O-470 cylinders

[RST Engineering]

As most of you know, I threw a jug in east BF Wyoming coming home from
Oshkosh last year. I put on an emergency cylinder from a reputable shop,
but the serial number indicated that this replacement jug has been around
for a long, long time.

I'm getting ready for the summer flying season, the Oshkosh trip, and
perhaps an Alaska trip next summer. I want to put on a good replacement jug
and perhaps a full set of replacement jugs once the top end of the engine
starts to deteriorate.

I'm told that Millenium is the jug of choice today, but I'd like some
comments...

If YOU were putting a replacement jug on an O-470 today, what would YOU use?
And who would you buy it from if you could supply an A&P/IA number to ship
it to?

Jim

[kage]

I would buy new ECI "Titan" cylinders with nickel-carbide coatings. I would
also buy the cheap ones that are all new except "rebarreled." About $1050
each. Saves about $200/ea. I think RAM has them.

KG



"RST Engineering" > wrote in message
...
> As most of you know, I threw a jug in east BF Wyoming coming home from
> Oshkosh last year. I put on an emergency cylinder from a reputable shop,
> but the serial number indicated that this replacement jug has been around
> for a long, long time.
>
> I'm getting ready for the summer flying season, the Oshkosh trip, and
> perhaps an Alaska trip next summer. I want to put on a good replacement
> jug and perhaps a full set of replacement jugs once the top end of the
> engine starts to deteriorate.
>
> I'm told that Millenium is the jug of choice today, but I'd like some
> comments...
>
> If YOU were putting a replacement jug on an O-470 today, what would YOU
> use? And who would you buy it from if you could supply an A&P/IA number to
> ship it to?
>
> Jim
>

[Denny]

When I did the top on my Super Viking I used ECI cylinders and had zero
problems and at this moment I would be tempted by their new Titan
cylinders...
Remember, money talks, especially when you quote a competitors figure
and then say, 'beat it and you get the business'.... If you are not a
good wheeler dealer, get someone else to make the calls...
One thing I have found over the years in business that greases the
skids like no other is direct money transfer to their bank... People
really like the idea that the money will be in hand within an hour or
two, and that there will not be a 3% withdrawal by Visa...

denny

[Denny]

http://www.vansairforce.net/eci/FlashEngine.htm

Here's a little blurb about the TItan's from a customer...

denny

[Paul kgyy]

See if you can get a copy of Aviation Consumer's article a year or so
back on this. Also, check out ECI cylinders. Remember that a top OH
doesn't add much value to your airplane, where a full overhaul does if
done by a reputable shop.

[Jon A.]

On 22 Mar 2005 09:38:36 -0800, "Paul kgyy" >
wrote:

>See if you can get a copy of Aviation Consumer's article a year or so
>back on this. Also, check out ECI cylinders. Remember that a top OH
>doesn't add much value to your airplane, where a full overhaul does if
>done by a reputable shop.

Better yet, contact the folks at GAMI. They may open your eyes a bit
about those ECI's from what they've been seeing.

[Rip]

In what way? Please elucidate.

Jon A. wrote:
> On 22 Mar 2005 09:38:36 -0800, "Paul kgyy" >
> wrote:
>
>
>>See if you can get a copy of Aviation Consumer's article a year or so
>>back on this. Also, check out ECI cylinders. Remember that a top OH
>>doesn't add much value to your airplane, where a full overhaul does if
>>done by a reputable shop.
>
>
> Better yet, contact the folks at GAMI. They may open your eyes a bit
> about those ECI's from what they've been seeing.

[SAC]

I have just purchased 6 rebuilt O470 cylinders from ECI. I can't tell you
how they'll do, but I can tell you that I'd never use Continental cylinders
again. This set lasted 1000 hour and started testing at 10-15 psi while
leaking through the exhaust valves. Also, you shouldn't need an A&P/IA
number to order your jugs, I just called ECI and told them what I wanted.
I'm just a "customer".

For reference, our last set were Millenium's and they held compressions
until we decided to overhaul at 200 over TBO. Compressions were in the mid
60's, but never dropped. This is considered good for Continentals. I would
choose Milleniums again if given the chance.

This time around, we are restricted to using ECI's due to our Texas Skyway's
O470 STC. We were told that we had to use ECI cylinders(to meet the STC)
because they perform the same modification....whatever that is, the STC is a
big secret that they won't release. We're starting to discover that the
Texas Skyway's HP increase is nothing more that a high flow carb
adjustment....but that's another discussion.

SAC


"RST Engineering" > wrote in message
...
> As most of you know, I threw a jug in east BF Wyoming coming home from
> Oshkosh last year. I put on an emergency cylinder from a reputable shop,
> but the serial number indicated that this replacement jug has been around
> for a long, long time.
>
> I'm getting ready for the summer flying season, the Oshkosh trip, and
> perhaps an Alaska trip next summer. I want to put on a good replacement
> jug and perhaps a full set of replacement jugs once the top end of the
> engine starts to deteriorate.
>
> I'm told that Millenium is the jug of choice today, but I'd like some
> comments...
>
> If YOU were putting a replacement jug on an O-470 today, what would YOU
> use? And who would you buy it from if you could supply an A&P/IA number to
> ship it to?
>
> Jim
>

[Jon A.]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 03:49:27 GMT, Rip
> wrote:

>In what way? Please elucidate.
>
Every time I "elucidate" (I guess), I get flamed from the intelligent
lurkers on the group while the more intelligent stand by, never
participating but understanding exactly what I say. If you want the
opinion of a few people who have for years been carefully watching
cylinders of all manufacture, looking at both their strengths and
weaknesses, contact the group at GAMI. Granted they don't have the
armchair backass experience that most of the people here have with
second guessing, but if a scientific opinion, gathered from the use of
thousands of hours of measured data using instruments that are on the
cutting edge interests you, give them a call.

I really don't want to say anything else about it. For you
armchairers, it's because I'm full of sh*t, so no need to take note.


>Jon A. wrote:
>> On 22 Mar 2005 09:38:36 -0800, "Paul kgyy" >
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>See if you can get a copy of Aviation Consumer's article a year or so
>>>back on this. Also, check out ECI cylinders. Remember that a top OH
>>>doesn't add much value to your airplane, where a full overhaul does if
>>>done by a reputable shop.
>>
>>
>> Better yet, contact the folks at GAMI. They may open your eyes a bit
>> about those ECI's from what they've been seeing.

[Jon A.]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 05:44:02 GMT, "SAC" > wrote:

>I have just purchased 6 rebuilt O470 cylinders from ECI. I can't tell you
>how they'll do, but I can tell you that I'd never use Continental cylinders
>again. This set lasted 1000 hour and started testing at 10-15 psi while
>leaking through the exhaust valves. Also, you shouldn't need an A&P/IA
>number to order your jugs, I just called ECI and told them what I wanted.
>I'm just a "customer".

Right on, but a mechanic may get a better price.
>
>For reference, our last set were Millenium's and they held compressions
>until we decided to overhaul at 200 over TBO. Compressions were in the mid
>60's, but never dropped. This is considered good for Continentals. I would
>choose Milleniums again if given the chance.

Great choice.

>
>This time around, we are restricted to using ECI's due to our Texas Skyway's
>O470 STC. We were told that we had to use ECI cylinders(to meet the STC)
>because they perform the same modification....whatever that is, the STC is a
>big secret that they won't release. We're starting to discover that the
>Texas Skyway's HP increase is nothing more that a high flow carb
>adjustment....but that's another discussion.
>
The Texas boys all seem to stick together.

>SAC
>
>

[Denny]

Jon, I'm not going to call ECI and demand that they waste their time
talking to a non customer (carburetor engines on my current plane)...
But, if you are aware of field problems with ECI TITAN cylinders, why
not just say so... Sure, some idiot will micturate all over you, it
comes with usenet... I pointed out that I had good service on my
IO-520D 300HP with their original Cermichrome cylnders - which were
supposedly junk... And, based on that experience I feel that their
TITAN cylinder with the nickle/silicon liner will work like
gangbusters...

denny

[Dave Butler]

Jon A. wrote:

> I really don't want to say anything else about it. For you
> armchairers, it's because I'm full of sh*t, so no need to take note.

Hmmm. You pretend not to care what we armchairers think, but evidently you do
care, so much so that it prevents you from providing possibly good information.
Too bad.

Go ahead an offer whatever valuable knowledge you have. If you're criticized by
people whose opinions you don't value, why worry?

Dave (armchairer extraordinaire)