Holding

[___P:Sir]

The 1 min timing (or 1½ min above 14.000 feet) - is that in Your opinion
inbound or outbound leg? Doc 8168 says "outbound no wind" - but that might
be a matter of definition, because all pro`s I asked, says Inbound...?
regards..
P.sir

[Ron Rosenfeld[_2_]]

On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 11:35:44 +0100, "___P:Sir" > wrote:

>The 1 min timing (or 1½ min above 14.000 feet) - is that in Your opinion
>inbound or outbound leg? Doc 8168 says "outbound no wind" - but that might
>be a matter of definition, because all pro`s I asked, says Inbound...?
>regards..
>P.sir
>

In the US, the timing is for the inbound leg. The timing for the outbound leg gets adjusted to achieve the 1 minute or 1 1/2 minute inbound leg timing:

Here is what the AIM says:

The initial outbound leg should be flown for 1 minute or
1 1/2 minutes (appropriate to altitude). Timing for
subsequent outbound legs should be adjusted, as
necessary, to achieve proper inbound leg time.

[___P:Sir]

"Ron Rosenfeld" > skrev i en meddelelse
...
> On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 11:35:44 +0100, "___P:Sir" > wrote:
>
>>The 1 min timing (or 1½ min above 14.000 feet) - is that in Your opinion
>>inbound or outbound leg? Doc 8168 says "outbound no wind" - but that might
>>be a matter of definition, because all pro`s I asked, says Inbound...?
>>regards..
>>P.sir
>>
>
> In the US, the timing is for the inbound leg. The timing for the outbound
> leg gets adjusted to achieve the 1 minute or 1 1/2 minute inbound leg
> timing:
>
> Here is what the AIM says:
>
> The initial outbound leg should be flown for 1 minute or
> 1 1/2 minutes (appropriate to altitude). Timing for
> subsequent outbound legs should be adjusted, as
> necessary, to achieve proper inbound leg time.

Thanks - if it is like that in the US, it surely must be in Europe as well?

P.Sir

[Ron Rosenfeld[_2_]]

On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 13:15:25 +0100, "___P:Sir" > wrote:

>Thanks - if it is like that in the US, it surely must be in Europe as well?
>
>P.Sir

I have no way of knowing that. I have not trained in Europe and my only experience flying in Europe has been VFR.
However, my brief perusal of some documentation I have from Jepp which references the ICAO document 8168 leads me to believe that such may NOT be the case in Europe.

Corrections for wind effect paragraph seems to state that the adjustment required on the outbound leg, for heading and timing, is only such as to ensure the aircraft is established on the inbound track before passing the holding fix. This is quite different from the wording in the US AIM and implies that the inbound timing can be much less than the "still-air" 1 or 1 1/2 minutes.

[sachin719]

"Ron Rosenfeld" skrev i en meddelelse
...
On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 11:35:44 +0100, "___P:Sir" wrote:

The 1 min timing (or 1½ min above 14.000 feet) - is that in Your opinion
inbound or outbound leg? Doc 8168 says "outbound no wind" - but that might
be a matter of definition, because all pro`s I asked, says Inbound...?
regards..
P.sir


In the US, the timing is for the inbound leg. The timing for the outbound
leg gets adjusted to achieve the 1 minute or 1 1/2 minute inbound leg
timing:

Here is what the AIM says:

The initial outbound leg should be flown for 1 minute or
1 1/2 minutes (appropriate to altitude). Timing for
subsequent outbound legs should be adjusted, as
necessary, to achieve proper inbound leg time.

Thanks - if it is like that in the US, it surely must be in Europe as well?

P.Sir


It's the outbound timing , Timed out abeam the aid or after rolling out in outbound heading with rate one or 25 degrees AOB whichever requires lesser bank. Correction for known winds both in heading and timing must be given so as to fly the desired track. authority - DOC 8168