remodel & upgrade or buy an upgraded plane?

[Dico Reyers]

Hi,

I have a 1967 m20e super 21. It has little for instrumentation and
the radio stack is pretty weak. It certainly isn't near IFR. The
interior is original and the paint is 5/10. It'll cruise at 130kts
2200 rpm and 23"

I'm looking for opinions on whether to upgrade and have a sharp, but
old plane... or should I just wait a couple more years and purchase a
newer plane that would meet my requirement and would potentially be
faster?

I'm just wondering about the resale. If I had an old house and built
a swimming pool outside for 20,000$... if I went to sell the whole
place I'd never get that money back out of the pool. Is it the same
with airplanes?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks,

-Dico

[Bob Noel]

In article >,
(Dico Reyers) wrote:

> I'm looking for opinions on whether to upgrade and have a sharp, but
> old plane... or should I just wait a couple more years and purchase a
> newer plane that would meet my requirement and would potentially be
> faster?
>
> I'm just wondering about the resale. If I had an old house and built
> a swimming pool outside for 20,000$... if I went to sell the whole
> place I'd never get that money back out of the pool. Is it the same
> with airplanes?

it's almost always cheaper to let someone else pay for
upgrades/improvements.

--
Bob Noel
Seen on Kerry's campaign airplane: "the real deal"
oh yeah baby.

[Ben Jackson]

In article >,
Dico Reyers > wrote:
>I'm just wondering about the resale. If I had an old house and built
>a swimming pool outside for 20,000$... if I went to sell the whole
>place I'd never get that money back out of the pool. Is it the same
>with airplanes?

It's worse with airplanes. The value of an airplane goes up roughly
by the used value of the installed avionics. After you factor in the
cost of the radios and the installation cost you probably only get
about 50% back. If you upgrade a plane beyond its typical mission
(eg if you put a CNX-80 in a Cessna 150, or if I put weather radar in
my Comanche) you will probably recoup even less.

Plus a major upgrade like that will have the plane down for months.
It's likely you could sell it and then buy a different plane and have
less downtime.

--
Ben Jackson
>
http://www.ben.com/

[Ron Natalie]

"Dico Reyers" > wrote in message ...

> I'm looking for opinions on whether to upgrade and have a sharp, but
> old plane... or should I just wait a couple more years and purchase a
> newer plane that would meet my requirement and would potentially be
> faster?

Yep it's the same with airplanes.

If you're talking about economics, it's almost universally easier to find a plane
that's already configured the way you want it and buy that than to do the mods
yourself. Avionics and other aircraft mods have a high initial depreciation.

If you want to make sure you get it right, and you're airframe is reasonably
good, modding yours will give you more control and perhaps a better finished
product at a higher cost.

Finally, if you could find a J or later model, it will be faster.

[G.R. Patterson III]

Dico Reyers wrote:
>
> I'm just wondering about the resale. If I had an old house and built
> a swimming pool outside for 20,000$... if I went to sell the whole
> place I'd never get that money back out of the pool. Is it the same
> with airplanes?

It's the same with airplanes.

George Patterson
If you want to know God's opinion of money, just look at the people
he gives it to.

[PaulH]

(Dico Reyers) wrote in message >...
> Hi,
>
> I have a 1967 m20e super 21. It has little for instrumentation and
> the radio stack is pretty weak. It certainly isn't near IFR. The
> interior is original and the paint is 5/10. It'll cruise at 130kts
> 2200 rpm and 23"
>
> I'm looking for opinions on whether to upgrade and have a sharp, but
> old plane... or should I just wait a couple more years and purchase a
> newer plane that would meet my requirement and would potentially be
> faster?
>
> I'm just wondering about the resale. If I had an old house and built
> a swimming pool outside for 20,000$... if I went to sell the whole
> place I'd never get that money back out of the pool. Is it the same
> with airplanes?
>
> Any advice would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -Dico


I elected to upgrade my 69 Arrow with Garmin 430, Stec autopilot, and
Stormscope. I love the airplane to begin with, I know what I have,
and if I fly it for 5 years I figure I get my money's work even with
50% return. Used airplanes often contain nasty surprises. I did it a
year at a time, during annual, midwinter when midwest flying weather
is grim anyway. The gradual approach also lets you learn as you go
and enjoy one new piece of equipment each year.

I believe you get better return on engine and cosmetics as long as you
don't go overboard.

[PaulH]

I elected to upgrade my 69 Arrow with Garmin 430, Stec autopilot, and
Stormscope. I love the airplane to begin with, I know what I have,
and if I fly it for 5 years I figure I get my money's work even with
50% return. Used airplanes often contain nasty surprises. I did it a
year at a time, during annual, midwinter when midwest flying weather
is grim anyway. The gradual approach also lets you learn as you go
and enjoy one new piece of equipment each year.

I believe you get better return on engine and cosmetics as long as you
don't go overboard.

[PaulH]

I elected to upgrade my 69 Arrow with Garmin 430, Stec autopilot, and
Stormscope. I love the airplane to begin with, I know what I have,
and if I fly it for 5 years I figure I get my money's work even with
50% return. Used airplanes often contain nasty surprises. I did it a
year at a time, during annual, midwinter when midwest flying weather
is grim anyway. The gradual approach also lets you learn as you go
and enjoy one new piece of equipment each year.

I believe you get better return on engine and cosmetics as long as you
don't go overboard.

[Rutger]

"Ron Natalie" > wrote in message >...
> "Dico Reyers" > wrote in message ...
>
> > I'm looking for opinions on whether to upgrade and have a sharp, but
> > old plane... or should I just wait a couple more years and purchase a
> > newer plane that would meet my requirement and would potentially be
> > faster?
>
> Yep it's the same with airplanes.
>
> If you're talking about economics, it's almost universally easier to find a plane
> that's already configured the way you want it and buy that than to do the mods
> yourself.

Also keep in mind that there will likely be an enhanced market for
selling good used planes down in Florida once their insurance checks
start coming in.

Sad and cruel, but true.

There will also be a lot more good used engines, avionics and other
salvageable parts hitting the market too :-(

[Mark Astley]

AviationConsumer had a recent article which touched on this subject.
Actually, that article was about whether or not you should buy a run
out and overhaul, or buy a plane with a newer engine. They did
mention, however, that in terms of recovering investment dollars,
interior, paint and engine are the best with avionics and other mods
at the bottom of the list. For example, they mention that avionics
typically only recover $0.30 on the dollar at resale time.

I read that to mean that if you only think you'll keep the plane a few
more years, go ahead and redo the interior and get the new paint.
Think longer time (or get out), if you want to do the panel.

good luck,
mark



(Dico Reyers) wrote in message >...
> Hi,
>
> I have a 1967 m20e super 21. It has little for instrumentation and
> the radio stack is pretty weak. It certainly isn't near IFR. The
> interior is original and the paint is 5/10. It'll cruise at 130kts
> 2200 rpm and 23"
>
> I'm looking for opinions on whether to upgrade and have a sharp, but
> old plane... or should I just wait a couple more years and purchase a
> newer plane that would meet my requirement and would potentially be
> faster?
>
> I'm just wondering about the resale. If I had an old house and built
> a swimming pool outside for 20,000$... if I went to sell the whole
> place I'd never get that money back out of the pool. Is it the same
> with airplanes?
>
> Any advice would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -Dico

[Kyle Boatright]

"Dico Reyers" > wrote in message
...
> Hi,
>
> I have a 1967 m20e super 21. It has little for instrumentation and
> the radio stack is pretty weak. It certainly isn't near IFR. The
> interior is original and the paint is 5/10. It'll cruise at 130kts
> 2200 rpm and 23"
>
> I'm looking for opinions on whether to upgrade and have a sharp, but
> old plane... or should I just wait a couple more years and purchase a
> newer plane that would meet my requirement and would potentially be
> faster?
>
> I'm just wondering about the resale. If I had an old house and built
> a swimming pool outside for 20,000$... if I went to sell the whole
> place I'd never get that money back out of the pool. Is it the same
> with airplanes?
>
> Any advice would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -Dico

Other posters are correct about the low return on your investment to upgrade
your airplane. However, one thing they didn't mention out is that when you
buy a new airplane, you're moving from a known airplane (yours) to an
unknown airplane (the new one). You'll probably find a few surprises during
the first annual on the new one. They could be minor, and then again, maybe
not... Anyway, you're adding some amount of risk to the equation when you
buy a new airplane.

KB