TFRs & Rescue Problems

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http://www.nola.com/weblogs/nola/index.ssf?/mtlogs/nola_nolaview/archives/2005_09.html#075758

There is a hospital "under siege" by armed gangs and the company which
runs the hospital has apparently tried to charter helicopters to go
take people off the roof but has been unable to get clearance from the
FAA to enter the TFR area.

Personally, I think I'd tell them "Here's what I'm doing, call traffic
for me, and you can violate me when I'm done saving people."

I'm all for maintaining control but when you have a desperate situation
on your hands, I'm willing to place my trust in individuals to do their
best. Americans are very good at self-organizing.

-cwk.

[Gig 601XL Builder]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
>
> http://www.nola.com/weblogs/nola/index.ssf?/mtlogs/nola_nolaview/archives/2005_09.html#075758
>
> There is a hospital "under siege" by armed gangs and the company which
> runs the hospital has apparently tried to charter helicopters to go
> take people off the roof but has been unable to get clearance from the
> FAA to enter the TFR area.
>
> Personally, I think I'd tell them "Here's what I'm doing, call traffic
> for me, and you can violate me when I'm done saving people."
>
> I'm all for maintaining control but when you have a desperate situation
> on your hands, I'm willing to place my trust in individuals to do their
> best. Americans are very good at self-organizing.
>
> -cwk.
>

Purely hearsay. Has this been confirmed anywhere else? She's at Florida
State University, how does she know these things?

[Guy Elden Jr]

>Personally, I think I'd tell them "Here's what I'm doing, call traffic
>for me, and you can violate me when I'm done saving people."

I thought all of the radio outlets and radar was out for a large
portion of the area. Who's going to call traffic for ya? Also, I've
heard all flights in/out are daylight hours only at this point, since
no electricity = no lights on at the airports at night.

--
Guy

[Hotel 179]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
>
> http://www.nola.com/weblogs/nola/index.ssf?/mtlogs/nola_nolaview/archives/2005_09.html#075758
>
> There is a hospital "under siege" by armed gangs and the company which
> runs the hospital has apparently tried to charter helicopters to go
> take people off the roof but has been unable to get clearance from the
> FAA to enter the TFR area.

----------------------------------reply-----------------------------------------------

Hello from the Gulf region,

I've been flying since before landfall and every day since the storm's
passage. Yesterday, the medivac choppers were with us at Jack Edwards (JKA)
in Gulf Shores. The pilot told me that they tried to land at one of the
hospitals but the landing pad was crowded with people and there had been
reports of gun fire.

Getting a clearance during the first couple of days meant calling the Marine
Air Ops on the west coast and giving them your name, call sign, agency, and
time of flight. After day 2, the FAA took over the task of assigning codes
and the process was the same. They would give you a squawk code, and
frequency and controller call sign. A P-3 was assigned to each State along
the coast and each State has a particular controller. Our's here in Alabama
was Omaha 45 CS and the system worked pretty well. Several times during the
missions, we'd have to change frequencies in order to accomodate
communication problems onboard the P-3. When the controller, who by the way
only provided advisories, was unreachable, we operated the way we normally
do down here....we talked to each other, gave position reports, and followed
standard procedures.

Fuel for the aircraft has not been an issue, but for the automobiles another
story. I sat in line for 2.5 last night only to have the store run out of
gas before I could get up to the pump. Today, I hit the line just right and
was re-fueled in about 20 minutes.

Fly safe,

Stephen
Alabama Wing, CAP

[Doug]

> >Personally, I think I'd tell them "Here's what I'm doing, call traffic
> >for me, and you can violate me when I'm done saving people."
>
> I thought all of the radio outlets and radar was out for a large
> portion of the area. Who's going to call traffic for ya? Also, I've
> heard all flights in/out are daylight hours only at this point, since
> no electricity = no lights on at the airports at night.
>

Radar service is out for a large area. Some friends of mine are readying
their planes to go help out. The flight service briefer said there is an
AWACS providing radar service.

[RST Engineering]

You've never landed at an airport at night without lights?

Jim



"Guy Elden Jr" > wrote in message
oups.com...


Also, I've
> heard all flights in/out are daylight hours only at this point, since
> no electricity = no lights on at the airports at night.

[Guy Elden Jr]

Nope, although I know it can be done. I suspect the lack of any
precision approaches into the airports would hamper this effort as
well, considering there is _no_ light at all in the vicinity.

--
Guy

[john smith]

RST Engineering wrote:
> You've never landed at an airport at night without lights?

Yep!
1945 Champ back in 1985. I knew the end of the runway was abeam the
firehouse. All I had to do was stay above 50 feet to clear the wires
next to the road. Once past the road, cut the throttle and ease the
stick back. It was easy to discern the asphalt from the grass in the
ambient light.

[Darrel Toepfer]

RST Engineering wrote:

> You've never landed at an airport at night without lights?

Da plane or the airport? I kneaux somebody dats done both...

[jmk]

<<Fuel for the aircraft has not been an issue, but for the automobiles
another
story.>>

Ever since Katrina hit, Angel Flight South Central (and South East)
have been working to get the injured out and trained personnel and
supplies into the area. As a medical relief flight, we've not had any
TFR problems - and now we are just staging a standing line of planes.
The Red Cross or National Guard brings them to us (mostly from
hospitals) and we have the next plane in line in the air in 15 minutes.


Fuel has been a problem - all the underground AVGAS supplies are
flooded (or empty) and so we are having to limit to planes that can fly
in and back unrefueled. That should get better soon. There are
supplies of AVGAS further north that are intact, but little
coordination as to which airports can sell to our pilots vs. which are
without power or gas.

It's getting there, slowly... but once the big crunch is over there is
going to be a continuing mess to reunite everyone. We are flying out
lots of babies from hospitals without natal care units working. To
handle as many as possible, that means the parents get left behind.
jmk

[Dave S]

RST Engineering wrote:

> You've never landed at an airport at night without lights?
>
> Jim
>

Not with people shooting at me, and debris potentially on the runway

Dave

[Wade]

Hotel 179 wrote:
<snip>
> Hello from the Gulf region,
>
> I've been flying since before landfall and every day since the storm's
> passage. Yesterday, the medivac choppers were with us at Jack Edwards (JKA)
> in Gulf Shores.
<snip>
> Fly safe,
>
> Stephen
> Alabama Wing, CAP

What missions are CAP volunteers flying along the Gulf?
Are you flying Civil Air Patrol-owned aircraft exclusively,
or are private aircraft being pressed into service?

[Hotel 179]

--

"Wade" > wrote in message news:247Se.430>
> What missions are CAP volunteers flying along the Gulf?
> Are you flying Civil Air Patrol-owned aircraft exclusively,
> or are private aircraft being pressed into service?
-------------------------------------reply------------------------------------------------
We first flew before the storm hit and video'd the entire coastline and
intra-coastal canal so that a "before" record could be compared to the
"after" (We means the Baldwin County and Mobile County Squadrons). On the
morning after the wind and rain, I took off before sunrise to allow my
Observer to still-photo the flooded areas and storm damaged sections of the
coastline and inland areas. These photos were used to brief the Emergency
Management folks at the local and State level as well as elected officials
from the various municipalities.

Other flights were to provide a photo platform for the Army Corp of
Engineers to shoot levy damage. I flew for the Highway Department doing
highway and bridge damage assessment. The power companies had us shoot
powerline damage. Officials from the State Insurance Commission had us fly
a sortie for them as they viewed the damage. Today, I flew a route search
for a hospital ship whose Command has lost contact with them....photo'd the
vessel and had our commo guys relay their position.

All told, we've flown about 15 hours in support of the relief efforts here
in Alabama. All of the flights are done in the Corporate plane. Our
squadron is assigned a 2001 C-172SP. It has the standard Cessna radio
package---dual nav/coms, 2 axis autopilot, KLN94 GPS, and a Becker Unit for
SAR. We took delivery from the factory and have put 850 hours on it since
new.

Semper vi.,

Stephen
Foley, Alabama