Flying through the Atlantic Seaboard

[xyzzy]

I am considering taking a flight from central North Carolina to Cape
Cod in late March of this year. Up until all of my flying has been in
the Southeast, with IAD being as far north as I've ventured.

Playing with the AOPA planner the route looks pretty interesting -- go
just east of the DC ADIZ, then over Delaware and New Jersey (prolly
with a fuel stop in Millville or thereabouts) and then directly over
LGA, then arc (sort of) along the coast to Cape Cod. Can a C-172
actually get an IFR flight on a route like that (I'm thinking about
9000 feet), or should multiple reroutes be expected from ATC? Is
there a routing through that area that is preferred by controllers for
the small fry? Better or worse times to go through that area? I plan
to file IFR even if the weather is severe clear. For obvious reasons
I'd rather not take the overwater route to the east, but if I go west I
make the trip a lot longer.

(btw the actual route I'm looking at is: MOATS V155 MANGE V157 ENO
KMIV [prolly fuel stop here] RBV V123 LGA V475 PVD V167 PEAKE --
I know it can probably be cleaned up a little but that's the general
idea)

Any advice from veterans of this area would be appreciated!

[Judah]

"xyzzy" > wrote in news:1169760531.861168.105800
@k78g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

> I am considering taking a flight from central North Carolina to Cape
> Cod in late March of this year. Up until all of my flying has been in
> the Southeast, with IAD being as far north as I've ventured.
>
> Playing with the AOPA planner the route looks pretty interesting -- go
> just east of the DC ADIZ, then over Delaware and New Jersey (prolly
> with a fuel stop in Millville or thereabouts) and then directly over
> LGA, then arc (sort of) along the coast to Cape Cod. Can a C-172
> actually get an IFR flight on a route like that (I'm thinking about
> 9000 feet), or should multiple reroutes be expected from ATC? Is
> there a routing through that area that is preferred by controllers for
> the small fry? Better or worse times to go through that area? I plan
> to file IFR even if the weather is severe clear. For obvious reasons
> I'd rather not take the overwater route to the east, but if I go west I
> make the trip a lot longer.
>
> (btw the actual route I'm looking at is: MOATS V155 MANGE V157 ENO
> KMIV [prolly fuel stop here] RBV V123 LGA V475 PVD V167 PEAKE --
> I know it can probably be cleaned up a little but that's the general
> idea)
>
> Any advice from veterans of this area would be appreciated!


Although they may not refuse your routing if the weather is good, they will
probably fly you over JFK, not LGA... AOPA's planner comes up with

VCN V16 ORW V475 PVD V167 PEAKE

And I'm inclined to believe that's more likely. I'm from HPN, so I
typically hit JFK and make my way up toward there coming in from the south,
or never make it to JFK coming in from the east.

Also, 9,000 will probably be fine. You can probably go lower if you want
over NYC area, but they probably won't let you below 7,000 or 6,000 on the
return flight. The handoffs in and out of NYC airspace are at that altitude
or higher.

Other than that, Nothing happens.

[Rich Badaracco]

The routing you've picked up to MIV should be ok. Coming out of MIV
expect the Leeah 3 departure over CYN and then V1 over JFK and DPK at
7000. Be prepared for numerous reroutes around NYC though.
Rich Badaracco
Director - Angel Flight North Carolina

xyzzy wrote:
> > (btw the actual route I'm looking at is: MOATS V155 MANGE V157 ENO
> KMIV [prolly fuel stop here] RBV V123 LGA V475 PVD V167 PEAKE --
> I know it can probably be cleaned up a little but that's the general
> idea)
>
> Any advice from veterans of this area would be appreciated!
>

[Ray Andraka]

xyzzy wrote:
> I am considering taking a flight from central North Carolina to Cape
> Cod in late March of this year. Up until all of my flying has been in
> the Southeast, with IAD being as far north as I've ventured.
>
> Playing with the AOPA planner the route looks pretty interesting -- go
> just east of the DC ADIZ, then over Delaware and New Jersey (prolly
> with a fuel stop in Millville or thereabouts) and then directly over
> LGA, then arc (sort of) along the coast to Cape Cod. Can a C-172
> actually get an IFR flight on a route like that (I'm thinking about
> 9000 feet), or should multiple reroutes be expected from ATC? Is
> there a routing through that area that is preferred by controllers for
> the small fry? Better or worse times to go through that area? I plan
> to file IFR even if the weather is severe clear. For obvious reasons
> I'd rather not take the overwater route to the east, but if I go west I
> make the trip a lot longer.
>
> (btw the actual route I'm looking at is: MOATS V155 MANGE V157 ENO
> KMIV [prolly fuel stop here] RBV V123 LGA V475 PVD V167 PEAKE --
> I know it can probably be cleaned up a little but that's the general
> idea)
>
> Any advice from veterans of this area would be appreciated!
>
If you file 9000' you are going to get the over-water route via MANTA
intersection, which is about 30 miles offshore. File at either 5000 or
7000' for V16 JFK V229 BDR V475. That's what you'll get if you want to
go over NY city IFR.

Returning, you'll only get V16 at 6000', which takes you across LI sound
near the RI-CT border, then down LI over JFK and across the Raritan Bay.

Your only other choices are either the over-water route, or the long way
around via Lake Henry VOR.

[Ray Andraka]

Ray Andraka wrote:


>>
>> Any advice from veterans of this area would be appreciated!
>>
> If you file 9000' you are going to get the over-water route via MANTA
> intersection, which is about 30 miles offshore. File at either 5000 or
> 7000' for V16 JFK V229 BDR V475. That's what you'll get if you want to
> go over NY city IFR.
>
> Returning, you'll only get V16 at 6000', which takes you across LI sound
> near the RI-CT border, then down LI over JFK and across the Raritan Bay.
>
> Your only other choices are either the over-water route, or the long way
> around via Lake Henry VOR.

I should add that I fly fairly frequently between PVD and Maryland. If
you file something else, you'll get the above routing if you filed 5000
to 7000 feet. If you file lower, you'll get Lancaster - LHY (I forget
the airway number, V93?), V58 HFD. If you file higher, you'll get the
over-water routing via MANTA.

NY departure will often move you up to 7000 if you are at 5 or down to 5
if you are at 7, usually via McGuire approach. They will usually give
you direct Madison when you are near the dogleg in V229. You will not
normally get V16 going North after JFK.

Coming southbound, you will only get 6000' on V16. If you ask for
another altitude, they'll tell you it's 6000 or you take the long way
around, period. Doesn't matter even if you are picking up ice (they may
let you up to 8000 for a bit, but will tell you that they need you back
down at 6 after deer park, and that if you need to stay at 8 they'll
need to send you around the long way, BTDT)

NY departure is usually pretty busy during day and evening hours, but it
isn't bad as long as you are paying attention. IIRC, McGuire will give
you to NY Approach on 124.75 right around DIXIE intersection, then
you'll get 135.9 near the JFK VOR, and then 133.1 as you approach the
dogleg in V229. McGuire Approach can be a real "treat" to work with.
Keep on your toes with them. You'll be talking to McGuire from just
before you get to the Coyle VOR until just past DIXIE.

[pgbnh]

Done Northern New England (MHT vicinity) to/from mid-New Jersey a lot. I
have done it both vfr and ifr. I would suggest that if the weather is good,
consider making the passage through the NY Class B VFR. If you are stopping
at Millville, you can go VFR up the coast, cross from Sandy Hook direct JFK,
then go either the length of Long Island or cross to BDR then Providence and
a right turn to MVY. NY Controllers are great, but that is VERY busy
airspace. If IFR you may get directed to places you do not want to be.
"xyzzy" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>I am considering taking a flight from central North Carolina to Cape
> Cod in late March of this year. Up until all of my flying has been in
> the Southeast, with IAD being as far north as I've ventured.
>
> Playing with the AOPA planner the route looks pretty interesting -- go
> just east of the DC ADIZ, then over Delaware and New Jersey (prolly
> with a fuel stop in Millville or thereabouts) and then directly over
> LGA, then arc (sort of) along the coast to Cape Cod. Can a C-172
> actually get an IFR flight on a route like that (I'm thinking about
> 9000 feet), or should multiple reroutes be expected from ATC? Is
> there a routing through that area that is preferred by controllers for
> the small fry? Better or worse times to go through that area? I plan
> to file IFR even if the weather is severe clear. For obvious reasons
> I'd rather not take the overwater route to the east, but if I go west I
> make the trip a lot longer.
>
> (btw the actual route I'm looking at is: MOATS V155 MANGE V157 ENO
> KMIV [prolly fuel stop here] RBV V123 LGA V475 PVD V167 PEAKE --
> I know it can probably be cleaned up a little but that's the general
> idea)
>
> Any advice from veterans of this area would be appreciated!
>

[Robert Chambers]

Don't accept V44 it's way far out over open water. I was given it on
the ground at Milville for a return trip to CT and I refused it. They
call it the shark route.

Robert

Judah wrote:
> "xyzzy" > wrote in news:1169760531.861168.105800
> @k78g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
>
>
>>I am considering taking a flight from central North Carolina to Cape
>>Cod in late March of this year. Up until all of my flying has been in
>>the Southeast, with IAD being as far north as I've ventured.
>>
>>Playing with the AOPA planner the route looks pretty interesting -- go
>>just east of the DC ADIZ, then over Delaware and New Jersey (prolly
>>with a fuel stop in Millville or thereabouts) and then directly over
>>LGA, then arc (sort of) along the coast to Cape Cod. Can a C-172
>>actually get an IFR flight on a route like that (I'm thinking about
>>9000 feet), or should multiple reroutes be expected from ATC? Is
>>there a routing through that area that is preferred by controllers for
>>the small fry? Better or worse times to go through that area? I plan
>>to file IFR even if the weather is severe clear. For obvious reasons
>>I'd rather not take the overwater route to the east, but if I go west I
>>make the trip a lot longer.
>>
>>(btw the actual route I'm looking at is: MOATS V155 MANGE V157 ENO
>>KMIV [prolly fuel stop here] RBV V123 LGA V475 PVD V167 PEAKE --
>>I know it can probably be cleaned up a little but that's the general
>>idea)
>>
>>Any advice from veterans of this area would be appreciated!
>
>
>
> Although they may not refuse your routing if the weather is good, they will
> probably fly you over JFK, not LGA... AOPA's planner comes up with
>
> VCN V16 ORW V475 PVD V167 PEAKE
>
> And I'm inclined to believe that's more likely. I'm from HPN, so I
> typically hit JFK and make my way up toward there coming in from the south,
> or never make it to JFK coming in from the east.
>
> Also, 9,000 will probably be fine. You can probably go lower if you want
> over NYC area, but they probably won't let you below 7,000 or 6,000 on the
> return flight. The handoffs in and out of NYC airspace are at that altitude
> or higher.
>
> Other than that, Nothing happens.

[Robert Chambers]

Don't accept that routing V139 any more than V44 - if they ask, tell
them "I have no life jackets aboard and this is not a seaplane". Twin
engine fine, single engine, manage your risks.

Ray Andraka wrote:
> xyzzy wrote:
>
>> I am considering taking a flight from central North Carolina to Cape
>> Cod in late March of this year. Up until all of my flying has been in
>> the Southeast, with IAD being as far north as I've ventured.
>>
>> Playing with the AOPA planner the route looks pretty interesting -- go
>> just east of the DC ADIZ, then over Delaware and New Jersey (prolly
>> with a fuel stop in Millville or thereabouts) and then directly over
>> LGA, then arc (sort of) along the coast to Cape Cod. Can a C-172
>> actually get an IFR flight on a route like that (I'm thinking about
>> 9000 feet), or should multiple reroutes be expected from ATC? Is
>> there a routing through that area that is preferred by controllers for
>> the small fry? Better or worse times to go through that area? I plan
>> to file IFR even if the weather is severe clear. For obvious reasons
>> I'd rather not take the overwater route to the east, but if I go west I
>> make the trip a lot longer.
>>
>> (btw the actual route I'm looking at is: MOATS V155 MANGE V157 ENO
>> KMIV [prolly fuel stop here] RBV V123 LGA V475 PVD V167 PEAKE --
>> I know it can probably be cleaned up a little but that's the general
>> idea)
>>
>> Any advice from veterans of this area would be appreciated!
>>
> If you file 9000' you are going to get the over-water route via MANTA
> intersection, which is about 30 miles offshore. File at either 5000 or
> 7000' for V16 JFK V229 BDR V475. That's what you'll get if you want to
> go over NY city IFR.
>
> Returning, you'll only get V16 at 6000', which takes you across LI sound
> near the RI-CT border, then down LI over JFK and across the Raritan Bay.
>
> Your only other choices are either the over-water route, or the long way
> around via Lake Henry VOR.