on you, it's not going
out the door with you." (handheld strobe, foil juice pouches, fire
starter kit, dried fruit, LED flashlight, pen and paper,
wind/waterproof jacket/pants, spaceblanket, bandana, sunglasses,
handheld GPS, pocket first aid kit, chemical light sticks)

The daypack (2600 cu in) contains more long-term survival items.
(water purifier, 5 liter hydration pouch, two 1 liter water bottles,
liquid fuel stove, plates/cups/utensils, lightweight shelter, LED
headlamp, handheld strobe, first aid kit, Swiss Army knife, multi-tool,
all-weather lighter, micro-fleece blanket, space blanket, bandana)

The first aid kit is made up of items found in an AvWeb article. It
transfers between the van and the airplane. Also, I would urge all of
you to take Red Cross First Aid class(es).

[Rosspilot]

I have a backpack in the baggage compartment containing a survival kit,
including space blankets, waterproof matches, light sticks, hunting knife,
small hand shovel, first aid kit, snake bite kit, water purification tablets,
mirrors, dried rations, rope and cord, Leatherman Delux tool, flares, insect
repellant, lots of other things I can't recall at this instant. It weighs
about 30 lbs.


www.Rosspilot.com

[Dale]

In article >,
EDR > wrote:

> As long as we are on the topics of putting lists together, Survival
> Gear is another topic we haven't covered.


Toilet paper.

--
Dale L. Falk

There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing
as simply messing around with airplanes.

http://home.gci.net/~sncdfalk/flying.html

[G.R. Patterson III]

EDR wrote:
>
> As long as we are on the topics of putting lists together, Survival
> Gear is another topic we haven't covered.

My kit hangs from the back of the pilot's seat. With a pull handle on top, it's
easy to grab on my way out. It holds military-style matches, three "space-age"
sleeping bags, three "space-age" blankets, a plastic dropcloth and coil of thin
line to use as a tent, a signal mirror, heavy sheath knife, compass, and a
variety of medical stuff.

There's lots of other stuff I would add (like food and water), but that's already
up to about 20 pounds.

George Patterson
Love, n.: A form of temporary insanity afflicting the young. It is curable
either by marriage or by removal of the afflicted from the circumstances
under which he incurred the condition. It is sometimes fatal, but more
often to the physician than to the patient.

[G.R. Patterson III]

Dale wrote:
>
> Toilet paper.

Note to self - take roll out to the plane tomorrow.

Thanks, Dale. Never occurred to me.

George Patterson
Love, n.: A form of temporary insanity afflicting the young. It is curable
either by marriage or by removal of the afflicted from the circumstances
under which he incurred the condition. It is sometimes fatal, but more
often to the physician than to the patient.

[john price]

I always keep a six-pack in the plane

John Price
CFII/AGI/IGI
http://home.att.net/~jm.price


"G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> EDR wrote:
> >
> > As long as we are on the topics of putting lists together, Survival
> > Gear is another topic we haven't covered.
>
> My kit hangs from the back of the pilot's seat. With a pull handle on top,
it's
> easy to grab on my way out. It holds military-style matches, three
"space-age"
> sleeping bags, three "space-age" blankets, a plastic dropcloth and coil of
thin
> line to use as a tent, a signal mirror, heavy sheath knife, compass, and a
> variety of medical stuff.
>
> There's lots of other stuff I would add (like food and water), but that's
already
> up to about 20 pounds.
>
> George Patterson
> Love, n.: A form of temporary insanity afflicting the young. It is
curable
> either by marriage or by removal of the afflicted from the
circumstances
> under which he incurred the condition. It is sometimes fatal, but
more
> often to the physician than to the patient.

[tony roberts]

Hi Ross

Why not wear the leatherman on your belt?
That way if you are ever unlucky enough to find yourself and passengers
handing upside down you can cut seatbelts and even break windows with it.
Also it is great for emergency inflight repairs (as are clamps - try
losing the throttle knob to see how great clamps are) and also, if you
ever have to exit the aircraft without time to collect your survival
kit, you'll have the leatherman, and hopefully snare wire and waterproof
matches on your person - you can survive pretty well with those 3 items
if you know survival techniques.


Tony


--

Tony Roberts
PP-ASEL
VFR OTT
Night
Almost Instrument :)
Cessna 172H C-GICE



> I have a backpack in the baggage compartment containing a survival kit,
> including space blankets, waterproof matches, light sticks, hunting knife,
> small hand shovel, first aid kit, snake bite kit, water purification tablets,
> mirrors, dried rations, rope and cord, Leatherman Delux tool, flares, insect
> repellant, lots of other things I can't recall at this instant. It weighs
> about 30 lbs.
>
>
> www.Rosspilot.com

[Rosspilot]

>Why not wear the leatherman on your belt?
>That way if you are ever unlucky enough to find yourself and passengers
>handing upside down you can cut seatbelts and even break windows with it.
>Also it is great for emergency inflight repairs (as are clamps - try
>losing the throttle knob to see how great clamps are) and also, if you
>ever have to exit the aircraft without time to collect your survival
>kit, you'll have the leatherman, and hopefully snare wire and waterproof
>matches on your person - you can survive pretty well with those 3 items
>if you know survival techniques.
>

Good idea, Tony . . . I actually have 2 Leatherman Tools. I have been keeping
one in my flight bag--but you're quite right. On the belt makes more sense.

As far as survival techniques, I am an ex Army Ranger, and have been through
SERE (survival, escape, resistance, evasion) training--standard for military
pilots. PLUS, I watch "Survivor" religiously <G>.

www.Rosspilot.com

[tony roberts]

> As far as survival techniques, I am an ex Army Ranger, and have been through
> SERE

And I'm telling you about survival? :) You could sure teach me more
than a few things.


>PLUS, I watch "Survivor" religiously <G>.

OK - That clinches it :)

Tony


--

Tony Roberts
PP-ASEL
VFR OTT
Night
Almost Instrument :)
Cessna 172H C-GICE

[Paul Sengupta]

Blimey. Never thought of taking all that on a trip from Bourne Park
to Compton Abbas for Sunday lunch...

:-)

Paul (yeah, I should use my plane more)

"EDR" > wrote in message
...
> As long as we are on the topics of putting lists together, Survival
> Gear is another topic we haven't covered.

[vincent p. norris]

>..... you can cut seatbelts

Isn't it easier just to unfasten them?

vince norris

[EDR]

What is the best metal/guage/length of wire to carry for snares?

[Dale]

In article >,
vincent p. norris > wrote:

> >..... you can cut seatbelts
>
> Isn't it easier just to unfasten them?


Yes, assuming you can get to the release. After a crash you may have
shift enough that you won't be able to release the seatbelt.

I know of one case where a floatplane flipped upside down in shallow
water. The pilot was still strapped in and couldn't release due to the
new upholstery being thicker than the original and the buckle being
outboard so that it was jammed against the armrest by the pilots weight.
Rescuers were attempting to get him out and handed him a knife, after a
moment he handed the knife back. The airplane sank and he died.

--
Dale L. Falk

There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing
as simply messing around with airplanes.

http://home.gci.net/~sncdfalk/flying.html

[tony roberts]

> >..... you can cut seatbelts
>
> Isn't it easier just to unfasten them?

Yes it is -
Unless you are hanging upside down, disoriented, unable to see . . .
Also, it isn't just for you - it's for your passengers too - if they are
hanging in the belt unconscious cutting the belt may be the only option,
particularly if fire/sinking/whatever make it time critical.

Tony

--

Tony Roberts
PP-ASEL
VFR OTT
Night
Almost Instrument :)
Cessna 172H C-GICE

[tony roberts]

In article >,
EDR > wrote:

> What is the best metal/guage/length of wire to carry for snares?

It depends on what you want to snare. For a pocket survival tool I buy a
light copper snare wire and it comes in a roll of about 15 ft. It only
weighs a few ounces. I like copper as when it is used as a snare it
doesn't stand out like steel does.

It has many survival uses. I teach a basic survival course and my
favourite use for it is tie together the poles to errect a signalfire
tower - it continues to hold when the fire takes off - unlike string
which lets the whole lot fall apart :). It is also great for fastening
the materials for your shelter, it is great to hold on your makeshift
snowshoes, it can be used to repair things, and to cut with. It can bind
a sharp stone to a pole to make a spear, and you can fish with it. And
it can be used as snare wire. The one that I use is good for birds,
rabbits, squirrels etc, and used in 2 or 3 loops it would be useable on
larger game.

HTH

Tony

--

Tony Roberts
PP-ASEL
VFR OTT
Night
Almost Instrument :)
Cessna 172H C-GICE

[vincent p. norris]

>> Isn't it easier just to unfasten them?
>
>Yes it is -
>Unless you are hanging upside down, disoriented, unable to see . . .

Sorry, Tony, I just don't find that persuasive. If you're "hanging
upside down, disoriented, unable to see," you're going to have a lot
more trouble finding your tool, unhooking it from your belt, etc.,
than opening a seat belt buckle you've done hundreds of times before.

vince norris

[G.R. Patterson III]

"vincent p. norris" wrote:
>
> If you're "hanging
> upside down, disoriented, unable to see," you're going to have a lot
> more trouble finding your tool, unhooking it from your belt, etc.,
> than opening a seat belt buckle you've done hundreds of times before.

Next time you're in a plane, try this. Fasten the belt. Then raise your body
as far off the seat as you can with your legs, putting as much pressure as you
can on the belt. Then try to open it.

If it's like mine, you won't be able to do it.

You'll have more pressure than that on the belt if you're upside down.

George Patterson
A diplomat is a person who can tell you to go to hell in such a way that
you look forward to the trip.

[Ron McKinnon]

"vincent p. norris" > wrote in message
...
> >> Isn't it easier just to unfasten them?
> >
> >Yes it is -
> >Unless you are hanging upside down, disoriented, unable to see . . .
>
> Sorry, Tony, I just don't find that persuasive. If you're "hanging
> upside down, disoriented, unable to see," you're going to have a lot
> more trouble finding your tool, unhooking it from your belt, etc.,
> than opening a seat belt buckle you've done hundreds of times before.

Or, perhaps something is jammed against the release, or against the harness
so you just can't access the release. Or the harness is tangled with
something or the release is mangled somehow. Or your hand/arm that should
operate the release is broken, or, your passenger can't get to his release
and you can only reach some other part of their harness ...

[Newps]

>>>Isn't it easier just to unfasten them?
>>
>>Yes it is -
>>Unless you are hanging upside down, disoriented, unable to see . . .

Are you saying the seatbelt is no longer around your waist?

[vincent p. norris]

>Next time you're in a plane, try this. Fasten the belt. Then raise your body
>as far off the seat as you can with your legs, putting as much pressure as you
>can on the belt. Then try to open it.
>
>If it's like mine, you won't be able to do it.

Fair enough; I'll try it. But if that's the case, I think it would be
smart to replace the buckle.

vince norris

[vincent p. norris]

>Or, perhaps something is jammed against the release, or against the harness
>so you just can't access the release. Or the harness is tangled with
>something or the release is mangled somehow. Or your hand/arm that should
>operate the release is broken, or, your passenger can't get to his release
>and you can only reach some other part of their harness ...

Sorry to sound so stubborn, but those just don't strike me as
realistic hyptheses. I can suggest as many "maybes" that would
prevent my using a tool to cut my seat belt.

I guess I'll just continue to take my chances without the
tool--although there's one in my bag for other purposes.

BTW, I don't wear a chute, either. But I do carry TWO flashlights at
night.

vince norris

[Ron McKinnon]

"vincent p. norris" > wrote in message
...
> >Or, perhaps something is jammed against the release, or against the
harness
> >so you just can't access the release. Or the harness is tangled with
> >something or the release is mangled somehow. Or your hand/arm that
should
> >operate the release is broken, or, your passenger can't get to his
release
> >and you can only reach some other part of their harness ...
>
> Sorry to sound so stubborn, but those just don't strike me as
> realistic hyptheses.

Well, the topic is Survival Gear. When do you need Survival Gear?
It suggests to me that you've maybe had to do a forced landing somewhere
you didn't intend. Might be into water, trees, or rough terrain. Its not
inconceivable that the plane is bent, maybe a lot, seats jammed together,
trees, branches or rocks, parts of the airframe or wing intruding, who
knows?
Even granting that you've lived through it so far, the hypotheses don't
sound that unrealistic to me.

> I can suggest as many "maybes" that would prevent my using a tool
> to cut my seat belt.

Sure. No guarantees. But the question is not whether you should or
shouldn't carry such a tool, but what kind of circumstances would
prevent you from simply unlatching your harness ...

[tony roberts]

> Sorry to sound so stubborn, but those just don't strike me as
> realistic hyptheses. I can suggest as many "maybes" that would
> prevent my using a tool to cut my seat belt.

Nobody is suggesting that you carry a knife and cut your seatbelt at
every opportunity. The point is that IF you find yourself in an
emergency situation and IF you cannot for whatever reason undo your
seatbelt and IF you have a tool with a knife which is within reach then
MAYBE it will get you out of the belt. Even if it only saves you 10
seconds it may be the difference between burning & not. Flying is all
about keeping options open - that's what we are doing.

> BTW, I don't wear a chute, either. But I do carry TWO flashlights at
> night.

Are they sharp? Sorry - couldn't resist :):):)

Tony

--

Tony Roberts
PP-ASEL
VFR OTT
Night
Almost Instrument :)
Cessna 172H C-GICE