Re: XMRadio Satellite Weather Has Arrived

[Richard Kaplan]

"Peter R." > wrote in message
ds.com...

> IMO, a satellite based weather product, such as WSI or XMRadio, seems to
> be the superior choice except for the display option, which is either a
> laptop or PDA that adds loose wires and equipment to a cramped cockpit.

I agree the "clutter factor" is an issue with a laptop or PDA in the
cockpit.

On the other hand, the fact that the XMRadio product has a portable antenna
and thus will work in your car, on the hotel porch, etc. when out of town is
an attractive option. And of course for renters portability is the only
option. And for instructors like me who teach in multiple airplanes besides
my own, portability is a nice option even if it does mean dealing with
"laptop clutter."

But better than all this, realize that both WSI and XMRadio plan to "soon"
release panel-mount versions of their hardware to work with certified
MFDs... considering the cost of that type of installation, it might very
well be worth it to experiment with both these systems in their portable
form to figure out which one you want as the installed panel-mount version
later on. You could probably later sell the portable versions on Ebay and
recover a good deal of the money.

--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Peter R.]

Richard Kaplan wrote:

> But better than all this, realize that both WSI and XMRadio plan to "soon"
> release panel-mount versions of their hardware to work with certified
> MFDs...

Sadly, I have had a few WSI sales people tell me that their weather
product will probably never interface with the B/K MFD, as B/K is not
releasing their MFD specs to WSI. These folks speculated that the
reason for this is that B/K is purposely reducing the number of uplinked
weather solutions on their MFD to one; their own package.

When it's your ball and your field, you are allowed to make up your own
rules. :(

--
Peter

[Dan Luke]

"Peter R." wrote:
> Sadly, I have had a few WSI sales people tell me that their weather
> product will probably never interface with the B/K MFD, as B/K is not
> releasing their MFD specs to WSI. These folks speculated that the
> reason for this is that B/K is purposely reducing the number of uplinked
> weather solutions on their MFD to one; their own package.
>
> When it's your ball and your field, you are allowed to make up your own
> rules. :(

Might be sad for aircraft owners, but BK would be foolish to do otherwise.
BK is investing in ground uplink stations all over the US - why should they
help owners go to the competition?
--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

[Richard Kaplan]

"Dan Luke" > wrote in message
...


> Might be sad for aircraft owners, but BK would be foolish to do otherwise.
> BK is investing in ground uplink stations all over the US - why should
they
> help owners go to the competition?

They should help owners go to the competition in order to sell MFDs.

This is exactly analogous to the situation years ago when personal computers
were evolving and open platform systems prospered due to 3rd party software
and hardware, while proprietary computer systems eventually became extinct.

Or to put it another way, BK is on a path to become the avionics equivalent
of Macintosh computers.

The whole idea of investing in an MFD should be to have confidence that
future avionics devices will interface with it. If BK treats its MFD as
proprietary and useful only with other BK products, then they have given
aircraft owners a major reason to be fearful of buying their MFD and
becoming locked into only BK produ]\

--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Richard Kaplan]

"Ryan Ferguson" > wrote in message
...

> What are you using to display the weather? Laptop? PDA? If PDA, which
> one?

I am using an XP-based laptop. I have not gotten to try it on a PDA yet
(that would be another version of the program), although I was told verbally
that the PDA version will not be able to support all of the features -- no
surprise, since the laptop-based software requires 350MB free hard drive
space and they recommend at least an 850 MHz Pentium.

As far as WeatherWorx vs. Palm VIIx, I think the people who will pay
$49/month for WeatherWorx and deal with the wiring clutter are people who
use their airplanes fairly often for practical IFR travel. I think other
people will stick with the simplicity, compactness, and economic advantages
of the Palm VIIx. They each have their advantage. To hook up Weatherworx,
you need to set up the computer, satellite receiver, and XMRadio box,
certainly not something you could/would do on the fly in the air. The
advantage of WeatherWorx is that once this is all set up, it updates
automatically during the flight so it is a lot less distracting. The
advantage of the Palm VIIx is that it can just sit in the side pocket of
your airplane and you can turn it on basically on a whim if you see
unexpected weather. On top of that, the Palm VIIx runs on just 2 AAA
batteries, vs. WeatherWorx which requires either a freshly charged
laptop/PDA battery or else a connection to the airplane's cigarette lighter
power source.


--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Jeff Doran]

Richard, thank you for posting the info on the xmradio weatherworx. I,
like many, have been searching for reliable in-cockpit weather
solutions. The closest thing to affordibility so far has been anywhere
wx from control vision, but even that is a bit pricey, and a rats nest
of wires. I use the Palm i705, and you just can't beat it for
portability and cost. However, as reliable as it is, even in flight,
there are too many times, when I just didnt get a signal or reply when
making an inflight weather request from CBAV or TurboWX.
For that past month, I have been using a poormans version of the
control vision solution...
Globalstar SAT phone, $595 list/$495 with rebate/$395 reconditioned
Ipaq H3635 pocket pc, on ebay for $100 (or any pocket pc), you can
even hook to your i705 and switch back and forth between the wireless
palm network and the SAT connection. I prefer the higher resolution
and color on the Ipaq for maps.
Globalstar data cable, $69;
IPAQ Serial Cable (not a hotsync cable, they are not the same) $20;
SAT phone is $35/month and .99/minute with 30 included min/month, or
$50/month with 120 minutes/month, .75/minute after that.
Control Visions deal is $25/month, first 100 mins free, then .99/min
after that.
A wide range of service plans to fit both budget and use.

(I do not work for any SAT phone company or aviation product company)

Data comes down at 9.6Kbps,plus I can make reliable, consistant voice
calls in flight.
I have not had any problem aquiring and holding a SAT signal in
flight, as long as the antenna is held reasonbly close to a window.
The glare shield is fine.
Admittedly, this is a request/reply setup, and I typically use
weathertap.com and flighbrief.com for inflight weather. Not that it is
very useful or fast, I can browse the web in flight, including pop3
email, etc etc...

The result is, I am juggling only a PDA, a short cable, and the sat
phone. Not Bad.

Did you ever notice how big and cumbersome even the smallest laptops
are when in the cockpit? Screen visibility in sunlight is another
concern.

About the only thing I see that XMradio has to offer is its
"broadcast" technology, and (I assume) greater bandwidth...not that
these are bad things.

BTW, I have a Delco Xmradio mounted on the pedestal of my mooney, with
the low profile antenna hiding on the glare shield...works great...but
I can't listen to Limbaugh.


Jeff Doran
Mooney N1159P ACY

> As far as WeatherWorx vs. Palm VIIx, I think the people who will pay
> $49/month for WeatherWorx and deal with the wiring clutter are people who
> use their airplanes fairly often for practical IFR travel. I think other
> people will stick with the simplicity, compactness, and economic advantages
> of the Palm VIIx. They each have their advantage. To hook up Weatherworx,
> you need to set up the computer, satellite receiver, and XMRadio box,
> certainly not something you could/would do on the fly in the air. The
> advantage of WeatherWorx is that once this is all set up, it updates
> automatically during the flight so it is a lot less distracting. The
> advantage of the Palm VIIx is that it can just sit in the side pocket of
> your airplane and you can turn it on basically on a whim if you see
> unexpected weather. On top of that, the Palm VIIx runs on just 2 AAA
> batteries, vs. WeatherWorx which requires either a freshly charged
> laptop/PDA battery or else a connection to the airplane's cigarette lighter
> power source.

[Richard Kaplan]

"Jeff Doran" > wrote in message
m...


> Did you ever notice how big and cumbersome even the smallest laptops
> are when in the cockpit? Screen visibility in sunlight is another
> concern.

Yes, I am somewhat concerned about that, but I know a pilot whom I have
worked with for recurrent training who swears by the WSI In Flight system
with a laptop and he says it is not inconvenient at all.. we'll see in a
month or two after some more pilots (include myself) get a bunch of
practical experience using XMRadio in the air. Maybe one of the RAM
computer mounts will be an option. Also XMRadio is supposed to support
PDAs, but we will have to see the details re: how well that works and what
features it can support on a PDA.


> About the only thing I see that XMRadio has to offer is its
> "broadcast" technology, and (I assume) greater bandwidth...not that
> these are bad things.

I think the "broadcast" technology advantage is immense since this allows
5-minute updates without having to worry about cost.

I think the automatic aquisition feature of XMRadio is a major advantage
over the satellite phone setup you describe -- I have tried that myself and
decided that logging onto the Internet in-flight and making regular requests
for weather was just too much of a distraction in any sort of weather where
I really wanted the datalink information... Here with WxWorx once everything
is set up on the ground it updates the signal automatically and should not
require any pilot input at all.



--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Richard Kaplan]

Just a quick clarification/update as I have had time to test this system
some more and ask a few more questions from the manufacturer:

First of all, the $629 price for the laptop-based WxWorx on Wings system by
Baron Services does not include an additional $30 for the antenna, which
brings the total cost to $659.

Second, the power requirement for the XMRadio receiver is 9VDC; however,
there is a voltage stepdown at the input to the receiver so it will accept
between 9V and 23V and therefore they anticipate it will be compatible with
most aircraft electrical systems.. .this is similar to the situation with
battery-powered GPS devices, which need to accept varying input voltages.
This is particularly important on 24V aircraft electrical systems which have
a stepped down "12V" cigarette lighter output but where this "12V" may vary
depending on the impedance of the connected device.

Next, the PDA version of their system will be sold by a separate company
called NavAiir. The PDA version apparently will be demonstrated at Oshkosh
but will not be for sale for 2-3 more weeks. It will cost $999 without the
PDA and is recommended to run on newer/faster PDAs only. It will use the
same weather data as the Weatherworx/Baron Services laptop-based system.

So my conclusions/plans are:

1. Clearly there is quite a web of companies working with XMRadio to produce
weather datalink systems; it may be hard to sort out the various
relationships and there may well be new products and new companies formed
over time.

2. Both the laptop and the PDA versions of the various XMRadio weather
datalink products will clearly be memory/processor intensive and may not
work with laptops or PDAs more than 1-2 years old - read the specs carefully


3. I am convinced that the quality of the data is well worth it in a GA
cockpit, though I am concerned about the practicality of the various wires
and power connections in the cockpit. I think what I will do for myself is
to use the laptop-based version of the WxWorx system, buy a couple of A/C
inverters at Wamart with rechargable batteries, and try to put together my
own "weather datalink briefcase" which will contain my laptop computer, A/C
inverters, XMRadio receiver, and assorted wires; this should then work in
the airplane or the car (for learning purposes as I drive through
thunderstorms) or anywhere else... the ultimate "nerd bag" for a
weaher-addicted pilot. If anyone else does something like this, shared
details would be helpful.


--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Richard Kaplan]

See these sites for updated info re: the laptop and PDA versions of WxWorx:

http://www.wxworx.com

http://www.airgator.com/Weather.htm


--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Nathan Young]

"Richard Kaplan" > wrote in message news:<d108be18406396d73f7173e630ed03bd@TeraNews>...
> See these sites for updated info re: the laptop and PDA versions of WxWorx:
>
> http://www.wxworx.com
>
> http://www.airgator.com/Weather.htm

Richard,

Do you know if the WxWorx software has provisions to accept an NMEA
GPS input from a serial port? It would be nice to see the weather
displayed track-up and relative to present position.

-Nathan

[David Lesher]

"Richard Kaplan" > writes:


>3. I am convinced that the quality of the data is well worth it in a GA
>cockpit, though I am concerned about the practicality of the various wires
>and power connections in the cockpit. I think what I will do for myself is
>to use the laptop-based version of the WxWorx system, buy a couple of A/C
>inverters at Wamart with rechargable batteries, and try to put together my
>own "weather datalink briefcase" which will contain my laptop computer, A/C
>inverters, XMRadio receiver, and assorted wires; this should then work in
>the airplane or the car (for learning purposes as I drive through
>thunderstorms) or anywhere else... the ultimate "nerd bag" for a
>weaher-addicted pilot. If anyone else does something like this, shared
>details would be helpful.


Errr.. what exactly are you trying to run from AC?

My point being, if you have a laptop to run, you want a straight
DC-DC adapter to power it. Radios Hack sells same, (All I see now
is #273-1867, but there are others I think) as do various laptop
speciality houses. They typically come with a mating plug for your
laptop that not-so-incidently programs the output voltage.

With such, everything should run off the aircraft. You could add
a 2-4 AhH gelcell for independence, but that will build your
arm muscles..
--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

[Richard Kaplan]

"David Lesher" > wrote in message
...

> Errr.. what exactly are you trying to run from AC?

Yes, you are correct... that would be better.. I do not have a cigarette
lighter adapter for my laptop but it would certainly be easier to buy that
then to deal with an A/C inverter.. the A/C inverter was suggsed by the
WeatherWorx engineer but as I thought about it you are correc it makes do
sense to go from D/C to A/C and then D/C with all the complexity involved.

--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Richard Kaplan]

"Nathan Young" > wrote in message
om...
> Do you know if the WxWorx software has provisions to accept an NMEA
> GPS input from a serial port? It would be nice to see the weather
> displayed track-up and relative to present position.

Yes, it does indeed have this provision.. that is an extra $100 or so as a
software feature. For most handheld GPS systems you can use the NMEA/serial
cable you normally use to update your GPS database.

--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Richard Kaplan]

An update re: the PDA version of Weatherworx (see www.navair.com) :

While I am extremely impressed with the laptop version (www.wxworx.com), I
saw the PDA version and I am not impressed. I find it difficult to get
enough data in range on the PDA to be useful for strategic purposes. In the
best case it would require a lot of button pressing or stylus work on the
PDA in-fligh to keep track of weather.

With the laptop version (which is cheaper than the PDA version by the way),
it is possible to get enough data on the screen so that you never need to
press any buttons or do any other adjustments.. set up the wires and
software before flight and then just look over to the laptop in-flight to
get updates each 5 minutes with no extra pilot workload whatsoever.. this is
really nice.

There are also two features on the laptop version which in many ways exceed
the abilities of expensive MFD-type weather datalink systems. First, it is
possible to click on any portion of the radar image and get an exact readout
of intensity from 0dB to 75dB; this is much better than the typical 6 VIP
levels we currently use in interpreting radar data.. .this could really help
to decide weather to fly in level 3 precip; there is a big difference
between 25dB weather and 50dB weather and anywhere in between. Second, it
is possible to click on the precip tops image at any point and get a readout
of the cloud tops at that particular point... these are very powerful
features to help interpret a radar image, and these features are not even in
$10K to $15K panel-mount weather datalink systems.

The only real downside to the WeatherWorx system is the wiring; I am going
to try to work out a briefcase with a large DC power supply which is totally
self-contained; I could then use this also in the car driving through
thunderstorms or precip to get a sense of what the radar images are telling
me.

Finally, WeatherWorx has said verbally at Oshkosh that later in the year
they are planning a reduced price subscription which will be "substantially
less than $49 per month" and which will include METARs, TAFs, and Nexrad but
not echo tops or lightnight or other advanced features.

--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Richard Kaplan]

"Ryan Ferguson" > wrote in message
...

> This would be a compelling reason for me to upgrade to a full-featured new
> color PDA if it works well. My Palm VIIx is still pumping out the budget
> wx, though.


See www.navair.com for details on the PDA product -- I tried it and am not
impressed; it is hard to get enough data on the screen for strategic weather
and there would be a lot of button/stylus work in-flight to use it
practically.

I think the laptop version (www.wxworx.com) is much more usable in flight.



--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Nathan Young]

Thanks. Now I just wish they would answer my email about
availability, pricing, and where to order.

-Nathan


"Richard Kaplan" > wrote in message news:<527867a3e5debdcaa47a43662d41a518@TeraNews>...
> "Nathan Young" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Do you know if the WxWorx software has provisions to accept an NMEA
> > GPS input from a serial port? It would be nice to see the weather
> > displayed track-up and relative to present position.
>
> Yes, it does indeed have this provision.. that is an extra $100 or so as a
> software feature. For most handheld GPS systems you can use the NMEA/serial
> cable you normally use to update your GPS database.

[Viperdoc]

I'm not sure I understand the discussion on DC voltage converters. I
currently have XM radio in my 28v plane, but the radio runs on 6 volts, so I
use an inverter to connect to the AC plug. Is it possible to get a 28v
cigarette lighter adaptor to cut the voltage to 6 volts directly? It would
be nice to eliminate the inverter.

The XM radio works great in the plane- CD quality stereo sound and over 100
channels with no drop outs in reception. It connected directly to my stereo
input.

Regarding weather, I'm waiting for Garmin to come up with an effective
interface with their 430/530, which is what they plan for the 1000. It'll
make the GDL 49 look like something from the stone age. The iPAQ/PC/GPS
combinations take a lot of wires and connections, as seen at OSH. Even the
Garmin reps admit that the GDL 49 left a lot to be desired.

How about satellite radio and real time weather all displayed on a Garmin
430/530 (the antennas are the same)?

[Casey Wilson]

"Viperdoc" > wrote in message
...
> I'm not sure I understand the discussion on DC voltage converters. I
> currently have XM radio in my 28v plane, but the radio runs on 6 volts, so
I
> use an inverter to connect to the AC plug. Is it possible to get a 28v
> cigarette lighter adaptor to cut the voltage to 6 volts directly? It would
> be nice to eliminate the inverter.

I'm not sure you will find one on the market. If you wanted to build it
yourself, you need to know the current flow in milliamperes (or amps) used
by the radio. That may be written on the ID plate or in the unit's specs.
For illustration, let's presume it is 150 milliamps. The supply voltage is
28 (actually closer to 32 without a load) so you need to drop 22 volts in a
resistor. You can calculate the required resistance by dividing the voltage
to drop (22) by the current flow (0.150) = 146.67 ohms. Round it up to 150.
Since it is going to dissipate energy in the form of heat, you need to know
the wattage or the product of current and voltage = 3.3 Watts. To be on the
safe side, you need to at least double that to 6.6 and round up to 10W. The
next safety feature would be an in-line fuse, but that's optional since you
can yank the connector out of the lighter socket.
Cut one of the pair of wires coming out of the connector and put the
10W, 150 ohm resistor in series. The typical night-light for the kid's
bedroom is 7.5W. Stick your finger up against one that has been on for a
couple of minutes and imagine about half that heat. That's what the
resistor is going to heat up to. The point is, keep your fingers off of it
when it's plugged in. Oh, that reminds me, don't wrap it up in foam -- the
heat needs to dissipate.

[Tarver Engineering]

"Ray Andraka" > wrote in message
...
> I wouldn't do it with just a dropping resistor. The current on the data
plate
> is typically the maximum current. Additionally, if you look at the
current over
> time you'll likely find that it fluctuates rapidly, especially in a
digital
> radio like the XM radio. Instead, your cable needs a voltage regulator.
This
> can be as simple as a zener diode and a resistor if the power dissipated
is
> small. A better regulator would be one that uses a switching regulator as
a
> DC-DC converter. You can get switching regulator modules with 28v input
and one
> of a variety of output voltages from a number of vendors. I'm sure
Digikey has
> a few of these modules. You'd have to add a case, wires, a fuse and
connectors.

I use Datel DC-DC converters in current avionics designs.

Your other option is to add a zener diode to the simple resistor circuit,
but now I am out in Jim Weir land and I will now retreat. (run away:)

> Casey Wilson wrote:
>
> > "Viperdoc" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > I'm not sure I understand the discussion on DC voltage converters. I
> > > currently have XM radio in my 28v plane, but the radio runs on 6
volts, so
> > I
> > > use an inverter to connect to the AC plug. Is it possible to get a 28v
> > > cigarette lighter adaptor to cut the voltage to 6 volts directly? It
would
> > > be nice to eliminate the inverter.
> >
> > I'm not sure you will find one on the market. If you wanted to
build it
> > yourself, you need to know the current flow in milliamperes (or amps)
used
> > by the radio. That may be written on the ID plate or in the unit's
specs.
> > For illustration, let's presume it is 150 milliamps. The supply voltage
is
> > 28 (actually closer to 32 without a load) so you need to drop 22 volts
in a
> > resistor. You can calculate the required resistance by dividing the
voltage
> > to drop (22) by the current flow (0.150) = 146.67 ohms. Round it up to
150.
> > Since it is going to dissipate energy in the form of heat, you need to
know
> > the wattage or the product of current and voltage = 3.3 Watts. To be on
the
> > safe side, you need to at least double that to 6.6 and round up to 10W.
The
> > next safety feature would be an in-line fuse, but that's optional since
you
> > can yank the connector out of the lighter socket.
> > Cut one of the pair of wires coming out of the connector and put the
> > 10W, 150 ohm resistor in series. The typical night-light for the kid's
> > bedroom is 7.5W. Stick your finger up against one that has been on for a
> > couple of minutes and imagine about half that heat. That's what the
> > resistor is going to heat up to. The point is, keep your fingers off of
it
> > when it's plugged in. Oh, that reminds me, don't wrap it up in foam --
the
> > heat needs to dissipate.
>
> --
> --Ray Andraka, P.E.
> President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
> 401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
> email
> http://www.andraka.com
>
> "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
> temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
> -Benjamin Franklin, 1759
>
>

[Morgans]

"Richard Kaplan" > wrote
>
> I bought at Oshkosh ($49) a rechargeable 12V battery with 7 Amp-hour
> endurance and a cigarette lighter adaptor output. This can easily run my
> laptop computer, XMRadio receiver, and GPS for way longer than my
airpalne's
> endurance. It is one more thing to carry around, but this also makes the
> devices completely portable and ends any worry I might have about
impedance
> matching when connecting devices to my airplane's cigarette lighter
adaptor.
>
> --
> Richard Kaplan, CFII
>
> www.flyimc.com
>
>
> You got ripped off. You can get a 7 amp hour battery from Tower Hobbies
(RC supplier) for 20 bucks. Those jumper packs for cars also serve the same
purpose, for less money.

I like your idea, just not the implementation! <g>
--
---Jim in NC---

[Viperdoc]

Went to Radio Shack last night and asked if they had a DC-DC converter for
24V-6V. I was told by the somewhat surly person behind the counter that they
didn't exist. However, I also needed a 12V-6V converter (a spare for the
car), and upon reading the package, it said: INPUT VOLTAGE 12-24 VOLTS!

So, it looks like the Radio Shack unit should work anyway, which would be
great since it would eliminate carrying an extra battery, making my own
unit, or using an invertors. Anything that means one less cord and two less
connections is a positive move in my opinion.

The XM radio works great in the cockpit as well as at home. The sound is at
least CD quality and the unit and antenna are small. The reception was also
perfect. I'm waiting for a panel mount that will also encompass the weather
data that interfaces with MFD's.

[Richard Kaplan]

"Morgans" <post/the/group.here.net> wrote in message
...

>You got ripped off. You can get a 7 amp hour battery from Tower Hobbies
> (RC supplier) for 20 bucks. Those jumper packs for cars also serve the
same
> purpose, for less money.

Where can I get this on their website? Even a smaller battery without the
charger included costs $50 or so as far as I can see:

http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXE559&P=7

--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Morgans]

Even a smaller battery without the
> charger included costs $50 or so as far as I can see:
>
> http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXE559&P=7
>
> --
> Richard Kaplan, CFII
>
> www.flyimc.com

Try this. For the charger, walmart has a peak sensing 1.5 amp maintainer
charger for under 15 bucks.
http:towerhobbies//www2..com/cgi-bin/wti0095p?FVPROFIL=++&FVSEARCH=TG3388

[Morgans]

"Morgans" <post/the/group.here.net> wrote in message
...
> Even a smaller battery without the
> > charger included costs $50 or so as far as I can see:
> >
> > http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXE559&P=7
> >
> > --
> > Richard Kaplan, CFII
> >
> > www.flyimc.com
>
> Try this. For the charger, walmart has a peak sensing 1.5 amp maintainer
> charger for under 15 bucks.
> http:towerhobbies//www2..com/cgi-bin/wti0095p?FVPROFIL=++&FVSEARCH=TG3388

Try again
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0095p?FVPROFIL=++&FVSEARCH=TG3388

--
---Jim in NC---

[Richard Kaplan]

"Morgans" <post/the/group.here.net> wrote in message
...

> Looook again. 33 bucks for TWO 7 amp/hr batteries. :-)

Fair enough... my mistake.

However the Hobbico website indicates the battery weighs 5.25 pounds and the
one I bought weighs 3 pounds and is smaller than the dimensions listed on
the Hobbico site... the goal at least for me is to fit this all into a
reasonable portable briefcase or carrying case.

Nonetheless, I agree with the idea that a hobby shop can be a relatively
cheap place to get portable battery supplies.. Thanks.

--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Lenny Sawyer]

When can we buy the XM unit? I have sent email and used the web based
form on their site, and no response... Any ideas???

Lenny Sawyer

Richard Kaplan wrote:
> "Peter R." > wrote in message
> ds.com...
>
>
>>IMO, a satellite based weather product, such as WSI or XMRadio, seems to
>>be the superior choice except for the display option, which is either a
>>laptop or PDA that adds loose wires and equipment to a cramped cockpit.
>
>
> I agree the "clutter factor" is an issue with a laptop or PDA in the
> cockpit.
>
> On the other hand, the fact that the XMRadio product has a portable antenna
> and thus will work in your car, on the hotel porch, etc. when out of town is
> an attractive option. And of course for renters portability is the only
> option. And for instructors like me who teach in multiple airplanes besides
> my own, portability is a nice option even if it does mean dealing with
> "laptop clutter."
>
> But better than all this, realize that both WSI and XMRadio plan to "soon"
> release panel-mount versions of their hardware to work with certified
> MFDs... considering the cost of that type of installation, it might very
> well be worth it to experiment with both these systems in their portable
> form to figure out which one you want as the installed panel-mount version
> later on. You could probably later sell the portable versions on Ebay and
> recover a good deal of the money.
>



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[Richard Kaplan]

"Lenny Sawyer" > wrote in message
...

> When can we buy the XM unit? I have sent email and used the web based
> form on their site, and no response... Any ideas???

Call Baron Services/WxWorx at 256-881-8811 or 321-751-9202
--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[David Lesher]

"Richard Kaplan" > writes:


>However the Hobbico website indicates the battery weighs 5.25 pounds and the
>one I bought weighs 3 pounds and is smaller than the dimensions listed on
>the Hobbico site... the goal at least for me is to fit this all into a
>reasonable portable briefcase or carrying case.

>Nonetheless, I agree with the idea that a hobby shop can be a relatively
>cheap place to get portable battery supplies.. Thanks.

A) Brand X Gel-Cells [tm] battery is going to weigh the same as
Brand Y, iffen they have the same Ah-H capacity. Same with size.
[But there are different form factors.] In short, they are going to
be more alike than different.

B) There are lots of places to buy Gel-Cells [tm] and some are going
to be far better than others. I don't buy enough to have scoped out
the best deals, but some locales have speciality battery dealers.
An alarm company WILL pay very little themselves, but have a big
markeup.

You can find many suppliers on-line, including Digi-Key; but watch
out for shipping; lead is heavy.


--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

This may be a dumb question (it sounds like all of the replies to this
thread have been far more tech-savvy than I) but is the antenna that the xm
radio system uses specific? Why couldn't you wire their receiver into an
existing gps antenna (fixed or portable)?
Are different satellite receivers able to share an antenna? If I understand
their ad, the premium service uses the same antenna but adds a gps module to
give specific mapping data. It sounds like this is a sharing arrangement
since the gps satellites and "rock" and "roll" are obviously distinct. What
if you already have a gps (portable or panel mounted) Is the premium service
able to use the signal from that? Frank
"Jeff Doran" > wrote in message
m...
> Richard, thank you for posting the info on the xmradio weatherworx. I,
> like many, have been searching for reliable in-cockpit weather
> solutions. The closest thing to affordibility so far has been anywhere
> wx from control vision, but even that is a bit pricey, and a rats nest
> of wires. I use the Palm i705, and you just can't beat it for
> portability and cost. However, as reliable as it is, even in flight,
> there are too many times, when I just didnt get a signal or reply when
> making an inflight weather request from CBAV or TurboWX.
> For that past month, I have been using a poormans version of the
> control vision solution...
> Globalstar SAT phone, $595 list/$495 with rebate/$395 reconditioned
> Ipaq H3635 pocket pc, on ebay for $100 (or any pocket pc), you can
> even hook to your i705 and switch back and forth between the wireless
> palm network and the SAT connection. I prefer the higher resolution
> and color on the Ipaq for maps.
> Globalstar data cable, $69;
> IPAQ Serial Cable (not a hotsync cable, they are not the same) $20;
> SAT phone is $35/month and .99/minute with 30 included min/month, or
> $50/month with 120 minutes/month, .75/minute after that.
> Control Visions deal is $25/month, first 100 mins free, then .99/min
> after that.
> A wide range of service plans to fit both budget and use.
>
> (I do not work for any SAT phone company or aviation product company)
>
> Data comes down at 9.6Kbps,plus I can make reliable, consistant voice
> calls in flight.
> I have not had any problem aquiring and holding a SAT signal in
> flight, as long as the antenna is held reasonbly close to a window.
> The glare shield is fine.
> Admittedly, this is a request/reply setup, and I typically use
> weathertap.com and flighbrief.com for inflight weather. Not that it is
> very useful or fast, I can browse the web in flight, including pop3
> email, etc etc...
>
> The result is, I am juggling only a PDA, a short cable, and the sat
> phone. Not Bad.
>
> Did you ever notice how big and cumbersome even the smallest laptops
> are when in the cockpit? Screen visibility in sunlight is another
> concern.
>
> About the only thing I see that XMradio has to offer is its
> "broadcast" technology, and (I assume) greater bandwidth...not that
> these are bad things.
>
> BTW, I have a Delco Xmradio mounted on the pedestal of my mooney, with
> the low profile antenna hiding on the glare shield...works great...but
> I can't listen to Limbaugh.
>
>
> Jeff Doran
> Mooney N1159P ACY
>
> > As far as WeatherWorx vs. Palm VIIx, I think the people who will pay
> > $49/month for WeatherWorx and deal with the wiring clutter are people
who
> > use their airplanes fairly often for practical IFR travel. I think
other
> > people will stick with the simplicity, compactness, and economic
advantages
> > of the Palm VIIx. They each have their advantage. To hook up
Weatherworx,
> > you need to set up the computer, satellite receiver, and XMRadio box,
> > certainly not something you could/would do on the fly in the air. The
> > advantage of WeatherWorx is that once this is all set up, it updates
> > automatically during the flight so it is a lot less distracting. The
> > advantage of the Palm VIIx is that it can just sit in the side pocket of
> > your airplane and you can turn it on basically on a whim if you see
> > unexpected weather. On top of that, the Palm VIIx runs on just 2 AAA
> > batteries, vs. WeatherWorx which requires either a freshly charged
> > laptop/PDA battery or else a connection to the airplane's cigarette
lighter
> > power source.

[Richard Kaplan]

> wrote in message
...

> This may be a dumb question (it sounds like all of the replies to this
> thread have been far more tech-savvy than I) but is the antenna that the
xm
> radio system uses specific? Why couldn't you wire their receiver into an
> existing gps antenna (fixed or portable)?

The XM Radio antenna is looking for one geosynchronous satellite; it is not
looking for the 12 GPS satellites. Perhaps it would work with a GPS
antenna, perhaps not; at the very least that would require modifying the
antenna connectors since the XM Radio antenna has a connection different
from any GPS antennas I have seen.

As far as GPS inputs for moving map navigation, you can use any GPS with an
NMEA output; that includes a lot of handheld GPS units.

--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

[Newps]

Richard Kaplan wrote:

> The XM Radio antenna is looking for one geosynchronous satellite; it is not
> looking for the 12 GPS satellites.

The antenna isn't "looking" for anything. It merely sits there and
catches what flies by. The receiver is what is looking for specific
things. If the frequencies are close a gps antenna might work.