Flying to JFK

[PaulaJay1]

I plan to fly out of JFK (commercial) in April and find that a connecting
flight from CLE is difficult. So what if I fly my Archer to somewhere near JFK
( I sure don't want to land there and they don't want me to). Any Ideas on
where would be a good place to keep the plane for a couple of weeks and still
have a good way to get to JFK?

TIA

Chuck

[Roy Smith]

PaulaJay1 > wrote:
> I plan to fly out of JFK (commercial) in April and find that a
> connecting flight from CLE is difficult. So what if I fly my Archer
> to somewhere near JFK ( I sure don't want to land there and they
> don't want me to). Any Ideas on where would be a good place to keep
> the plane for a couple of weeks and still have a good way to get to
> JFK?

Depends on what you mean by "a good way".

My guess is the best way to get to JFK by public transit right now is
to land at Farmingdale (FRG), get the FBO to give you a lift to the
LIRR station (http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/lirr/html/ttn/farmingd.htm),
take the train to Jamaica, and transfer there for the new JFK AirTrain
(http://www.panynj.gov/airtrain).

Figure 20 minutes futzing around at the FBO while they scrounge up
somebody to give you a ride, 5 minutes to the train station, anywhere
from 5 minutes to an hour waiting for the train, 40 minutes to
Jamaica, 15 minutes for the transfer, 15 minutes to get to your
terminal on the AirTrain. That adds up to somewhere between 1:30 to
as much as 2:30 from when you hit the FBO to when you get to the JFK
terminal.

You'd probably do better getting a cab. If you avoid rush hour
traffic, it's probably a half hour cab ride.

The only other plausable alternative I can think of would be to land
at LDJ and get a cab (or car service) directly from there. It's 40
fewer direct miles if you're coming in from the west (and possibly
many fewer flying miles, if you get routed the long way around the
Class B into FRG). The down side is a much longer cab ride, and
probably crappier FBO service. I've got a friend based at LDJ; if you
want I can put you in touch with him for better info.

[Marco Leon]

I will second Roy's recommendation to fly into FRG. I'm based there and I
also take the Long Island Railroad into work every day from the Farmingdale
train station. If you do choose to go into FRG, price around the transient
tiedown costs. I believe Long Island Jet Center (631-843-9488) is cheaper
but check thier price against Atlantic Aviation (631-752-9022). I've taken
the LIRR/AirTrain combination and it's pretty good. However for a "couple of
weeks" you'll probably have a fair amount of baggage so the extra $$ you
spend on a car service/taxi may be worth it to avoid lugging your stuff
around the train. If/when you call the FBOs, ask for a recommendation on a
car service/taxi/shuttle to JFK.

Here's the train schedule: http://www.lirr.org/lirr/html/ttn/farmingd.htm.
When are you planning on flying in?

Marco Leon



"Roy Smith" > wrote in message
...
> PaulaJay1 > wrote:
> > I plan to fly out of JFK (commercial) in April and find that a
> > connecting flight from CLE is difficult. So what if I fly my Archer
> > to somewhere near JFK ( I sure don't want to land there and they
> > don't want me to). Any Ideas on where would be a good place to keep
> > the plane for a couple of weeks and still have a good way to get to
> > JFK?
>
> Depends on what you mean by "a good way".
>
> My guess is the best way to get to JFK by public transit right now is
> to land at Farmingdale (FRG), get the FBO to give you a lift to the
> LIRR station (http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/lirr/html/ttn/farmingd.htm),
> take the train to Jamaica, and transfer there for the new JFK AirTrain
> (http://www.panynj.gov/airtrain).
>
> Figure 20 minutes futzing around at the FBO while they scrounge up
> somebody to give you a ride, 5 minutes to the train station, anywhere
> from 5 minutes to an hour waiting for the train, 40 minutes to
> Jamaica, 15 minutes for the transfer, 15 minutes to get to your
> terminal on the AirTrain. That adds up to somewhere between 1:30 to
> as much as 2:30 from when you hit the FBO to when you get to the JFK
> terminal.
>
> You'd probably do better getting a cab. If you avoid rush hour
> traffic, it's probably a half hour cab ride.
>
> The only other plausable alternative I can think of would be to land
> at LDJ and get a cab (or car service) directly from there. It's 40
> fewer direct miles if you're coming in from the west (and possibly
> many fewer flying miles, if you get routed the long way around the
> Class B into FRG). The down side is a much longer cab ride, and
> probably crappier FBO service. I've got a friend based at LDJ; if you
> want I can put you in touch with him for better info.

[Mike Schumann]

Are you sure it wouldn't be cheaper and less hassle to fly commercial to
JFK?????

Mike Schumann

"Marco Leon" <mmleon(at)yahoo.com> wrote in message
...
>I will second Roy's recommendation to fly into FRG. I'm based there and I
> also take the Long Island Railroad into work every day from the
> Farmingdale
> train station. If you do choose to go into FRG, price around the transient
> tiedown costs. I believe Long Island Jet Center (631-843-9488) is cheaper
> but check thier price against Atlantic Aviation (631-752-9022). I've taken
> the LIRR/AirTrain combination and it's pretty good. However for a "couple
> of
> weeks" you'll probably have a fair amount of baggage so the extra $$ you
> spend on a car service/taxi may be worth it to avoid lugging your stuff
> around the train. If/when you call the FBOs, ask for a recommendation on a
> car service/taxi/shuttle to JFK.
>
> Here's the train schedule: http://www.lirr.org/lirr/html/ttn/farmingd.htm.
> When are you planning on flying in?
>
> Marco Leon
>
>
>
> "Roy Smith" > wrote in message
> ...
>> PaulaJay1 > wrote:
>> > I plan to fly out of JFK (commercial) in April and find that a
>> > connecting flight from CLE is difficult. So what if I fly my Archer
>> > to somewhere near JFK ( I sure don't want to land there and they
>> > don't want me to). Any Ideas on where would be a good place to keep
>> > the plane for a couple of weeks and still have a good way to get to
>> > JFK?
>>
>> Depends on what you mean by "a good way".
>>
>> My guess is the best way to get to JFK by public transit right now is
>> to land at Farmingdale (FRG), get the FBO to give you a lift to the
>> LIRR station (http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/lirr/html/ttn/farmingd.htm),
>> take the train to Jamaica, and transfer there for the new JFK AirTrain
>> (http://www.panynj.gov/airtrain).
>>
>> Figure 20 minutes futzing around at the FBO while they scrounge up
>> somebody to give you a ride, 5 minutes to the train station, anywhere
>> from 5 minutes to an hour waiting for the train, 40 minutes to
>> Jamaica, 15 minutes for the transfer, 15 minutes to get to your
>> terminal on the AirTrain. That adds up to somewhere between 1:30 to
>> as much as 2:30 from when you hit the FBO to when you get to the JFK
>> terminal.
>>
>> You'd probably do better getting a cab. If you avoid rush hour
>> traffic, it's probably a half hour cab ride.
>>
>> The only other plausable alternative I can think of would be to land
>> at LDJ and get a cab (or car service) directly from there. It's 40
>> fewer direct miles if you're coming in from the west (and possibly
>> many fewer flying miles, if you get routed the long way around the
>> Class B into FRG). The down side is a much longer cab ride, and
>> probably crappier FBO service. I've got a friend based at LDJ; if you
>> want I can put you in touch with him for better info.
>
>

[Greg Piney]

The best way would be to fly to JFK (or LaGuardia) the day before and
spend the night in one of the airport hotels.

Greg Piney

Mike Schumann wrote:
> Are you sure it wouldn't be cheaper and less hassle to fly commercial to
> JFK?????
>
> Mike Schumann
>
> "Marco Leon" <mmleon(at)yahoo.com> wrote in message
> ...
>
>>I will second Roy's recommendation to fly into FRG. I'm based there and I
>>also take the Long Island Railroad into work every day from the
>>Farmingdale
>>train station. If you do choose to go into FRG, price around the transient
>>tiedown costs. I believe Long Island Jet Center (631-843-9488) is cheaper
>>but check thier price against Atlantic Aviation (631-752-9022). I've taken
>>the LIRR/AirTrain combination and it's pretty good. However for a "couple
>>of
>>weeks" you'll probably have a fair amount of baggage so the extra $$ you
>>spend on a car service/taxi may be worth it to avoid lugging your stuff
>>around the train. If/when you call the FBOs, ask for a recommendation on a
>>car service/taxi/shuttle to JFK.
>>
>>Here's the train schedule: http://www.lirr.org/lirr/html/ttn/farmingd.htm.
>>When are you planning on flying in?
>>
>>Marco Leon
>>
>>
>>
>>"Roy Smith" > wrote in message
...
>>
>>>PaulaJay1 > wrote:
>>>
>>>>I plan to fly out of JFK (commercial) in April and find that a
>>>>connecting flight from CLE is difficult. So what if I fly my Archer
>>>>to somewhere near JFK ( I sure don't want to land there and they
>>>>don't want me to). Any Ideas on where would be a good place to keep
>>>>the plane for a couple of weeks and still have a good way to get to
>>>>JFK?
>>>
>>>Depends on what you mean by "a good way".
>>>
>>>My guess is the best way to get to JFK by public transit right now is
>>>to land at Farmingdale (FRG), get the FBO to give you a lift to the
>>>LIRR station (http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/lirr/html/ttn/farmingd.htm),
>>>take the train to Jamaica, and transfer there for the new JFK AirTrain
>>>(http://www.panynj.gov/airtrain).
>>>
>>>Figure 20 minutes futzing around at the FBO while they scrounge up
>>>somebody to give you a ride, 5 minutes to the train station, anywhere
>>>from 5 minutes to an hour waiting for the train, 40 minutes to
>>>Jamaica, 15 minutes for the transfer, 15 minutes to get to your
>>>terminal on the AirTrain. That adds up to somewhere between 1:30 to
>>>as much as 2:30 from when you hit the FBO to when you get to the JFK
>>>terminal.
>>>
>>>You'd probably do better getting a cab. If you avoid rush hour
>>>traffic, it's probably a half hour cab ride.
>>>
>>>The only other plausable alternative I can think of would be to land
>>>at LDJ and get a cab (or car service) directly from there. It's 40
>>>fewer direct miles if you're coming in from the west (and possibly
>>>many fewer flying miles, if you get routed the long way around the
>>>Class B into FRG). The down side is a much longer cab ride, and
>>>probably crappier FBO service. I've got a friend based at LDJ; if you
>>>want I can put you in touch with him for better info.
>>
>>
>
>

[PaulaJay1]

In article >, "Marco Leon" <mmleon(at)yahoo.com>
writes:

>I will second Roy's recommendation to fly into FRG. I'm based there and I
>also take the Long Island Railroad into work every day from the Farmingdale
>train station. If you do choose to go into FRG, price around the transient
>tiedown costs. I believe Long Island Jet Center (631-843-9488) is cheaper
>but check thier price against Atlantic Aviation (631-752-9022). I've taken
>the LIRR/AirTrain combination and it's pretty good. However for a "couple of
>weeks" you'll probably have a fair amount of baggage so the extra $$ you
>spend on a car service/taxi may be worth it to avoid lugging your stuff
>around the train. If/when you call the FBOs, ask for a recommendation on a
>car service/taxi/shuttle to JFK.
>
>Here's the train schedule: http://www.lirr.org/lirr/html/ttn/farmingd.htm.
>When are you planning on flying in?
>

Thanks for all the info.

I would be comming in about April 17 and flying out about May 1. Don't believe
that flying the Archer makes sense but it might be fun to "fight" the NY
controllers.

I have found a good commercial flight into/outof LGA. How would it be to fly
into LGA (in the big iron) and then use ground transportation to JFK. I'm
guessing 1/2 hr trip between airports??? I'll probably stay over at one of the
JFK hotels comming back as the return flight gets in at 8PM on 4/30. Any
suggestions there?

Thanks again for everything,

Chuck

[Rosspilot]

> I'll probably stay over at one of the
>JFK hotels comming back as the return flight gets in at 8PM on 4/30. Any
>suggestions there?


The Holiday Inn at JFK (not the express)
is great! I have stayed there when I have an early morning departure (6 or 7
AM) the next day. My wife and I drive down the afternoon before the flight,
have a leisurely dinner out, and for $199.00, we get a room and can keep our
car there for up to 10 days, and a shuttle to/from the terminal.
Hard to beat in NYC.


www.Rosspilot.com

[Marco Leon]

Are you sure you guys are "owners?" ;) If you were, you would realize that
"convenience" is lower on the priority pole than "getting in your own plane
and flying." Help the guy out OK? Think of it as "assisting a fellow aviator
in decreasing his per-hour aircraft costs." And before you ask, NO--the
taxi/train costs do not play into the equation :)

Marco Leon


"Greg Piney" > wrote in message
...
> The best way would be to fly to JFK (or LaGuardia) the day before and
> spend the night in one of the airport hotels.
>
> Greg Piney
>
> Mike Schumann wrote:
>> Are you sure it wouldn't be cheaper and less hassle to fly commercial to
>> JFK?????
>>
>> Mike Schumann
>>
>> "Marco Leon" <mmleon(at)yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>I will second Roy's recommendation to fly into FRG. I'm based there and I
>>>also take the Long Island Railroad into work every day from the
>>>Farmingdale
>>>train station. If you do choose to go into FRG, price around the
>>>transient
>>>tiedown costs. I believe Long Island Jet Center (631-843-9488) is cheaper
>>>but check thier price against Atlantic Aviation (631-752-9022). I've
>>>taken
>>>the LIRR/AirTrain combination and it's pretty good. However for a "couple
>>>of
>>>weeks" you'll probably have a fair amount of baggage so the extra $$ you
>>>spend on a car service/taxi may be worth it to avoid lugging your stuff
>>>around the train. If/when you call the FBOs, ask for a recommendation on
>>>a
>>>car service/taxi/shuttle to JFK.
>>>
>>>Here's the train schedule:
>>>http://www.lirr.org/lirr/html/ttn/farmingd.htm.
>>>When are you planning on flying in?
>>>
>>>Marco Leon
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"Roy Smith" > wrote in message
...
>>>
>>>>PaulaJay1 > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>I plan to fly out of JFK (commercial) in April and find that a
>>>>>connecting flight from CLE is difficult. So what if I fly my Archer
>>>>>to somewhere near JFK ( I sure don't want to land there and they
>>>>>don't want me to). Any Ideas on where would be a good place to keep
>>>>>the plane for a couple of weeks and still have a good way to get to
>>>>>JFK?
>>>>
>>>>Depends on what you mean by "a good way".
>>>>
>>>>My guess is the best way to get to JFK by public transit right now is
>>>>to land at Farmingdale (FRG), get the FBO to give you a lift to the
>>>>LIRR station (http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/lirr/html/ttn/farmingd.htm),
>>>>take the train to Jamaica, and transfer there for the new JFK AirTrain
>>>>(http://www.panynj.gov/airtrain).
>>>>
>>>>Figure 20 minutes futzing around at the FBO while they scrounge up
>>>>somebody to give you a ride, 5 minutes to the train station, anywhere
>>>>from 5 minutes to an hour waiting for the train, 40 minutes to
>>>>Jamaica, 15 minutes for the transfer, 15 minutes to get to your
>>>>terminal on the AirTrain. That adds up to somewhere between 1:30 to
>>>>as much as 2:30 from when you hit the FBO to when you get to the JFK
>>>>terminal.
>>>>
>>>>You'd probably do better getting a cab. If you avoid rush hour
>>>>traffic, it's probably a half hour cab ride.
>>>>
>>>>The only other plausable alternative I can think of would be to land
>>>>at LDJ and get a cab (or car service) directly from there. It's 40
>>>>fewer direct miles if you're coming in from the west (and possibly
>>>>many fewer flying miles, if you get routed the long way around the
>>>>Class B into FRG). The down side is a much longer cab ride, and
>>>>probably crappier FBO service. I've got a friend based at LDJ; if you
>>>>want I can put you in touch with him for better info.
>>>
>>>
>>

[Marco Leon]

Sense? Sense??! Don't let those other posters make you think logically now.
You'll be flying your own plane man! When you take a moment to relax at
wherever you're going, you can sit back and take pride in the fact that you
helped yourself get there. Not to mention looking forward to flying again
when you return. :)

Have a good trip.

Marco Leon


"PaulaJay1" > wrote in message:
Thanks for all the info.
>
> I would be comming in about April 17 and flying out about May 1. Don't
> believe
> that flying the Archer makes sense but it might be fun to "fight" the NY
> controllers.
>
> I have found a good commercial flight into/outof LGA. How would it be to
> fly
> into LGA (in the big iron) and then use ground transportation to JFK. I'm
> guessing 1/2 hr trip between airports??? I'll probably stay over at one
> of the
> JFK hotels comming back as the return flight gets in at 8PM on 4/30. Any
> suggestions there?
>
> Thanks again for everything,
>
> Chuck

[Roy Smith]

In article >,
"Marco Leon" <mleon(at)optonline.net> wrote:

> Are you sure you guys are "owners?" ;) If you were, you would realize that
> "convenience" is lower on the priority pole than "getting in your own plane
> and flying." Help the guy out OK? Think of it as "assisting a fellow aviator
> in decreasing his per-hour aircraft costs." And before you ask, NO--the
> taxi/train costs do not play into the equation :)

Actually, another possibility is to just fly into JFK to make your
connection. It's certainly possible, but the tiedown fees are a bit
steep :-) The fee schedule is at
http://www.panynj.gov/aviation/jfkscheduleframe.htm

[Aaron Coolidge]

PaulaJay1 > wrote:
: I would be comming in about April 17 and flying out about May 1. Don't believe
: that flying the Archer makes sense but it might be fun to "fight" the NY
: controllers.

The NY controllers are one of the most reasonable "B" controllers around
in almost every case I can remember. BOS is the biggest annoyance, at least
to VFR folks. I've flown my Cherokee right over the JFK VOR many times,
both ways, IFR and VFR, with never a problem.

: I have found a good commercial flight into/outof LGA. How would it be to fly
: into LGA (in the big iron) and then use ground transportation to JFK. I'm
: guessing 1/2 hr trip between airports???

Perhaps at 4AM. I'd plan at least 1 hour. I'd try to get a "car" service.
The taxi drivers absolutely hate going to the airports because of the taxi
pool. Getting a taxi from one airport to the other is likely to get you
a crash course in Russian swear words.

: I'll probably stay over at one of the
: JFK hotels comming back as the return flight gets in at 8PM on 4/30. Any
: suggestions there?

Not at JFK. I have always stayed at the La Guardia Airport Marriott with
good results. They have a shuttle from the airport to the hotel.
--
Aaron C.

[Roy Smith]

Aaron Coolidge > wrote:
> : I have found a good commercial flight into/outof LGA. How would it be to
> : fly
> : into LGA (in the big iron) and then use ground transportation to JFK. I'm
> : guessing 1/2 hr trip between airports???
>
> Perhaps at 4AM. I'd plan at least 1 hour. I'd try to get a "car" service.
> The taxi drivers absolutely hate going to the airports because of the taxi
> pool. Getting a taxi from one airport to the other is likely to get you
> a crash course in Russian swear words.

One thing to know about cabs in NYC is they are required to take you
anywhere you want to go within the city limits (plus a few other places,
like Newark Airport). They can't refuse a fare just because they don't
want to go where you're going. If you flag down a cab on the street
somewhere, they may try and blow you off, but at the major airports,
there are taxi dispatchers who enforce the rules.

I figure sometime in the next century or two, they'll actually complete
the job they started and extend the AirTrain to LGA. When that happens,
you'll be able to walk out of the terminal at LGA onto a train, and walk
off the train 20-30 minutes later at the terminal in JFK. No Russian
vocabulary lessons required.

[Peter R.]

Roy Smith ) wrote:

> One thing to know about cabs in NYC is they are required to take you
> anywhere you want to go within the city limits (plus a few other places,
> like Newark Airport). They can't refuse a fare just because they don't
> want to go where you're going.

In theory. But in reality:

With two bags in hand during afternoon rush hour, I flag down a cab on
6th Avenue and 49th street.

"La Guardia, please" I says to the driver.

"I don't want to go there," he responds, shaking his head as he zooms
away from the curb.

Sure, I could have noted his ID number, then immediately called the NY
Taxi&Livery department to blow him in, but hey, it was his loss of
income. I caught another cab a minute later and the driver made a
pretty good tip.

--
Peter

[Colin W Kingsbury]

"Peter R." > wrote in message
...
> Roy Smith ) wrote:
>
> > One thing to know about cabs in NYC is they are required to take you
> > anywhere you want to go within the city limits (plus a few other places,
> > like Newark Airport). They can't refuse a fare just because they don't
> > want to go where you're going.
>
> In theory. But in reality:
>

I never tell the cab driver where I'm going until I close the door. It's a
little harder for someone to tell you to get out than to shake their head
and drive away.

-cwk.

[Colin W Kingsbury]

"Aaron Coolidge" > wrote in message
...
>
> The NY controllers are one of the most reasonable "B" controllers around
> in almost every case I can remember. BOS is the biggest annoyance, at
least
> to VFR folks. I've flown my Cherokee right over the JFK VOR many times,
> both ways, IFR and VFR, with never a problem.
>

Agreed that NY Approach is not as scary as people would expect (just very
fast), but what makes you ding Boston? I "grew up" flying out of Bedford
right under the shelf and never had any trouble with them. Clearances
through the Bravo tend to be dependent on which runways are in use at Logan.
They often have 4/22 and 9/27 in use so that shuts off a lot of airspace.
Certainly if you're trying to fly along the coastline you're not going to
get cleared through too often.

Also, the BOS Bravo isn't nearly as much of an inconvenience to navigation
as the EWK-LGA-JFK complex is. Let's say you're flying from BVY on the North
Shore to PYM on the south, more or less striaght over BOS. If you're willing
to stay below 3000' you can stay below the shelf and only go a few miles out
of your way and still have 1000'+ clearance for everything. OTOH, in plenty
of trips there's simply no good way around NY's class B, so there may be
more of an onus on them to clear VFR traffic through.

In any case I've never had a problem with Boston. Bradley on the other hand
has often proven a nuisance to deal with. I don't know if they're
under-staffed or what.

Best,
-cwk.

[[email protected]]

why not fly your archer to cle from your home airport ?
less hassle & less money
jon