Mother Russia closer to develop an ABM system

[Alejandro Magno]

Russia is actually much closer to developing an effective
anti-ballistic missile defense system than the United States. Russia's
latest S-400 surface-to-air missile system is currently in its final
stage of testing and is due to enter service in 2001-2002. The S-400
is the only SAM system in the world that has been designed from the
very start with anti-ballistic missile capability in mind. Development
of such systems became possible following the 1997 correction to the
1972 ABM treaty accepted by the US and Russia during negotiations in
New York. The correction made a more accurate distinction between
strategic and non-strategic ABM defenses. While the S-400, its
predecessor - the S-300 and its anti-ballistic adaptation designated
"Antey" - are unmatched by any other long-range SAM system in the
world, there is already the S-500 in the final stages of development.
Successful export of S-300 systems made Russian SAM manufacturers
highly productive and competitive. In addition, when the ABM treaty
was modified to allow only one ABM system for each the USSR and
America, the USSR deployed a limited ABM system to protect its
capital, Moscow.

http://www.area51zone.com/abm/index4.shtml

http://www.vce.com/missile_defense.html

Americans really need to build an ABM defense system, Mother Russia
can vaporize any country with her 1960s technology:
http://www.vce.com/tsar.html

"It is just that I am of the opinion, that Europe will consolidate its
reputation as a powerful and truly independent center of world
politics, firmly and for the long term, if it can join its own
capabilities with Russia's possibilities--with the human, territorial
and natural resources, and the economic, cultural and DEFENSE
potential of Russia."
(President Vladimir Putin in his address to the German Reichstag)

After reading the declaration of Tsar Vladimir, I can only think that
every piece of the puzzle is coming to the right place for the end of
NATO, and the birth of http://www.imperium-europa.org/

Alejandro Magno III

[B2431]

(Alejandro Magno)
>Date: 1/4/2004 10:36 PM Central Standard Time
>Message-id: >
>
>Russia is actually much closer to developing an effective
>anti-ballistic missile defense system than the United States. Russia's
>latest S-400 surface-to-air missile system is currently in its final
>stage of testing and is due to enter service in 2001-2002.

Um, wake up, it's 2004, genius.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired

[Kevin Brooks]

"B2431" > wrote in message
...
> (Alejandro Magno)
> >Date: 1/4/2004 10:36 PM Central Standard Time
> >Message-id: >
> >
> >Russia is actually much closer to developing an effective
> >anti-ballistic missile defense system than the United States. Russia's
> >latest S-400 surface-to-air missile system is currently in its final
> >stage of testing and is due to enter service in 2001-2002.
>
> Um, wake up, it's 2004, genius.

Not if "Mother Russia" says it's not! She's all powerful, didn't ya know?

You gotta wonder if this was not a problem throughout the Soviet days, and
might explain some of their difficulties in fielding equipment that could
equal western systems..."Okay! Comrades, we very much must field aircraft
able to counter imperialist warmonger F-15! It now 1980; I propose we put
wonderful example of great Soviet proletariat aircraft design Mig-29 into
service in 1970! Ha! Take that, you yankee running dogs..."

Brooks

>
> Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired

[Ragnar]

"Alejandro Magno" > wrote in message
om...
> Russia is actually much closer to developing an effective
> anti-ballistic missile defense system than the United States. Russia's
> latest S-400 surface-to-air missile system is currently in its final
> stage of testing and is due to enter service in 2001-2002.

Umm, please learn to read BEFORE you cut and paste. Its 2004 and it still
isn't in service.

[Keith Willshaw]

"Alejandro Magno" > wrote in message
om...
> Russia is actually much closer to developing an effective
> anti-ballistic missile defense system than the United States.

The USSR fielded an ABM system around Moscow in
the 1970's

> Russia's
> latest S-400 surface-to-air missile system is currently in its final
> stage of testing and is due to enter service in 2001-2002. The S-400
> is the only SAM system in the world that has been designed from the
> very start with anti-ballistic missile capability in mind.

Hogwash.

Both the US Sprint and Spartan missiles and the Soviet Galosh systems of the
70's
were designed for the ABM role.


> Development
> of such systems became possible following the 1997 correction to the
> 1972 ABM treaty accepted by the US and Russia during negotiations in
> New York. The correction made a more accurate distinction between
> strategic and non-strategic ABM defenses. While the S-400, its
> predecessor - the S-300 and its anti-ballistic adaptation designated
> "Antey" - are unmatched by any other long-range SAM system in the
> world, there is already the S-500 in the final stages of development.

In fact the S-400 is a development of the S-300PMU and
its deployment has been deferred until 2005 due to development
problems and lack of funds

S-500 appears to be little more than a paper exercise at this point

> Successful export of S-300 systems made Russian SAM manufacturers
> highly productive and competitive. In addition, when the ABM treaty
> was modified to allow only one ABM system for each the USSR and
> America, the USSR deployed a limited ABM system to protect its
> capital, Moscow.
>

No amendment happened or was necessary, the ABM treaty always
allowed one such system for each country

I note you lifted this article in its entirety from a
web page without acknowledging the attribution
Let me correct this

http://www.area51zone.com/abm/index4.shtml

Keith

[Stephen Harding]

Keith Willshaw wrote:

> I note you lifted this article in its entirety from a
> web page without acknowledging the attribution
> Let me correct this
>
> http://www.area51zone.com/abm/index4.shtml

That would be "Alejandro Magno III, Emperator Europum",
and denizen of the "Area 51 Zone" fer sure!


SMH

[Alejandro Magno]

Stephen Harding wrote

> Keith Willshaw wrote:
>
> > I note you lifted this article in its entirety from a
> > web page without acknowledging the attribution
> > Let me correct this
> >
> > http://www.area51zone.com/abm/index4.shtml

> That would be "Alejandro Magno III, Emperator Europum",
> and denizen of the "Area 51 Zone" fer sure!
>
>
> SMH

Thanks SMH. Once the Empire is formed, you will have all the Aryan
Women you want, only you. You can even start building your own, the
russian scientists will clone as many women as you wish. I recommend 4
women.
- One for the house, cooking and take care of the children.
- Another women for sex and traveling.
- Another to cut the grass.
- A woman with a PhD to go to work and make $400,000 a year for you.

You will have a lot of time to go watch the Hockey game and visit all
the bars you want while your women are doing all the hard work.

Start building your dream lady here:
http://www.nationalvanguard.org/story.php?id=1203
Better than ordered by catalog.

Why are you talking with Keith "The Ostrich" Willshaw ?

Ostriches will not be welcomed in http://www.imperium-europa.org ,
they will be sent to Africa so they can enjoy African culture and
tolerance, see for yourself here: http://www.radicalracism.com

More about Holy Russian defense systems (they are faith based, so they
do not miss their targets):

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/shkval.htm
ups ups ups, sorry...... this is a torpedo for Keith "The Ostrich"
Willshaw's ass.

Here the defense system:
http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/program/soviet/s-500.htm
http://cns.miis.edu/pubs/reports/sokrmd.htm
http://www.kitsune.addr.com/Rifts/Rifts-Earth-Vehicles/Soviet/NS_TM-262_Missile_Tank.htm
http://www.american-partisan.com/cols/2002/pyne/qtr2/0528.htm
http://www.techcentralstation.com/123102C.html
http://www.cesd.org/mddf/mddf02.htm
http://www.assembly-weu.org/en/documents/sessions_ordinaires/rpt/2001/1737.html
http://www.defenselink.mil/speeches/2001/s20010719-depsecdef2.html

Alejandro Magno III, Emperator Europum

[Pete]

"Alejandro Magno" > wrote
>
> Alejandro Magno III, Emperator Europum

Please, please tell us what you've been smoking, that we may avoid it.
Evidently, it leads to serious psychosis.

Pete

[Stephen Harding]

Alejandro Magno wrote:

> Stephen Harding wrote
>
>>That would be "Alejandro Magno III, Emperator Europum",
>>and denizen of the "Area 51 Zone" fer sure!
>
> Thanks SMH. Once the Empire is formed, you will have all the Aryan
> Women you want, only you. You can even start building your own, the
> russian scientists will clone as many women as you wish. I recommend 4
> women.

Bless you! Hail to the Emperor!

> - One for the house, cooking and take care of the children.
> - Another women for sex and traveling.
> - Another to cut the grass.

I like mowing the lawn myself. Can I put the "grass woman" on
sex duty along with the other?

> - A woman with a PhD to go to work and make $400,000 a year for you.
>
> You will have a lot of time to go watch the Hockey game and visit all
> the bars you want while your women are doing all the hard work.
>
> Start building your dream lady here:
> http://www.nationalvanguard.org/story.php?id=1203
> Better than ordered by catalog.
>
> Why are you talking with Keith "The Ostrich" Willshaw ?

You're right. He spouts too many *facts*. It's boring.

Maybe he could be assigned to mow my lawn?

> Ostriches will not be welcomed in http://www.imperium-europa.org ,
> they will be sent to Africa so they can enjoy African culture and
> tolerance, see for yourself here: http://www.radicalracism.com
>
> More about Holy Russian defense systems (they are faith based, so they
> do not miss their targets):
>
> http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/shkval.htm
> ups ups ups, sorry...... this is a torpedo for Keith "The Ostrich"
> Willshaw's ass.
>
> Here the defense system:
> http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/program/soviet/s-500.htm
> http://cns.miis.edu/pubs/reports/sokrmd.htm
> http://www.kitsune.addr.com/Rifts/Rifts-Earth-Vehicles/Soviet/NS_TM-262_Missile_Tank.htm
> http://www.american-partisan.com/cols/2002/pyne/qtr2/0528.htm
> http://www.techcentralstation.com/123102C.html
> http://www.cesd.org/mddf/mddf02.htm
> http://www.assembly-weu.org/en/documents/sessions_ordinaires/rpt/2001/1737.html
> http://www.defenselink.mil/speeches/2001/s20010719-depsecdef2.html
>
> Alejandro Magno III, Emperator Europum

Can't quite get to to all the reading material right now.
The sex girls are due to arrive shortly.


SMH

[SalMX70]

Soviet/Russian SAM/ABM systems have always been the best.
For example, in the Yom Kippur War the SA-6 totally dominated the IAF
and made mincemeat out of the IAF.
Sure the IAF made mincemeat out of the SAF and EAF, but that still
doesn't change the fact that the SA-6 made mincemeat out of the IAF.
The Israeli Air Force was afraid to face the SA-6, and most of the
SA-6 batteries that were destroyed were destroyed by IDF GROUND
forces, and BTW the VAST majority of SA-6 Sam Batteries were still
intact at the end of the war.
I was reading some where that Egyptian SA-6 batteries fired like 95
missiles during the Yom Kippur war and as a result 64 IAF aircraft
were shot down by those missiles, so considering that sometimes 2
missiles might be fired at the same aircraft, that's a VERY impressive
performance against the IAF by the SA-6.
I was also reading that even a weak little country like Syria was able
to shoot down 36 IAF aircraft in a single day largely because of the
SA-6.
Later during the 80s in Lebanon when the SA-6 was OLD and Israel had
newer aircraft and using UAVs to fool the SA-6, the IAF was able to do
great against the SA-6.
However, the moral of the story still remains, NEW Top of the Line
Russian SAMs and ABM systems are the BEST IN THE WORLD and always have
been and I'm sure that the Russian S-400 would give the IAF or any
airforce even more trouble than the SA-6 gave to the IAF in the Yom
Kippur War.



(Alejandro Magno) wrote in message >...
> Russia is actually much closer to developing an effective
> anti-ballistic missile defense system than the United States. Russia's
> latest S-400 surface-to-air missile system is currently in its final
> stage of testing and is due to enter service in 2001-2002. The S-400
> is the only SAM system in the world that has been designed from the
> very start with anti-ballistic missile capability in mind. Development
> of such systems became possible following the 1997 correction to the
> 1972 ABM treaty accepted by the US and Russia during negotiations in
> New York. The correction made a more accurate distinction between
> strategic and non-strategic ABM defenses. While the S-400, its
> predecessor - the S-300 and its anti-ballistic adaptation designated
> "Antey" - are unmatched by any other long-range SAM system in the
> world, there is already the S-500 in the final stages of development.
> Successful export of S-300 systems made Russian SAM manufacturers
> highly productive and competitive. In addition, when the ABM treaty
> was modified to allow only one ABM system for each the USSR and
> America, the USSR deployed a limited ABM system to protect its
> capital, Moscow.
>
> http://www.area51zone.com/abm/index4.shtml
>
> http://www.vce.com/missile_defense.html
>
> Americans really need to build an ABM defense system, Mother Russia
> can vaporize any country with her 1960s technology:
> http://www.vce.com/tsar.html
>
> "It is just that I am of the opinion, that Europe will consolidate its
> reputation as a powerful and truly independent center of world
> politics, firmly and for the long term, if it can join its own
> capabilities with Russia's possibilities--with the human, territorial
> and natural resources, and the economic, cultural and DEFENSE
> potential of Russia."
> (President Vladimir Putin in his address to the German Reichstag)
>
> After reading the declaration of Tsar Vladimir, I can only think that
> every piece of the puzzle is coming to the right place for the end of
> NATO, and the birth of http://www.imperium-europa.org/
>
> Alejandro Magno III

[Krztalizer]

>However, the moral of the story still remains, NEW Top of the Line
>Russian SAMs and ABM systems are the BEST IN THE WORLD and always have
>been

That's quite a leap, between how good the SA-6 was 30 years ago and today.
BTW, did you hear of about the Hawk and its various improved models? PK beats
the SA-6. I think Russian/Soviet propaganda is the BEST IN THE WORLD and
always has been.

>S-400 would give the IAF or any
>airforce even more trouble than the SA-6 gave to the IAF in the Yom
>Kippur War.

Only if no lessons were learned in the past 30 years. You may think that is
likely - you'd be wrong. The IAF had NO experience against SAMs prior to that
first slaughter. That's obviously changed. The losses that occurred later in
the Bekaa Valley and elsewhere took place during engagements where often dozens
of missiles were launched at targets that were already engaged in dogfights
with other aircraft - but in your mind, the IAF wouldn't have learned from such
encounters? Bright one, that's foolish.

The S400 has been touted long and hard as the latest and greatest SAM,
practically since the first pencil drawings of it were made. It'll be a LOT
more impressive if it makes it into combat and lives up to the dreams; until
then, its simply not the BEST IN THE WORLD! at anything.

Gordon

[Ron]

>Soviet/Russian SAM/ABM systems have always been the best.
>For example, in the Yom Kippur War the SA-6 totally dominated the IAF
>and made mincemeat out of the IAF.
>Sure the IAF made mincemeat out of the SAF and EAF, but that still
>doesn't change the fact that the SA-6 made mincemeat out of the IAF.
>The Israeli Air Force was afraid to face the SA-6, and most of the
>SA-6 batteries that were destroyed were destroyed by IDF GROUND
>forces, and BTW the VAST majority of SA-6 Sam Batteries were still
>intact at the end of the war.
>I was reading some where that Egyptian SA-6 batteries fired like 95
>missiles during the Yom Kippur war and as a result 64 IAF aircraft
>were shot down by those missiles, so considering that sometimes 2
>missiles might be fired at the same aircraft, that's a VERY impressive
>performance against the IAF by the SA-6.
>I was also reading that even a weak little country like Syria was able
>to shoot down 36 IAF aircraft in a single day largely because of the
>SA-6.
>Later during the 80s in Lebanon when the SA-6 was OLD and Israel had
>newer aircraft and using UAVs to fool the SA-6, the IAF was able to do
>great against the SA-6.
>However, the moral of the story still remains, NEW Top of the Line
>Russian SAMs and ABM systems are the BEST IN THE WORLD and always have
>been and I'm sure that the Russian S-400 would give the IAF or any
>airforce even more trouble than the SA-6 gave to the IAF in the Yom
>Kippur War.

Hmmm then what happened in 1982 to the Syrian air defense systems?

It wasnt just age of the SA-6 that caused it defeat, it was tactics and lessons
learned from 73.

IAF was caught unprepared to deal with those SAMs in 73. They have not made
that mistake since.



Ron
Pilot/Wildland Firefighter