MBNA Aircraft Financing

[att news group]

I wanted to relate an interesting story. I purchased a small single engine
Piper in January of this year through my business. At the time I had extra
cash in the business, so rather than finance it, I decided just to use the
cash and then
perhaps put the financing in place later.

Well the later turned out to be yesterday. I decided to try MBNA based upon
AOPA's recommendation, so I called MBNA. and inquired about the financing.
Generally I have found AOPA's approved affiliates to be excellent, and very
customer service orientated. This was not the case with MBNA. To my
surprise the MBNA representative told me they could not finance a plane that
wasn't an actual purchase. I didn't really understand why, and asked him to
explain. He said it was like doing a cash out refinance of your home. I
said it's not even the same thing. So he checked with a supervisor. When
he came back he said they could not finance it. He compared it again to a
cash out refinance of a home. That analogy really confused me. I said,
so if I produced an agreement of sale transferring from my corporate name to
another entity you would finance it? That thought, I think, confused him.
I then made a snap decision that they are definitely not customer service
orientated, and I didn't need to be creative to place my business with MBNA.
So I thanked him for his time and we parted ways. Interestingly enough I
called several other vendors that specialize in aircraft financing, they
were delighted to have my business and finance the plane.

It is incredulous that MBNA would not finance this plane! I guess MBNA has
more business than they need because they sure don't seem very anxious to
bring on new business, or at the very least are not really geared to handle
aircraft financing, it is really a side line business and does not conform
to their core business model, the credit card business. Inflexibility
up-front is not
a really good sign of customer support and service. I would not
recommend MBNA, and would urge others to look else where for their aircraft
financing. I would also be curious if anyone else has had customer
inflexibility with MBNA?

Charles

[Victor]

> I wanted to relate an interesting story. I purchased a small single
engine
> Piper in January of this year through my business. At the time I had
extra
> cash in the business, so rather than finance it, I decided just to use the
> cash and then
> perhaps put the financing in place later.

<snipped>
I've never tried to finance an aircraft with MBNA, but as a consumer finance
company they are a bunch of evil *******s. Everybody should stay away from
them.

[Ian Taylor]

When I bought my last airplane, I had the money to buy it, but thought I
should keep it in the company, and finanace the airplane. Also called MBNA
on AOPA's recomendation, and the refused to finance, as I was the owner of
my company. No flexibility, no discussion, no thoughts about what they could
do. So I decided to just write a check for it. (and came home and cut up and
cancelled my MBNA credit cards)



"att news group" > wrote in message
...
> I wanted to relate an interesting story. I purchased a small single
engine
> Piper in January of this year through my business. At the time I had
extra
> cash in the business, so rather than finance it, I decided just to use the
> cash and then
> perhaps put the financing in place later.
>
> Well the later turned out to be yesterday. I decided to try MBNA based
upon
> AOPA's recommendation, so I called MBNA. and inquired about the financing.
> Generally I have found AOPA's approved affiliates to be excellent, and
very
> customer service orientated. This was not the case with MBNA. To my
> surprise the MBNA representative told me they could not finance a plane
that
> wasn't an actual purchase. I didn't really understand why, and asked him
to
> explain. He said it was like doing a cash out refinance of your home. I
> said it's not even the same thing. So he checked with a supervisor. When
> he came back he said they could not finance it. He compared it again to a
> cash out refinance of a home. That analogy really confused me. I said,
> so if I produced an agreement of sale transferring from my corporate name
to
> another entity you would finance it? That thought, I think, confused him.
> I then made a snap decision that they are definitely not customer service
> orientated, and I didn't need to be creative to place my business with
MBNA.
> So I thanked him for his time and we parted ways. Interestingly enough I
> called several other vendors that specialize in aircraft financing, they
> were delighted to have my business and finance the plane.
>
> It is incredulous that MBNA would not finance this plane! I guess MBNA
has
> more business than they need because they sure don't seem very anxious to
> bring on new business, or at the very least are not really geared to
handle
> aircraft financing, it is really a side line business and does not conform
> to their core business model, the credit card business. Inflexibility
> up-front is not
> a really good sign of customer support and service. I would not
> recommend MBNA, and would urge others to look else where for their
aircraft
> financing. I would also be curious if anyone else has had customer
> inflexibility with MBNA?
>
> Charles
>
>
>
>

[Charlie]

That's interesting. I have been talking to Dorr as well and so far they
have been excellent. Easy to work with, very accommodating.

Charlie

"Aaron Coolidge" > wrote in message
...
> att news group > wrote:
> : Well the later turned out to be yesterday. I decided to try MBNA based
> upon
> : AOPA's recommendation, so I called MBNA. and inquired about the
> financing.
>
> I also called MBNA when I financed my airplane (I know, never finance
> anything, perhaps when I move to Nirvana...). I was underwhelmed with
> their
> customer service. I financed through Dorr Aviation which is about 1 mile
> from my place. (The actual loan is written with "Eaglemark" which is
> Harley-Davidson's credit arm). I was able to visit their office, and the
> customer service has been very good, both from Dorr and from Eaglemark.
> --
> Aaron C.

[john smith]

"Ian Taylor" > wrote:
> When I bought my last airplane, I had the money to buy it, but thought I
> should keep it in the company, and finanace the airplane. Also called MBNA
> on AOPA's recomendation, and the refused to finance, as I was the owner of
> my company. No flexibility, no discussion, no thoughts about what they could
> do. So I decided to just write a check for it. (and came home and cut up and
> cancelled my MBNA credit cards)

Had you put the purchase on your MNBA credit card, you probably would
have had no problem!

[houstondan]

y'all are making me feel a lot better. as i've been moving toward
buying a 172, one of the contacts was to my aopa card for
financing...mbna.

horrible.the poor brain-damaged child they had on the fone for intake
kept dropping her crayon and getting confused but promised to have
someone get back to me.

nobody got back. finally got thru and was told the loan was denied.
now, isn't that fun. i did not apply for the loan, just asked that
someone consult with me on it but now i have a denial on my record.
first one of those in over 30 years. thanks mbna.theydon't know why it
was denied. didn't you get our letter? no letter sent. called twice
more and finally a letter was delivered thanks to some detective work
by my postman since they had a somewhat similar name with a somewhat
similar address. the letter is suitable for framing in it's absurdity.
typos, misspellings mis-facts. just sloppy as it can be.

i'll probably do wells fargo since that's where i park most of my cash
but if anyone has a GOOD airplane finance outfit please post. i was
trying to get a rate from mbna to run against the bank.

it's nice to know it wasn't personal. mbna hates everybody!

dan

[Charlie]

LOL good point!


"john smith" > wrote in message
...
> "Ian Taylor" > wrote:
>> When I bought my last airplane, I had the money to buy it, but thought I
>> should keep it in the company, and finanace the airplane. Also called
>> MBNA
>> on AOPA's recomendation, and the refused to finance, as I was the owner
>> of
>> my company. No flexibility, no discussion, no thoughts about what they
>> could
>> do. So I decided to just write a check for it. (and came home and cut up
>> and
>> cancelled my MBNA credit cards)
>
> Had you put the purchase on your MNBA credit card, you probably would
> have had no problem!

[john smith]

[snip]
> first one of those in over 30 years. thanks mbna.theydon't know why it
> was denied. didn't you get our letter? no letter sent. called twice
> more and finally a letter was delivered thanks to some detective work
> by my postman since they had a somewhat similar name with a somewhat
> similar address. the letter is suitable for framing in it's absurdity.
> typos, misspellings mis-facts. just sloppy as it can be.

Send a copy of the letter with notes of the inaccuracies to AOPA and let
them know of your displeasure with their sponsorship.

[kontiki]

thats funy, MBNA done good fer me my kuzin werks there they lent me some mony ta by a
knew trayler.

[Ken Reed]

> I also called MBNA when I financed my airplane (I know, never finance
> anything, perhaps when I move to Nirvana...). I was underwhelmed with their
> customer service. I financed through Dorr Aviation which is about 1 mile
> from my place. (The actual loan is written with "Eaglemark" which is
> Harley-Davidson's credit arm). I was able to visit their office, and the
> customer service has been very good, both from Dorr and from Eaglemark.

I too just financed my Cirrus with Dorr Aviation. I have nothing but
good things to say of the experience. Good rate, good terms, reasonable
fees and a great representative that I dealt with; Brian Bourett
>.

---
Ken Reed

[xyzzy]

Victor wrote:

>>I wanted to relate an interesting story. I purchased a small single
>
> engine
>
>>Piper in January of this year through my business. At the time I had
>
> extra
>
>>cash in the business, so rather than finance it, I decided just to use the
>>cash and then
>>perhaps put the financing in place later.
>
>
> <snipped>
> I've never tried to finance an aircraft with MBNA, but as a consumer finance
> company they are a bunch of evil *******s. Everybody should stay away from
> them.
>
>
Yes. Their AOPA Visa card is a black mark on AOPA's reputation.

--
"You can support the troops but not the president"
--Representative Tom Delay (R-TX), during the Kosovo war.

[Charlie]

I have been talking with Brian as well and he is great!

Charlie

"Ken Reed" > wrote in message
k.net...
>> I also called MBNA when I financed my airplane (I know, never finance
>> anything, perhaps when I move to Nirvana...). I was underwhelmed with
>> their customer service. I financed through Dorr Aviation which is about 1
>> mile
>> from my place. (The actual loan is written with "Eaglemark" which is
>> Harley-Davidson's credit arm). I was able to visit their office, and the
>> customer service has been very good, both from Dorr and from Eaglemark.
>
> I too just financed my Cirrus with Dorr Aviation. I have nothing but good
> things to say of the experience. Good rate, good terms, reasonable fees
> and a great representative that I dealt with; Brian Bourett
> >.
>
> ---
> Ken Reed

[BTIZ]

hopefully the "credit inquiry" and denial do not end up on your Credit
Report.
Check that quickly.. and now.. when you apply to get a new loan.. do you
have to say you were denied credit by another "lending institution"?

sounds like lawsuit material against mbna

BT

"houstondan" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> y'all are making me feel a lot better. as i've been moving toward
> buying a 172, one of the contacts was to my aopa card for
> financing...mbna.
>
> horrible.the poor brain-damaged child they had on the fone for intake
> kept dropping her crayon and getting confused but promised to have
> someone get back to me.
>
> nobody got back. finally got thru and was told the loan was denied.
> now, isn't that fun. i did not apply for the loan, just asked that
> someone consult with me on it but now i have a denial on my record.
> first one of those in over 30 years. thanks mbna.theydon't know why it
> was denied. didn't you get our letter? no letter sent. called twice
> more and finally a letter was delivered thanks to some detective work
> by my postman since they had a somewhat similar name with a somewhat
> similar address. the letter is suitable for framing in it's absurdity.
> typos, misspellings mis-facts. just sloppy as it can be.
>
> i'll probably do wells fargo since that's where i park most of my cash
> but if anyone has a GOOD airplane finance outfit please post. i was
> trying to get a rate from mbna to run against the bank.
>
> it's nice to know it wasn't personal. mbna hates everybody!
>
> dan
>

[Rick Beebe]

> I wanted to relate an interesting story. I purchased a small single engine
> Piper in January of this year through my business. At the time I had extra
> cash in the business, so rather than finance it, I decided just to use the
> cash and then
> perhaps put the financing in place later.
>
> Well the later turned out to be yesterday. I decided to try MBNA based upon
> AOPA's recommendation, so I called MBNA. and inquired about the financing.
> Generally I have found AOPA's approved affiliates to be excellent, and very
> customer service orientated. This was not the case with MBNA. To my
> surprise the MBNA representative told me they could not finance a plane that
> wasn't an actual purchase. I didn't really understand why, and asked him to

I'll offer a counterpoint to this. I bought my plane 3 years ago for
cash. 6 months ago I decided to "refinance" so I could update my radio
stack. I used MBNA and they were a pleasure to deal with. They gave me a
better rate and offered to finance more of the plane than Dorr or the
other ones I talked to. One difference in our stories--I did finance
more than the cost of the stack and used the extra to pay off a home
equity line so as far as they were concerned it was a refinance and not
just taking cash out of the plane. Still, they were great to work with.
Maybe the Bank of America merger has addled their brains. The bank where
I have my checking and savings accounts recently became BoA. Now I get
half the services for twice the fees.

--Rick

[George Patterson]

att news group wrote:
>
> I would not
> recommend MBNA, and would urge others to look else where for their aircraft
> financing. I would also be curious if anyone else has had customer
> inflexibility with MBNA?

When I bought my Maule, I checked with a variety of companies about the loan.
Every company was quick to volunteer their interest rate, but I also asked each
company what the payments would be. MBNA had the lowest interest rate but the
highest monthly payments. Don't know why, but I'm aware that there is a certain
amount of leeway in the methods allowed for calculating interest on such loans.
MBNA also had the most convoluted application form.

George Patterson
Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.

[Charlie]

Hi Rick,

I wasn't looking to do a "cash out", I just wanted to finance what I paid
for the plane, or some significant portion thereof. I live in Wilmington,
the banks headquarters, and one of my customers happens to have run this
department until he retired, about two years ago He wasn't that surprised
with my story. When he ran the department, particularly a loan of this
size, that would not have to go to loan committee, he would have approved it
on the spot. Maybe I just got the wrong represintative. I wish I had
talked with the one you worked with. I have a lot of customers and friends
who are senior MBNA executives, I could probably make a call, and I'm
pretty sure I would get the financing. But I don't want to do that. They
are either going to be easy to work with or not, and if they are this
inflexible up front who knows how bad they will be during the life of the
loan. Several years ago I had a similar experience with their credit card
department. I needed a short term loan to cover income taxes. I decided to
do a cash advance off of my MBNA card at our local bank. When I got my
statement the next month from MBNA I was surprised to see a $900 surcharge,
in addition to the 21% interest they charge. Needless to say I was a little
annoyed. I called them to discuss the charge and have it reduced or
hopefully removed. They wouldn't, even after I kicked the complaint up
several levels. So I closed the account on the spot and paid off the card.
I swore I never would use MBNA again (so much for me resolution!) Now they
were certainly within their rights to charge me that. I had apparently
agreed to it. But in the long run they lost a good customer because of
their inflexibility, and lack of customer focus. In discussing that
particular incident with some of my credit card customers from other credit
card banks in Wilmington, they told me that their banks would probably have
removed the $900 fee, and kept the customer happy. Who knows?

I agree with you as well that I have found AOPA's approved vendors to be
generally excellent as well. This MBNA deal is the exception. Maybe MBNA
was having a bad day the day I called? I wrote AOPA last week about this
and other than an automatic reply I haven't heard word one from them yet.
I'm sure they get a lot of emails from their members, so I will be curious
to hear what their thoughts are when they respond.

Charlie

"Rick Beebe" > wrote in message
...
>> I wanted to relate an interesting story. I purchased a small single
>> engine
>> Piper in January of this year through my business. At the time I had
>> extra
>> cash in the business, so rather than finance it, I decided just to use
>> the
>> cash and then
>> perhaps put the financing in place later.
>>
>> Well the later turned out to be yesterday. I decided to try MBNA based
>> upon
>> AOPA's recommendation, so I called MBNA. and inquired about the
>> financing.
>> Generally I have found AOPA's approved affiliates to be excellent, and
>> very
>> customer service orientated. This was not the case with MBNA. To my
>> surprise the MBNA representative told me they could not finance a plane
>> that
>> wasn't an actual purchase. I didn't really understand why, and asked him
>> to
>
> I'll offer a counterpoint to this. I bought my plane 3 years ago for cash.
> 6 months ago I decided to "refinance" so I could update my radio stack. I
> used MBNA and they were a pleasure to deal with. They gave me a better
> rate and offered to finance more of the plane than Dorr or the other ones
> I talked to. One difference in our stories--I did finance more than the
> cost of the stack and used the extra to pay off a home equity line so as
> far as they were concerned it was a refinance and not just taking cash out
> of the plane. Still, they were great to work with. Maybe the Bank of
> America merger has addled their brains. The bank where I have my checking
> and savings accounts recently became BoA. Now I get half the services for
> twice the fees.
>
> --Rick

[kristoffer-m20j]

I just purchased a 1993 Mooney M20J. My first contact was to MBNA. As someone that is self employed my tax returns do not give a clear picture my income. I filled out an application online and wait for there response within 24 hours (per there site). After two days I called them only to get a rude response for one of their reps. informing me I was declined. When I tried to question the reasoning behind the denial the rep simply huffed & puffed that I continued to waste his time. Two days later I called back in hopes to get a different rep (no such luck) only to receive the same treatment. When I informed him I could come up with as much cash as they would require & that I just needed a minimal loan he then passed me off to the under writer that was equally annoyed by my phone call & said he would not fund any amount!

I then contacted 1st Pryor of Oklahoma (Bob) explained my situation & was approved within two hours.


As a long time AOPA member I am very disappointed that AOPA would recommend MBNA. This is obviously a case of AOPA selling out to MNBA for there MONEY!!!

[Steve Foley]

#1) I would finance nothing with MNBA - for many other reasons.

#2) Why do you feel there is a difference between borrowing money against a
house you own, and borrowing money against a plane you own?

When you are buying, you are protecting your interests, which, at the time
of purchase, usually mirror the interests of the bank/finance company. You
want the best purchase at the best price.

When you are refinancing something you already own, you're not likely to
walk away if you find out the plane isn't worth the asking price.

I doubt the telemarketer on the phone understands this, nor does the
supervisor. They are simply told that they cannot write a loan without
transfer of ownership.


"att news group" > wrote in message
...
To my surprise the MBNA representative told me they could not finance a
plane that
wasn't an actual purchase. I didn't really understand why, and asked him to
explain. He said it was like doing a cash out refinance of your home. I
said it's not even the same thing. So he checked with a supervisor. When
he came back he said they could not finance it. He compared it again to a
cash out refinance of a home. That analogy really confused me.

[Steve Foley]

BTW, check you BOA accounts. They recently started charging me $10 per
month, even though I use direct deposit. As it turns out, they did not
convert my fee free Fleet account to the same fee free BOA account. They
said that they would not waive the fee because it was not a bank error, and
they had notified me of the change.

I brought ALL the correspondence (a file four inches thick) I have gotten
from BOA this year to my local branch, took it to a teller, and asked her to
point out where it showed that I would have to pay for this account.

She changed the account and waived the fee.


"Rick Beebe" > wrote in message
...
> > I wanted to relate an interesting story. I purchased a small single
engine
> > Piper in January of this year through my business. At the time I had
extra
> > cash in the business, so rather than finance it, I decided just to use
the
> > cash and then
> > perhaps put the financing in place later.
> >
> > Well the later turned out to be yesterday. I decided to try MBNA based
upon
> > AOPA's recommendation, so I called MBNA. and inquired about the
financing.
> > Generally I have found AOPA's approved affiliates to be excellent, and
very
> > customer service orientated. This was not the case with MBNA. To my
> > surprise the MBNA representative told me they could not finance a plane
that
> > wasn't an actual purchase. I didn't really understand why, and asked
him to
>
> I'll offer a counterpoint to this. I bought my plane 3 years ago for
> cash. 6 months ago I decided to "refinance" so I could update my radio
> stack. I used MBNA and they were a pleasure to deal with. They gave me a
> better rate and offered to finance more of the plane than Dorr or the
> other ones I talked to. One difference in our stories--I did finance
> more than the cost of the stack and used the extra to pay off a home
> equity line so as far as they were concerned it was a refinance and not
> just taking cash out of the plane. Still, they were great to work with.
> Maybe the Bank of America merger has addled their brains. The bank where
> I have my checking and savings accounts recently became BoA. Now I get
> half the services for twice the fees.
>
> --Rick

[OtisWinslow]

"att news group" > wrote in message
...
> I would also be curious if anyone else has had customer
> inflexibility with MBNA?
>
> Charles
>

I've used MBNA for my last 3 planes. I've had no problems. And on one of
them
they wrote the loan for the new one prior to the old one being sold. On
another
they refinanced it when interest rates dropped considerably.

Are you contacting the group that handles AOPA financing? Or just a
random MBNA loan rep?

I've always had courteous, quick service and will call them first the next
time I buy a plane.

[Dave]

ANY large company goes downhill in customer service.

Off Topic, but COMCAST is a good example. Now that they have a monopoly in
our area, you can't get ANYTHING from them.

MBNA has always been a large finance company due to the fact that their name
is used by groups like Nascar, AOPA, etc. That doesn't mean they are good.

Look for a good underwritten company thats NEW. NEW companies have GREAT
customer service.


"att news group" > wrote in message
...
>I wanted to relate an interesting story. I purchased a small single engine
> Piper in January of this year through my business. At the time I had
> extra
> cash in the business, so rather than finance it, I decided just to use the
> cash and then
> perhaps put the financing in place later.
>
> Well the later turned out to be yesterday. I decided to try MBNA based
> upon
> AOPA's recommendation, so I called MBNA. and inquired about the financing.
> Generally I have found AOPA's approved affiliates to be excellent, and
> very
> customer service orientated. This was not the case with MBNA. To my
> surprise the MBNA representative told me they could not finance a plane
> that
> wasn't an actual purchase. I didn't really understand why, and asked him
> to
> explain. He said it was like doing a cash out refinance of your home. I
> said it's not even the same thing. So he checked with a supervisor. When
> he came back he said they could not finance it. He compared it again to a
> cash out refinance of a home. That analogy really confused me. I said,
> so if I produced an agreement of sale transferring from my corporate name
> to
> another entity you would finance it? That thought, I think, confused him.
> I then made a snap decision that they are definitely not customer service
> orientated, and I didn't need to be creative to place my business with
> MBNA.
> So I thanked him for his time and we parted ways. Interestingly enough I
> called several other vendors that specialize in aircraft financing, they
> were delighted to have my business and finance the plane.
>
> It is incredulous that MBNA would not finance this plane! I guess MBNA
> has
> more business than they need because they sure don't seem very anxious to
> bring on new business, or at the very least are not really geared to
> handle
> aircraft financing, it is really a side line business and does not conform
> to their core business model, the credit card business. Inflexibility
> up-front is not
> a really good sign of customer support and service. I would not
> recommend MBNA, and would urge others to look else where for their
> aircraft
> financing. I would also be curious if anyone else has had customer
> inflexibility with MBNA?
>
> Charles
>
>
>
>

[Charlie]

No. I called the number right off of the AOPA member page.

Charlie

"OtisWinslow" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> "att news group" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I would also be curious if anyone else has had customer
>> inflexibility with MBNA?
>>
>> Charles
>>
>
> I've used MBNA for my last 3 planes. I've had no problems. And on one of
> them
> they wrote the loan for the new one prior to the old one being sold. On
> another
> they refinanced it when interest rates dropped considerably.
>
> Are you contacting the group that handles AOPA financing? Or just a
> random MBNA loan rep?
>
> I've always had courteous, quick service and will call them first the next
> time I buy a plane.
>

[Charlie]

Just to put a final message to the group about my MBNA customer experience.
I picked up a message Monday from a representative from MBNA's aviation
lending group. She had been contacted by AOPA regarding my criticism
(kudos' to AOPA for the prompt follow through on my behalf) I called her
back. After hearing what I wanted to do, she basically reiterated what her
colleague had told me last week that they wouldn't finance a plane that had
been purchased more than sixty days prior.

My recommendation for anyone out there is don't waste your time with MBNA,
call Dorr and ask to speak to Brian. They are great and are anxious to meet
the aviation customer's needs.

Happy flying,

Charlie




"Dave" > wrote in message
...
> ANY large company goes downhill in customer service.
>
> Off Topic, but COMCAST is a good example. Now that they have a monopoly
> in our area, you can't get ANYTHING from them.
>
> MBNA has always been a large finance company due to the fact that their
> name is used by groups like Nascar, AOPA, etc. That doesn't mean they are
> good.
>
> Look for a good underwritten company thats NEW. NEW companies have GREAT
> customer service.
>
>
> "att news group" > wrote in message
> ...
>>I wanted to relate an interesting story. I purchased a small single
>>engine
>> Piper in January of this year through my business. At the time I had
>> extra
>> cash in the business, so rather than finance it, I decided just to use
>> the
>> cash and then
>> perhaps put the financing in place later.
>>
>> Well the later turned out to be yesterday. I decided to try MBNA based
>> upon
>> AOPA's recommendation, so I called MBNA. and inquired about the
>> financing.
>> Generally I have found AOPA's approved affiliates to be excellent, and
>> very
>> customer service orientated. This was not the case with MBNA. To my
>> surprise the MBNA representative told me they could not finance a plane
>> that
>> wasn't an actual purchase. I didn't really understand why, and asked him
>> to
>> explain. He said it was like doing a cash out refinance of your home. I
>> said it's not even the same thing. So he checked with a supervisor.
>> When
>> he came back he said they could not finance it. He compared it again to
>> a
>> cash out refinance of a home. That analogy really confused me. I said,
>> so if I produced an agreement of sale transferring from my corporate name
>> to
>> another entity you would finance it? That thought, I think, confused
>> him.
>> I then made a snap decision that they are definitely not customer service
>> orientated, and I didn't need to be creative to place my business with
>> MBNA.
>> So I thanked him for his time and we parted ways. Interestingly enough I
>> called several other vendors that specialize in aircraft financing, they
>> were delighted to have my business and finance the plane.
>>
>> It is incredulous that MBNA would not finance this plane! I guess MBNA
>> has
>> more business than they need because they sure don't seem very anxious to
>> bring on new business, or at the very least are not really geared to
>> handle
>> aircraft financing, it is really a side line business and does not
>> conform
>> to their core business model, the credit card business. Inflexibility
>> up-front is not
>> a really good sign of customer support and service. I would not
>> recommend MBNA, and would urge others to look else where for their
>> aircraft
>> financing. I would also be curious if anyone else has had customer
>> inflexibility with MBNA?
>>
>> Charles
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

[10Squared]

Dave wrote:

> ANY large company goes downhill in customer service.

This is not limited to large companies. My economic theory states that
"Incompetence drives the economy". When the economy is in the toilet
companies keep only the best employees who know how to do what it takes to
get and keep business. At the top of the cycle, companies tend to put the
worst employees on the front line interfacing with customers and driving
away business. Judging from the service I've been getting lately we are at
the top of the cycle.

With respect to MNBA aircraft financing, in my recent dealings with them in
purchasing a vintage airplane I thought they did a pretty good job.
Everything was done when they said it would be done and the transaction was
done quickly.

Watch out for the terms on accelerated payments.

Cheers,

Jim

[Lets Fly]

"10Squared" > wrote in message
...
> Dave wrote:
>
>> ANY large company goes downhill in customer service.
>
> This is not limited to large companies. My economic theory states that
> "Incompetence drives the economy". When the economy is in the toilet
> companies keep only the best employees who know how to do what it takes to
> get and keep business. At the top of the cycle, companies tend to put the
> worst employees on the front line interfacing with customers and driving
> away business. Judging from the service I've been getting lately we are at
> the top of the cycle.
>
> With respect to MNBA aircraft financing, in my recent dealings with them
> in
> purchasing a vintage airplane I thought they did a pretty good job.
> Everything was done when they said it would be done and the transaction
> was
> done quickly.
>
> Watch out for the terms on accelerated payments.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Jim

I finanaced both my first plane (C-172N) with them and then my C180H, to get
financing, you litterally have to have excellent credit, they denied me a
few times between both, and i was honestly surprised they approved me the
2nd time around

[OtisWinslow]

I've had several loans with them and I thought they did fine. They even
carried
two loans at the same time while I was getting my old plane sold on one
occasion.




"Lets Fly" > wrote in message
...
> "10Squared" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Dave wrote:
>>
>>> ANY large company goes downhill in customer service.
>>
>> This is not limited to large companies. My economic theory states that
>> "Incompetence drives the economy". When the economy is in the toilet
>> companies keep only the best employees who know how to do what it takes
>> to
>> get and keep business. At the top of the cycle, companies tend to put the
>> worst employees on the front line interfacing with customers and driving
>> away business. Judging from the service I've been getting lately we are
>> at
>> the top of the cycle.
>>
>> With respect to MNBA aircraft financing, in my recent dealings with them
>> in
>> purchasing a vintage airplane I thought they did a pretty good job.
>> Everything was done when they said it would be done and the transaction
>> was
>> done quickly.
>>
>> Watch out for the terms on accelerated payments.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Jim
>
> I finanaced both my first plane (C-172N) with them and then my C180H, to
> get financing, you litterally have to have excellent credit, they denied
> me a few times between both, and i was honestly surprised they approved me
> the 2nd time around
>
>

[Matt]

I just recently closed on an aircraft loan with MBNA for a Cessna 152. I
used the online application. Although the website advertises a response
within 24 hours, I had not received any call within 3 days. So I called
them and was transferred to the voicemail of the woman (Stacy F.) who was
handling my application. I left her a voicemail and waited for a few days.
Having not received a return call, I assumed that I was denied. However I
needed to pull the trigger quick on the plane, and I reluctantly called
again. Finally I received an audience with Stacy and found out I was
approved.

The only major purchase I have financed has been a car, so I had some
questions about the process for financing a plane. I had several questions
and Stacy was uncooperative in answering them. She has an attitude a mile
wide. I was wasting her time by asking questions like "Do you require
documentation of a prepurchase inspection before closing?" Is that an
unreasonable question? Time for a career change, Stacy. Maybe accounting.

The rate I was quoted was high, even after I agreed to put down 20%. Maybe
most of the people that are financing aircraft with MBNA are looking for
loans of $250,000 and financing a Cessna 152 was not important to them.

The only reason I went with MBNA was because the application process was a
little simpler, and I wanted to close on the plane quick. They did not ask
me for financial statements, tax returns, or W-2s.

However the customer service was total crap. I am now looking to refinance
with another company, even if at the same rate. I feel guilty for having
supported the cause. I would not recommend MBNA. The only reason I
continue to use the MBNA credit card is for the 5% discount.

Matt


> I would not
> recommend MBNA, and would urge others to look else where for their
> aircraft
> financing. I would also be curious if anyone else has had customer
> inflexibility with MBNA?
>
> Charles

[OtisWinslow]

Strange. On the 4 loans I've had with them I knew within a few
hours about being approved.


"Matt" > wrote in message
. ..
>I just recently closed on an aircraft loan with MBNA for a Cessna 152. I
>used the online application. Although the website advertises a response
>within 24 hours, I had not received any call within 3 days. So I called
>them and was transferred to the voicemail of the woman (Stacy F.) who was
>handling my application. I left her a voicemail and waited for a few days.
>Having not received a return call, I assumed that I was denied. However I
>needed to pull the trigger quick on the plane, and I reluctantly called
>again. Finally I received an audience with Stacy and found out I was
>approved.
>
> The only major purchase I have financed has been a car, so I had some
> questions about the process for financing a plane. I had several
> questions and Stacy was uncooperative in answering them. She has an
> attitude a mile wide. I was wasting her time by asking questions like "Do
> you require documentation of a prepurchase inspection before closing?" Is
> that an unreasonable question? Time for a career change, Stacy. Maybe
> accounting.
>
> The rate I was quoted was high, even after I agreed to put down 20%.
> Maybe most of the people that are financing aircraft with MBNA are looking
> for loans of $250,000 and financing a Cessna 152 was not important to
> them.
>
> The only reason I went with MBNA was because the application process was a
> little simpler, and I wanted to close on the plane quick. They did not
> ask me for financial statements, tax returns, or W-2s.
>
> However the customer service was total crap. I am now looking to
> refinance with another company, even if at the same rate. I feel guilty
> for having supported the cause. I would not recommend MBNA. The only
> reason I continue to use the MBNA credit card is for the 5% discount.
>
> Matt
>
>
>> I would not
>> recommend MBNA, and would urge others to look else where for their
>> aircraft
>> financing. I would also be curious if anyone else has had customer
>> inflexibility with MBNA?
>>
>> Charles
>
>

[Ron Natalie]

Matt wrote:

> However the customer service was total crap. I am now looking to refinance
> with another company, even if at the same rate. I feel guilty for having
> supported the cause. I would not recommend MBNA. The only reason I
> continue to use the MBNA credit card is for the 5% discount.
>
It doesn't get any better after you get the loan. The customer support
on the loan servicing was screwed up many times and despite repeated
calls and promisses by MBNA reps in the AOPA booths at Oshkosh each
year that they'd personally look into the problems, things persisted
to the day I paid the loan off early because some snot-nosed kid refused
to endorse the insurance check for work that had already been done and
****ed off me and every mecahnic involved by his attitude.

Nothing AOPA offers as a "endorsed" service is a good deal for anybody
other than AOPA themselves.

[Chris Schmelzer]

MBNA did a good job (though a bit high on the interest rate) on my M20C
purchase just a month ago...

--
Chris Schmelzer, MD