LA Basin Preferred Routes?

[Dane Spearing]

In a couple of weeks, I'll be flying from SNA (Santa Ana/John Wayne, CA) up to
the Bay Area (Palo Alto, CA), and was wondering if there is any way to plan
or know in advance which departure SoCal is likely to give me.

In looking at the SNA SIDs, a logical choice seems to be the Anaheim Three
Departure for VTU (ANAHM3.VTU). However, what appears to be logical to the
departing pilot is not always what is logical to SoCal Approach. :)

The route I'm thinking of flying is:

KSNA AHAHM3.VTU V485 SJC KPAO

Anyone from the LA Basin who has departed from SNA northwest bound have
any insight? Should I just file the SID that I'm interested in, and hope that
I get it?

-- Dane

[[email protected]]

Dane Spearing wrote:
> In a couple of weeks, I'll be flying from SNA (Santa Ana/John Wayne, CA) up to
> the Bay Area (Palo Alto, CA), and was wondering if there is any way to plan
> or know in advance which departure SoCal is likely to give me.

Since nobody's biting, I'll give you my 2 cents. Its been a while (18
months or so) since I last flew between those airports IFR. I don't
recall the exact details, but I think I filed and they took me via Van
Nuys, Gorman and Avenal or something like that. I don't recall flying
a particular SID, just that we departed effectively on a right 45 (off
of rwy 19R) then they took us to a wide right downwind during vectors
to VNY. But the route you propose sounds decent enough to me. I've
taken V485 plenty of times and that works well for getting to PAO.

So what's up with John Wayne departure control? I seem to remember
having to talk to them for a bit between John Wayne tower and SOCAL
approach/departure control (on a different flight, though, seem to
remember being VFR then). Are they running a mini-approach control
from within the tower there? Is that the future of the system: after
consolidating all the TRACONs into big super-approach controls, small
individual approach controls will sprout up again from each tower?

Peter

[Dane Spearing]

In article . com>,
> wrote:
>So what's up with John Wayne departure control? I seem to remember
>having to talk to them for a bit between John Wayne tower and SOCAL
>approach/departure control (on a different flight, though, seem to
>remember being VFR then). Are they running a mini-approach control
>from within the tower there? Is that the future of the system: after
>consolidating all the TRACONs into big super-approach controls, small
>individual approach controls will sprout up again from each tower?

Every time I've departed SNA, either IFR or VFR, I've always been
handed off first to John Wayne departure, and then to SoCal. I'm
not based out of SNA, so I don't know the details, but it's been that
way for the past 7 or so years that I've been flying in and out of there
(about 3-4 times per year). It does seem a bit strange though, doesn't it.
It's like there is an extra layer in the ATC system.

-- Dane

[Ron Garret]

In article . com>,
wrote:

> Dane Spearing wrote:
> > In a couple of weeks, I'll be flying from SNA (Santa Ana/John Wayne, CA) up
> > to
> > the Bay Area (Palo Alto, CA), and was wondering if there is any way to plan
> > or know in advance which departure SoCal is likely to give me.
>
> Since nobody's biting, I'll give you my 2 cents.

Here's an idea: file a flight plan with your preferred routing (don't
pick a SID, just file your preferred waypoints, or file direct). Then
call up SNA clearance delivery on the phone and ask for your clearance.
Your actual routing on the day you do fly is very likely to be the same.
Wait half an hour, and then call them back to tell them that you've
decided to postpone your flight until another day.

rg

Y'All,
I have found that reliance on ATC to get the most economic route out of
the LA Basin is a lost cause. Personally, I like to go tower en route in
smaller bites as direct as I can. It avoids the larger program designed to
fly the little guy around the basin.

Once yoiu are on your wayjust keep asking for amendments. From
Bakersfield or Santa Barbara lthe tower enroute system is a piece of cake.

Supposedly, every facility has a specialist called an 'expediter' who can
get
you what you want. I used it once and all the way through the basin the ATC
guys kept asking me how I was able to get where I was. Seems that
they did not get my kind of hand-off into their space. It seemed to be an
arrival from an unexpected direction and at an unusually low altitude.

Gene Whitrt