Re: Origin of "aeroplane"

[Geoff May]

The Raven wrote:
> Whilst taking a 2minute break from some mind numbing work I pondered on the
> origin of the word "aeroplane" and it's definition. Interesting word once
> you get passed the now common "plane" equals aircraft.
>
> Initially, aircraft were "flying machines" or "airships" but at some stage
> the word "aeroplane" was arrived at.
>
> "aero" is rather obvious, presumably "of the air". However, "plane" seems an
> unusual choice of word. To "plane" the air? To fly along a "plane" of air? A
> wing "planing" through air?
>
> If "plane" is to "planing" then it would seem logical to assume this is in
> reference to wings "planing the air"
>
> Can anyone point to a defining point in time when the word came into use and
> it's original definition/interpretation?
>
> PS. Does a Fighter plane "plane fighters"? There, now it's on topic for the
> group....... :-)
>
> The Raven

"Plane" comes from the Greek word "planos" which means "wandering".

MfG

Geoff.

--
A Formula One [tm](r)(c) Database is available at http://glibs.ssmmdd.co.uk/

Database will be updated after the French GP

[Jack G]

>
> "Plane" comes from the Greek word "planos" which means "wandering".
>
> MfG
>
> Geoff.

Did you read that somewhere - or do you have actual experience being a
Greek?

Jack

>
> --
> A Formula One [tm](r)(c) Database is available at
http://glibs.ssmmdd.co.uk/
>
> Database will be updated after the French GP
>

[Geoff May]

wrote:
> On Wed, 2 Jul 2003 14:26:00 +1000, "The Raven" >
> wrote:
>
> http://www.etymonline.com
> airplane - 1907, in Amer.Eng. largely superseding earlier aeroplane
> (1873, and still common in British Eng.), from Fr. aéroplane, from Gk.
> aero- "air" + stem of planer "to soar" (see plane (1)). Aircraft is
> also from 1907; airship is 1888, from Ger. Luftschiff "motor-driver
> dirigible."
>
> plane (1) - "flat surface," 1604, from L. plantum "flat surface," from
> neut. of planus "flat, level." The verb meaning "soar, glide on
> motionless wings" is 1410, from M.Fr. planer, from L. planum on notion
> of bird gliding with flattened wings.

Interesting. Slightly different from my dictionary. I do concede that my
dictionary may be in error, though. Personally, I thought it came from
the Greek word but I am not 100% certain of that.

MfG

Geoff.

--
A Formula One [tm](r)(c) Database is available at http://glibs.ssmmdd.co.uk/

Database will be updated after the French GP

[Jack G]

Geoff -

I just thought I'd beat Art to it...

Jack

"Geoff May" > wrote in message
...
> Jack G wrote:
> >>"Plane" comes from the Greek word "planos" which means "wandering".
> >
> > Did you read that somewhere - or do you have actual experience being a
> > Greek?
>
> Nope, I'm not Greek.
>
> I looked it up in my dictionary, "The New Collins Concise English
> Dictionary", but that was to make sure I'd got the right word. I
> remember looking it up at school once and needed to refresh my memory.
>
> MfG
>
> Geoff.
>
> --
> A Formula One [tm](r)(c) Database is available at
http://glibs.ssmmdd.co.uk/
>
> Database will be updated after the French GP
>

[Mary Shafer]

On Wed, 02 Jul 2003 06:51:29 +0200, Geoff May
> wrote:

> "Plane" comes from the Greek word "planos" which means "wandering".

I believe you're thinking of "planet" here. The planets were regarded
as being "wanderers" because they seemed to wander in relation to the
stars.

Mary

--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer

"Turn to kill, not to engage." LCDR Willie Driscoll, USN

[Peter Twydell]

In article >, The Raven
> writes
>Whilst taking a 2minute break from some mind numbing work I pondered on the
>origin of the word "aeroplane" and it's definition. Interesting word once
>you get passed the now common "plane" equals aircraft.
>
>Initially, aircraft were "flying machines" or "airships" but at some stage
>the word "aeroplane" was arrived at.
>
>"aero" is rather obvious, presumably "of the air". However, "plane" seems an
>unusual choice of word. To "plane" the air? To fly along a "plane" of air? A
>wing "planing" through air?
>
>If "plane" is to "planing" then it would seem logical to assume this is in
>reference to wings "planing the air"
>
>Can anyone point to a defining point in time when the word came into use and
>it's original definition/interpretation?
>
>PS. Does a Fighter plane "plane fighters"? There, now it's on topic for the
>group....... :-)
>
Here's a bunch of stuff from the Shorter Oxford English Dictionary:
(the numbers show the century when usage was first noted; M19 = mid
19th, etc.)


aeroplane n. & v. M19. [In sense A.1 f. AERO- + PLANE; in sense A.2 f.
Fr. aéroplane, f. aéro- AERO- + Gk -planos wandering.]

A n. <unknown>
1 An aerofoil. M19-E20.
2 An aircraft that is heavier than air and has fixed (non-rotating)
wings. L19.
B v.i. Fly like or in an aeroplane. E20.


aero- comb. form of Gk aer air. Often spec. w. ref. to aeroplanes and
aviation.


plane E17. [L planum flat surface, use as n. of neut. of planus PLAIN,
introduced in 17 as refash. of PLAIN to express the geometrical and
allied uses (cf. Fr. plan which similarly replaced plain).]

c A relatively thin, flat or slightly curved, usu. movable structure
used to produce an upwards, downwards, or occas. lateral force by the
flow of the surrounding air or water over its surface; an aerofoil, a
hydrofoil; spec. a hydroplane on a submarine. Cf. AEROPLANE E19.

HTH
--
Peter

Ying tong iddle-i po!

[Stuart Chapman]

"The Raven" > wrote in message
...
> Whilst taking a 2minute break from some mind numbing work I pondered on
the
> origin of the word "aeroplane" and it's definition. Interesting word once
> you get passed the now common "plane" equals aircraft.
>
> Initially, aircraft were "flying machines" or "airships" but at some stage
> the word "aeroplane" was arrived at.
>
> "aero" is rather obvious, presumably "of the air". However, "plane" seems
an
> unusual choice of word. To "plane" the air? To fly along a "plane" of air?
A
> wing "planing" through air?
>
> If "plane" is to "planing" then it would seem logical to assume this is in
> reference to wings "planing the air"
>
> Can anyone point to a defining point in time when the word came into use
and
> it's original definition/interpretation?
>
> PS. Does a Fighter plane "plane fighters"? There, now it's on topic for
the
> group....... :-)
>
> The Raven
>
>
>
>

I wonder what the Wright brothers called their machine?

Stupot

[Andrew Chaplin]

Stuart Chapman wrote:
>
> I wonder what the Wright brothers called their machine?

The Wright "Flyer"?
--
Andrew Chaplin
SIT MIHI GLADIUS SICUT SANCTO MARTINO
(If you're going to e-mail me, you'll have to get "yourfinger." out.)

[Cub Driver]

>"aero" is rather obvious, presumably "of the air". However, "plane" seems an
>unusual choice of word. To "plane" the air? To fly along a "plane" of air? A
>wing "planing" through air?

Since the usage is British (and I think "aeroplane" precedes
"airplane") I turn to the Shorter Oxford, which sez:

middle 19th century (!)

from the French (we will have to call it a Freedom Craft, I suppose)

in which language aero means aero :)

and plane is from the Greek planos = wandering


all the best -- Dan Ford (email: info AT danford.net)

see the Warbird's Forum at http://www.danford.net/index.htm
Vietnam | Flying Tigers | Pacific War | Brewster Buffalo | Piper Cub

[Cub Driver]

On Wed, 02 Jul 2003 07:15:11 +0200, Geoff May
> wrote:

>Interesting. Slightly different from my dictionary. I do concede that my
>dictionary may be in error, though. Personally, I thought it came from
>the Greek word but I am not 100% certain of that.

You can be certain. The folks at Oxford University Press agree with
you, and OUP is God.

The Shorter Oxford for meanings and derivations.

Webster's Collegiate for pronunciation, American usage, and the
meaning of new words until the next SOED comes out in about ten years
:)

all the best -- Dan Ford (email: info AT danford.net)

see the Warbird's Forum at http://www.danford.net/index.htm
Vietnam | Flying Tigers | Pacific War | Brewster Buffalo | Piper Cub

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"Stuart Chapman" > wrote in message
...
>
> I wonder what the Wright brothers called their machine?
>

Flyer

[M. J. Powell]

In message >,
writes
>On Wed, 2 Jul 2003 14:26:00 +1000, "The Raven" >
>wrote:
>
>http://www.etymonline.com
>airplane - 1907, in Amer.Eng. largely superseding earlier aeroplane
>(1873, and still common in British Eng.), from Fr. aéroplane, from Gk.
>aero- "air" + stem of planer "to soar" (see plane (1)). Aircraft is
>also from 1907; airship is 1888, from Ger. Luftschiff "motor-driver
>dirigible."
>
>plane (1) - "flat surface," 1604, from L. plantum "flat surface," from
>neut. of planus "flat, level." The verb meaning "soar, glide on
>motionless wings" is 1410, from M.Fr. planer, from L. planum on notion
>of bird gliding with flattened wings.

The French for 'Glider' is 'Planeur'.

Mike
--
M.J.Powell

[Geoff May]

robert arndt wrote:
> Geoff May > wrote in message >...
>
wrote:
>>
>>>[snipped]
>
> The French seem to have formed the word "aero-plane" (1873) from two
> earlier French craft- the Aeronave (1865) concept and the flying model
> aircraft Penaud Planophore (1871). The flying Planophore was the most
> influential design of the 19th century that inspired the great
> aviation pioneers to build a full scale aeroplane/airplane for flight.
>
> Rob
> World Encylopedia of Civil Aviation

I asked on another news group about this one and this was the reply:

The Oxford Dictionary of English Etymology (1966) supports both the
Greek planos and the Latin planus by way of the French "plan."

However, the Oxford English Dictionary (1989) gives only the French
Latinate derivation. IMO this entry is the more convincing. The first
usage of aeroplane was in terms of the wing or plane itself. an 1866
article refers to the application of a beetles wings as aeroplanes and a
1902 article describes airships as a combination of "äerostat,
äeroplane, and propelling apparatus." Simultaneous to this, "aeroplane"
was being used to describe heavier than air craft to distinguish it from
all the other flying craft like balloons. *Switch to Mongolfier
brothers sketch*

Perhaps the idea of the planos origin came about because of the use of
the word as a verb as in "aeroplaning" to describe traveling about by
aeroplane. This usage would seem to be archaic, but maybe that is where
the confusion started.

</paste>

MfG and thanks Toof,

Geoff.

--
A Formula One [tm](r)(c) Database is available at http://glibs.ssmmdd.co.uk/

Database will be updated after the French GP

[Stuart Chapman]

"Andrew Chaplin" > wrote in message
...
> Stuart Chapman wrote:
> >
> > I wonder what the Wright brothers called their machine?
>
> The Wright "Flyer"?
> --
> Andrew Chaplin
> SIT MIHI GLADIUS SICUT SANCTO MARTINO
> (If you're going to e-mail me, you'll have to get "yourfinger." out.)


Yes, but was this a title, such as Titanic, or simply a name, such as ocean
liner....

Stupot

[Cub Driver]

>However, the Oxford English Dictionary (1989) gives only the French
>Latinate derivation.

Funnily enough, the Shorter Oxford (1993) gives only the French Greek
derivation :)

(G planos = wandering)

There must be blood on the floor after Lesley Brown and the boys
settled that one!

Or perhaps you were looking at "plane" and not at "aeroplane"?

all the best -- Dan Ford (email: info AT danford.net)

see the Warbird's Forum at http://www.danford.net/index.htm
Vietnam | Flying Tigers | Pacific War | Brewster Buffalo | Piper Cub

[Richard Brooks]

"Stuart Chapman" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Andrew Chaplin" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Stuart Chapman wrote:
> > >
> > > I wonder what the Wright brothers called their machine?
> >
> > The Wright "Flyer"?

That was after it flew of course but Anglo-Saxon names before that!

Richard.

[Bill Shatzer]

On Thu, 3 Jul 2003, Stuart Chapman wrote:

> "Andrew Chaplin" > wrote in message

> > Stuart Chapman wrote:

> > > I wonder what the Wright brothers called their machine?

> > The Wright "Flyer"?

> Yes, but was this a title, such as Titanic, or simply a name, such as ocean
> liner....

The Wrights' patent referred to it as a "flying machine" while the
term "aeroplane" was reserved for the flying machine's "aeroplanes".

Cheers and all,

[Cub Driver]

>> The Wright "Flyer"?

>Yes, but was this a title, such as Titanic, or simply a name, such as ocean
>liner....

No, I don't think so. The Flyer name was around at least till 1911,
much to the confusion of folks who want to see the original Flyer in
action this December.

I think that to the Wrights, Flyer was the generic name.

Langley called his aircraft the Aerodrome.

all the best -- Dan Ford (email: info AT danford.net)

see the Warbird's Forum at http://www.danford.net/index.htm
Vietnam | Flying Tigers | Pacific War | Brewster Buffalo | Piper Cub

[Keith Willshaw]

"Cub Driver" > wrote in message
...
>
> >> The Wright "Flyer"?
>
> >Yes, but was this a title, such as Titanic, or simply a name, such as
ocean
> >liner....
>
> No, I don't think so. The Flyer name was around at least till 1911,
> much to the confusion of folks who want to see the original Flyer in
> action this December.
>
> I think that to the Wrights, Flyer was the generic name.
>
> Langley called his aircraft the Aerodrome.
>

I think you'll find that the reference to his machine as an aerodrome came
not from Langley but from articles in the scientifc American of August 22,
1903
and October 17 1903

Langley in his press release simply referred to flying machines

<Quote>
To the Press:
The present experiments being made in mechanical flight have been carried on
partly with funds provided by the Board of Ordnance and Fortifications, and
partly from private sources, and from a special endowment of the Smithsonian
Institution. The experiments are carried on with the approval of the board
of regents of the Smithsonian Institution. The public's interest in them may
lead to an unfounded expectation as to their immediate results without an
explanation, which is here briefly given.
These trials, with some already conducted with steam driven flying machines,
are believed to be the first in the history of invention where bodies far
heavier than the air itself have been sustained in the air for more than a
few seconds by purely mechanical means. In my previous trials success has
only been reached after initial failures, which alone have taught the way to
it, and I know no reason why prospective trials should be an exception. It
is possible, rather than probable, that it may be otherwise now, but judging
from the light of past experience it is to be regretted that the enforced
publicity which has been given to these initial experiments which are
essentially experiments, and nothing else a may lead to quite unfounded
expectations.

It is the practice of all scientific men, indeed, of all prudent men, not to
make public the results of their work till these are certain. This
consideration, and no desire to withhold from the public matters in which
the public is interested, has dictated the policy thus far pursued here. The
fullest publicity consistent with the national interest (since these recent
experience have for their object the development of a machine for war
purposes) will be given to this work when it reaches a stage which warrants
publication.
S. P. Langley
Smithsonian Institution, August 19. "

</Quote>

The first use of the term aeroplane by one of the pioneers of
aviation seems to have been by Sir Hiram Maxim in his work
entitled 'Aerial Navigation: The Power Required' published in 1891

<Quote>
I think all scientists are agreed that if we are ever able to navigate the
air it must be on the aeroplane system; that is, the weight of the machine
and passenger or passengers must be carried by a large plane driven at a
high velocity through the air. There is, however, some difference in opinion
in regard to the proper manner of propelling these planes...I am in favor of
a scew- propeller, because with it I find a high-degree of efficiency, and
the possibility of applying a large amount of force in a continuous manner
without any vibration or unsteadiness in action...'
</Quote>

Keith