Chopper Question

[Sovek]

ok, I still use MSFS-98, however I cant do anything with the choppers, I
cant even get off the ground before it goes haywire :( help! I thought it
might be a glitch in the chopper they gave me, so I downloaded another
chopper, still have the same problem, what do I do?
--
RIW Steel Wing, Saterday nights at midnight ET,

[David G. Bell]

On Thursday, in article
<01c3a494$c6b0daa0$0400a8c0@soveks-computer>
"Sovek" wrote:

> ok, I still use MSFS-98, however I cant do anything with the choppers, I
> cant even get off the ground before it goes haywire :( help! I thought it
> might be a glitch in the chopper they gave me, so I downloaded another
> chopper, still have the same problem, what do I do?

I'm not sure that the default chopper is the easiest to fly, and I've
had better luck with third-party MD-500 variants.

I think a seperate throttle, rather than a knob on a joystick base, and
rudder-pedals, make a huge difference.

Over the years, I've had a lot of experience of flying Flight Simulator
at slow frame rates, and acquired the habit of _slow_ control movements,
which could make a difference. Consider adjusting control sensitivity
and the central dead-zone.

--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"History shows that the Singularity started when Tim Berners-Lee
was bitten by a radioactive spider."

[John Stewart]

FS2004 has made a big difference in how helicopters are operated. Get a
book on FS for instructions on how to fly. For example, you tip forward as
if you are going to run into the ground in order to gain speed. Quite a
flip from other planes.

John Stewart


"Sovek" > wrote in message
news:01c3a494$c6b0daa0$0400a8c0@soveks-computer...
> ok, I still use MSFS-98, however I cant do anything with the choppers, I
> cant even get off the ground before it goes haywire :( help! I thought it
> might be a glitch in the chopper they gave me, so I downloaded another
> chopper, still have the same problem, what do I do?
> --
> RIW Steel Wing, Saterday nights at midnight ET,

[Al Denelsbeck]

"Sovek" > wrote in
news:01c3a494$c6b0daa0$0400a8c0@soveks-computer:

> ok, I still use MSFS-98, however I cant do anything with the choppers, I
> cant even get off the ground before it goes haywire :( help! I thought it
> might be a glitch in the chopper they gave me, so I downloaded another
> chopper, still have the same problem, what do I do?


First off, the default Bell 206B in FS98 has some pretty serious
issues with unrealistic instability. Most especially, the body roll with
anti-torque (rudder) input is too pronounced, but there are other problems
as well. I would recommend not using it, or any model that uses its .air
file.

Second, helos *are* hard to fly. They're inherently unstable, largely
like balancing the aircraft on the top of a flagpole, and take a long time
to learn how to fly correctly.

Inputs have a delayed affect, and it needs a soft touch. So
essentially, you need to enter a small amount of stick or rudder input and
get back to neutral *before* it apparently takes affect. If you're still
holding the stick over by the time the bird starts to respond, chances are
you're overcontrolling and will soon pitch it out of control.

You *need* to have separate rudder ability, even if just a twisty-
stick. Disable auto-coordination, it's impossible to fly properly with it -
helos work entirely differently than fixed wings. Also, you may find it
better to set null zones on your joystick/rudder controls to nothing. Boost
sensitvity to max on aileron/elevators, somewhere around 50% for rudder and
throttle.

Get the frame rates as high as you can, at least when learning. Dump
all non-essential secenery details - the most I would have is ground
textures, to see when the aircraft is starting to drift (and it will). It
also helps to have a high visibility control panel (i.e., NOT the Bell). I
also often use the refueling areas as helipads, positioned so that the
pumps are visible, because this gives one of the best references for
aircraft movement.

As you increase throttle in a hover or takeoff, you will induce some
yawing, and this is typical and perfectly realistic, so you need to apply a
little rudder input to counter it. With the Bell, this will also induce
roll (too much), so be ready for that. Gentle touch, wait for it.

The FS models are usually pretty sensitive to translational lift too,
which is the tendency for the aircraft to have more lift in forward motion.
When forward motion halts, the aircraft will begin to descend, so extra
throttle input is needed to control this.

So, taking off. Apply enough throttle to start lifting off, and be
ready for some rudder input as soon as it's airborne. Gentle, bump it and
return. Takes a while to get a feel (less than the real thing, though).
Keep increasing throttle and let the nose drop a bit - this will induce
forward motion, a much more stable condition than hovering. Don't be
concerned if you lose all sight of the horizon as this occurs, as long as
you're increasing throttle and the climb indicator still registers positive
(think of all those fast takeoffs you've seen in action movies - the nose
can drop a hell of a lot, but you're not flying forward yet, you're flying
straight up). As you start serious forward movement, you may then start to
descend slightly, so ease back on the nose now. You'll find it becomes very
stable with airspeed above 35 knots or so. A little steady rudder input is
necessary during higher speed flights to remain straight and level, which
is also realistic (throttle versus drag versus anti-torque).

Landing, hoo boy! Expect a lot of crashes. A wheeled aircraft can
give you a slight edge in landings as you do gentle run-on landings while
getting the hang of it. You can also maintain slight forward airspeed
during descent and lose this just before touchdown, for more stability, but
it will still be hard. Don't aim for anything at first, just line up on a
runway. Lower the throttle to start a gentle descent and keep the nose just
a little below the horizon. You'll be losing airspeed as well - the goal is
to shed both airspeed and altitude at about the same rate so you end up in
a hover at 10' AGL or so. Takes practice. If you start losing control,
increase throttle to abort the approach and go around again. But as you get
close to the ground, lift the nose enough to dump the airspeed (may need to
go quite high) and *be ready* for that loss of lift when you hit zero -
increasing throttle will be necessary so you don't just plummet. Gently on
the stick and rudder, just nudge them to correct the drifting as soon as it
occurs, level the nose as soon as you hit zero, let the throttle down
gently to set it down. If you hold the stick back too long, you may start
backwards flight, which does not register on the airspeed indicator and
will be very hard to see with the nose up.

When you crash, replay it from spot plane position and watch what
went wrong. Sometimes it will seem total nonsense, other times it provides
valuable input ("Ah! I was sliding sideways at touchdown!")

Two reasonably forgiving aircraft to try out for learning: The Hughes
500 model by Ian Standfast (who quite simply made *the best* helicopter
models for FS98) named "mesa_pd.zip", available at www.flightsim.com, and
the MH-60G Pave Hawk model by Phill Stokes, no slouch either in design,
extremely stable, finest touch on the throttle I've ever seen. Filename
"mh60g.zip", but I don't know where I got it, Flightsim doesn't have it.
Try a search, or I'll send it direct if you like.

Ask me nice, and I'll send my US Customs Service repaint with custom
panel and proper sounds ;-).

Overall, be patient, be gentle, and get lots of practice.


- Al.

--
To reply, insert dash in address to separate G and I in the domain

[Peter Duniho]

"John Stewart StewartWeb.org>" <John@<NOSPAM> wrote in message
...
> FS2004 has made a big difference in how helicopters are operated. Get a
> book on FS for instructions on how to fly. For example, you tip forward
as
> if you are going to run into the ground in order to gain speed. Quite a
> flip from other planes.

Which other planes? None I know of.

Not to imply that controlling a helicopter is anything near the same as
controlling an airplane but, the "push forward on the stick to go faster" is
one of the few ways that helicopters and airplanes are the same.

Pete

[Sovek]

ok, first off, I do not have a joystick, thats on my want list, second,
where is a good sight to download a *good* chopper? I did have a steady
hover a couple of feet off the ground, but that fowled up too :( another
question is, how many of you circle the airport before landing? I never do
and have a good landing record, course some of em were pretty rough :/
--
RIW Steel Wing, Saterday nights at midnight ET,

Al Denelsbeck > wrote in article
>...
> "Sovek" > wrote in
> news:01c3a494$c6b0daa0$0400a8c0@soveks-computer:
>
> > ok, I still use MSFS-98, however I cant do anything with the choppers,
I
> > cant even get off the ground before it goes haywire :( help! I thought
it
> > might be a glitch in the chopper they gave me, so I downloaded another
> > chopper, still have the same problem, what do I do?
>
>
> First off, the default Bell 206B in FS98 has some pretty serious
> issues with unrealistic instability. Most especially, the body roll with
> anti-torque (rudder) input is too pronounced, but there are other
problems
> as well. I would recommend not using it, or any model that uses its .air
> file.
>
> Second, helos *are* hard to fly. They're inherently unstable,
largely
> like balancing the aircraft on the top of a flagpole, and take a long
time
> to learn how to fly correctly.
>
> Inputs have a delayed affect, and it needs a soft touch. So
> essentially, you need to enter a small amount of stick or rudder input
and
> get back to neutral *before* it apparently takes affect. If you're still
> holding the stick over by the time the bird starts to respond, chances
are
> you're overcontrolling and will soon pitch it out of control.
>
> You *need* to have separate rudder ability, even if just a twisty-
> stick. Disable auto-coordination, it's impossible to fly properly with it
-
> helos work entirely differently than fixed wings. Also, you may find it
> better to set null zones on your joystick/rudder controls to nothing.
Boost
> sensitvity to max on aileron/elevators, somewhere around 50% for rudder
and
> throttle.
>
> Get the frame rates as high as you can, at least when learning. Dump

> all non-essential secenery details - the most I would have is ground
> textures, to see when the aircraft is starting to drift (and it will). It

> also helps to have a high visibility control panel (i.e., NOT the Bell).
I
> also often use the refueling areas as helipads, positioned so that the
> pumps are visible, because this gives one of the best references for
> aircraft movement.
>
> As you increase throttle in a hover or takeoff, you will induce some

> yawing, and this is typical and perfectly realistic, so you need to apply
a
> little rudder input to counter it. With the Bell, this will also induce
> roll (too much), so be ready for that. Gentle touch, wait for it.
>
> The FS models are usually pretty sensitive to translational lift
too,
> which is the tendency for the aircraft to have more lift in forward
motion.
> When forward motion halts, the aircraft will begin to descend, so extra
> throttle input is needed to control this.
>
> So, taking off. Apply enough throttle to start lifting off, and be
> ready for some rudder input as soon as it's airborne. Gentle, bump it and

> return. Takes a while to get a feel (less than the real thing, though).
> Keep increasing throttle and let the nose drop a bit - this will induce
> forward motion, a much more stable condition than hovering. Don't be
> concerned if you lose all sight of the horizon as this occurs, as long as

> you're increasing throttle and the climb indicator still registers
positive
> (think of all those fast takeoffs you've seen in action movies - the nose

> can drop a hell of a lot, but you're not flying forward yet, you're
flying
> straight up). As you start serious forward movement, you may then start
to
> descend slightly, so ease back on the nose now. You'll find it becomes
very
> stable with airspeed above 35 knots or so. A little steady rudder input
is
> necessary during higher speed flights to remain straight and level, which

> is also realistic (throttle versus drag versus anti-torque).
>
> Landing, hoo boy! Expect a lot of crashes. A wheeled aircraft can
> give you a slight edge in landings as you do gentle run-on landings while

> getting the hang of it. You can also maintain slight forward airspeed
> during descent and lose this just before touchdown, for more stability,
but
> it will still be hard. Don't aim for anything at first, just line up on a

> runway. Lower the throttle to start a gentle descent and keep the nose
just
> a little below the horizon. You'll be losing airspeed as well - the goal
is
> to shed both airspeed and altitude at about the same rate so you end up
in
> a hover at 10' AGL or so. Takes practice. If you start losing control,
> increase throttle to abort the approach and go around again. But as you
get
> close to the ground, lift the nose enough to dump the airspeed (may need
to
> go quite high) and *be ready* for that loss of lift when you hit zero -
> increasing throttle will be necessary so you don't just plummet. Gently
on
> the stick and rudder, just nudge them to correct the drifting as soon as
it
> occurs, level the nose as soon as you hit zero, let the throttle down
> gently to set it down. If you hold the stick back too long, you may start

> backwards flight, which does not register on the airspeed indicator and
> will be very hard to see with the nose up.
>
> When you crash, replay it from spot plane position and watch what
> went wrong. Sometimes it will seem total nonsense, other times it
provides
> valuable input ("Ah! I was sliding sideways at touchdown!")
>
> Two reasonably forgiving aircraft to try out for learning: The
Hughes
> 500 model by Ian Standfast (who quite simply made *the best* helicopter
> models for FS98) named "mesa_pd.zip", available at www.flightsim.com, and

> the MH-60G Pave Hawk model by Phill Stokes, no slouch either in design,
> extremely stable, finest touch on the throttle I've ever seen. Filename
> "mh60g.zip", but I don't know where I got it, Flightsim doesn't have it.
> Try a search, or I'll send it direct if you like.
>
> Ask me nice, and I'll send my US Customs Service repaint with custom

> panel and proper sounds ;-).
>
> Overall, be patient, be gentle, and get lots of practice.
>
>
> - Al.
>
> --
> To reply, insert dash in address to separate G and I in the domain
>

[78Trip]

On 6 Nov 2003 21:28:12 -0600, Speedbyyrd > wrote:

>Don't question Pete the Know-It-All!!! Has all the answers!
>
> 'Oh, Great Brother of the Dark...
> Who rideth on the hot winds of Hell....
> I bid you, appear before me now!
>
> The SpeedByrd :>

The Subject line reads Chopper Question....not ASSHOLE question,
SpeedBump! Crawl back under your rock and play with your weenie some
more! Wayne the Janitor.....your crack whore mother would be proud.

[Al Denelsbeck]

"Sovek" > wrote in
news:01c3a4ec$a2ea3140$0400a8c0@soveks-computer:

> ok, first off, I do not have a joystick, thats on my want list,
> second, where is a good sight to download a *good* chopper? I did have
> a steady hover a couple of feet off the ground, but that fowled up too
> :( another question is, how many of you circle the airport before
> landing? I never do and have a good landing record, course some of em
> were pretty rough :/

Without a joystick, you won't get anywhere with a helicopter unless
you're unbelieveably good. It takes a lot of control input and, as I said,
separate rudder work, so look for at least a rudder-capable twisty-stick,
or a separate set of pedals. Keyboad or mouse commands aren't too likely to
cut it, and will increase the frustration level unnecessarily.

mesa_pd.zip at www.flightsim.com, login and Search File Library

mh60g.zip at http://sim-stuff.00game.com/military.htm

Circle the airport? Not unless ATC directs it ;-).


- Al.

--
To reply, insert dash in address to separate G and I in the domain

[Anonymous]

Peter Duniho wrote in message ...
>"John Stewart StewartWeb.org>" <John@<NOSPAM> wrote in message
...
>> FS2004 has made a big difference in how helicopters are operated. Get a
>> book on FS for instructions on how to fly. For example, you tip forward
>as
>> if you are going to run into the ground in order to gain speed. Quite a
>> flip from other planes.
>
>Which other planes? None I know of.
>
>Not to imply that controlling a helicopter is anything near the same as
>controlling an airplane but, the "push forward on the stick to go faster" is
>one of the few ways that helicopters and airplanes are the same.

Well if you want to KEEP flying your plane instead of flying a field, then
keeping the nose down is generally not a good idea... ;o)

Whereas with a helicopter, if you push the nose down and keep it just slightly
tipped downwards, while making careful increases to the collective, you should
be able to increase speed AND keep your altitude roughly the same.

A good tip I was given was to face into the wind on takeoffs and landings in
helicopters.

If you don't have rudder pedals, then keep the "Realism" slider quite low, or
you most often find yourself spinning rapidly on the spot. Pedals are needed
to keep making the fine adjustments required for flying helos.

And yes - slow, careful, gentle movements are needed.

--
Graeme Porter
-^-_ _
/ [_][_]_:_ Proud owner of a 1978
/| _||_ v Pearl Fiberglass Shell kit
| / \ |
-=/=\\____//=\=jaa "I married Miss right, I just didn't
know her first name was 'Always'"
-- Anonymous

[Quilljar]

I heard that choppers do not fly at all. It's just that the earth rejects
them temporarily! :-)


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 03/11/2003

[Paul Riley]

"Quilljar" > wrote in message
...
> I heard that choppers do not fly at all. It's just that the earth rejects
> them temporarily! :-)

No, choppers do fly--the rotors beat the air into submission!!!! I know,
spent 18 years flying them for the US Army. <VBG>

Paul

[Al Denelsbeck]

"Paul Riley" > wrote in
:

>
> "Quilljar" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I heard that choppers do not fly at all. It's just that the earth
>> rejects them temporarily! :-)
>
> No, choppers do fly--the rotors beat the air into submission!!!! I
> know, spent 18 years flying them for the US Army. <VBG>

It's a close match, though... ;-)


- Al.

--
To reply, insert dash in address to separate G and I in the domain

[Peter Duniho]

"Anonymous" > wrote in message
...
> Well if you want to KEEP flying your plane instead of flying a field, then
> keeping the nose down is generally not a good idea... ;o)

That all depends. But if the airplane is about the stall, the only way to
avoid "flying a field" is to push on the stick. Keeping the nose down is
*exactly* the good idea.

> Whereas with a helicopter, if you push the nose down and keep it just
slightly
> tipped downwards, while making careful increases to the collective, you
should
> be able to increase speed AND keep your altitude roughly the same.

Note your use of "while making careful increases to the collective".
Likewise, in an airplane, all that's necessary to maintain altitude is to
make "careful increases to power".

Pete

[Al Denelsbeck]

"Peter Duniho" > wrote in
:

> "Anonymous" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Well if you want to KEEP flying your plane instead of flying a field,
>> then keeping the nose down is generally not a good idea... ;o)
>
> That all depends. But if the airplane is about the stall, the only
> way to avoid "flying a field" is to push on the stick. Keeping the
> nose down is *exactly* the good idea.
>
>> Whereas with a helicopter, if you push the nose down and keep it just
> slightly
>> tipped downwards, while making careful increases to the collective,
>> you
> should
>> be able to increase speed AND keep your altitude roughly the same.
>
> Note your use of "while making careful increases to the collective".
> Likewise, in an airplane, all that's necessary to maintain altitude is
> to make "careful increases to power".

Forward flight on a helicopter is achieved by having the rotor disk
tipped forward, which has to be done by tipping the body as well (to a
lesser extent with a rigid hub, but still necessary). This is regardless of
the power settings, altitude, rate-of-climb, et cetera.

And you *will not climb* in any fixed wing aircraft with the nose
pointed down. In a helo, this is typical behavior.


- Al.

--
To reply, insert dash in address to separate G and I in the domain

[Peter Duniho]

"Al Denelsbeck" > wrote in message
. 8...
> Forward flight on a helicopter is achieved by having the rotor disk
> tipped forward

Yes, I know that. So?

> And you *will not climb* in any fixed wing aircraft with the nose
> pointed down.

I never said you would.

> In a helo, this is typical behavior.

I never said it wasn't.

Sorry...was there a point to your post?

Pete

[Quilljar]

Paul Riley wrote:
> "Quilljar" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I heard that choppers do not fly at all. It's just that the earth
>> rejects them temporarily! :-)
>
> No, choppers do fly--the rotors beat the air into submission!!!! I
> know, spent 18 years flying them for the US Army. <VBG>
>
> Paul

Yeah I know, I spent some time falling into the sea in them in the Royal
Navy, in the mediterranean in winter ouch!


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[Al Denelsbeck]

"Peter Duniho" > wrote in
:

> "Al Denelsbeck" > wrote in message
> . 8...
>> Forward flight on a helicopter is achieved by having the rotor disk
>> tipped forward
>
> Yes, I know that. So?
>
>> And you *will not climb* in any fixed wing aircraft with the nose
>> pointed down.
>
> I never said you would.
>
>> In a helo, this is typical behavior.
>
> I never said it wasn't.
>
> Sorry...was there a point to your post?


About as much point as your posts bandying about 'pointing a fixed-
wing's nose down to go faster'. You can go even faster, eventually, by
pointing the nose sraight up and killing throttle, too. So what? And in
what way does this have anything whatsoever to do with the thread on
instructing someone about helo flight?

Lowering the nose to gain airspeed in a fixed wing is generally
considered to be really poor flying skills, not to mention inviting
overspeed situations. Descents are supposed to be strictly controlled,
which is why you *reduce* power to accomplish them, and if you're lowering
the nose to counter a stall, that means a) it's too damn high to begin
with, and b) you don't know what the hell you're doing.

Enough of a point?


- Al.

--
To reply, insert dash in address to separate G and I in the domain

[Peter Duniho]

"Al Denelsbeck" > wrote in message
. 7...
> Lowering the nose to gain airspeed in a fixed wing is generally
> considered to be really poor flying skills, not to mention inviting
> overspeed situations.

lol...

Obviously not a pilot. Or at least, not a skilled one. There are numerous
situations where airspeed is controlled with pitch, and the only way to
increase airspeed with pitch is to lower the nose.

For whatever reason, you have gotten your nose all bent out of shape for
nothing. But you might want to stop before you've dug yourself even deeper.
The more you talk about flying, the less it looks like you know.

Pete

[Ralph Jones]

On Fri, 7 Nov 2003 16:23:55 -0800, "Peter Duniho"
> wrote:

>"Al Denelsbeck" > wrote in message
. 7...
>> Lowering the nose to gain airspeed in a fixed wing is generally
>> considered to be really poor flying skills, not to mention inviting
>> overspeed situations.
>
>lol...
>
>Obviously not a pilot. Or at least, not a skilled one.

Definitely one who's never done a loop...

rj

[David G. Bell]

On Friday, in article
<01c3a4ec$a2ea3140$0400a8c0@soveks-computer>
"Sovek" wrote:

> ok, first off, I do not have a joystick, thats on my want list, second,
> where is a good sight to download a *good* chopper? I did have a steady
> hover a couple of feet off the ground, but that fowled up too :( another
> question is, how many of you circle the airport before landing? I never do
> and have a good landing record, course some of em were pretty rough :/

There have been, over the years, some good books about how to fly Flight
Simulator realistically, and, apart from helicopters, there have been
few changes. A book covering FS4 can still tell you a lot about flying
a Cessna according to the proper procedures.

Circling the airfield, the "pattern", is a way of setting up the
landing. It gives a chance to look over the runway, and provides a set
of consistent visual cues. Done right, you're flying parallel to the
runway, at the same distance and altitude above the runway, and it
always looks the same. It's a method for visual flying, "VFR".

The other method is the normal way for airliners, business jets, and the
like, flying with radio beacons and, sometimes. without anything visible
outside, what they call "IFR". The specifics differ for each airfield,
and each runway, but involve picking up, and following, a radio beam
aligned with the runway.

Either way, the last part of the approach and landing gets to be
consistent; the speed and the descent rate fixing a line in the sky
which reaches the runway at the same point every time.


Now, you can fly the Cessna well without a joystick, and it can even
teach you good habits. You have to keep thinking ahead, as you can't
easily give a quick flick of full-stick to get out of trouble. But
don't fly with turbulent air.

It's important to get the elevator trim right, rather than just keying
in a bit of elevator, as you would have to re-key that correction each
time you centre the controls.

The basic principle is to get the speed right with the elevators,
remembering to lower the undercarriage and use the flaps, and adjust the
descent rate with the throttle. The throttle will affect the speed too,
and the elevator trim can need a little tweak with a major throttle
change. The pattern can give time to do some of this setting up for the
landing.

For Flight Simulator, Meigs Field is the traditional place to learn all
this. An important real-world point is that the approach patterns for
Meigs had to be over the lake, safely clear of the city buildings. So,
approaching from the south needs right-hand turns while from the north
uses left-hand turns.

It's also important to practise at other airports, so you learn to
recognise when the runway looks right, rather than learning to fly over
some local landmark.

Back in the days of FS4 some people recommended starting out with the
Learjet. Everything happens much faster, and that can be pretty
overwhelming. And it's easy to run out of runway at Meigs. But Flight
Simulator crashes don't kill people.




--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"History shows that the Singularity started when Tim Berners-Lee
was bitten by a radioactive spider."

[Al Denelsbeck]

"Peter Duniho" > wrote in
:

> Obviously not a pilot. Or at least, not a skilled one. There are
> numerous situations where airspeed is controlled with pitch, and the
> only way to increase airspeed with pitch is to lower the nose.
>
> For whatever reason, you have gotten your nose all bent out of shape
> for nothing. But you might want to stop before you've dug yourself
> even deeper. The more you talk about flying, the less it looks like
> you know.

'Numerous' situations? I would question that, but then I tend to define
'numerous' differently. But you're right, there isn't much point in
escalating it.

I would suspect we're at cross purposes regarding the intention of
John Stewart's post. I interpreted it to mean that forward flight was
achieved in a helo *only* by lowering the nose, and this is true enough.
You won't manage it otherwise. This *is* different from a fixed-wing, where
forward motion isn't related (in most cases) to body pitch, but to the
thrust from the engine. You appear to have chosen to make a case against
the statement in its literal sense. Whatever floats your boat - I tend to
feel this is a counterproductive approach. I suppose you've gotten some
point across, just not sure what it might be.

- Al.

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