Degaussing a Warrior

[DavidM]

Has anyone reading this group had to degauss a firewall? My Warrior
took a lightning strike last July while parked, melting a bit of the
propeller tip and magnetizing much of the plane forward of the firewall
(so that the compass always points towards the propeller). The engine
has now been overhauled, and all engine parts and the mount degaussed,
but after trying several compasses, we cannot get any to indicate
properly -- something is still strongly magnetized. Tomorrow my AME
(IA/A&P) will bring in a specialized meter and degaussing device to
start trying to hunt down the problem, but I'm quite discouraged being
grounded for this long.


Thanks in advance for any help,


David

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, "DavidM" > said:
>(so that the compass always points towards the propeller). The engine
>has now been overhauled, and all engine parts and the mount degaussed,
>but after trying several compasses, we cannot get any to indicate
>properly -- something is still strongly magnetized. Tomorrow my AME

Aw man, you can't catch a break, can you? I thought you were ready to
start flying again.


--
Paul Tomblin > http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
Could you stop changing your email address willy-nilly, so my killfile
can spare me from your erudition and wit?
-- Alan Shutko

[[email protected]]

DavidM > wrote:
> Has anyone reading this group had to degauss a firewall? My Warrior
> took a lightning strike last July while parked, melting a bit of the
> propeller tip and magnetizing much of the plane forward of the firewall
> (so that the compass always points towards the propeller). The engine
> has now been overhauled, and all engine parts and the mount degaussed,
> but after trying several compasses, we cannot get any to indicate
> properly -- something is still strongly magnetized. Tomorrow my AME
> (IA/A&P) will bring in a specialized meter and degaussing device to
> start trying to hunt down the problem, but I'm quite discouraged being
> grounded for this long.


> Thanks in advance for any help,


> David

This is probably stating the obvious, but only the iron/steel stuff
can be magnetized.

A dime store (do those exist anymore?) compass should point to the
magnetized part as you walk around the nose.

Held too closely it will point to any iron/steel part magnetized
or not, so start out at a distance where you start seeing a "disturbance
in the force".

--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

[nrp]

You might check

http://www.sacskyranch.com/degaussi.htm

Your firewall is galvanized steel (not stainless steel) as I recall.
It is probably the culprit.

[DavidM]

wrote:

> Held too closely it will point to any iron/steel part magnetized
> or not, so start out at a distance where you start seeing a "disturbance
> in the force".

We've done the compass walkaround in great detail, and as best we can
tell, the remaining problem is close to the firewall (the engine mount
was already degaussed in Halifax while the engine was being
overhauled), though there are one or two other minor hotspots. A
proper meter (I'm not sure whether it's a "gauss meter" or a "flux
meter") will be arriving at the shop tomorrow, and that should let us
pinpoint the problem more closely.


All the best,


David

[Drew Dalgleish]

Maybe you should just give up and get a vertical card compass with a
remote sensor out in a wing tip.

>Has anyone reading this group had to degauss a firewall? My Warrior
>took a lightning strike last July while parked, melting a bit of the
>propeller tip and magnetizing much of the plane forward of the firewall
>(so that the compass always points towards the propeller). The engine
>has now been overhauled, and all engine parts and the mount degaussed,
>but after trying several compasses, we cannot get any to indicate
>properly -- something is still strongly magnetized. Tomorrow my AME
>(IA/A&P) will bring in a specialized meter and degaussing device to
>start trying to hunt down the problem, but I'm quite discouraged being
>grounded for this long.
>
>
>Thanks in advance for any help,
>
>
>David
>

[DavidM]

Drew Dalgleish wrote:

> Maybe you should just give up and get a vertical card compass with a
> remote sensor out in a wing tip.

Using a remote sensor (probably in the tail rather than the wingtip) is
my fallback, if everything else fails. I'm not sure whether an STC
would be required for that.


All the best,


David

[Denny]

WIth the flux meter and a Color TV degausser coil, you should be able
to cure it... Even a compass will help you pick out the magnetized
areas in the engine compartment for giving the buzz treatment... The
key to using the degausser is to buzz the part and keep the power on
while you withdraw the coil, not put the coil against it and just turn
the power on and off...

denny

[[email protected]]

Denny > wrote:
: WIth the flux meter and a Color TV degausser coil, you should be able
: to cure it... Even a compass will help you pick out the magnetized
: areas in the engine compartment for giving the buzz treatment... The
: key to using the degausser is to buzz the part and keep the power on
: while you withdraw the coil, not put the coil against it and just turn
: the power on and off...

I'll agree that the tv degausser will likely be able to do it. With all the
decorations (like engine mount + engine), it might be tricky to get in where you need
it to be.

I'd recommend removing any/all things possible to reduce the risk of
magnetizing anything else.

-Cory

--

************************************************** ***********************
* Cory Papenfuss *
* Electrical Engineering candidate Ph.D. graduate student *
* Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University *
************************************************** ***********************

[[email protected]]

Denny > wrote:
: key to using the degausser is to buzz the part and keep the power on
: while you withdraw the coil, not put the coil against it and just turn
: the power on and off...

Oh, and if space constraints make it difficult or impossible to gracefully
move away while running, you can probably use a variac to ramp the field up/down to
simulate moving the coil. That's how the degaussers in monitors work.

-Cory

--

************************************************** ***********************
* Cory Papenfuss *
* Electrical Engineering candidate Ph.D. graduate student *
* Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University *
************************************************** ***********************

[Darrel Toepfer]

Denny wrote:

> WIth the flux meter and a Color TV degausser coil, you should be able
> to cure it... Even a compass will help you pick out the magnetized
> areas in the engine compartment for giving the buzz treatment... The
> key to using the degausser is to buzz the part and keep the power on
> while you withdraw the coil, not put the coil against it and just turn
> the power on and off...

How about a tape eraser? Would be easier to get into tight places...

[Mike W.]

Yes, a bulk tape eraser will work.

"Darrel Toepfer" > wrote in message
.. .
> Denny wrote:

> How about a tape eraser? Would be easier to get into tight places...

[David Lesher]

I strongly doubt a tape degausser will do you much good.
Likewise a color-TV coil.

You need a lot of field strength to clean [really, re-randomize..]
structual steel. You also need to be able to get that field where
it's needed.

Tapes and TV sets are orders of magnitude more subtle than the
results of a strike.

But feel free to try; just get the compasses well away before you
start.
--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

[[email protected]]

DavidM wrote:

> We've done the compass walkaround in great detail, and as best we can
> tell, the remaining problem is close to the firewall (the engine mount
> was already degaussed in Halifax while the engine was being

How about the rudder pedal/bar assemblies?

Also the control yoke shafts and central control column/T-bar/chain
drive assembly?

Aren't those all also made of steel in a PA28?

[DavidM]

A proper airplane degausser and flux meter (??) arrived at the shop
from Halifax, and my AME (= IA/A&P) spent the day carefully degaussing
my plane. Everything that could be easily removed, like the steering
rods, was degaussed externally (the mount and main engine had already
been degaussed during overhaul). The main magnetism was on the left
side of the firewall, particularly where there's a steel band for bolts
to attach. Working very carefully (to avoid introducing any new,
opposite magnetism) he worked over it bit by bit, and believes he's got
it all -- at least, a handheld compass in the plane now indicates close
to the correct direction, rather than always north or north-northwest.

Every ferrous part in the plane showed a bit deflection on the meter
before degaussing.


All the best,


David

[zatatime]

On 4 Nov 2005 04:48:20 -0800, "DavidM" >
wrote:

>A proper airplane degausser and flux meter (??) arrived at the shop
>from Halifax, and my AME (= IA/A&P) spent the day carefully degaussing
>my plane. Everything that could be easily removed, like the steering
>rods, was degaussed externally (the mount and main engine had already
>been degaussed during overhaul). The main magnetism was on the left
>side of the firewall, particularly where there's a steel band for bolts
>to attach. Working very carefully (to avoid introducing any new,
>opposite magnetism) he worked over it bit by bit, and believes he's got
>it all -- at least, a handheld compass in the plane now indicates close
>to the correct direction, rather than always north or north-northwest.
>
>Every ferrous part in the plane showed a bit deflection on the meter
>before degaussing.
>
>
>All the best,
>
>
>David


I wish you well, and hope you got it all. Thanks for sharing your
tribulations with this ordeal.

z

[soxinbox]

It doesn't matter how intense the strike was. The metal can only hold a
certain magnetic flux. If you exceed the metals maximum flux then the
degausser will work. The TV degausser was designed to degause iron and
steel, and so it can exceed the maximum magnetic flux of steel. It should
work fine. You can also use an AC motor as a degausser, and a small compass
as a field detector.

The Navy still has a number of degaussing stations in operation. If you can
just convince them to let you park your plane on the deck...

"David Lesher" > wrote in message
...
>
> I strongly doubt a tape degausser will do you much good.
> Likewise a color-TV coil.
>
> You need a lot of field strength to clean [really, re-randomize..]
> structual steel. You also need to be able to get that field where
> it's needed.
>
> Tapes and TV sets are orders of magnitude more subtle than the
> results of a strike.
>
> But feel free to try; just get the compasses well away before you
> start.
> --
> A host is a host from coast to
> & no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
> Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
> is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

[Dave]

Where do you live Dave?

We fly a Warrior (151) out of Fredericton, - was in HFX
last weekend..

Dave


On 4 Nov 2005 04:48:20 -0800, "DavidM" >
wrote:

>A proper airplane degausser and flux meter (??) arrived at the shop
>from Halifax, and my AME (= IA/A&P) spent the day carefully degaussing
>my plane. Everything that could be easily removed, like the steering
>rods, was degaussed externally (the mount and main engine had already
>been degaussed during overhaul). The main magnetism was on the left
>side of the firewall, particularly where there's a steel band for bolts
>to attach. Working very carefully (to avoid introducing any new,
>opposite magnetism) he worked over it bit by bit, and believes he's got
>it all -- at least, a handheld compass in the plane now indicates close
>to the correct direction, rather than always north or north-northwest.
>
>Every ferrous part in the plane showed a bit deflection on the meter
>before degaussing.
>
>
>All the best,
>
>
>David

[DavidM]

Dave wrote:

> We fly a Warrior (151) out of Fredericton, - was in HFX
> last weekend..

I'm based at Ottawa (CYOW), but stopped at Moncton, Port Hawkesbury,
Halifax, and Fredericton as part of a family trip to Cape Breton in
summer 2004 -- it's a beautiful area for flying, especially around the
Bay of Fundy and along the Northumberland Strait. I'd strongly
recommend that any U.S. pilots in New England reading this make the
short flight up there.

This summer, because of the lightning strike, we ended up cancelling
our trip to the Gaspe, along with a few other planned trips.

You guys must have had quite a time early in the summer with all the
problems at Halifax airport. Did you see a lot of diversions into
Fredericton?


All the best,


David

[[email protected]]

>Maybe you should just give up and get a vertical card compass with a
>remote sensor out in a wing tip.

Both Canadian and American law require a nonstabilized magnetic
direction indicator that isn't dependent on the aircraft's electrical
system. The remote systems don't qualify. I wish they did, as the mag
compass can be a real pain to calibrate in any airplane that has
miscellaneous magnetic fields in it.

Dan

[Dave]

Hi Dave!

Your assessment is correct... It was very busy here at YFC,
many diversions to Fredericton and Moncton.

Moncton actually tried to capitalize on it, but the people
here at YFC just tried to help out...

We get a lot of diversions here from HFX and Moncton
anyway, and from Saint John.

Of all these airports, YFC is the only "inland" one...so this
situation is normal, the weather here in Fredericton is usually just
better..

Sorry your trip was cut short...bummer! I have following your
thread with "Warrior" interest.

Ours is a '77 151.. new to us in Aug. Just "learning" our
"new" plane!

Discovered a phone plug in the map pocket 2 weeks ago, with
wire attached!

Previous owner(s) never mentioned it, no documentation. Asked
them..."Thats your audio input to the intercom"

ALRRIGGGHT! Fired up a $49 mp3 player, plugged in the wire and
volia!

last weekend to HFX, 6500 ft over the Bay of fundy, smooooth
air, sun is shining, the Lyc is purring,crew & pax tuning everything
from Meatloaf to Enya.....

Hard to get it any better than that! :)

(Hope Jay reads this! ) hehe...

Hope you Warrior gets better soon!

Dave

On 6 Nov 2005 05:20:00 -0800, "DavidM" >
wrote:

>Dave wrote:
>
>> We fly a Warrior (151) out of Fredericton, - was in HFX
>> last weekend..
>
>I'm based at Ottawa (CYOW), but stopped at Moncton, Port Hawkesbury,
>Halifax, and Fredericton as part of a family trip to Cape Breton in
>summer 2004 -- it's a beautiful area for flying, especially around the
>Bay of Fundy and along the Northumberland Strait. I'd strongly
>recommend that any U.S. pilots in New England reading this make the
>short flight up there.
>
>This summer, because of the lightning strike, we ended up cancelling
>our trip to the Gaspe, along with a few other planned trips.
>
>You guys must have had quite a time early in the summer with all the
>problems at Halifax airport. Did you see a lot of diversions into
>Fredericton?
>
>
>All the best,
>
>
>David

[DL]

"soxinbox" > wrote in message
.. .
> It doesn't matter how intense the strike was. The metal can only hold a
> certain magnetic flux. If you exceed the metals maximum flux then the
> degausser will work. The TV degausser was designed to degause iron and
> steel, and so it can exceed the maximum magnetic flux of steel. It should
> work fine. You can also use an AC motor as a degausser, and a small
> compass as a field detector.
- snip -

I'm really curious. How does one go about using "an AC motor as a
degausser"? Not doubting - would like to know something about the technique
for doing that.

DL

[soxinbox]

An AC motor works by rotating an AC magnetic field around a rotor, thus any
AC motor is generating an AC magnetic field. You can use it to degauss
something by placing the energized motor close to the object and slowly
pulling the motor away. Basically this is how all degaussing equipment
works, only some equipment decreases the field electronically, and some
decreases the field by increasing the distance from the object.

"DL" > wrote in message
k.net...
> "soxinbox" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> It doesn't matter how intense the strike was. The metal can only hold a
>> certain magnetic flux. If you exceed the metals maximum flux then the
>> degausser will work. The TV degausser was designed to degause iron and
>> steel, and so it can exceed the maximum magnetic flux of steel. It should
>> work fine. You can also use an AC motor as a degausser, and a small
>> compass as a field detector.
> - snip -
>
> I'm really curious. How does one go about using "an AC motor as a
> degausser"? Not doubting - would like to know something about the
> technique for doing that.
>
> DL
>