True cost of ownership

[Lou Parker]

Can anyone tell me where to find a spreadsheet (fill in the blank) of
the the true cost of ownership. I'm looking at a few aircraft with a
friend and we would like to know what this is going to cost. I'm
trying to figure fuel, insurance, mait., etc..

[Hankal]

>I'm looking at a few aircraft with a
>friend and we would like to know what this is going to cost. I'm
>trying to figure fuel, insurance, mait., etc..

If you have to ask you cannot afford it.
Depends on flying hours, most times it is cheaper to rent.
172 owner!

[Steven Barnes]

"Lou Parker" > wrote in message
om...
> Can anyone tell me where to find a spreadsheet (fill in the blank) of
> the the true cost of ownership. I'm looking at a few aircraft with a
> friend and we would like to know what this is going to cost. I'm
> trying to figure fuel, insurance, mait., etc..

Exactly 1.5 times the amount of money you have.

[Bela P. Havasreti]

On 17 Oct 2004 16:43:43 -0700, (Lou Parker) wrote:

>Can anyone tell me where to find a spreadsheet (fill in the blank) of
>the the true cost of ownership. I'm looking at a few aircraft with a
>friend and we would like to know what this is going to cost. I'm
>trying to figure fuel, insurance, mait., etc..

How much money will it take to own/operate an [insert type
of aircraft here]? Answer is easy... All of it!

All kidding aside, it seems you have to operate a typical light
aircraft around a 100+ hours per year before it makes pure economical
sense to own vs rent. I operate around 200 hours per year
and burn 1600 or so gallons of gas doing it (lately, at $3 bucks
per gallon). The insurance is around $1K per year. The maintenance
costs are nil, as I do all the work on my airplane under the
supervision of my IA. I spend maybe $500 - $1000 per year
on parts/supplies/consumables. When you do the math, my direct
operating costs (not counting engine overhaul or other reserves) is
$34 per hour (this is for a 1954 Cessna 170B). The per hour operating
cost looks very appealing when you operate 200+ hours per year, but
you have to be able to belly up to the bar and ante up for all that
gas money, etc.

Be that as it may, there are some of us out here who don't care how
much it costs. It's in our blood, we can't live without it, so we pay
the bills and go flying. Life is short and then you die. Try to have
some fun along the way!

Bela P. Havasreti

PS: Sorry I don't have a link for the spreadsheet you're
after.

[Louis L. Perley III]

"Lou Parker" > wrote in message
om...
> Can anyone tell me where to find a spreadsheet (fill in the blank) of
> the the true cost of ownership. I'm looking at a few aircraft with a
> friend and we would like to know what this is going to cost. I'm
> trying to figure fuel, insurance, mait., etc..

Here is one that is based off of one someone sent me a while back, I've
modified it some from when I received it, but the equations still work. Some
of the equations are based on rules of thumb that seem to provide a decent
buffer for unplanned expenses, etc. Your mileage may vary, but at least it's
a start.

http://www.lp3.net/docs/AircraftWorkbook.xls

--
Louis L. Perley III
N46000 - C152
N370 - PA-23-250

[C Kingsbury]

There is an old rule of thumb that 4x cost of fuel will get you in the right
ballpark. If you look through all the what-it-costs threads here you'll
likely find this rule holds up as well as most of the spreadsheets and takes
a lot less time to use.

The essential thing to realize is that you will have no guarantees no matter
what you do. You could buy a Bonanza and get 3-4 years of cheap annuals and
little unexpected maintenance or you could buy a 172 and have the engine
chow a valve and need a major 800 hours sooner than you expected. Neither
are likely, but they are not impossible either.

The key is to not just pay the bills but to have a little reserve. For a
plane like a 172 you'll want 5,000-7,500, that will absorb just about
anything you're likely to encounter. If the engine dies you can always get
an overhaul loan or just sell it and eat the loss. The more goodies the
plane has- autopilot, CS prop, retractable gear, bigger engines, fancy
radios, etc. the bigger this number needs to be. You can make do with less
but in my case I'd prefer to not be tempted to take too many shortcuts.

Best,
-cwk.

"Lou Parker" > wrote in message
om...
> Can anyone tell me where to find a spreadsheet (fill in the blank) of
> the the true cost of ownership. I'm looking at a few aircraft with a
> friend and we would like to know what this is going to cost. I'm
> trying to figure fuel, insurance, mait., etc..

[Carl Orton]

"C Kingsbury" > wrote in message
ink.net...
>
> If the engine dies you can always get
> an overhaul loan or just sell it and eat the loss.

Interesting. Didn't know you could get a loan strictly just for an overhaul.
Do the normal aircraft financing sources provide this? What if there's
already an outstanding loan? What if there isn't a loan (i.e., you have no
record with *them*, but you have a good credit history)?

Thanks for any details you can provide;
Carl

[OtisWinslow]

I got an engine loan from MBNA on a plane they already had the
primary loan on. Wasn't a problem at all.


"Carl Orton" > wrote in message
...
> "C Kingsbury" > wrote in message
> ink.net...
>>
>> If the engine dies you can always get
>> an overhaul loan or just sell it and eat the loss.
>
> Interesting. Didn't know you could get a loan strictly just for an
> overhaul. Do the normal aircraft financing sources provide this? What if
> there's already an outstanding loan? What if there isn't a loan (i.e., you
> have no record with *them*, but you have a good credit history)?
>
> Thanks for any details you can provide;
> Carl
>

[C Kingsbury]

"Carl Orton" > wrote in message
...
> "C Kingsbury" > wrote in message
> ink.net...
> >
> > If the engine dies you can always get
> > an overhaul loan or just sell it and eat the loss.
>
> Interesting. Didn't know you could get a loan strictly just for an
overhaul.
> Do the normal aircraft financing sources provide this? What if there's
> already an outstanding loan? What if there isn't a loan (i.e., you have no
> record with *them*, but you have a good credit history)?

Heck, you can get a loan on anything so long as the bank can put a lien on
it and know they'll get their money back. Since engines add value almost
dollar-for-dollar it's a no-brainer.

Now, ask a bank for an unsecured line of credit for a small business, that's
when they practice making the faces they use to scare little kids.

-cwk.