A-12 on Intrepid

[Jeanne]

Hi,

Has anyone seen the current condition of the A-12 Blackbird residing
at the Intrepid Museum? To my eyes, she is deteriorating rather badly.
If you care to see current pictures please visit
http://www.savetheblackbird.com. PLease be advised that the Intrepid
has now moved her to the left side of the deck to facilitate one of
their many events. You can also see a live image of the flight deck
via the Intrepid Earthcam camera. You can locate this site by using
the Google search for Intrepid Earthcam. This will also allow you to
see the current conditions on the deck. I would LOVE to hear any
feedback. Thanks for the time.

[Keith Willshaw]

"Thomas J. Paladino Jr." > wrote in message
...
>
> "Jeanne" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Hi,
> >
> > Has anyone seen the current condition of the A-12 Blackbird residing
> > at the Intrepid Museum? To my eyes, she is deteriorating rather badly.
> > If you care to see current pictures please visit
> > http://www.savetheblackbird.com. PLease be advised that the Intrepid
> > has now moved her to the left side of the deck to facilitate one of
> > their many events. You can also see a live image of the flight deck
> > via the Intrepid Earthcam camera. You can locate this site by using
> > the Google search for Intrepid Earthcam. This will also allow you to
> > see the current conditions on the deck. I would LOVE to hear any
> > feedback. Thanks for the time.
>
> I never understood why they didn't keep that plane inside the Intrepid, in
> one of the display areas, from the beginning. It is arguably the single
most
> expensive, rare and interesting piece that they have.
>
> I remember going to the Intrepid when the A-12 had first arrived (I was
> around 14 or so), with a friend of the family who was also an engineer for
> Grumman (he worked on the X-29, I believe). It was the coolest thing I had
> ever seen in my entire life. And it was still in it's totally original
> condition. They didn't have it roped off or anything at that point, so we
> could get right up next to it, and look in the engine cavities and landing
> gear bays and everything. He explained some of the details to me, and
showed
> me some of the seams that were a bit wider than they should have been,
> explaining how they would seal up at speed. The original paint was still
on
> it, and I remember that the skin of the plane in certain areas almost felt
> like soft plastic. The tires were light grey, but deflated, and the engine
> cavities still smelled like jet fuel. It was great.
>
> I know that it would not be practical to have kept the plane in exactly
that
> condition, but they should have moved it down into the museum area of the
> ship shortly after that. It is a big plane, but it could have easily fit,
> and it would not be in such a sad state as it is now. It really is a
shame.
>

I suspect it wouldnt fit on the elevator without being sliced up

Keith

[Jeanne]

Hey Keith,

Thanks for the feedback. As often as I naively tried to convince
Intrepid that downstairs on the hanger deck might be a better place
for the A-12, the word was that "she was better viewed from the flight
deck" They basically use her as a draw. If you've been out to
Intrepid, you know how she looks from the street level. They will
NEVER move her inside. Besides they need the area downstairs for their
banquets and events. Her wings were already cut so it isn't an issue
of moving her. believe me.

Let's face it, the A-12 does not belong on the flight deck of ANY
ship. They never served the Navy, never flew off a flight deck and
have no historical value there. This particular A-12 was "bought" by
Zak Fisher, the Late CEO/founder of the Intrepid. The A-12 on Intrepid
is just that---a meal ticket, a draw, and they consider her as nothing
more. Just like you, I was out there when they first put her on the
deck. It was what drove me to help her. If you read any of the text at
my website, there's the explanation. Only the SR-71/A-12 Blackbird
people/affeciandos can save her now by making a fuss over her
treatment.

Jeannette

[Keith Willshaw]

"Jeanne" > wrote in message
m...
> Hey Keith,
>
> Thanks for the feedback. As often as I naively tried to convince
> Intrepid that downstairs on the hanger deck might be a better place
> for the A-12, the word was that "she was better viewed from the flight
> deck" They basically use her as a draw. If you've been out to
> Intrepid,

I have

> you know how she looks from the street level. They will
> NEVER move her inside. Besides they need the area downstairs for their
> banquets and events. Her wings were already cut so it isn't an issue
> of moving her. believe me.
>

Yes but she's 102 ft long, the Intrepids elevators as installed
were 60ft by 34 ft , Unless you cut ger in half she aint gonna fit

> Let's face it, the A-12 does not belong on the flight deck of ANY
> ship. They never served the Navy, never flew off a flight deck and
> have no historical value there.

However Intrepid is not just a naval museum but an aerospace one.


> This particular A-12 was "bought" by
> Zak Fisher, the Late CEO/founder of the Intrepid. The A-12 on Intrepid
> is just that---a meal ticket, a draw, and they consider her as nothing
> more. Just like you, I was out there when they first put her on the
> deck. It was what drove me to help her. If you read any of the text at
> my website, there's the explanation. Only the SR-71/A-12 Blackbird
> people/affeciandos can save her now by making a fuss over her
> treatment.
>

The alternative to that aircraft going to Intrepid was more likely
the scrapyard, thats where most went after all.

I sympathise with your concerns but frankly Intrepid loses
money as it is, the only admission charges dont cover maintenance
costs and without the money from those banquets the museum
would go bust.

I watched the scrap dealers cutting up aircraft at a failed museum
here in the UK once , trust me you dont want to see that happen.

Keith

[Thomas J. Paladino Jr.]

"TBBlakeley" > wrote in message
...
> >The alternative to that aircraft going to Intrepid was more likely
> >the scrapyard, thats where most went after all.
>
> Actually, the FACT is, NOT 1 of the Blackbird Aircraft went to any
> scrapyard...NOT ONE!!! Believe me, everyone of these aircraft were sought
> after by numerous museums.

Yep, not a single one was scrapped. Here is a good link, with a list of
every A-12/SR-71 and it's current situation.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/intell/systems/sr-71.htm

[TBBlakeley]

>The alternative to that aircraft going to Intrepid was more likely
>the scrapyard, thats where most went after all.

Actually, the FACT is, NOT 1 of the Blackbird Aircraft went to any
scrapyard...NOT ONE!!! Believe me, everyone of these aircraft were sought
after by numerous museums.

[John A. Weeks III]

In article >, Keith Willshaw
> wrote:

> The alternative to that aircraft going to Intrepid was more likely
> the scrapyard, thats where most went after all.

Bull. Not one single Blackbird has been scrapped since the
program was shut down and the Blackbirds sent to museums. This
are historically significant aircarft, and they deserve to be
treated as the museum pieces that they are.

> I sympathise with your concerns but frankly Intrepid loses
> money as it is, the only admission charges dont cover maintenance
> costs and without the money from those banquets the museum
> would go bust.

Well, if the Intrepid cannot take care of this historic aircraft,
then they should give it up to someone who can. There are dozens
of musuems that would love to have a Blackbird.

-john-

--
================================================== ==================
John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708
Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com
================================================== ==================

[Michael Kube-McDowell]

On Tue, 5 Aug 2003 16:06:07 +0100, "Keith Willshaw"
> wrote:

>
>"Jeanne" > wrote in message
m...

>> This particular A-12 was "bought" by
>> Zak Fisher, the Late CEO/founder of the Intrepid. The A-12 on Intrepid
>> is just that---a meal ticket, a draw, and they consider her as nothing
>> more. Just like you, I was out there when they first put her on the
>> deck. It was what drove me to help her. If you read any of the text at
>> my website, there's the explanation. Only the SR-71/A-12 Blackbird
>> people/affeciandos can save her now by making a fuss over her
>> treatment.
>>
>
>The alternative to that aircraft going to Intrepid was more likely
>the scrapyard, thats where most went after all.

True of many workaday aircraft, but not the Blackbirds. Look at any
list of them by serial number (there's one at
http://digilander.libero.it/maddog666/serie.htm) and you'll see that
every single one of them begins "Lost..." "On display at..." or "In
storage for...".

K-Mac


--
Michael P. Kube-McDowell
Warbirding and other bad habits: http://www.sff.net/people/K-Mac/warbird.htm
Warbird sighting album: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/K-mac/

[Mary Shafer]

On Tue, 05 Aug 2003 19:24:36 -0500, "John A. Weeks III"
> wrote:

> In article >, Keith Willshaw
> > wrote:
>
> > The alternative to that aircraft going to Intrepid was more likely
> > the scrapyard, thats where most went after all.
>
> Bull. Not one single Blackbird has been scrapped since the
> program was shut down and the Blackbirds sent to museums. This
> are historically significant aircarft, and they deserve to be
> treated as the museum pieces that they are.

That A-12 went to Intrepid long before 1990. Don't confuse the A-12s,
which were distributed to museums first, with the SR-71s, which were
distributed after the deactivation.

You do know there's an SR-71 buried over by the Edwards AFB dump,
don't you? I think it would be more correct to say that no intact
Blackbird has been scrapped.

Folks, not all Blackbirds survived intact. A pretty fair number were
written off. Check the list in Crickmore.

Mary

--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer

[Peter Twydell]

In article >, Michael
Kube-McDowell > writes
>On Tue, 5 Aug 2003 16:06:07 +0100, "Keith Willshaw"
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Jeanne" > wrote in message
m...
>
>>> This particular A-12 was "bought" by
>>> Zak Fisher, the Late CEO/founder of the Intrepid. The A-12 on Intrepid
>>> is just that---a meal ticket, a draw, and they consider her as nothing
>>> more. Just like you, I was out there when they first put her on the
>>> deck. It was what drove me to help her. If you read any of the text at
>>> my website, there's the explanation. Only the SR-71/A-12 Blackbird
>>> people/affeciandos can save her now by making a fuss over her
>>> treatment.
>>>
>>
>>The alternative to that aircraft going to Intrepid was more likely
>>the scrapyard, thats where most went after all.
>
>True of many workaday aircraft, but not the Blackbirds. Look at any
>list of them by serial number (there's one at
>http://digilander.libero.it/maddog666/serie.htm) and you'll see that
>every single one of them begins "Lost..." "On display at..." or "In
>storage for...".
>

Blue on black is very difficult to read!

Neither this site nor the one mentioned earlier by John Weeks shows that
SR-71A 64-17962 has been at the Imperial War Museum at Duxford since May
2001.
--
Peter

Ying tong iddle-i po!

[Jeanne]

Peter Twydell > wrote in message >...
> In article >, Michael
> Kube-McDowell > writes
> >On Tue, 5 Aug 2003 16:06:07 +0100, "Keith Willshaw"
> > wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>"Jeanne" > wrote in message
> m...
>
> >>> This particular A-12 was "bought" by
> >>> Zak Fisher, the Late CEO/founder of the Intrepid. The A-12 on Intrepid
> >>> is just that---a meal ticket, a draw, and they consider her as nothing
> >>> more. Just like you, I was out there when they first put her on the
> >>> deck. It was what drove me to help her. If you read any of the text at
> >>> my website, there's the explanation. Only the SR-71/A-12 Blackbird
> >>> people/affeciandos can save her now by making a fuss over her
> >>> treatment.
> >>>
> >>
> >>The alternative to that aircraft going to Intrepid was more likely
> >>the scrapyard, thats where most went after all.
> >
> >True of many workaday aircraft, but not the Blackbirds. Look at any
> >list of them by serial number (there's one at
> >http://digilander.libero.it/maddog666/serie.htm) and you'll see that
> >every single one of them begins "Lost..." "On display at..." or "In
> >storage for...".
> >
>
> Blue on black is very difficult to read!
>
> Neither this site nor the one mentioned earlier by John Weeks shows that
> SR-71A 64-17962 has been at the Imperial War Museum at Duxford since May
> 2001.


I found it very interesting that a Blackbird had been allowed out of
this country, albeit a friendly nation. Lots of politics there.

Jeannette

[Keith Willshaw]

"Jeanne" > wrote in message
om...
> "Keith Willshaw" > wrote in message
news:<bgq7p2$ks0$1
> >
> > And many of those 'on display' are outside and in no better condition
> > than the one on Intrepid
> >
> > Gate guardians are rarely well maintained
> >
> > Keith
>
> There are no gate guards made up of A-12's. All of the ones that are
> out there have had issues but none are displayed with the recklessness
> of the Intrepid. Take a look at the Minn ANG A-12, gorgeous condition.
> The one that is at the Alabama museum is now indoors,

It was pretty shabby looking when outdoors in the parking lot

http://www.themindspill.com/air_space/space/ASRC/A12.jpg

> Blackbird Park
> has the great weather so outdoor exhibition isn't too much of an
> issue. It goes on.

Yet further down you complain of the effects the heat has on
the aircraft out of doors in New York. Now given that Blackbird Park
is in the Mjave desert ....

> Considering there are only 9 of these aircraft in
> existance with #121 and #122 being the flight test vehicles, ( #122
> 's cockpit is what the fleet would have looked like if continued and
> not canceled) and the fact that #122 also sports the "barracuda" on
> her nose. #121 and #124 do not have it. The "Barracuda" was added to
> help solve the problem of the windshield glass sealant getting so hot
> it melted and ran back on the glass, it caused the max heat point to
> be onto itself rather than on the windshield frame. Intrepid's bird
> deserves better conditions.
>

You still havent explained how they are supposed to move
a 102ft long aircraft below decks using a 65ft long elevator

Keith

[Jeanne]

"John A. Weeks III" > wrote in message >...
> In article >, Keith Willshaw
> > wrote:
>
> > The alternative to that aircraft going to Intrepid was more likely
> > the scrapyard, thats where most went after all.
>
> Bull. Not one single Blackbird has been scrapped since the
> program was shut down and the Blackbirds sent to museums. This
> are historically significant aircarft, and they deserve to be
> treated as the museum pieces that they are.
>
> > I sympathise with your concerns but frankly Intrepid loses
> > money as it is, the only admission charges dont cover maintenance
> > costs and without the money from those banquets the museum
> > would go bust.
>
> Well, if the Intrepid cannot take care of this historic aircraft,
> then they should give it up to someone who can. There are dozens
> of musuems that would love to have a Blackbird.
>
> -john-

Intrepid's corporate atmosphere and it's CEO/PR/ finanical/ officers
are ALL making from 90,000 to 6 figure salaries. Everyone of them.
They spend virtually NOTHING on exhibits, rely on former crewmembers
and vocational schools and volunteers to support the museum staff, and
they spend nothing on the flight deck and hanger deck exhibit aircraft
excerpt for the occasional house pain that they use to paint the A-12.
there is NOT ONE curator or historial on the staff. However, there are
plenty of PR people. John is right. There are lots of museums that
would LOVE to have that aircraft! However, due to "politics" they will
never have the chance.

Jeannette

[Keith Willshaw]

"Jeanne" > wrote in message
om...
> "John A. Weeks III" > wrote in message
>...
> > In article >, Keith Willshaw
> > > wrote:

>
> Intrepid's corporate atmosphere and it's CEO/PR/ finanical/ officers
> are ALL making from 90,000 to 6 figure salaries.

Please provide a cite to substantiate the claim that the Intrepid museum CEO
draws a 6 figure salary from that organisation

> Everyone of them.
> They spend virtually NOTHING on exhibits, rely on former crewmembers
> and vocational schools and volunteers to support the museum staff, and
> they spend nothing on the flight deck and hanger deck exhibit aircraft
> excerpt for the occasional house pain that they use to paint the A-12.
> there is NOT ONE curator or historial on the staff. However, there are
> plenty of PR people. John is right. There are lots of museums that
> would LOVE to have that aircraft! However, due to "politics" they will
> never have the chance.
>
> Jeannette

Hmm their website lists the following recently completed
capital projects

Allison & Howard Lutnick Theater
The Museum has installed a new, state-of-the-art 245 seat theatre.

Visitor Center
The Museum has constructed a modern, inviting facility as the Museum's new
Visitor Center

Crew Mess Area
In May 2001 the Museum opened the Crew Mess Area to accommodate school and
tour groups and other Museum visitors.

Full-Access Elevator
A new elevator, funded by the Disabled American Veterans, allows complete
access to the Intrepid's Flight, Hangar and Third Decks

Flight Deck
A Congressional appropriation allowed for the replacement of the Intrepid's
old wooden flight deck, which had seriously deteriorated over time, with a
new steel surface

HVAC System
A new air conditioning and heating system has been installed in the Museum's
Hangar Deck.

Exhibit: Defending Our Future
Defending our Future is an interactive exhibit showcasing our nation's
latest military technology and equipment

Exhibit: Mission Control
Mission Control teaches about the history of America's exploration of space,
from the first space flights to today's international space station

Amongst their planned projects is

Hangar Facility
The Museum will construct a hangar building to accommodate the restoration
of the aircraft on display at the Intrepid Sea Air Space Museum. Students
from the College of Aeronautics in New York will restore the aircraft under
the supervision of faculty members of the College in a credit-bearing course
in aircraft restoration. These students will work within the new hangar
building, which will feature large windows on one side to allow Museum
visitors to view the work in progress.

I note further that your portrait of Zachary Fisher is rather
different than that in a back issue of Navy News

<Quote>
NEW YORK (NNS) -- The Presidental Medal of Freedom Award, the
highest honor that can be awarded a United States citizen, was
presented Monday to Zachary Fisher by President Clinton in a
private ceremony at the Waldof Astoria hotel in New York City. The
ceremony was attended by Mrs. Clinton, Secretary of Defense
William S. Cohen and the heads of all five branches of military
service. Fisher was awarded the medal for his steadfast and
generous support of the U.S. military.

<snip>
In 1978, Fisher founded the Intrepid Museum Foundation to
save the historic and battle-scarred aircraft carrier Intrepid
from scrapping. Through his efforts the vessel became the
foundation of the Intrepid Sea Air Space Museum, which opened in
New York City in 1982. Since that time, Fisher has contributed
more than $25 million to the establishment and operation of the
Museum, a tribute to the thousands of military men and women who
have served and continue to serve our country.
<snip>
In addition to founding the Intrepid Museum, Fisher and his
wife formed the Zachery and Elizabeth Fisher Armed Services
Foundation to provide contributions to families who survive the
death of a loved one in the armed service. These began with a
$10,000 contribution to each of the families of the 238 victims of
the bombing of the Marine barracks in Beirut in 1983. Since then,
the Foundation has sent more than 600 checks of more than $10,000
each to the families of other military personnel who have been
killed.
<snip>
The Foundation also provides scholarship funds to active and
former service members and their families. Since 1987, more than
700 students have received scholarships of between $500 and
$2,500. In 1990, the Fishers began the Fisher House Program,
dedicating more than $15 million to the construction of 28 comfort
homes for families of hospitalized military personnel. The houses
are designed to provide all the comforts of a "home away from
home," and to allow families to support one another through their
difficult times.
In similar efforts, the Fishers provided $1.4 million for the
establishment of a child care center at Camp Pendleton Marine Base
in California, and led in supporting the CAMP program at Lackland
Air Force Base which serves disabled children of military
personnel.
<snip>
</Quote>

Politics is doubtless an issue but it seems you do protest too much.

Keith

[Pete]

"Mike Beede" > wrote
>
> > You still havent explained how they are supposed to move
> > a 102ft long aircraft below decks using a 65ft long elevator
>
> I thought one end of the elevator on a carrier was usually
> just sticking out into space. Can't you let the nose do likewise?
> If the nose isn't long enough (I have no reference that allows
> me to tell) even if it's parked diagonally, then you would have
> to build something to extend the elevator (which would
> presumably be expensive).

Still won't work.
Take a look at the overhead drawing at the bottom of
http://www.intrepidmuseum.org/exhibits_a-blackbird.html
Making the large assumption that this is to scale, and assuming the
starboard/aft square is the starboard elevator, and the pentagon right in
front of the A-12 silhouette is the (now sealed?) centerline elevator. how
would it fit? Both elevators are way too small. The widest part of the wings
look like a really tight fit on the starboard/aft, even diagonally. And a
complete non starter on the centerline.

Here's a pic of an A-4 on (I think) the centerline elevator. Huge difference
in size between an A-4 and the A-12.
http://www.warships1.com/UScv11_Intrepid_elevator-Gogey.jpg

Can't get it belowdecks without cutting some major steel...either ship or
aircraft.

Pete

>
> Regards,
>
> Mike

[John A. Weeks III]

In article >, Clark
<stillnospam@me> wrote:

> Oh BS, just use a crane. Now I don't have info about shoehorning it into the
> hanger deck but getting poised to go in is relatively easy with a big-honkin-
> crane.

Clark -- I like the "can do" attitude.

All of the carriers that I have been on have had an opening on the
end of the hangar deck. How about using a crane on a barge to lift
the Blackbird up so it can be pulled into the hangar deck from the
aft end of the ship?

-john-

--
================================================== ==================
John A. Weeks III 952-432-2708
Newave Communications http://www.johnweeks.com
================================================== ==================

[Jeanne]

Peter Twydell > wrote in message >...
> In article >, John A. Weeks III
> > writes
> >In article >, Peter Twydell
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Neither this site nor the one mentioned earlier by John Weeks shows that
> >> SR-71A 64-17962 has been at the Imperial War Museum at Duxford since May
> >> 2001.
> >
> >On my "survivors" list, I have had it listed as follows for quite
> >some time...
> >
> > "Moved indoors to the new American Air Museum in late 2002/early
> > 2003. Was outdoors at the Imperial War Musuem, and previously in
> > storage at Air Force Plant 42 in Palmdale, CA."
> >
> >While the American Air Museum is located on the grounds of the
> >Imperial War Museum, it is a seperate entity with different
> >management. You can find the status of all surviving Blackbirds
> >on my list at http://www.johnweeks.com/sr71. I spend a lot of
> >time, effort, and money visiting these aircraft and keeping up
> >with their status.
> >
> >-john-
> >
> Sorry, John, I mixed up your posting with Thomas Paladino's.
>
> I wasn't aware the American War Museum was under different management.
> "Wrecks and Relics" doesn't mention that, and many of the aircraft there
> were once part of the regular IWM exhibits.
>
> I never saw the SR71 outdoors, only in the Superhangar with the
> Sunderland, Vulcan, Lancaster, Mossie, etc. The outer portion of the
> starboard LE had been rubbed shiny by all the people wanting to tough
> the aircraft!
>
> It's satisfying to have an SR-71 available all year round now, instead
> of only once a year at Mildenhall. Nowhere near as good as seeing her
> fly, though.
>
> As has been mentioned before, a visit to the IWM is an absolute must for
> anyone visiting the UK. (SWMBO and I are looking for a new house at the
> moment, and a spot half-way between Duxford and Old Warden would be most
> suitable.)


> "Wrecks and Relics" doesn't mention that, and many of the aircraft there
> were once part of the regular IWM exhibits.

Peter,
What is" Wrecks and Relics "( (I'm guessing that its a publication) Is
it indigenous to only to UK. Do you know where I can get a copy or
hopefully its online?

Thanks
Jeannette

[Jeanne]

Peter Twydell > wrote in message >...
> In article >, Jeanne
> > writes
> >Peter Twydell > wrote in message news:<o2wxZJAZJgM$EwDr
> >...
> >> In article >, John A. Weeks III
> >> > writes
> >> >In article >, Peter Twydell
> >> > wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Neither this site nor the one mentioned earlier by John Weeks shows that
> >> >> SR-71A 64-17962 has been at the Imperial War Museum at Duxford since May
> >> >> 2001.
> >> >
> >> >On my "survivors" list, I have had it listed as follows for quite
> >> >some time...
> >> >
> >> > "Moved indoors to the new American Air Museum in late 2002/early
> >> > 2003. Was outdoors at the Imperial War Musuem, and previously in
> >> > storage at Air Force Plant 42 in Palmdale, CA."
> >> >
> >> >While the American Air Museum is located on the grounds of the
> >> >Imperial War Museum, it is a seperate entity with different
> >> >management. You can find the status of all surviving Blackbirds
> >> >on my list at http://www.johnweeks.com/sr71. I spend a lot of
> >> >time, effort, and money visiting these aircraft and keeping up
> >> >with their status.
> >> >
> >> >-john-
> >> >
> >> Sorry, John, I mixed up your posting with Thomas Paladino's.
> >>
> >> I wasn't aware the American War Museum was under different management.
> >> "Wrecks and Relics" doesn't mention that, and many of the aircraft there
> >> were once part of the regular IWM exhibits.
> >>
> >> I never saw the SR71 outdoors, only in the Superhangar with the
> >> Sunderland, Vulcan, Lancaster, Mossie, etc. The outer portion of the
> >> starboard LE had been rubbed shiny by all the people wanting to tough
> >> the aircraft!
> >>
> >> It's satisfying to have an SR-71 available all year round now, instead
> >> of only once a year at Mildenhall. Nowhere near as good as seeing her
> >> fly, though.
> >>
> >> As has been mentioned before, a visit to the IWM is an absolute must for
> >> anyone visiting the UK. (SWMBO and I are looking for a new house at the
> >> moment, and a spot half-way between Duxford and Old Warden would be most
> >> suitable.)
> >
> >
> >> "Wrecks and Relics" doesn't mention that, and many of the aircraft there
> >> were once part of the regular IWM exhibits.
> >
> >Peter,
> >What is" Wrecks and Relics "( (I'm guessing that its a publication) Is
> >it indigenous to only to UK. Do you know where I can get a copy or
> >hopefully its online?
> >
> >Thanks
> >Jeannette
>
> It's a UK book published every 2 years, listing museum, retired and
> derelict aircraft in the British Isles. Currently in its 18th edition,
> the author is Ken Ellis, and it's published by Midland Publishing, ISBN
> 1857801334. I found it on the Amazon US site at various prices from USD
> 31 or so.
>
> It's a pretty amazing work, 320 pages of very detailed information. The
> SR-71A is on the front cover, shown in the Superhangar I mentioned, with
> parts of a Comet, Harrier, Vulcan, Buccaneer and Dove visible.
>
> Amazon UK says:
> Wrecks & Relics is a national institution. Each edition is eagerly
> awaited and snapped up by enthusiasts, historians, owners and operators
> of historic aircraft and curators of aviation collections as the most
> trusted and hard-working of reference books in the field of aviation.
> Now in its 41st year of publication, the 18th edition marks the author's
> 29th year at the helm. The book takes the reader on a county-by-county
> and province-by-province journey through the fascinating world of
> museums, military stores and dumps, 'geriatric' airliners awaiting the
> axe, restoration workshops, technical schools, treasures in garages and
> barns and much more. Within the wealth of information supplied can be
> found commentary, items to raise the eyebrow and myriad 'I never knew
> that', expressions! Fully revised and updated, this latest edition has
> an array of appendices to take the subject further and the usual
> extensive indexing and cross-referencing. The 64 page full colour photo
> section is packed with fascinating and obscure subjects which are wide
> ranging as ever. Interest in aviation heritage continues to increase -
> possession of Wrecks & Relics is the subject's essential companion.
>
>
> There's also European Wrecks & Relics by Otger van der Kooij, ISBN
> 1857800850.


Thanks so much! I'll try Amazon and Ebay right now! Sound like
something I would defintley want in my collection.

[Jeanne]

(Jeanne) wrote in message >...
> Peter Twydell > wrote in message >...
> > In article >, Jeanne
> > > writes
> > >Peter Twydell > wrote in message news:<o2wxZJAZJgM$EwDr
> > >...
> > >> In article >, John A. Weeks III
> > >> > writes
> > >> >In article >, Peter Twydell
> > >> > wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> >> Neither this site nor the one mentioned earlier by John Weeks shows that
> > >> >> SR-71A 64-17962 has been at the Imperial War Museum at Duxford since May
> > >> >> 2001.
> > >> >
> > >> >On my "survivors" list, I have had it listed as follows for quite
> > >> >some time...
> > >> >
> > >> > "Moved indoors to the new American Air Museum in late 2002/early
> > >> > 2003. Was outdoors at the Imperial War Musuem, and previously in
> > >> > storage at Air Force Plant 42 in Palmdale, CA."
> > >> >
> > >> >While the American Air Museum is located on the grounds of the
> > >> >Imperial War Museum, it is a seperate entity with different
> > >> >management. You can find the status of all surviving Blackbirds
> > >> >on my list at http://www.johnweeks.com/sr71. I spend a lot of
> > >> >time, effort, and money visiting these aircraft and keeping up
> > >> >with their status.
> > >> >
> > >> >-john-
> > >> >
> > >> Sorry, John, I mixed up your posting with Thomas Paladino's.
> > >>
> > >> I wasn't aware the American War Museum was under different management.
> > >> "Wrecks and Relics" doesn't mention that, and many of the aircraft there
> > >> were once part of the regular IWM exhibits.
> > >>
> > >> I never saw the SR71 outdoors, only in the Superhangar with the
> > >> Sunderland, Vulcan, Lancaster, Mossie, etc. The outer portion of the
> > >> starboard LE had been rubbed shiny by all the people wanting to tough
> > >> the aircraft!
> > >>
> > >> It's satisfying to have an SR-71 available all year round now, instead
> > >> of only once a year at Mildenhall. Nowhere near as good as seeing her
> > >> fly, though.
> > >>
> > >> As has been mentioned before, a visit to the IWM is an absolute must for
> > >> anyone visiting the UK. (SWMBO and I are looking for a new house at the
> > >> moment, and a spot half-way between Duxford and Old Warden would be most
> > >> suitable.)
> > >
> > >
> > >> "Wrecks and Relics" doesn't mention that, and many of the aircraft there
> > >> were once part of the regular IWM exhibits.
> > >
> > >Peter,
> > >What is" Wrecks and Relics "( (I'm guessing that its a publication) Is
> > >it indigenous to only to UK. Do you know where I can get a copy or
> > >hopefully its online?
> > >
> > >Thanks
> > >Jeannette
> >
> > It's a UK book published every 2 years, listing museum, retired and
> > derelict aircraft in the British Isles. Currently in its 18th edition,
> > the author is Ken Ellis, and it's published by Midland Publishing, ISBN
> > 1857801334. I found it on the Amazon US site at various prices from USD
> > 31 or so.
> >
> > It's a pretty amazing work, 320 pages of very detailed information. The
> > SR-71A is on the front cover, shown in the Superhangar I mentioned, with
> > parts of a Comet, Harrier, Vulcan, Buccaneer and Dove visible.
> >
> > Amazon UK says:
> > Wrecks & Relics is a national institution. Each edition is eagerly
> > awaited and snapped up by enthusiasts, historians, owners and operators
> > of historic aircraft and curators of aviation collections as the most
> > trusted and hard-working of reference books in the field of aviation.
> > Now in its 41st year of publication, the 18th edition marks the author's
> > 29th year at the helm. The book takes the reader on a county-by-county
> > and province-by-province journey through the fascinating world of
> > museums, military stores and dumps, 'geriatric' airliners awaiting the
> > axe, restoration workshops, technical schools, treasures in garages and
> > barns and much more. Within the wealth of information supplied can be
> > found commentary, items to raise the eyebrow and myriad 'I never knew
> > that', expressions! Fully revised and updated, this latest edition has
> > an array of appendices to take the subject further and the usual
> > extensive indexing and cross-referencing. The 64 page full colour photo
> > section is packed with fascinating and obscure subjects which are wide
> > ranging as ever. Interest in aviation heritage continues to increase -
> > possession of Wrecks & Relics is the subject's essential companion.
> >
> >
> > There's also European Wrecks & Relics by Otger van der Kooij, ISBN
> > 1857800850.
>
>
> Thanks so much! I'll try Amazon and Ebay right now! Sound like
> something I would defintley want in my collection.

Has anyone been to NYC and seen the A-12 on Intrepid as of late? I'd
love to know your impression of what you've seen.
Jean

[Jeanne]

"Keith Willshaw" > wrote in message >...
> "Jeanne" > wrote in message
> om...
> > (Jeanne) wrote in message
> >...
>
> > Has anyone been to NYC and seen the A-12 on Intrepid as of late? I'd
> > love to know your impression of what you've seen.
> > Jean
>
> I just posted a picture I took last year on alt.binaries.pictures.military
>
> It looked in reasonable shape to me
>
> Keith

The photos that I took, at least the recent ones are from May 2003.
were taken on a bright, sunny, morning, so the light was exceptional.
I also used an Olypmus OM-2 with macro and zoom lenses along with 28mm
and 50mm lenses. I would like to know if you noticed if the refueling
hatch and the tail dump hatch were open when you saw her. I have a
book which I complied that shows the state of the aircraft from 1995
through 2003. I was in the position to be able to take these photos
and since I worked on the restoration, I also have detailed photos of
that. I also have detailed notes on #122 up until the time I left
Intrepid. I WISH I could be able to post all those photos so that you
could see all the good work that we had done and how it is now been
undone and left to rack and ruin. If you are interested maybe I can
copy the book and get it to you.

Jean