ATPL student

[Frode Berg]

Today I finally took the plunge and ordered the distance study course
towards the ATPL frozen theory!

I have been wanting this for years, but it's quite a costly thing to start,
so it's taken a while!

I now have 280 hours on my PPL, and looking forward to get my IR rating
maybe next fall!

Can't wait to start studying!!

Frode

[Jim Macklin]

You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours break-downs
to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right away.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

"Frode Berg" > wrote in message
...
| Today I finally took the plunge and ordered the distance
study course
| towards the ATPL frozen theory!
|
| I have been wanting this for years, but it's quite a
costly thing to start,
| so it's taken a while!
|
| I now have 280 hours on my PPL, and looking forward to get
my IR rating
| maybe next fall!
|
| Can't wait to start studying!!
|
| Frode
|
|

[Bob Moore]

Jim Macklin wrote
> You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours break-downs
> to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right away.

Section 61.159: Aeronautical experience: Airplane category rating.
(a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b), (c), and (d) of this section, a
person who is applying for an airline transport pilot certificate with an
airplane category and class rating must have at least 1,500 hours of total
time as a pilot that includes at least:

(1) 500 hours of cross-country flight time.

(2) 100 hours of night flight time.

(3) 75 hours of instrument flight time, in actual or simulated instrument
conditions, subject to the following:

[Jim Macklin]

Yep, I think I switched the 135 PIC IFR time with the ATP.
Any case, with only 280, the OP has plenty of time to study.



"Bob Moore" > wrote in message
. 122...
| Jim Macklin wrote
| > You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours
break-downs
| > to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right away.
|
| Section 61.159: Aeronautical experience: Airplane category
rating.
| (a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b), (c), and (d) of
this section, a
| person who is applying for an airline transport pilot
certificate with an
| airplane category and class rating must have at least
1,500 hours of total
| time as a pilot that includes at least:
|
| (1) 500 hours of cross-country flight time.
|
| (2) 100 hours of night flight time.
|
| (3) 75 hours of instrument flight time, in actual or
simulated instrument
| conditions, subject to the following:
|
|

[Peter Clark]

I didn't know there was such a thing in the US FAR as a "frozen" ATPL?
That combined with the poster's message originating from a service in
Norway lends me to think he's talking JAR.

On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 22:32:40 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
> wrote:

>Yep, I think I switched the 135 PIC IFR time with the ATP.
>Any case, with only 280, the OP has plenty of time to study.
>
>
>
>"Bob Moore" > wrote in message
. 122...
>| Jim Macklin wrote
>| > You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours
>break-downs
>| > to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right away.
>|
>| Section 61.159: Aeronautical experience: Airplane category
>rating.
>| (a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b), (c), and (d) of
>this section, a
>| person who is applying for an airline transport pilot
>certificate with an
>| airplane category and class rating must have at least
>1,500 hours of total
>| time as a pilot that includes at least:
>|
>| (1) 500 hours of cross-country flight time.
>|
>| (2) 100 hours of night flight time.
>|
>| (3) 75 hours of instrument flight time, in actual or
>simulated instrument
>| conditions, subject to the following:
>|
>|
>

[Jim Macklin]

He didn't say, however, ATP ICAO or JAR would seem to
require more than 280 hours, particularly when he doesn't
consider the IR for a year.


"Peter Clark" >
wrote in message
...
|I didn't know there was such a thing in the US FAR as a
"frozen" ATPL?
| That combined with the poster's message originating from a
service in
| Norway lends me to think he's talking JAR.
|
| On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 22:32:40 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
| > wrote:
|
| >Yep, I think I switched the 135 PIC IFR time with the
ATP.
| >Any case, with only 280, the OP has plenty of time to
study.
| >
| >
| >
| >"Bob Moore" > wrote in message
| . 122...
| >| Jim Macklin wrote
| >| > You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours
| >break-downs
| >| > to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right away.
| >|
| >| Section 61.159: Aeronautical experience: Airplane
category
| >rating.
| >| (a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b), (c), and (d)
of
| >this section, a
| >| person who is applying for an airline transport pilot
| >certificate with an
| >| airplane category and class rating must have at least
| >1,500 hours of total
| >| time as a pilot that includes at least:
| >|
| >| (1) 500 hours of cross-country flight time.
| >|
| >| (2) 100 hours of night flight time.
| >|
| >| (3) 75 hours of instrument flight time, in actual or
| >simulated instrument
| >| conditions, subject to the following:
| >|
| >|
| >

[tom418[_1_]]

Years (and I mean years) ago, you needed 1200 hours (within the preceding 8
years) to get an ATP (they were known as ATR certificates then). Is this
what you remembered, Jim?
"Jim Macklin" > wrote in message
news:yVuGg.5676$SZ3.4307@dukeread04...
> Yep, I think I switched the 135 PIC IFR time with the ATP.
> Any case, with only 280, the OP has plenty of time to study.
>
>
>
> "Bob Moore" > wrote in message
> . 122...
> | Jim Macklin wrote
> | > You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours
> break-downs
> | > to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right away.
> |
> | Section 61.159: Aeronautical experience: Airplane category
> rating.
> | (a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b), (c), and (d) of
> this section, a
> | person who is applying for an airline transport pilot
> certificate with an
> | airplane category and class rating must have at least
> 1,500 hours of total
> | time as a pilot that includes at least:
> |
> | (1) 500 hours of cross-country flight time.
> |
> | (2) 100 hours of night flight time.
> |
> | (3) 75 hours of instrument flight time, in actual or
> simulated instrument
> | conditions, subject to the following:
> |
> |
>
>

[Jim Macklin]

Probably, I've had my ATP for a long time. Don't read those
regs daily anymore.



"tom418" > wrote in message
news:0YCGg.217374$k%3.33925@dukeread12...
| Years (and I mean years) ago, you needed 1200 hours
(within the preceding 8
| years) to get an ATP (they were known as ATR certificates
then). Is this
| what you remembered, Jim?
| "Jim Macklin" > wrote
in message
| news:yVuGg.5676$SZ3.4307@dukeread04...
| > Yep, I think I switched the 135 PIC IFR time with the
ATP.
| > Any case, with only 280, the OP has plenty of time to
study.
| >
| >
| >
| > "Bob Moore" > wrote in message
| > . 122...
| > | Jim Macklin wrote
| > | > You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours
| > break-downs
| > | > to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right away.
| > |
| > | Section 61.159: Aeronautical experience: Airplane
category
| > rating.
| > | (a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b), (c), and (d)
of
| > this section, a
| > | person who is applying for an airline transport pilot
| > certificate with an
| > | airplane category and class rating must have at least
| > 1,500 hours of total
| > | time as a pilot that includes at least:
| > |
| > | (1) 500 hours of cross-country flight time.
| > |
| > | (2) 100 hours of night flight time.
| > |
| > | (3) 75 hours of instrument flight time, in actual or
| > simulated instrument
| > | conditions, subject to the following:
| > |
| > |
| >
| >
|
|

[tom418[_1_]]

Actually, reading a copy of the TERPS provides relief from insomnia :)
"Jim Macklin" > wrote in message
news:gzDGg.5696$SZ3.2865@dukeread04...
> Probably, I've had my ATP for a long time. Don't read those
> regs daily anymore.
>
>
>
> "tom418" > wrote in message
> news:0YCGg.217374$k%3.33925@dukeread12...
> | Years (and I mean years) ago, you needed 1200 hours
> (within the preceding 8
> | years) to get an ATP (they were known as ATR certificates
> then). Is this
> | what you remembered, Jim?
> | "Jim Macklin" > wrote
> in message
> | news:yVuGg.5676$SZ3.4307@dukeread04...
> | > Yep, I think I switched the 135 PIC IFR time with the
> ATP.
> | > Any case, with only 280, the OP has plenty of time to
> study.
> | >
> | >
> | >
> | > "Bob Moore" > wrote in message
> | > . 122...
> | > | Jim Macklin wrote
> | > | > You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours
> | > break-downs
> | > | > to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right away.
> | > |
> | > | Section 61.159: Aeronautical experience: Airplane
> category
> | > rating.
> | > | (a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b), (c), and (d)
> of
> | > this section, a
> | > | person who is applying for an airline transport pilot
> | > certificate with an
> | > | airplane category and class rating must have at least
> | > 1,500 hours of total
> | > | time as a pilot that includes at least:
> | > |
> | > | (1) 500 hours of cross-country flight time.
> | > |
> | > | (2) 100 hours of night flight time.
> | > |
> | > | (3) 75 hours of instrument flight time, in actual or
> | > simulated instrument
> | > | conditions, subject to the following:
> | > |
> | > |
> | >
> | >
> |
> |
>
>

[Jim Macklin]

When I was working full-time as a pilot, I was both chief
flight instructor for the school and director of operations
for the charter department. I was also flying all the
single and multiengine Beech planes on charter, Bonanza,
Baron, including the 58TC and P Baron, all the King Air 90s
and the 200 and 300 King Air. made for a lot of business
with the FSDO taking proficiency tests.

I watched Jack Webb in DRAGNET as a kid and noticed how he'd
arrest somebody and say,"You're under arrest for violation
of {and he's quote some California law}." I decided that
was a neat idea so I memorized Part 61 and 91 by number,
paragraph and sub-paragraph. So when some FAA Inspector
would ask me about some procedure, I'd ay, that's 91.32 or
61.187, and before I actually had to give the answer they'd
give up and move on to another question. It worked wonders
and was even a source of entertainment at the FSDO with the
new inspectors.

But then they restructured part 91 and made it logical, but
the numbers were all different and it just wasn't worth the
trouble.

Then I had to forget control zones and airport traffic areas
and learn Class A,B,C,D,E and G.

And I have to remember birthdays, anniversaries, passwords,
account logins, software update schedules, HTML tags, and
how much water works best with the new rice.

It is actually fun to try.


"tom418" > wrote in message
news:FXGGg.219382$k%3.112275@dukeread12...
| Actually, reading a copy of the TERPS provides relief from
insomnia :)
| "Jim Macklin" > wrote
in message
| news:gzDGg.5696$SZ3.2865@dukeread04...
| > Probably, I've had my ATP for a long time. Don't read
those
| > regs daily anymore.
| >
| >
| >
| > "tom418" > wrote in
message
| > news:0YCGg.217374$k%3.33925@dukeread12...
| > | Years (and I mean years) ago, you needed 1200 hours
| > (within the preceding 8
| > | years) to get an ATP (they were known as ATR
certificates
| > then). Is this
| > | what you remembered, Jim?
| > | "Jim Macklin" >
wrote
| > in message
| > | news:yVuGg.5676$SZ3.4307@dukeread04...
| > | > Yep, I think I switched the 135 PIC IFR time with
the
| > ATP.
| > | > Any case, with only 280, the OP has plenty of time
to
| > study.
| > | >
| > | >
| > | >
| > | > "Bob Moore" > wrote in
message
| > | >
. 122...
| > | > | Jim Macklin wrote
| > | > | > You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours
| > | > break-downs
| > | > | > to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right
away.
| > | > |
| > | > | Section 61.159: Aeronautical experience: Airplane
| > category
| > | > rating.
| > | > | (a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b), (c), and
(d)
| > of
| > | > this section, a
| > | > | person who is applying for an airline transport
pilot
| > | > certificate with an
| > | > | airplane category and class rating must have at
least
| > | > 1,500 hours of total
| > | > | time as a pilot that includes at least:
| > | > |
| > | > | (1) 500 hours of cross-country flight time.
| > | > |
| > | > | (2) 100 hours of night flight time.
| > | > |
| > | > | (3) 75 hours of instrument flight time, in actual
or
| > | > simulated instrument
| > | > | conditions, subject to the following:
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | >
| > |
| > |
| >
| >
|
|

[Peter Clark]

Thus the "frozen" thing. Basically AIUI, you pass the written but
don't meet any other requirements of holding an ATP (including
practical and hours). Seems like it could be up there in the list of
pointless pieces of paper one could striving to be waving around, but
since I don't know JAR/ICAO stuff I could be wrong about it's
significance.

On Tue, 22 Aug 2006 06:30:13 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
> wrote:

>He didn't say, however, ATP ICAO or JAR would seem to
>require more than 280 hours, particularly when he doesn't
>consider the IR for a year.
>
>
>"Peter Clark" >
>wrote in message
...
>|I didn't know there was such a thing in the US FAR as a
>"frozen" ATPL?
>| That combined with the poster's message originating from a
>service in
>| Norway lends me to think he's talking JAR.
>|
>| On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 22:32:40 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
>| > wrote:
>|
>| >Yep, I think I switched the 135 PIC IFR time with the
>ATP.
>| >Any case, with only 280, the OP has plenty of time to
>study.
>| >
>| >
>| >
>| >"Bob Moore" > wrote in message
>| . 122...
>| >| Jim Macklin wrote
>| >| > You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours
>| >break-downs
>| >| > to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right away.
>| >|
>| >| Section 61.159: Aeronautical experience: Airplane
>category
>| >rating.
>| >| (a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b), (c), and (d)
>of
>| >this section, a
>| >| person who is applying for an airline transport pilot
>| >certificate with an
>| >| airplane category and class rating must have at least
>| >1,500 hours of total
>| >| time as a pilot that includes at least:
>| >|
>| >| (1) 500 hours of cross-country flight time.
>| >|
>| >| (2) 100 hours of night flight time.
>| >|
>| >| (3) 75 hours of instrument flight time, in actual or
>| >simulated instrument
>| >| conditions, subject to the following:
>| >|
>| >|
>| >
>

[N4865G]

Gents,

Frozen ATPL is purely JAR licence required to fly commercially in
Europe.
It relates to passing the theory part of the rating.
You still need to have your Commercial, IR, etc. but chances of getting
a flying job without one are marginal.
ATPL gets 'unfrozen' passing 1500TT flight time.

Cheers

Dom

Peter Clark napisal(a):
> Thus the "frozen" thing. Basically AIUI, you pass the written but
> don't meet any other requirements of holding an ATP (including
> practical and hours). Seems like it could be up there in the list of
> pointless pieces of paper one could striving to be waving around, but
> since I don't know JAR/ICAO stuff I could be wrong about it's
> significance.
>
> On Tue, 22 Aug 2006 06:30:13 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
> > wrote:
>
> >He didn't say, however, ATP ICAO or JAR would seem to
> >require more than 280 hours, particularly when he doesn't
> >consider the IR for a year.
> >
> >
> >"Peter Clark" >
> >wrote in message
> ...
> >|I didn't know there was such a thing in the US FAR as a
> >"frozen" ATPL?
> >| That combined with the poster's message originating from a
> >service in
> >| Norway lends me to think he's talking JAR.
> >|
> >| On Mon, 21 Aug 2006 22:32:40 -0500, "Jim Macklin"
> >| > wrote:
> >|
> >| >Yep, I think I switched the 135 PIC IFR time with the
> >ATP.
> >| >Any case, with only 280, the OP has plenty of time to
> >study.
> >| >
> >| >
> >| >
> >| >"Bob Moore" > wrote in message
> >| . 122...
> >| >| Jim Macklin wrote
> >| >| > You have to have 1200 hours with specific hours
> >| >break-downs
> >| >| > to take the ATP [USA] you can do the IR right away.
> >| >|
> >| >| Section 61.159: Aeronautical experience: Airplane
> >category
> >| >rating.
> >| >| (a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b), (c), and (d)
> >of
> >| >this section, a
> >| >| person who is applying for an airline transport pilot
> >| >certificate with an
> >| >| airplane category and class rating must have at least
> >| >1,500 hours of total
> >| >| time as a pilot that includes at least:
> >| >|
> >| >| (1) 500 hours of cross-country flight time.
> >| >|
> >| >| (2) 100 hours of night flight time.
> >| >|
> >| >| (3) 75 hours of instrument flight time, in actual or
> >| >simulated instrument
> >| >| conditions, subject to the following:
> >| >|
> >| >|
> >| >
> >

[Frode Berg]

"N4865G" ...
> Gents,
>
> Frozen ATPL is purely JAR licence required to fly commercially in
> Europe.
> It relates to passing the theory part of the rating.
> You still need to have your Commercial, IR, etc. but chances of getting
> a flying job without one are marginal.
> ATPL gets 'unfrozen' passing 1500TT flight time.
>
> Cheers
>
> Dom
>


Hi!

What I meant but described poorly, is that I have started the ATPL theory,
which includes the IR and CPL theory.
I have to pass the IR theory before getting my IR rating, and en Europe if I
later found out I wanted to get a CPL or ATPL (in ove 1000 hours time, I
know...) I would have to take the entire course one more time, as there are
currently no stepping stones up from the IR to the CPL. At least not here in
Norway. Maybe different in other Europe countries.
Anyway, the IR part is the major part of the CPL and ATPL theory anyhow, so
it kind of makes sense to do the whole thing if you don't rule out any
chance of wanting to pursuit the other ratings later.

Anyway, just excited I have finally actually started my IR rating (and
getting the theory done towards the other ones at the same time!)

:-)

Frode

[TMG]

In Europe (or any JAA country) almost any new IR student does his ATPL
theory first. There is so little difference between a full ATPL course and a
IR-only theory course that most do the full ATPL. If you get your IR rating
your ATPL theory no longer expires, so you are set to continue to CPL and
eventually ATPL.

It does make IR ratings unnecesarily complex though (compared to FAA IR)

TMG


"Frode Berg" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> "N4865G" ...
> > Gents,
> >
> > Frozen ATPL is purely JAR licence required to fly commercially in
> > Europe.
> > It relates to passing the theory part of the rating.
> > You still need to have your Commercial, IR, etc. but chances of getting
> > a flying job without one are marginal.
> > ATPL gets 'unfrozen' passing 1500TT flight time.
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Dom
> >
>
>
> Hi!
>
> What I meant but described poorly, is that I have started the ATPL theory,
> which includes the IR and CPL theory.
> I have to pass the IR theory before getting my IR rating, and en Europe if
I
> later found out I wanted to get a CPL or ATPL (in ove 1000 hours time, I
> know...) I would have to take the entire course one more time, as there
are
> currently no stepping stones up from the IR to the CPL. At least not here
in
> Norway. Maybe different in other Europe countries.
> Anyway, the IR part is the major part of the CPL and ATPL theory anyhow,
so
> it kind of makes sense to do the whole thing if you don't rule out any
> chance of wanting to pursuit the other ratings later.
>
> Anyway, just excited I have finally actually started my IR rating (and
> getting the theory done towards the other ones at the same time!)
>
> :-)
>
> Frode
>
>