Dept procedures stumper questions

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Here's some items to liven up the group...

1. Suppose your departure clearance includes "cross X vor at or above
5000, Y vor at or above 10,000, maintain 15,0000 feet." Once airborne
you're given "maintain FL200". Do the altitude restrictions at X and
Y vor's still apply?

2. Now suppose you're assigned a SID which has the same vor crossing
altitudes restrictions, and 15,000 as the final altitude. And again,
once airborne, you're given "maintain FL200". Do the altitude
restrictions at X and Y vor's still apply?

3. Your sid states "runway heading to 2000 feet, turn right to 090
degrees. At 10 dme, climb to 4000 feet.":

a. Once airborne (at 1000 feet) you're given "direct X vor. Must you
maintain 2000 feet until 10 dme?

b. Now suppose at 1000 feet you're given direct X vor, maintain 6000
feet. Must you maintain 2000 feet until 10 dme?

[Ron Rosenfeld]

On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 14:41:08 -0300, wrote:

>Here's some items to liven up the group...

The answers to your questions are all in the AIM. You will find it a
useful source of information.

I will leave it to you to locate the quotations.

>
>1. Suppose your departure clearance includes "cross X vor at or above
>5000, Y vor at or above 10,000, maintain 15,0000 feet." Once airborne
>you're given "maintain FL200". Do the altitude restrictions at X and
>Y vor's still apply?

"If an altitude to "maintain" is restated, whether prior to departure or
while airborne, previously issued altitude restrictions are canceled,
including any DP altitude restrictions if any."


>
>2. Now suppose you're assigned a SID which has the same vor crossing
>altitudes restrictions, and 15,000 as the final altitude. And again,
>once airborne, you're given "maintain FL200". Do the altitude
>restrictions at X and Y vor's still apply?

"If an altitude to "maintain" is restated, whether prior to departure or
while airborne, previously issued altitude restrictions are canceled,
including any DP altitude restrictions if any."

>
>3. Your sid states "runway heading to 2000 feet, turn right to 090
>degrees. At 10 dme, climb to 4000 feet.":
>
>a. Once airborne (at 1000 feet) you're given "direct X vor. Must you
>maintain 2000 feet until 10 dme?

"After an aircraft is established on an ODP/SID and subsequently vectored
or cleared off of the ODP or SID transition, pilots shall consider the
ODP/SID canceled, unless the controller adds "expect to resume ODP/SID."

>
>b. Now suppose at 1000 feet you're given direct X vor, maintain 6000
>feet. Must you maintain 2000 feet until 10 dme?


"After an aircraft is established on an ODP/SID and subsequently vectored
or cleared off of the ODP or SID transition, pilots shall consider the
ODP/SID canceled, unless the controller adds "expect to resume ODP/SID."

"If an altitude to "maintain" is restated, whether prior to departure or
while airborne, previously issued altitude restrictions are canceled,
including any DP altitude restrictions if any."
Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

[Bee]

wrote:

> Here's some items to liven up the group...
>
> 1. Suppose your departure clearance includes "cross X vor at or above
> 5000, Y vor at or above 10,000, maintain 15,0000 feet." Once airborne
> you're given "maintain FL200". Do the altitude restrictions at X and
> Y vor's still apply?
>
> 2. Now suppose you're assigned a SID which has the same vor crossing
> altitudes restrictions, and 15,000 as the final altitude. And again,
> once airborne, you're given "maintain FL200". Do the altitude
> restrictions at X and Y vor's still apply?
>
> 3. Your sid states "runway heading to 2000 feet, turn right to 090
> degrees. At 10 dme, climb to 4000 feet.":
>
> a. Once airborne (at 1000 feet) you're given "direct X vor. Must you
> maintain 2000 feet until 10 dme?
>
> b. Now suppose at 1000 feet you're given direct X vor, maintain 6000
> feet. Must you maintain 2000 feet until 10 dme?

Issue is being worked in FAA/Industry Instrument Procedures Group:


http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/afs/afs400/afs420/acfipg/open/media/Hist%2007-01-274.pdf

[Ron Rosenfeld]

On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 18:20:13 -0700, Bee > wrote:

>Issue is being worked in FAA/Industry Instrument Procedures Group:

In question 1 it is not clear if the OP is referencing a verbal departure
clearance, or a SID or an ODP.

But in 2 and 3, he specifically references a SID.

I would agree with you that the verbiage needs to be cleared up with regard
to an ODP.


Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)