Sport Pilot

[PaulaJay1]

Question.

Does having a private pilot single enging land qualify to get you a sport pilot
ticket? Seems like it should but I have never read so. What do we have to do
to get that ticket. As I get older and think of giving up the Archer, (and
before losing my medical for some reason) the Sport might be a good thing to
have for a few years just for fun flying on good days.

Chuck

[BTIZ]

Chuck... as many people that have read the new Sport Pilot information.. is
as many different interpretations as you will get.

If you currently have a VALID ClassIII medical or higher, and a Private
Pilot Certificate.
You can fly Light Sport Aircraft, J-3, small Taylor Craft, etc that qualify
as "Airplane", but also "Light Sport Aircraft"

If you CHOOSE to not renew the ClassIII medical, and will limit yourself to
Light Sport Aircraft, and fly under Light Sport Aircraft RULES, altitude
limits, distance limits, endorsements for special airspace etc, then you can
continue to fly that J-3 Cub with your current ratings.

I do not believe there is any special paperwork required to get the Sport
Pilot "rating", however if you choose to fly a LSA like a powered trike,
either weight shift or 3 axis, then you will have to get the endorsements
for qualification in those aircraft. However I do not think you need to
replace your Private Ticket for a Sport Pilot certificate, just the
endorsements and paperwork for qualification.

HOWEVER, if you are DENIED a ClassIII medical, due to any reason, or you
have a medical condition that would force your ClassIII to be invalid before
it expired, then you cannot fly as a Sport Pilot on your "drivers license
medical". You first have to clear the medical issue with the FAA, get a new
ClassIII, then allow it to expire and then fly under Sport Pilot rules.

I know.. it does not make sense.

BT
"PaulaJay1" > wrote in message
...
> Question.
>
> Does having a private pilot single enging land qualify to get you a sport
> pilot
> ticket? Seems like it should but I have never read so. What do we have
> to do
> to get that ticket. As I get older and think of giving up the Archer,
> (and
> before losing my medical for some reason) the Sport might be a good thing
> to
> have for a few years just for fun flying on good days.
>
> Chuck

[[email protected]]

What about those of us flying under Special Issue Class III? Can I do
sport pilot if I just let it lapse?

I've never actually had a denial: address the problem up front and got
my special issue before meeting the examiner.

[Robert M. Gary]

BTIZ wrote:
> Chuck... as many people that have read the new Sport Pilot
information.. is
> as many different interpretations as you will get.
>
> If you currently have a VALID ClassIII medical or higher, and a
Private
> Pilot Certificate.
> You can fly Light Sport Aircraft, J-3, small Taylor Craft, etc that
qualify
> as "Airplane", but also "Light Sport Aircraft"


As a private pilot, can we fly LSA certified aircraft (of where there
are currently none, but will be some)? There seems to be a lot of
confusion about LSA aircraft. I believe a SP can fly a J-3, but a J-3
is still a normal category certified aircraft. I believe a new category
will be put on some airplanes called "LSA" that will allow owners to do
some maintenance.

-Robert

[BTIZ]

FAR 61.303(b) A person using a current and valid U.S. drivers license to
meet the requirements of this paragraph must-
(1) Comply with restrictions and limitations imposed by that person's
drivers license and any judicial or administrative order applying to the
operation of a motor vehicle;
(2) Have been found eligible for the issuance of at least a third class
airman medical certificate at the time of his most recent application (if
the person has applied for a medical certificate);
(3) Not had his most recently issued medical certificate (if the person
has held a medical certificate) suspended or revoked OR MOST RECENT
AUTHORIZATION OF SPECIAL ISSUANCE of a medical certificate withdrawn; AND
(4) not know or have reason to know of any medical condition that would make
that person unable to operate a light sport aircraft in a safe manner.

Soo... what that means to me.. and I am not a law judge..
(1) you have a Current and Valid Special Issue
(2) you allow it to lapse and not be renewed, it was not revoked because the
heart problem got worse.. or what ever the special waiver is for
(3) your drivers license says you have to wear glasses, if diabetic, must
check sugar level every hour.. etc.. (you must comply with restrictions on
the auto license)
(4) the judge did not say you cannot drive for DUI, to many driving
violations (points) against the drivers license which would revoke the
license
(5) you are not currently suffering from a cold and taking cold medications
that could cause drowsiness or dizziness AND you don't know of any other
medical problems that would have deemed you ineligible to fly.

Fly as a Sport Pilot, in Light Sport Aircraft.. and be safe..

BT

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> What about those of us flying under Special Issue Class III? Can I do
> sport pilot if I just let it lapse?
>
> I've never actually had a denial: address the problem up front and got
> my special issue before meeting the examiner.
>

[BTIZ]

go to FAA and do a document search for "Sport Pilot Rule7_19" it is a MS
Word document and gets heavy into the explanation and determination of rules
now contained in the 2005 version of FAR 61., it might also be found on the
AOPA or EAA web pages

BT

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> What about those of us flying under Special Issue Class III? Can I do
> sport pilot if I just let it lapse?
>
> I've never actually had a denial: address the problem up front and got
> my special issue before meeting the examiner.
>

[Colin W Kingsbury]

The way the AOPA/EAA have always described it was that a
private/commercial/ATP pilot could "exercise sport pilot privileges" to fly
fixed-wing aircraft without needing any changes to their ticket. The Light
Sport Aircraft thing is a new route to a restricted form of certification of
*aircraft* and has nothing to do with pilot certification. A pilot can
exercise sport pilot privileges in any aircraft certified as an LSA or
Normal/Aero/Utility category so long as it meets specific performance &
operating limitations. Of course it's implict that an aircraft certified as
a LSA will meet those restrictions.

-cwk.

"Robert M. Gary" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> BTIZ wrote:
> > Chuck... as many people that have read the new Sport Pilot
> information.. is
> > as many different interpretations as you will get.
> >
> > If you currently have a VALID ClassIII medical or higher, and a
> Private
> > Pilot Certificate.
> > You can fly Light Sport Aircraft, J-3, small Taylor Craft, etc that
> qualify
> > as "Airplane", but also "Light Sport Aircraft"
>
>
> As a private pilot, can we fly LSA certified aircraft (of where there
> are currently none, but will be some)? There seems to be a lot of
> confusion about LSA aircraft. I believe a SP can fly a J-3, but a J-3
> is still a normal category certified aircraft. I believe a new category
> will be put on some airplanes called "LSA" that will allow owners to do
> some maintenance.
>
> -Robert
>

[Ron Wanttaja]

On 5 Jan 2005 12:02:54 -0800, "Robert M. Gary" > wrote:

>
>BTIZ wrote:
>> Chuck... as many people that have read the new Sport Pilot
>> information.. is as many different interpretations as you will get.
>>
>> If you currently have a VALID ClassIII medical or higher, and a
>> Private Pilot Certificate. You can fly Light Sport Aircraft, J-3,
>> small Taylor Craft, etc that qualify as "Airplane", but also "Light
>> Sport Aircraft"
>
>As a private pilot, can we fly LSA certified aircraft (of where there
>are currently none, but will be some)?

Yes, just like you can fly Primary, Normal, Utility, Experimental, or other
categories of aircraft.

>There seems to be a lot of
>confusion about LSA aircraft. I believe a SP can fly a J-3, but a J-3
>is still a normal category certified aircraft.

Yes. Here's a segment of a posting I made recently to rec.aviation.homebuilt:

The basic confusion here is over the term, "Light Sport Aircraft." IHMO, the
developers of the new rules made a mistake here, as they use the same term for
two separate, but related, concepts.

The first is that of "Light Sport Aircraft" as a definition. The regulation
changes added this definition to 14CFR Part 1...what us'n old timers would call
FAR Part 1. In Part 1, an LSA is an aircraft that has a gross weight of 1320
pounds or less, a stall speed less than 52 MPH, a flat-out level flight top
speed of 138 MPH or less, etc.

A person with a Sport Pilot license, or someone with a Primary, Private,
Commercial, or ATP license with an honorably lapsed FAA medical (e.g., a valid
medical that expired and was not revoked or renewal denied), can fly *any*
aircraft that meets the LSA definition.

This airplane can be licensed in ANY Category... Normal, utility, primary,
experimental, restricted, limited, etc. The only exceptions I can think if is
if a given aircraft has a set of operating limitations assigned by the FAA that
require a minimal set of pilot qualifications.

So, that's LSA as a definition. The FAA also instituted a *certification
category* called "Special Light Sport Aircraft."

There are two basic kinds of Airworthiness Certificate. There is the 'Standard'
category. Once an aircraft receives a certificate in the Standard category, the
owner can operate the aircraft with no more attention from the FAA. A Standard
category aircraft can be flown for pleasure, rented, leased, or carry passengers
for hire with no additional involvement from the FAA other than the operator
ensuring the appropriate FARs for the type of operation be followed.. Standard
category includes "Normal" category, "Utility," "Aerobatic," "Commuter," and
"Transport." Each aircraft in these categories is assumed to be airworthy as
long as the appropriate inspections verify that the aircraft still meet the
description of its type certificate.

The other basic kind of Airworthiness is the "Special" category. The Special
category exists to allow aircraft that do not necessarily meet the requirements
of the Standard category to be operated to perform specific tasks. This
category includes Restricted, Limited, Experimental, and, now, the Light Sport
Aircraft category.

The Light Sport Aircraft category under the "Special" category (hence, "Special
Light Sport Aircraft") was created to allow production of ready-to-fly small
aircraft without requiring the level of design verification that Standard
category requires. To be produced on a Standard certificate, you have to meet
the FARs...and SLSAs do NOT meet the "regular" FARs. The FAA is allowing the
industry itself to define the amount of testing and validation necessary for a
SLSA airworthiness certificate.

The only things the FAA requires is that the aircraft produced must meet the FAR
Part 1 definition of an LSA, that the industry agree on the requirements *all*
SLSA aircraft must meet (e.g., the consensus standards), and that every occupant
of a SLSA aircraft be advised that the airplane does not meet FAA certification
requirements. In other words, all SLSA aircraft must include the same kind of
"Passenger Warning" that homebuilts carry.

> ... I believe a new category
> will be put on some airplanes called "LSA" that will allow owners to do
> some maintenance.

Actually, owners of SLSAs have no more maintenance rights than owners of
conventional aircraft...they can perform Preventative Maintenance. However, a
new "maintenance license" has been created to go with the new category...the
Light Sport-Maintenance (LS-M) Repairman Certificate. A person can obtain an
LS-M Certificate after just 120 hours training (vs. ~2000+ for an A&P).
Aircraft that are certified as Special Light Sport Aircraft can be maintained
and annualed by an LS-M.

There is also a new type of Experimental aircraft, the Experimental LSA. See
rec.aviation.homebuilt for an ongoing discussion of the ramifications of this.

Those who are interested can see an article I wrote about the new rules at:

http://www.kitplanes.com/sportplanes/0411KPLSARevolution.pdf

Ron Wanttaja

[PaulaJay1]

In article . com>, "Robert M.
Gary" > writes:

> If you currently have a VALID ClassIII medical or higher, and a
>Private
>> Pilot Certificate.
>> You can fly Light Sport Aircraft, J-3, small Taylor Craft, etc that
>qualify
>> as "Airplane", but also "Light Sport Aircraft"

No question about that, Robert. But a Sport ticket requires no medical. But I
have heard that if you lose you medical you cannot get the Sport. So the
question is - can you get the Sport before you might lose the medical and
continue to fly "light Aircraft" when not being qualified to fly the big ones
like my Archer.

Chuck

[BTIZ]

>
> No question about that, Robert. But a Sport ticket requires no medical.
> But I
> have heard that if you lose you medical you cannot get the Sport. So the
> question is - can you get the Sport before you might lose the medical and
> continue to fly "light Aircraft" when not being qualified to fly the big
> ones
> like my Archer.
>
> Chuck

The Sport Ticket Does require a medical, it's what you have to have to pass
your auto drivers license. I do not believe that you can get an "issued"
Sport Pilot Certificate, because you already have a higher rating. The trick
here is to allow your Current medical to expire, and limit yourself to sport
aircraft.. and sport aircraft rules.. altitude, location where you can fly,
etc.

BECAUSE, If have a medical certificate and you LOSE the medical, you can't
fly sport pilot until you clear the issue that lost you the medical. You
just can't go straight to.. I don't need a medical status. Re Read 61.303(b)

BT

[Colin W Kingsbury]

Right- all the FAA literature on the topic refers to "if your most recent
application was denied/deferred." Even if you've had a quadruple bypass and
needed a special issuance renewed every six months, all you need for Sport
Pilot is to get a third-class medical issued successfully *once* and you're
good for the duration.

This does leave the pilot who suspects he may have problems on his next
medical with something of a Hobson's Choice...

-cwk.

"BTIZ" > wrote in message
news:eglDd.12095$232.6757@fed1read05...
> >
> > No question about that, Robert. But a Sport ticket requires no medical.
> > But I
> > have heard that if you lose you medical you cannot get the Sport. So
the
> > question is - can you get the Sport before you might lose the medical
and
> > continue to fly "light Aircraft" when not being qualified to fly the big
> > ones
> > like my Archer.
> >
> > Chuck
>
> The Sport Ticket Does require a medical, it's what you have to have to
pass
> your auto drivers license. I do not believe that you can get an "issued"
> Sport Pilot Certificate, because you already have a higher rating. The
trick
> here is to allow your Current medical to expire, and limit yourself to
sport
> aircraft.. and sport aircraft rules.. altitude, location where you can
fly,
> etc.
>
> BECAUSE, If have a medical certificate and you LOSE the medical, you can't
> fly sport pilot until you clear the issue that lost you the medical. You
> just can't go straight to.. I don't need a medical status. Re Read
61.303(b)
>
> BT
>
>

[BTIZ]

>
> This does leave the pilot who suspects he may have problems on his next
> medical with something of a Hobson's Choice...
>
> -cwk.

true.. the kicker is.. never be denied...

BT

[ET]

(PaulaJay1) wrote in
:

> In article . com>,
> "Robert M. Gary" > writes:
>
>> If you currently have a VALID ClassIII medical or higher, and a
>>Private
>>> Pilot Certificate.
>>> You can fly Light Sport Aircraft, J-3, small Taylor Craft, etc that
>>qualify
>>> as "Airplane", but also "Light Sport Aircraft"
>
> No question about that, Robert. But a Sport ticket requires no
> medical. But I have heard that if you lose you medical you cannot get
> the Sport. So the question is - can you get the Sport before you
> might lose the medical and continue to fly "light Aircraft" when not
> being qualified to fly the big ones like my Archer.
>
> Chuck

Simple answer "YES!"

You don't "get" the Sport Ticket.... If you let your medical lapse and
fly a sport compliant aircraft you are now "acting" as a sport pilot...
no signoffs needed. The only part of the SP regs you have to worry
about are the aircraft restrictions as a PP acting as a SP.

Goto SportPilot.org and look at the top menus for the list of certified
aircraft that meet the def.


ET

[ET]

"BTIZ" > wrote in
news:bYpDd.13833$232.10134@fed1read05:

>>
>> This does leave the pilot who suspects he may have problems on his
>> next medical with something of a Hobson's Choice...
>>
>> -cwk.
>
> true.. the kicker is.. never be denied...
>
> BT
>
>
>

THIS is why I see the new SLSA aircraft sales taking off in a HUGE way
in the next few years. Why would an aging baby boomer, developing a
typical "diabetic gut" buy a 200K-300K aircraft and sweat every medical,
when he can buy a 60K-90K aircraft that still goes 75% as fast (and only
burns 5-7 gal/hr) and relax....

ET

[ET]

ET > wrote in
:

> (PaulaJay1) wrote in
> :
>
>> In article . com>,
>> "Robert M. Gary" > writes:
>>
>>> If you currently have a VALID ClassIII medical or higher, and a
>>>Private
>>>> Pilot Certificate.
>>>> You can fly Light Sport Aircraft, J-3, small Taylor Craft, etc that
>>>qualify
>>>> as "Airplane", but also "Light Sport Aircraft"
>>
>> No question about that, Robert. But a Sport ticket requires no
>> medical. But I have heard that if you lose you medical you cannot
>> get the Sport. So the question is - can you get the Sport before you
>> might lose the medical and continue to fly "light Aircraft" when not
>> being qualified to fly the big ones like my Archer.
>>
>> Chuck
>
> Simple answer "YES!"
>
> You don't "get" the Sport Ticket.... If you let your medical lapse and
> fly a sport compliant aircraft you are now "acting" as a sport
> pilot... no signoffs needed. The only part of the SP regs you have to
> worry about are the aircraft restrictions as a PP acting as a SP.
>
> Goto SportPilot.org and look at the top menus for the list of
> certified aircraft that meet the def.
>
>
> ET
>

oops, sorry, the "only" above is not correct, you still have the daytime
VFR restrictions etc....

ET

[Juan Jimenez]

"PaulaJay1" > wrote in message
...
> In article . com>,
> "Robert M.
> Gary" > writes:
>
>> If you currently have a VALID ClassIII medical or higher, and a
>>Private
>>> Pilot Certificate.
>>> You can fly Light Sport Aircraft, J-3, small Taylor Craft, etc that
>>qualify
>>> as "Airplane", but also "Light Sport Aircraft"
>
> No question about that, Robert. But a Sport ticket requires no medical.

Actually, it does if you cannot get a driver's license.

> But I have heard that if you lose you medical you cannot get the Sport.

Not quite. You can get a special issuance and let it expire.

> So the question is - can you get the Sport before you might lose the
> medical and
> continue to fly "light Aircraft" when not being qualified to fly the big
> ones
> like my Archer.

If you had the medical, the assumption is you had at least a PPL. If that's
the case, you don't need to "get the Sport," your PPL allows you to fly LSA
with a driver's license, if your last medical was not revoked or denied. But
you're still supposed to stick to the medical requirements.

[Juan Jimenez]

"BTIZ" > wrote in message
news:eglDd.12095$232.6757@fed1read05...
> >
> The Sport Ticket Does require a medical, it's what you have to have to
> pass your auto drivers license.

What happens if you don't drive and never had a driver's license? :)

[BTIZ]

the regulations do not make for that.. that I have found..

Any one else know about it?

BT

"Juan Jimenez" > wrote in message
...
>
> "BTIZ" > wrote in message
> news:eglDd.12095$232.6757@fed1read05...
>> >
>> The Sport Ticket Does require a medical, it's what you have to have to
>> pass your auto drivers license.
>
> What happens if you don't drive and never had a driver's license? :)
>
>
>

[Juan Jimenez]

If you can't get a driver's license or never had one in the first place, you
have to have at least a third class medical in order to exercise sport pilot
privileges. Remember, it's a medical, or a driver's license. One of the two,
unless your last medical was revoked or denied.

"BTIZ" > wrote in message
news:5GKDd.17513$232.11175@fed1read05...
> the regulations do not make for that.. that I have found..
>
> Any one else know about it?
>
> BT
>
> "Juan Jimenez" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "BTIZ" > wrote in message
>> news:eglDd.12095$232.6757@fed1read05...
>>> >
>>> The Sport Ticket Does require a medical, it's what you have to have to
>>> pass your auto drivers license.
>>
>> What happens if you don't drive and never had a driver's license? :)
>>
>>
>>
>
>

[BTIZ]

if you can answer your own question... then why did you ask?

all you have done is repeated what was already stated a few posts up in the
thread..

BT

"Juan Jimenez" > wrote in message
...
> If you can't get a driver's license or never had one in the first place,
> you have to have at least a third class medical in order to exercise sport
> pilot privileges. Remember, it's a medical, or a driver's license. One of
> the two, unless your last medical was revoked or denied.
>
> "BTIZ" > wrote in message
> news:5GKDd.17513$232.11175@fed1read05...
>> the regulations do not make for that.. that I have found..
>>
>> Any one else know about it?
>>
>> BT
>>
>> "Juan Jimenez" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>
>>> "BTIZ" > wrote in message
>>> news:eglDd.12095$232.6757@fed1read05...
>>>> >
>>>> The Sport Ticket Does require a medical, it's what you have to have to
>>>> pass your auto drivers license.
>>>
>>> What happens if you don't drive and never had a driver's license? :)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

[Colin W Kingsbury]

"ET" > wrote in message
...
> "BTIZ" > wrote in
> news:bYpDd.13833$232.10134@fed1read05:
>
>
> THIS is why I see the new SLSA aircraft sales taking off in a HUGE way
> in the next few years. Why would an aging baby boomer, developing a
> typical "diabetic gut" buy a 200K-300K aircraft and sweat every medical,
> when he can buy a 60K-90K aircraft that still goes 75% as fast (and only
> burns 5-7 gal/hr) and relax....
>

To be fair, 250k will buy you a very nice Bonanza that will do things no
sportplane could dream of.

What LSA will have a huge impact on are the values of lower-end spamcans
like my 172N. Why spend $50k on a plane as old as you are when for 50% more
you can buy new?

-cwk.

[Ron Wanttaja]

On Sat, 08 Jan 2005 20:51:30 GMT, "Colin W Kingsbury"
> wrote:

>To be fair, 250k will buy you a very nice Bonanza that will do things no
>sportplane could dream of.
>
>What LSA will have a huge impact on are the values of lower-end spamcans
>like my 172N. Why spend $50k on a plane as old as you are when for 50% more
>you can buy new?

But it really depends on what the buyer needs the plane *for*. A buyer who
needs a 172 won't buy an LSA, since the LSA is limited to two seats. So I
wouldn't think it will affect the used 172 prices that much, except for those
fun-flyers who have been merely picking a 172 by default.

LSAs will hurt the market for used planes of like performance, unless those used
planes are Sport Pilot compatible. Prices for used Cessna 150s will probably go
down, prices for Champs and other qualifying planes. should go up, depending on
how much the new certified LSAs go for.

Ron Wanttaja

[Juan Jimenez]

Take a chill pill and look for the smiley. I could have sworn you knew the
answer and would find the humor. If not, oh, well. Never mind.

"BTIZ" > wrote in message
news:U3TDd.19971$232.15585@fed1read05...
> if you can answer your own question... then why did you ask?
>
> all you have done is repeated what was already stated a few posts up in
> the thread..
>
> BT
>
> "Juan Jimenez" > wrote in message
> ...
>> If you can't get a driver's license or never had one in the first place,
>> you have to have at least a third class medical in order to exercise
>> sport pilot privileges. Remember, it's a medical, or a driver's license.
>> One of the two, unless your last medical was revoked or denied.
>>
>> "BTIZ" > wrote in message
>> news:5GKDd.17513$232.11175@fed1read05...
>>> the regulations do not make for that.. that I have found..
>>>
>>> Any one else know about it?
>>>
>>> BT
>>>
>>> "Juan Jimenez" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>>
>>>> "BTIZ" > wrote in message
>>>> news:eglDd.12095$232.6757@fed1read05...
>>>>> >
>>>>> The Sport Ticket Does require a medical, it's what you have to have to
>>>>> pass your auto drivers license.
>>>>
>>>> What happens if you don't drive and never had a driver's license? :)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

[Juan Jimenez]

"Colin W Kingsbury" > wrote in message
k.net...
>
> "ET" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "BTIZ" > wrote in
>> news:bYpDd.13833$232.10134@fed1read05:
>>
>>
>> THIS is why I see the new SLSA aircraft sales taking off in a HUGE way
>> in the next few years. Why would an aging baby boomer, developing a
>> typical "diabetic gut" buy a 200K-300K aircraft and sweat every medical,
>> when he can buy a 60K-90K aircraft that still goes 75% as fast (and only
>> burns 5-7 gal/hr) and relax....
>>
>
> To be fair, 250k will buy you a very nice Bonanza that will do things no
> sportplane could dream of.

Unhuh, like swallowing the rest of the contents of your wallet. <g> But
there's one thing a Bonanza can't do for any amount of money, and that's fly
a Sport Pilot or PPL with a driver's license and no medical.

> What LSA will have a huge impact on are the values of lower-end spamcans
> like my 172N. Why spend $50k on a plane as old as you are when for 50%
> more
> you can buy new?

172 doesn't qualify for LSA and it has four seats, LSA's can only have two.
I don't think 172's will lose value, because 1) the decision on the part of
FAA Aeromedical to cut off medical denials at the knees has put a rather
large damper on the whole thing and 2) most people who get sport pilot's
licenses will most likely eventually continue to PPL so they can fly planes
like the 172. Heck, not even the C150 qualifies for LSA!