Flying Restricted Airspace

[H.J.]

If I want to fly in some restricted airspace - nevermind the reason - how is
that done?
The chart says the controlling authority is ZLC Center. That's Salt Lake
ARTCC, right?
So if I'm flying VFR, what do I do?
Do I find any low alt freq to the SLC ARTCC in the AF/D and call "Salt Lake
Center. 1234X Request transition through R12345"
Any tips?

hj

[Jessica Core]

A Lieberman wrote:

> H.J. wrote:
> >
> > If I want to fly in some restricted airspace - nevermind the reason - how is
> > that done?
> > The chart says the controlling authority is ZLC Center. That's Salt Lake
> > ARTCC, right?
> > So if I'm flying VFR, what do I do?
> > Do I find any low alt freq to the SLC ARTCC in the AF/D and call "Salt Lake
> > Center. 1234X Request transition through R12345"

If you're lucky the chart might even have a frequency to get the green light
through the restricted airspace. But, yes contact the facility responsible for
the airspace at the frequency appropriate for the location/altitude you are at.

>
>
> Oh yeah, how do we know you are not a terrorist *smile*.
>
> Or work for a terrorist that doesn't want to fly....
>
> I would suspect the area would be restricted for photo opportunities as
> well, so taking snapshots may be one of the reasons for restricted
> airspace.

Why would you suspect that? If "taking snapshops" was to be avoided, the
airspace would be prohibited, although you'd have to prohibit awfully darn high to
be meaningful in an age with quality telephoto lenses and even satellite
photography. Restricted areas many times are areas where there is a lot of
military training activity and/or parachuting, mortar firing, etc. (MOAs have
activity too but are not restricted). If the danger is not present at the moment,
("not hot") you can often get approval to fly through.

> Why else would you want to overfly a restricted area? Inquiring minds
> like to know....

Because it lies between Point A & Point B where you are trying to travel?

[Jessica Core]

A Lieberman wrote:

> Jessica Core wrote:
>
> > Why would you suspect that? If "taking snapshops" was to be avoided, the
> > airspace would be prohibited, although you'd have to prohibit awfully darn high to
> > be meaningful in an age with quality telephoto lenses and even satellite
> > photography. Restricted areas many times are areas where there is a lot of
> > military training activity and/or parachuting, mortar firing, etc. (MOAs have
> > activity too but are not restricted). If the danger is not present at the moment,
> > ("not hot") you can often get approval to fly through.
>
> If the area is restricted and hot ATC will not issue a clearance. Go to
> http://hal9000.inetstrat.com/airspace/SpecialUse.htm for special use
> airspace. Website also provides the AIM chapters as appropriate.

That's why the chart lists a facility that handles the particular restricted area so you
can call them, find out if its actually currently hot, and get permission to transit the
airspace if available.

> The restricted airspace I have encountered was a military installation.
> I'd suspect that the military may not want planes loitering overhead
> when there may be sensitive operations on the ground that may be
> subjected to photographs.

Again, contact the listed facility and give them your intentions. They will tell you if
you can transit that airspace.

>
>
> > Because it lies between Point A & Point B where you are trying to travel?
>
> Most of these restricted areas "may" take you a couple of miles out of
> your way.

Or they may be larger.

> Plan far enough ahead, and maybe a change of 10 degrees in
> your heading before getting to the restricted airspace will circumvent
> the area and then after passing, adjust the other direction. Really not
> that hard to do. Situational awareness is the key.

Or just call the facility in charge of that airspace to see if you can enter. They are
typically quite nice and polite about it. Really. No need to be afraid of doing this.
Reading the information on the chart and communication is the key.

[David Reinhart]

Let me guess, you live in the Eastern part of the United States, right? If you'd
ever flown out West you'd know how numerous and huge some of the restricted areas
are out there. Flying around them, especially in a 150/152 class airplane, can
literally add hours to a trip.

Most of the R areas, especially the big ones, aren't established for operational
security. Most of them are bombing ranges and the like where they don't want
civilians getting their--tailfeathers shot off. There are execptions, of course,
like the one in Nevada that contains what is popularly known as Area 51 or
"Dreamland". That area is as big as it is partly to give room for strange
aircraft and weapons, but also to keep prying eyes as far away as possible. If
you want an idea just how big a useful presidential TFR or Capital ADIZ would need
to be, take a look at that one. Sorry, I can't remember the number offhand.

On my long solo cross-country I had to change my route because of weather problems
at one of my planned stops. I ended up in Palm Springs and the shortest way home
was through an R area. The FSS briefer told me that I could fly around (not an
option-it was getting late and would be dark before I arrived), wait until the
next day when the area would be "cold", or go straight through at not more than
500 feet AGL. I spent the night at PSP.

The moral: never hesitate to ask if an R area is cold. If it isn't, they'll tell
you and you might save yourself a whole lot of travel time.

Dave Reinhart


A Lieberman wrote:

> H.J. wrote:
> >
> > If I want to fly in some restricted airspace - nevermind the reason - how is
> > that done?
> > The chart says the controlling authority is ZLC Center. That's Salt Lake
> > ARTCC, right?
> > So if I'm flying VFR, what do I do?
> > Do I find any low alt freq to the SLC ARTCC in the AF/D and call "Salt Lake
> > Center. 1234X Request transition through R12345"
>
> Oh yeah, how do we know you are not a terrorist *smile*.
>
> Or work for a terrorist that doesn't want to fly....
>
> I would suspect the area would be restricted for photo opportunities as
> well, so taking snapshots may be one of the reasons for restricted
> airspace.
>
> Why else would you want to overfly a restricted area? Inquiring minds
> like to know....
>
> Allen

[Casey Wilson]

"H.J." > wrote in message
...
> If I want to fly in some restricted airspace - nevermind the reason - how
is
> that done?
> The chart says the controlling authority is ZLC Center. That's Salt Lake
> ARTCC, right?
> So if I'm flying VFR, what do I do?
> Do I find any low alt freq to the SLC ARTCC in the AF/D and call "Salt
Lake
> Center. 1234X Request transition through R12345"
> Any tips?
>
> hj

Wait for a long holiday weekend -- particullary one with a flex-Friday
if the military owner has such a thing. Then ask your friendly ATC sector
controller ( you did already request flight following, didn't you?) for
permission to fly across R123nn, whatever. What you don't want to do is
start orbiting or flying thisaway and thataway. Two things might happen:
(1) you might get a letter you won't like, or (2) the owners will take away
the privledge for the rest of us -- in which case you might get a lot of
letters.
With all that said -- the best thing to do is avoid the restricted area
unless you have more than just a casual reason to go traipsing across. The
military people are pretty understanding and they realize that in somecase
they can save us lots of time and gas,
Now, if you are planning on doodling across Dugway, bad idea. Besides,
they buried all the sheep already.

[A Lieberman]

H.J. wrote:
>
> If I want to fly in some restricted airspace - nevermind the reason - how is
> that done?
> The chart says the controlling authority is ZLC Center. That's Salt Lake
> ARTCC, right?
> So if I'm flying VFR, what do I do?
> Do I find any low alt freq to the SLC ARTCC in the AF/D and call "Salt Lake
> Center. 1234X Request transition through R12345"

Oh yeah, how do we know you are not a terrorist *smile*.

Or work for a terrorist that doesn't want to fly....

I would suspect the area would be restricted for photo opportunities as
well, so taking snapshots may be one of the reasons for restricted
airspace.

Why else would you want to overfly a restricted area? Inquiring minds
like to know....

Allen

[A Lieberman]

Jessica Core wrote:

> Why would you suspect that? If "taking snapshops" was to be avoided, the
> airspace would be prohibited, although you'd have to prohibit awfully darn high to
> be meaningful in an age with quality telephoto lenses and even satellite
> photography. Restricted areas many times are areas where there is a lot of
> military training activity and/or parachuting, mortar firing, etc. (MOAs have
> activity too but are not restricted). If the danger is not present at the moment,
> ("not hot") you can often get approval to fly through.

If the area is restricted and hot ATC will not issue a clearance. Go to
http://hal9000.inetstrat.com/airspace/SpecialUse.htm for special use
airspace. Website also provides the AIM chapters as appropriate.

The restricted airspace I have encountered was a military installation.
I'd suspect that the military may not want planes loitering overhead
when there may be sensitive operations on the ground that may be
subjected to photographs.

> Because it lies between Point A & Point B where you are trying to travel?

Most of these restricted areas "may" take you a couple of miles out of
your way. Plan far enough ahead, and maybe a change of 10 degrees in
your heading before getting to the restricted airspace will circumvent
the area and then after passing, adjust the other direction. Really not
that hard to do. Situational awareness is the key.

Allen

[BTIZ]

We fly through R airspace all the time.. shortest route between Las Vegas
and Bakersfield Calif, call up the controlling agency, their frequencies are
on the chart.. in this case it's Joshua Approach on the designated frequency
and ask the status of the surrounding MOAs and the Restricted..

Much easier to get clearance on weekends than mid-week, depends on the users
operations.. China Lake NAS, Ft Irwin Army Base or Edwards AFB.. many times
the Ft Irwin areas are hot, or we are told we can transit the northern
ranges, shoot the Gap at Trona to go south of China Lake and then proceed on
west when clear. Many times we will get cleared either through the R space
or "Cleared above 5000AGL.

Some of the R area near Edwards AFB and Ft Irwin Army Base covers the
"Goldstone Communications" center. That is the local "space communications"
for Huston Control and any of the shuttles that may be flying and the
International Space station.. also any far reaching exploring missions that
are out there.. Don't ever expect to get cleared to close to that antenna..
so you don't block their reception.

Keep in mind, the R airspace out here can be the size of some east coast
States. Just one county in Nevada (Clark County, Las Vegas) is the same
square mile acreage as the State of Delaware.

Another reader refers to "Dreamland", that area is R-4808 and R4809, that
area covers the old "Department of Energy Test Site" with the above ground
and below ground nuclear testing of the 1950s and 1960s. Also the new home
of Yucca Mountain where all of the US wants to store the spent fuel from
nuclear reactors into eternity.

Don't ever expect a low altitude clearance over that ground, but on late
night or weekend occasions, a high flyer (Flight Level Flyer) might get
through.

BT

"H.J." > wrote in message
...
> If I want to fly in some restricted airspace - nevermind the reason - how
is
> that done?
> The chart says the controlling authority is ZLC Center. That's Salt Lake
> ARTCC, right?
> So if I'm flying VFR, what do I do?
> Do I find any low alt freq to the SLC ARTCC in the AF/D and call "Salt
Lake
> Center. 1234X Request transition through R12345"
> Any tips?
>
> hj
>
>

[MikeM]

In the areas west of SLC, the controlling agency is "Clover Control";
their frequency is on the charts. I've had good luck shortcutting across
the restricted areas just by asking them. They will give you a discrete
sqwak code, radar indentify you, and give you a routing, sometimes
direct
to where you want to go, sometimes not.

The only time I have called ZLC about this if I know apriori that Clover
has gone home for the weekend...

MikeM
Skylane '1MM
Pacer '00Z
SLC

"H.J." wrote:
>
> If I want to fly in some restricted airspace - nevermind the reason - how is
> that done?
> The chart says the controlling authority is ZLC Center. That's Salt Lake
> ARTCC, right?
> So if I'm flying VFR, what do I do?
> Do I find any low alt freq to the SLC ARTCC in the AF/D and call "Salt Lake
> Center. 1234X Request transition through R12345"
> Any tips?
>
> hj

[C J Campbell]

Check the legend on your sectional to see when the restricted airspace is
active. Few restricted areas are active all of the time. You can fly through
when it is not active. You also can fly through with permission or vectors
from ATC, or you can call the local controlling agency and find out
procedures for a particular restricted area.

Usually restricted areas are there for your safety -- something is going on
in there that is extremely dangerous to aircraft. Permission to fly through
restricted areas is routinely given when circumstances permit. Areas where
air traffic is permanently not allowed for security reasons are usually
prohibited areas. Prohibited areas are rare.

Some areas have "temporary" restricted areas around them. These used to be
used for controlling traffic around major sporting events or news events and
around other areas attracting intense aerial activity, such as forest fires.
The new TFRs are more or less permanent and are used much the same way as
prohibited areas are, except there are numerous exceptions allowed for
traffic to fly through them.

[Kevin McCue]

Don't ever expect overflight of dreamland. Even military pilots w/top secret
clearances get in DEEP doodoo over busting airspace during exercises in the
other R areas.

--
Kevin McCue
KRYN
'47 Luscombe 8E
Rans S-17 (for sale)




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[H.J.]

"A Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
> H.J. wrote:
> >
> > If I want to fly in some restricted airspace - nevermind the reason -
how is
> > that done?
> > The chart says the controlling authority is ZLC Center. That's Salt Lake
> > ARTCC, right?
> > So if I'm flying VFR, what do I do?
> > Do I find any low alt freq to the SLC ARTCC in the AF/D and call "Salt
Lake
> > Center. 1234X Request transition through R12345"
>
> Oh yeah, how do we know you are not a terrorist *smile*.

You don't know.

>
> Or work for a terrorist that doesn't want to fly....
>
> I would suspect the area would be restricted for photo opportunities as
> well, so taking snapshots may be one of the reasons for restricted
> airspace.
>
> Why else would you want to overfly a restricted area? Inquiring minds
> like to know....
>
> Allen


If you've ever been flying around SLC, you'd see three things.
1. Class B.
2. Mountains 10000 MSL tall
3. Restricted Airspace.

Basically If something is not #2, then it is #3 or #1
So it's good to get to know the ins and outs of about 50% of my airspace.

[[email protected]]

>Some of the R area near Edwards AFB and Ft Irwin Army Base covers the
>"Goldstone Communications" center. That is the local "space communications"
>for Huston Control and any of the shuttles that may be flying and the
>International Space station.. also any far reaching exploring missions that
>are out there.. Don't ever expect to get cleared to close to that antenna..
>so you don't block their reception.

This is for your own protection.
Some of those transmitters will put out enough radiated power in a very tight
beam that at normal altitudes (not the FL's) it would make a microwave oven
look like a childs toy.

[David Reinhart]

Yeah, I grew up in that part of California and had many friends who worked at
Goldstone. If a bird flew across the 210 ft. Mars dish while it was transmitting
it would disappear in a puff of smoke.

Dave Reinhart


wrote:

> >Some of the R area near Edwards AFB and Ft Irwin Army Base covers the
> >"Goldstone Communications" center. That is the local "space communications"
> >for Huston Control and any of the shuttles that may be flying and the
> >International Space station.. also any far reaching exploring missions that
> >are out there.. Don't ever expect to get cleared to close to that antenna..
> >so you don't block their reception.
>
> This is for your own protection.
> Some of those transmitters will put out enough radiated power in a very tight
> beam that at normal altitudes (not the FL's) it would make a microwave oven
> look like a childs toy.

[G.R. Patterson III]

Casey Wilson wrote:
>
> What you don't want to do is start orbiting or flying thisaway and thataway.

You won't get that with a restricted area. Either they'll tell you "sure, no
problem", assign you a different altitude, or tell you to avoid the area.

George Patterson
The actions taken by the New Hampshire Episcopalians (ie. inducting a gay
bishop) are an affront to Christians everywhere. I am just thankful that
the church's founder, Henry VIII, and his wife Catherine of Aragon, and his
wife Anne Boleyn, and his wife Jane Seymour, and his wife Anne of Cleves,
and his wife Katherine Howard, and his wife Catherine Parr are no longer
here to suffer through this assault on traditional Christian marriages.

[No Such User]

In article >, H.J. wrote:
>Do I find any low alt freq to the SLC ARTCC in the AF/D and call "Salt Lake
>Center. 1234X Request transition through R12345"
>Any tips?
>
I don't know if there's an official way to ask, but what I always hear is
something like, "hey, center, is R12345 hot today?"