Airline Pilots Fly Past Airport at 20,000'

[Larry Dighera]

Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?


http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
Barbi Walker
The Arizona Republic
Feb. 20, 2008 04:59 PM

The Federal Aviation Administration is investigating whether two
airline pilots who flew past the airport in Hilo Hawaii by 15
miles last Wednesday were asleep.

Go! Airlines flight 1002 left from Honolulu and was expected to
land in Hilo around 10 a.m., but had to turn around after flying
past the airport. ...

A radar track of the flight provided by the Web site
www.flightaware.com shows the plane remained at 21,000 feet as it
flew past Hilo before returning to the airport.

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

Larry Dighera wrote:
> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>
>
> http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
> Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii


Hell, yes.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[Larry Dighera]

On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 00:01:49 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
<mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
>:

>Larry Dighera wrote:
>> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>>
>>
>> http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
>> Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>
>
>Hell, yes.


Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?

[WingFlaps]

On Feb 21, 10:55*pm, Larry Dighera > wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 00:01:49 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
> <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
> >:
>
> >Larry Dighera wrote:
> >> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>
> >>http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
> >> * *Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>
> >Hell, yes.
>
> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?

The cockpit voice recorder shows they had just started a conversation
about MSFS and then it went quiet.

Cheers

[Marty Shapiro]

WingFlaps > wrote in news:34daaac1-d38b-44f3-bea6-
:

> On Feb 21, 10:55*pm, Larry Dighera > wrote:
>> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 00:01:49 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
>> <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
>> >:
>>
>> >Larry Dighera wrote:
>> >> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>>
>> >>http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
>> >> * *Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>>
>> >Hell, yes.
>>
>> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
>> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?
>
> The cockpit voice recorder shows they had just started a conversation
> about MSFS and then it went quiet.
>
> Cheers

Maybe they got the BSD and had to wait for a reboot to resume flying!:-))

--
Marty Shapiro
Silicon Rallye Inc.

(remove SPAMNOT to email me)

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

Larry Dighera wrote:
>>> http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
>>> Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>>
>>
>> Hell, yes.
>
>
> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?


Probably were both exhausted by a schedule that was marginally legal but ill
advised. I would imagine it was not through choice... the company probably
stuck them with it and gave them the choice of fly or quit.

It happens all the time. Believe me, those two weren't the only ones asleep at
the wheel that day. They just got caught.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[gatt[_2_]]

"Larry Dighera" > wrote in message
...
>
> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?

Oxygen issues maybe? Could that happen?

The F.O. must have hit the Snooze button.

-c

[Larry Dighera]

On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 08:32:26 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
<mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
>:

>Larry Dighera wrote:
>>>> http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
>>>> Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>>>
>>>
>>> Hell, yes.
>>
>>
>> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
>> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?
>
>
>Probably were both exhausted by a schedule that was marginally legal but ill
>advised.

Perhaps, but it was 0900 local.

>I would imagine it was not through choice... the company probably
>stuck them with it and gave them the choice of fly or quit.
>
>It happens all the time. Believe me, those two weren't the only ones asleep at
>the wheel that day. They just got caught.

Well, thankfully ATC kept calling them before they got out of range.

A little more info:

http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1056-full.html#197200
even stranger than usual -- it was 9 o'clock in the
morning, and the flight was a 45-minute hop from Honolulu to Hilo.
Local TV station KGMB9
(http://kgmb9.com/main/content/view/4199/40/)
said it obtained a radar track of the flight, which showed it
stayed at 21,000 feet and flew past the Hilo airport about 15
miles out to sea before turning around and returning to descend.
Air traffic controllers reportedly tried to contact the pilots for
25 minutes and got no response.

[JGalban via AviationKB.com]

gatt wrote:

>
>Oxygen issues maybe? Could that happen?
>

Unlikely. The passengers had no trouble remaining awake. Several of them
noticed as they flew past Hilo at cruising altitude.

John Galban=====>N4BQ (PA28-180)

--
Message posted via AviationKB.com
http://www.aviationkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/aviation/200802/1

[Phil J]

On Feb 20, 8:39*pm, Larry Dighera > wrote:
> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?

Naw. They were both on Usenet.

[Robert M. Gary]

On Feb 21, 8:46*am, "JGalban via AviationKB.com" <u32749@uwe> wrote:
> gatt wrote:
>
> >Oxygen issues maybe? * Could that happen?
>
> * Unlikely. *The passengers had no trouble remaining awake. *Several of them
> noticed as they flew past Hilo at cruising altitude.

And no one pulled the cord? What a bunch of lazy pax.

-Robert

[Paul kgyy]

If one pilot was male and the other female, there might be another
explanation.

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

Larry Dighera wrote:
>> Probably were both exhausted by a schedule that was marginally legal but ill
>> advised.
>
> Perhaps, but it was 0900 local.



Once upon a time when I was a part 135 cargo pilot, I got a call from my
employer at around 0900 saying that I was needed to fly some auto parts from
Shelby, NC to Cleveland, OH. She said to start getting ready and she'd call me
back with the details in a half hour or so. Well, she called back about 15
minutes later saying the vendor didn't have enough of the parts to justify the
flight and so it was off.

That night, as I was getting ready for bed at 2330, I got another call from the
dispatcher saying the flight was on again, and that I was expected at Shelby for
a 0100 pickup. I needed to be at the Charlotte airport by about 1215 to make it
over to Shelby on time. So off I went.

Without boring you with the details, I fought some killer 60-70 knot headwinds
and ice on the way up there and ended up making an intermediate fuel stop at
Charleston, WV (after shooting the ILS), then into Cleveland with another ILS.

After taking on more fuel, I took off again into IMC but soon climbed on top and
settled in for a screaming cruise (now I had all that wind behind me). After
about an hour I switched to the inboard aux tanks.

I woke up when the right engine quit. As I reached over to change tanks and hit
the boost, the other engine quit as well. I remember marveling at how
accurately I'd leaned those engines. Anyway, the C-402 engines relit very
quickly and I was on my way again with no one the wiser. I promised God I would
never fall asleep flying again.

I broke that promise twice more on the remainder of the flight. I touched down
shortly after dawn at Charlotte.

Now, was my flight time in excess of the allowable. No. And my employer could
make the argument that my duty day didn't start until 2330. So what was
illegal? Nothing, I guess. But I sure was a whipped pup.

So the Hawaiian episode happened at 0900? I'd be very curious to see what
they'd been doing for the last 48 hours. And sitting at an airport waiting in
uniform doesn't constitute crew rest to me. Nor does the time spent in taxis.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[Larry Dighera]

Thanks for relating your firsthand experience.

On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 14:18:26 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
<mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
>:

>That night, as I was getting ready for bed at 2330, I got another call from the
>dispatcher saying the flight was on again, and that I was expected at Shelby for
>a 0100 pickup. I needed to be at the Charlotte airport by about 1215 to make it
>over to Shelby on time. So off I went.

Was that an FAA certificated Dispatcher?
http://www.faa.gov/safety/programs_initiatives/oversight/atos/library/data_collection/media/EPI_6_1_4_O.doc

http://www.fltdisp.com/TheDispatchCareer/DutiesandResponsibilities/tabid/57/Default.aspx

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

Larry Dighera wrote:
>> That night, as I was getting ready for bed at 2330, I got another call from
>> the dispatcher saying the flight was on again, and that I was expected at
>> Shelby for a 0100 pickup. I needed to be at the Charlotte airport by about
>> 1215 to make it over to Shelby on time. So off I went.
>
> Was that an FAA certificated Dispatcher?
> http://www.faa.gov/safety/programs_initiatives/oversight/atos/library/data_collection/media/EPI_6_1_4_O.doc
>
> http://www.fltdisp.com/TheDispatchCareer/DutiesandResponsibilities/tabid/57/Default.aspx


She was a company dispatcher. I have no idea what other credentials she held.
This was back around 1990 and the company went tango uniform not three weeks
later.

Pity. Not only was I out of a job, I had just completed the ground school on
the C-47. We had two of them and I never got to actually fly either. I did
pinch a manual, however.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[WingFlaps]

On Feb 22, 8:16*am, Paul kgyy > wrote:
> If one pilot was male and the other female, there might be another
> explanation.

This explanation does not require differing sexes. From statistics,
pair of homsexuals would be more likely to be having sex by the way!!!

Cheers

[gatt[_2_]]

"JGalban via AviationKB.com" <u32749@uwe> wrote in message
news:801237d5237ee@uwe...
> gatt wrote:

>>Oxygen issues maybe? Could that happen?

> Unlikely. The passengers had no trouble remaining awake. Several of
> them
> noticed as they flew past Hilo at cruising altitude.


That would be an odd feeling. I wonder if anybody notified the flight
attendants..

-c

[gatt[_2_]]

"WingFlaps" > wrote in message
...
On Feb 22, 8:16 am, Paul kgyy > wrote:
>> If one pilot was male and the other female, there might be another
>> explanation.

>This explanation does not require differing sexes. From statistics,
>pair of homsexuals would be more likely to be having sex by the way!!!


"If the cockpit's a-rockin, don't bother knockin'"

[Bob Fry]

>>>>> "RG" == Robert M Gary > writes:

RG> And no one pulled the cord? What a bunch of lazy pax.

What about the cabin crew. Or were they snoozing also.
--
He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a
monster. For if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also
into you.
~ Nietzsche

[gatt[_2_]]

"Paul kgyy" > wrote in message
...

> If one pilot was male and the other female, there might be another
> explanation.

They were getting leied.

-c

[Bertie the Bunyip]

On 21 Feb, 02:39, Larry Dighera > wrote:
> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>
> *http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
> * * Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
> * * Barbi Walker
> * * The Arizona Republic
> * * Feb. 20, 2008 04:59 PM
>
> * * The Federal Aviation Administration is investigating whether two
> * * airline pilots who flew past the airport in Hilo Hawaii by 15
> * * miles last Wednesday were asleep.
>
> * * Go! Airlines flight 1002 left from Honolulu and was expected to
> * * land in Hilo around 10 a.m., but had to turn around after flying
> * * past the airport. ...


Must have been reading your stuff.



Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip]

On 21 Feb, 09:55, Larry Dighera > wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 00:01:49 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
> <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
> >:
>
> >Larry Dighera wrote:
> >> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>
> >>http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
> >> * *Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>
> >Hell, yes.
>
> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?

Go **** yourself and mind your own business, Larry.

Bertie

[Mortimer Schnerd, RN[_2_]]

gatt wrote:
> "Paul kgyy" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>> If one pilot was male and the other female, there might be another
>> explanation.
>
> They were getting leied.



Go to your room without supper.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

[Roy Smith]

Larry Dighera > wrote:

> A little more info:
>
> http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1056-full.html#197200
> even stranger than usual -- it was 9 o'clock in the
> morning, and the flight was a 45-minute hop from Honolulu to Hilo.
> Local TV station KGMB9
> (http://kgmb9.com/main/content/view/4199/40/)
> said it obtained a radar track of the flight, which showed it
> stayed at 21,000 feet and flew past the Hilo airport about 15
> miles out to sea before turning around and returning to descend.
> Air traffic controllers reportedly tried to contact the pilots for
> 25 minutes and got no response.

On the CVR: "Hey, Bob, c'mon,stop screwing around. I distinctly remember
it was *your* turn to set the new password on the autopilot this morning."

[Viperdoc]

It's just another "the sky is falling" gloom and doom post from Larry. He
must be the biggest office gossip as well.

[Judah]

Larry Dighera > wrote in
:

> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?

More likely than the theory that both pilots were simultaneously captured by
aliens and transported off the plane for 20 minutes for invasive exploration.

However, since the cockpit doors remain locked by TSA regulation, we'll never
know.

[Larry Dighera]

On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 17:04:22 -0800 (PST), Bertie the Bunyip
> wrote in
>:

>On 21 Feb, 09:55, Larry Dighera > wrote:
>> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 00:01:49 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
>> <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
>> >:
>>
>> >Larry Dighera wrote:
>> >> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>>
>> >>http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
>> >> * *Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>>
>> >Hell, yes.
>>
>> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
>> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?
>
>Go **** yourself and mind your own business, Larry.
>
>Bertie

From the plaintive squeal above, it would appear that my analysis
resonated with an alleged (retired?) NW airline pilot. Telling.....

If in flight snoozing is accepted among flight crew, it is apparent
from this incident, that it carries the same sort of hazard as failing
to have one pilot on O2 at altitude, a la the Payne Stewart Lear 35
mishap: http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/2000/AAB0001.htm

[Mxsmanic]

Larry Dighera writes:

> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?

Absolutely, but it implies that either both pilots were coincidentally very
irresponsible in not getting enough sleep before flying or not keeping one
person awake at all times, or there is a problem with the airline that leaves
pilots with so little rest that they cannot resist falling asleep in flight.

> The Federal Aviation Administration is investigating whether two
> airline pilots who flew past the airport in Hilo Hawaii by 15
> miles last Wednesday were asleep.
>
> Go! Airlines flight 1002 left from Honolulu and was expected to
> land in Hilo around 10 a.m., but had to turn around after flying
> past the airport. ...

I'd check the history of the pilots in the days prior to the flight to see if
they got appropriate rest, and if they didn't, either the pilots erred in not
sleeping enough, or the airline erred in somehow preventing them from getting
enough rest.

> A radar track of the flight provided by the Web site
> www.flightaware.com shows the plane remained at 21,000 feet as it
> flew past Hilo before returning to the airport.

Starting the descent out of cruise normally requires action by a human pilot;
otherwise the aircraft will continue to fly its route, but without descending.

The Helios Airways incident was similar: after everyone lost consciousness on
the flight, the automation flew the aircraft to its destination and executed a
missed approach and hold, but never left cruise altitude (until the engines
ran out of fuel).

[Mxsmanic]

Larry Dighera writes:

> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?

One pilot asleep in cruise is normally not a hazard, although technically it
isn't allowed (for an aircraft that legally requires two pilots to fly).

[Mxsmanic]

Larry Dighera writes:

> Perhaps, but it was 0900 local.

The world of airlines has little connection to local time. Pilots can be
tired at any time of day.

> http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1056-full.html#197200
> even stranger than usual -- it was 9 o'clock in the
> morning, and the flight was a 45-minute hop from Honolulu to Hilo.

They could still be too tired to stay awake, depending on what happened prior
to that flight.

[Mxsmanic]

Larry Dighera writes:

> A radar track of the flight provided by the Web site
> www.flightaware.com shows the plane remained at 21,000 feet as it
> flew past Hilo before returning to the airport.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ASH1002/history/20080213/1925Z/PHNL/PHTO

[Roy Smith]

In article >,
Roy Smith > wrote:

> Larry Dighera > wrote:
>
> > A little more info:
> >
> > http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1056-full.html#197200
> > even stranger than usual -- it was 9 o'clock in the
> > morning, and the flight was a 45-minute hop from Honolulu to Hilo.
> > Local TV station KGMB9
> > (http://kgmb9.com/main/content/view/4199/40/)
> > said it obtained a radar track of the flight, which showed it
> > stayed at 21,000 feet and flew past the Hilo airport about 15
> > miles out to sea before turning around and returning to descend.
> > Air traffic controllers reportedly tried to contact the pilots for
> > 25 minutes and got no response.
>
> On the CVR: "Hey, Bob, c'mon,stop screwing around. I distinctly remember
> it was *your* turn to set the new password on the autopilot this morning."

Alternate version: "OK, you said it was, Keep the needle on W and land when
you've counted 3 islands, right? Or was it 4 islands?"

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Larry Dighera writes:
>
>> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>
> Absolutely, but it implies that either both pilots were coincidentally
> very irresponsible in not getting enough sleep before flying or not
> keeping one person awake at all times, or there is a problem with the
> airline that leaves pilots with so little rest that they cannot resist
> falling asleep in flight.

How th e**** would you know, moron?
>
> The Helios Airways incident was similar:


No, it wasnt.

after everyone lost
> consciousness on the flight, the automation flew the aircraft to its
> destination and executed a missed approach and hold, but never left
> cruise altitude (until the engines ran out of fuel).

No, it didn't



Bertie
>

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Larry Dighera writes:
>
>> A radar track of the flight provided by the Web site
>> www.flightaware.com shows the plane remained at 21,000 feet as it
>> flew past Hilo before returning to the airport.
>
> http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ASH1002/history/20080213/1925Z/PHNL/
> PHTO
>

Idiot.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Larry Dighera > wrote in
:

> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 00:01:49 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
> <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
> >:
>
>>Larry Dighera wrote:
>>> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>>>
>>>
>>> http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
>>> Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>>
>>
>>Hell, yes.
>
>
> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?
>
>

What business is that of your's?


you gonna fly multi crew airplanes?


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Larry Dighera > wrote in
:

> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 08:32:26 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
> <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
> >:
>
>>Larry Dighera wrote:
>>>>> http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
>>>>> Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hell, yes.
>>>
>>>
>>> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep
>>> on the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?
>>
>>
>>Probably were both exhausted by a schedule that was marginally legal
>>but ill advised.
>
> Perhaps, but it was 0900 local.
>
>>I would imagine it was not through choice... the company probably
>>stuck them with it and gave them the choice of fly or quit.
>>
>>It happens all the time. Believe me, those two weren't the only ones
>>asleep at the wheel that day. They just got caught.
>
> Well, thankfully ATC kept calling them before they got out of range.=


you have no idea what you're talking about.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Larry Dighera > wrote in
:

> Thanks for relating your firsthand experience.
>
> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 14:18:26 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
> <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
> >:
>
>>That night, as I was getting ready for bed at 2330, I got another call
>>from the dispatcher saying the flight was on again, and that I was
>>expected at Shelby for a 0100 pickup. I needed to be at the Charlotte
>>airport by about 1215 to make it over to Shelby on time. So off I
>>went.
>
> Was that an FAA certificated Dispatcher?
> http://www.faa.gov/safety/programs_initiatives/oversight/atos/library/d
> ata_collection/media/EPI_6_1_4_O.doc


WTF is the difference?

Again, you have no idea what you're talking about.

Regulations don't keep people awake, fjukkwit.


bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Larry Dighera writes:
>
>> Perhaps, but it was 0900 local.
>
> The world of airlines has little connection to local time. Pilots can
> be tired at any time of day.
>
>> http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1056-full.html#197200
>> even stranger than usual -- it was 9 o'clock in the
>> morning, and the flight was a 45-minute hop from Honolulu to
>> Hilo.
>
> They could still be too tired to stay awake, depending on what
> happened prior to that flight.


You are, of course, alos an idiot and don't know what you're talking about.


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Larry Dighera > wrote in
:

> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 17:04:22 -0800 (PST), Bertie the Bunyip
> > wrote in
> >:
>
>>On 21 Feb, 09:55, Larry Dighera > wrote:
>>> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 00:01:49 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
>>> <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
>>> >:
>>>
>>> >Larry Dighera wrote:
>>> >> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>>>
>>> >>http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-
sleepingpilots.html
>>> >> * *Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>>>
>>> >Hell, yes.
>>>
>>> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep
on
>>> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?
>>
>>Go **** yourself and mind your own business, Larry.
>>
>>Bertie
>
> From the plaintive squeal above, it would appear that my analysis
> resonated with an alleged (retired?) NW airline pilot. Telling.....
>

No, it isn't. What's telling is you, as usual, have no idea of whence
you speak.

> If in flight snoozing is accepted among flight crew, it is apparent
> from this incident, that it carries the same sort of hazard as failing
> to have one pilot on O2 at altitude, a la the Payne Stewart Lear 35
> mishap: http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/2000/AAB0001.htm
>

Nope,


You're an idiot. And if you weren;'t such an officious **** I'd educate
you on this subject, but since you are and always will be, you can, as
always, go **** up a rope



Bertie


Bertie

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Mxsmanic > wrote in
:

> Larry Dighera writes:
>
>> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep
>> on the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?
>
> One pilot asleep in cruise is normally not a hazard, although
> technically it isn't allowed (for an aircraft that legally requires
> two pilots to fly).


Worng again, tardboi


Bertie
>

[Rich Ahrens[_2_]]

Larry Dighera wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 17:04:22 -0800 (PST), Bertie the Bunyip
> > wrote in
> >:
>
>> On 21 Feb, 09:55, Larry Dighera > wrote:
>>> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 00:01:49 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
>>> <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
>>> >:
>>>
>>>> Larry Dighera wrote:
>>>>> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>>>>> http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
>>>>> Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>>>> Hell, yes.
>>> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
>>> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?
>> Go **** yourself and mind your own business, Larry.
>>
>> Bertie
>
> From the plaintive squeal above, it would appear that my analysis
> resonated with an alleged (retired?) NW airline pilot. Telling.....

You're flying for NW now, Bertie? Now I'm going to have to start hating
you for associating with that company in any way...

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

Rich Ahrens > wrote in news:47bf1054$0$93276$804603d3
@auth.newsreader.iphouse.com:

> Larry Dighera wrote:
>> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 17:04:22 -0800 (PST), Bertie the Bunyip
>> > wrote in
>> >:
>>
>>> On 21 Feb, 09:55, Larry Dighera > wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 00:01:49 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
>>>> <mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com> wrote in
>>>> >:
>>>>
>>>>> Larry Dighera wrote:
>>>>>> Is it possible that BOTH pilots fell asleep?
>>>>>> http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0220abrk-sleepingpilots.html
>>>>>> Airline pilots may have slept past their stop in Hawaii
>>>>> Hell, yes.
>>>> Does that mean that their CRM procedures tolerated one pilot asleep on
>>>> the job, or did they both fall asleep simultaneously?
>>> Go **** yourself and mind your own business, Larry.
>>>
>>> Bertie
>>
>> From the plaintive squeal above, it would appear that my analysis
>> resonated with an alleged (retired?) NW airline pilot. Telling.....
>
> You're flying for NW now, Bertie? Now I'm going to have to start hating
> you for associating with that company in any way...


Hey I couldn't care less what they're painted like... Blame scheduling for
anything else.

Bertie

[george]

On Feb 22, 6:33 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:

>
> Worng again, tardboi
>
Now now Bertie.
Stop playing with the afflicted or they'll tell their mummies

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

george > wrote in news:1fa28f2c-c2fe-48ca-abb7-77081b72a9e1
@41g2000hsc.googlegroups.com:

> On Feb 22, 6:33 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>
>>
>> Worng again, tardboi
>>
> Now now Bertie.
> Stop playing with the afflicted or they'll tell their mummies
>
>

You sound like Mrs Bunyip. She's convinved I'm going to hell for "mocking
the afflicted"

Bertie

[george]

On Feb 23, 8:58 am, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
> george > wrote in news:1fa28f2c-c2fe-48ca-abb7-77081b72a9e1
> @41g2000hsc.googlegroups.com:
>
> > On Feb 22, 6:33 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>
> >> Worng again, tardboi
>
> > Now now Bertie.
> > Stop playing with the afflicted or they'll tell their mummies
>
> You sound like Mrs Bunyip. She's convinved I'm going to hell for "mocking
> the afflicted"
>
One crew area is pretty much the same as all the others :-)

[Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]]

george > wrote in
:

> On Feb 23, 8:58 am, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>> george > wrote in
>> news:1fa28f2c-c2fe-48ca-abb7-77081b72a9e1
>> @41g2000hsc.googlegroups.com:
>>
>> > On Feb 22, 6:33 pm, Bertie the Bunyip > wrote:
>>
>> >> Worng again, tardboi
>>
>> > Now now Bertie.
>> > Stop playing with the afflicted or they'll tell their mummies
>>
>> You sound like Mrs Bunyip. She's convinved I'm going to hell for
>> "mocking the afflicted"
>>
> One crew area is pretty much the same as all the others :-)
>
>
>

True, so true. though we recently got a new candy machine.

Bertie