RV-8 What happened?

[Lady Pilot]

Inhofe's Plane Experiences Problems After Landing

POSTED: 12:12 am CDT October 6, 2006
UPDATED: 12:31 pm CDT October 6, 2006

TULSA, Okla. -- A single-engine plane piloted by Sen. Jim Inhofe spun around
after landing at a Tulsa airport, authorities said Thursday.

Neither Inhofe, R-Okla., an experienced flyer, nor his spokesman, Danny
Finnerty, were hurt in the incident, which Finnerty described as "pretty
minor."

Inhofe and Finnerty were returning from a stop in Duncan in southwestern
Oklahoma around 7:55 p.m. when Inhofe's RV-8 prop plane came in for what
seemed to be a smooth landing at Riverside Airport, Finnerty said.

"Everything was as it should be," he said. "Upon landing, everything was
fine before the tail wheel touched down on the pavement. At that point, the
plane got a little squirrely and fishtailed a little."

Roland Herwig, a spokesman for the Federal Aviation Administration in
Oklahoma City, said a preliminary inquiry found that the plane spun around
briefly upon landing.

Finnerty said Inhofe thinks there may have been a problem with the plane's
rudder.

The plane is old-fashioned, with two wheels in the front and one in the
back, Finnerty said.

Any clues?

LP

[Ron Wanttaja]

On Fri, 6 Oct 2006 22:17:54 -0500, "Lady Pilot" > wrote:

> "Roland Herwig, a spokesman for the Federal Aviation Administration in
> Oklahoma City, said a preliminary inquiry found that the plane spun around
> briefly upon landing.
>
> "Finnerty said Inhofe thinks there may have been a problem with the plane's
> rudder.
>
> "The plane is old-fashioned, with two wheels in the front and one in the
> back, Finnerty said."
>
> Any clues?

Could be human error, could be mechanical error. The Senator wouldn't be the
first pilot to lose control while landing a taildragger.

As for potential mechanical causes, could be a jammed brake, could be a problem
with the tailwheel itself. We had a Maule at a local airport lose one of the
links that connected the tailwheel to the rudder, a month or two back.
Depending on how the tailwheel control is set up, this could cause the tailwheel
to turn sharply.

Ron Wanttaja

[Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe]

"Lady Pilot" > wrote in message
news:F%EVg.2323$fl.2292@dukeread08...
> Inhofe's Plane Experiences Problems After Landing
>
> POSTED: 12:12 am CDT October 6, 2006
> UPDATED: 12:31 pm CDT October 6, 2006
>
> TULSA, Okla. -- A single-engine plane piloted by Sen. Jim Inhofe spun
> around
> after landing at a Tulsa airport, authorities said Thursday.
>
Ground loops happen.

A taildragger is dynamically unstable because the center of mass is behind
the main gear - get it a little sideways and it wants to continue around all
the way. Perhaps it was the end of a long day and the pilot got a little
behind the aircraft, or..., or... or...

It's kind like parallel parking - some people seem to have a hard time with
it.

Why does something like this even make the paper?




--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.

[Mark Hickey]

"Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe" <The Sea Hawk at wow way d0t com> wrote:

>A taildragger is dynamically unstable because the center of mass is behind
>the main gear

Any rear-steer vehicle is inherently unstable, regardless of COG/M
(think "forklift"), more due to the effect on the direction of the
rear wheel as the vehicle turns (essentially, a positive feedback
loop).

>- get it a little sideways and it wants to continue around all
>the way. Perhaps it was the end of a long day and the pilot got a little
>behind the aircraft, or..., or... or...

I think you left out a couple "ors"... ;-)

>It's kind like parallel parking - some people seem to have a hard time with
>it.

Great example!

>Why does something like this even make the paper?

It's the political silly season. If it comes out that a senator
overcooks his pasta, you'll read about it.

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $795 ti frame

[Peter Dohm]

"Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe" <The Sea Hawk at wow way d0t com> wrote in message
news:IM6dnWZ4Jq0eALrYnZ2dnUVZ_uudnZ2d@wideopenwest .com...
> "Lady Pilot" > wrote in message
> news:F%EVg.2323$fl.2292@dukeread08...
> > Inhofe's Plane Experiences Problems After Landing
> >
> > POSTED: 12:12 am CDT October 6, 2006
> > UPDATED: 12:31 pm CDT October 6, 2006
> >
> > TULSA, Okla. -- A single-engine plane piloted by Sen. Jim Inhofe spun
> > around
> > after landing at a Tulsa airport, authorities said Thursday.
> >
> Ground loops happen.
>
> A taildragger is dynamically unstable because the center of mass is behind
> the main gear - get it a little sideways and it wants to continue around
all
> the way. Perhaps it was the end of a long day and the pilot got a little
> behind the aircraft, or..., or... or...
>
> It's kind like parallel parking - some people seem to have a hard time
with
> it.
>
> Why does something like this even make the paper?
>
>
>
>
> --
> Geoff
> The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
> remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
> When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.
>
>
There is a tendency for greater interest, and sometimes greater
investivation, when a VIP has been on board.

Sometimes that makes good sense, and other times it can be a waste of
effort--like reading the tabloids at the grocery check-out line.

Peter

[Peter Dohm]

"Ron Wanttaja" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 6 Oct 2006 22:17:54 -0500, "Lady Pilot" >
wrote:
>
> > "Roland Herwig, a spokesman for the Federal Aviation Administration in
> > Oklahoma City, said a preliminary inquiry found that the plane spun
around
> > briefly upon landing.
> >
> > "Finnerty said Inhofe thinks there may have been a problem with the
plane's
> > rudder.
> >
> > "The plane is old-fashioned, with two wheels in the front and one in the
> > back, Finnerty said."
> >
> > Any clues?
>
> Could be human error, could be mechanical error. The Senator wouldn't be
the
> first pilot to lose control while landing a taildragger.
>
> As for potential mechanical causes, could be a jammed brake, could be a
problem
> with the tailwheel itself. We had a Maule at a local airport lose one of
the
> links that connected the tailwheel to the rudder, a month or two back.
> Depending on how the tailwheel control is set up, this could cause the
tailwheel
> to turn sharply.
>
> Ron Wanttaja

The same has happened down my way.

Tension springs can simply defy inspection--especially on a pre-flight.

Peter

[John Kunkel]

"Lady Pilot" > wrote in message
news:F%EVg.2323$fl.2292@dukeread08...
> Inhofe's Plane Experiences Problems After Landing
>
>
> Finnerty said Inhofe thinks there may have been a problem with the plane's
> rudder.

Of course the rudder was at fault, would one expect a politician to admit
they could be at fault?

[Bill Daniels]

Nothing was wrong. The Senator just wanted a very fast 360 degree view of
the airport from runway level.


"John Kunkel" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> "Lady Pilot" > wrote in message
> news:F%EVg.2323$fl.2292@dukeread08...
>> Inhofe's Plane Experiences Problems After Landing
>>
>>
>> Finnerty said Inhofe thinks there may have been a problem with the
>> plane's
>> rudder.
>
> Of course the rudder was at fault, would one expect a politician to admit
> they could be at fault?
>

[Lady Pilot]

"Ron Wanttaja" wrote:
> On Fri, 6 Oct 2006 22:17:54 -0500, "Lady Pilot" wrote:
>
>> "Roland Herwig, a spokesman for the Federal Aviation Administration in
>> Oklahoma City, said a preliminary inquiry found that the plane spun
>> around
>> briefly upon landing.

True! :-)
>>
>> "Finnerty said Inhofe thinks there may have been a problem with the
>> plane's
>> rudder.

I agree now...

>>
>> "The plane is old-fashioned, with two wheels in the front and one in the
>> back, Finnerty said."
>>
>> Any clues?
>
> Could be human error, could be mechanical error. The Senator wouldn't be
> the
> first pilot to lose control while landing a taildragger.

Ah, this isn't the first time, or second....if my memory serves me
correctly! ;-)

>
> As for potential mechanical causes, could be a jammed brake, could be a
> problem
> with the tailwheel itself.

Thanks,...confirms what I've be thinking... but you *never know*

> We had a Maule at a local airport lose one of the
> links that connected the tailwheel to the rudder, a month or two back.
> Depending on how the tailwheel control is set up, this could cause the
> tailwheel
> to turn sharply.
>
Not the norm...I'm sure! Sorry I haven't answered sooner...<major crisis>

LP

> Ron Wanttaja

[Lady Pilot]

"Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe" wrote:
> "Lady Pilot" > wrote:
>> Inhofe's Plane Experiences Problems After Landing
>>
>> POSTED: 12:12 am CDT October 6, 2006
>> UPDATED: 12:31 pm CDT October 6, 2006
>>
>> TULSA, Okla. -- A single-engine plane piloted by Sen. Jim Inhofe spun
>> around
>> after landing at a Tulsa airport, authorities said Thursday.
>>
> Ground loops happen.

Of course...I've owned 3 Beech 18 tail draggers...

>
> A taildragger is dynamically unstable because the center of mass is behind
> the main gear -

Are you an aerodynamics engineer? ;-) Many pilots around the world are
"effiencient" in training by a professional.


> get it a little sideways and it wants to continue around all the way.
> Perhaps it was the end of a long day and the pilot got a little behind the
> aircraft, or..., or... or...

Or....where are you? heheeheeeee

LP
>
> It's kind like parallel parking - some people seem to have a hard time
> with it.
>
> Why does something like this even make the paper?
>
>
> >
> --
> Geoff
> The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
> remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
> When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.
>

[Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe]

"Lady Pilot" > wrote in message
news:vdYXg.6100$fl.417@dukeread08...
>
> "Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe" wrote:
>> "Lady Pilot" > wrote:
>>> Inhofe's Plane Experiences Problems After Landing
>>>
>>> POSTED: 12:12 am CDT October 6, 2006
>>> UPDATED: 12:31 pm CDT October 6, 2006
>>>
>>> TULSA, Okla. -- A single-engine plane piloted by Sen. Jim Inhofe spun
>>> around
>>> after landing at a Tulsa airport, authorities said Thursday.
>>>
>> Ground loops happen.
>
> Of course...I've owned 3 Beech 18 tail draggers...

Cool. I've always wanted to fly one of those.
Learned to fly in a C-120, but I'm so rusty nowadays that my brother doesn't
let me handle his T-18 or his "Pitts" on the ground.

>
>>
>> A taildragger is dynamically unstable because the center of mass is
>> behind the main gear -
>
> Are you an aerodynamics engineer? ;-) Many pilots around the world are
> "effiencient" in training by a professional.
>

B.S. Mechanical Engineering, M.S. Electronics and Computer Controlled
Systems.
My brother is the one with degrees in Aero engineering.

>
>> get it a little sideways and it wants to continue around all the way.
>> Perhaps it was the end of a long day and the pilot got a little behind
>> the aircraft, or..., or... or...
>
> Or....where are you? heheeheeeee
>

Yea.

--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.

[Roger (K8RI)]

On Sat, 7 Oct 2006 09:24:16 -0400, "Peter Dohm"
> wrote:

>"Ron Wanttaja" > wrote in message
...
>> On Fri, 6 Oct 2006 22:17:54 -0500, "Lady Pilot" >
>wrote:
>>
>> > "Roland Herwig, a spokesman for the Federal Aviation Administration in
>> > Oklahoma City, said a preliminary inquiry found that the plane spun
>around
>> > briefly upon landing.
>> >
>> > "Finnerty said Inhofe thinks there may have been a problem with the
>plane's
>> > rudder.
>> >
>> > "The plane is old-fashioned, with two wheels in the front and one in the
>> > back, Finnerty said."
>> >
>> > Any clues?
>>
>> Could be human error, could be mechanical error. The Senator wouldn't be
>the
>> first pilot to lose control while landing a taildragger.
>>
>> As for potential mechanical causes, could be a jammed brake, could be a
>problem
>> with the tailwheel itself. We had a Maule at a local airport lose one of
>the
>> links that connected the tailwheel to the rudder, a month or two back.
>> Depending on how the tailwheel control is set up, this could cause the
>tailwheel
>> to turn sharply.
>>
>> Ron Wanttaja
>
>The same has happened down my way.
>
>Tension springs can simply defy inspection--especially on a pre-flight.

We had one throw a spring here at 3BS on take off last summer or the
summer before. It shook but he already had rudder control. Other
than the pilot being a bit apprehensive on landing (he wasn't sure
what had happened but had a good idea). The landing was uneventful.
When he came to a stop they found the one spring hanging loose. I
don't think they found a reason for it coming off as it had plenty of
tension.


>
>Peter
>
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com