Picture from Diego Garcia runway

[Allen Thomson]

Caution: I *think* this is genuine, not Photoshopped, but these days
you can never tell. Anyway, genuine or fake, it's kind of neat.

http://www.ammochiefs.com/Diego%20Garcia%204.jpg

[Scott Ferrin]

On 7 Apr 2004 14:49:50 -0700, (Allen Thomson)
wrote:

>Caution: I *think* this is genuine, not Photoshopped, but these days
>you can never tell. Anyway, genuine or fake, it's kind of neat.
>
>http://www.ammochiefs.com/Diego%20Garcia%204.jpg


It's real. There are others of B-1s and B-52s out there too. I
always wondered if there were any photos of all THREE bombers there.

[Mike Beede]

In article >, Scott Ferrin > wrote:

> On 7 Apr 2004 14:49:50 -0700, (Allen Thomson)
> wrote:
>
> >Caution: I *think* this is genuine, not Photoshopped, but these days
> >you can never tell. Anyway, genuine or fake, it's kind of neat.
> >
> >http://www.ammochiefs.com/Diego%20Garcia%204.jpg
>
>
> It's real. There are others of B-1s and B-52s out there too. I
> always wondered if there were any photos of all THREE bombers there.

The B-2 appears to be climbing. If so, why does it have its rudders
in air brake mode (whatever the correct terminology is, please fill it
in)? When you're climbing, you'd usually prefer to *reduce* drag,
not increase it.

Mike Beede

[Scott Ferrin]

On Wed, 07 Apr 2004 19:19:55 -0500, Mike Beede > wrote:

>In article >, Scott Ferrin > wrote:
>
>> On 7 Apr 2004 14:49:50 -0700, (Allen Thomson)
>> wrote:
>>
>> >Caution: I *think* this is genuine, not Photoshopped, but these days
>> >you can never tell. Anyway, genuine or fake, it's kind of neat.
>> >
>> >http://www.ammochiefs.com/Diego%20Garcia%204.jpg
>>
>>
>> It's real. There are others of B-1s and B-52s out there too. I
>> always wondered if there were any photos of all THREE bombers there.
>
>The B-2 appears to be climbing. If so, why does it have its rudders
>in air brake mode (whatever the correct terminology is, please fill it
>in)? When you're climbing, you'd usually prefer to *reduce* drag,
>not increase it.
>
> Mike Beede


The way they work is to add drag to turn the aircraft. They are
normally split 5 degrees IIRC to act as rudders. In "stealth mode"
they apparently tighten that up but with a loss of authority I'd
think. In any case I've heard them referred to as "drag rudders" and
"split rudders".

[Bob Wilsey]

I is real, the full size image can be found on the www.af.mil under
images/aircraft/bomber/b2 section. Night one launch during OIF.
The rudders are just trying to keep the nose straight during high gross,
high thrust, low air speed during takeoff phase. Gotta do what you gotta do
when you don't have a tail.

Bob


"Mike Beede" > wrote in message
...
> In article >, Scott Ferrin
> wrote:
>
> > On 7 Apr 2004 14:49:50 -0700, (Allen Thomson)
> > wrote:
> >
> > >Caution: I *think* this is genuine, not Photoshopped, but these days
> > >you can never tell. Anyway, genuine or fake, it's kind of neat.
> > >
> > >http://www.ammochiefs.com/Diego%20Garcia%204.jpg
> >
> >
> > It's real. There are others of B-1s and B-52s out there too. I
> > always wondered if there were any photos of all THREE bombers there.
>
> The B-2 appears to be climbing. If so, why does it have its rudders
> in air brake mode (whatever the correct terminology is, please fill it
> in)? When you're climbing, you'd usually prefer to *reduce* drag,
> not increase it.
>
> Mike Beede

[tscottme]

Mike Beede > wrote in message
...
>
> The B-2 appears to be climbing. If so, why does it have its rudders
> in air brake mode (whatever the correct terminology is, please fill it
> in)? When you're climbing, you'd usually prefer to *reduce* drag,
> not increase it.
>
> Mike Beede

I was somewhat surprised to learn that the slightly deployed surfaces
you see in the photo are usually slightly deployed during much of the
flight. I doubt this applies during segments when stealth is most in
demand, but as I recall it being explained, the slight deployment of
those surfaces have only a small aerodynamic penalty, if any, but at
this position they are immediately useful for aircraft control. That's
to say, from their completely stowed position until the position at
which they affect aircraft control there would be a significant lag.
Traveling with the drag rudders in the position in the photo gives a
more prompt reaction to control input. I seem to remember the figure
being that the drag rudders are deployed approximately 5 degrees from
their stowed position most of the time.

This explanation seems to be supported by the practice of some
sailplanes. I was surprised to learn that some high performance
sailplanes (gliders) actually are able to raise their flaps *slightly
above* the stowed position and achieve better lift or maybe it's speed
in that configuration.

--


Scott
--------
"I'm an internationalist. I'd like to see our troops dispersed through
the world only at the directive of the United Nations," and that he
wants "to almost eliminate CIA activity."
John F. Kerry, 1970 Harvard Crimson

[Bill McClain]

Beautiful image. The KC-135s (if that's what they are) are good to
see; my wife's uncle used to be an IP on those.

On the B-2: What are those two little spoilers, or whatever they are,
above each engine nacelle? Apart from messing up the airplane's nice
lines <g> what do they do?

[John]

Bob Wilsey wrote:

> I is real, the full size image can be found on the www.af.mil under
> images/aircraft/bomber/b2 section. Night one launch during OIF.
> The rudders are just trying to keep the nose straight during high gross,
> high thrust, low air speed during takeoff phase. Gotta do what you gotta do
> when you don't have a tail.
>
> Bob
>

http://www.af.mil/media/photodb/web/web_030320-F-4338B-042.jpg

[Alan Minyard]

On 8 Apr 2004 05:06:52 -0700, (Bill McClain) wrote:

>Beautiful image. The KC-135s (if that's what they are) are good to
>see; my wife's uncle used to be an IP on those.
>
>On the B-2: What are those two little spoilers, or whatever they are,
>above each engine nacelle? Apart from messing up the airplane's nice
>lines <g> what do they do?

I believe that they are engine intake ducts, at low speed there is insufficient
intake area.

Al Minyard

[[email protected]]

Steven James Forsberg > wrote:

>: Allen Thomson wrote:
>:> Caution: I *think* this is genuine, not Photoshopped, but these days
>:> you can never tell. Anyway, genuine or fake, it's kind of neat.
>:>
>:> http://www.ammochiefs.com/Diego%20Garcia%204.jpg
>

Mean lookin' sumbitch aint it?
--

-Gord.

[[email protected]]

"tscottme" > wrote:

>Mike Beede > wrote in message
...
>>
>> The B-2 appears to be climbing. If so, why does it have its rudders
>> in air brake mode (whatever the correct terminology is, please fill it
>> in)? When you're climbing, you'd usually prefer to *reduce* drag,
>> not increase it.
>>
>> Mike Beede
>
>I was somewhat surprised to learn that the slightly deployed surfaces
>you see in the photo are usually slightly deployed during much of the
>flight. I doubt this applies during segments when stealth is most in
>demand, but as I recall it being explained, the slight deployment of
>those surfaces have only a small aerodynamic penalty, if any, but at
>this position they are immediately useful for aircraft control. That's
>to say, from their completely stowed position until the position at
>which they affect aircraft control there would be a significant lag.
>Traveling with the drag rudders in the position in the photo gives a
>more prompt reaction to control input. I seem to remember the figure
>being that the drag rudders are deployed approximately 5 degrees from
>their stowed position most of the time.
>
>This explanation seems to be supported by the practice of some
>sailplanes. I was surprised to learn that some high performance
>sailplanes (gliders) actually are able to raise their flaps *slightly
>above* the stowed position and achieve better lift or maybe it's speed
>in that configuration.

Sort of goes along with how hydraulics work...the hydraulic
controls of sensitive items like propellers have a built in
'jitter' to the system pressure. It's explained by saying that
half the time the fluid is moving in the direction that it's
needed to move, this makes for a more immediate response when
demanded.

Don't kill -me-, kill my many instructors... :)
--

-Gord.

[[email protected]]

"W. D. Allen Sr." > wrote:

>Looks like the B-2 took off downwind, based on the direction the taxiing
>planes are headed.
>
>WDA
>

I don't see that...the B2 is sort of headed away from the camera
and up toward the top left of the pic so it just left the end of
the runway that you can just see on the right. The a/c are
taxiing down the parallel taxiway then will turn right on another
till reaching the runway then turn right and backtrack it to the
button. (or so it seems to me)
--

-Gord.

[[email protected]]

John > wrote:

>Bob Wilsey wrote:
>
>> I is real, the full size image can be found on the www.af.mil under
>> images/aircraft/bomber/b2 section. Night one launch during OIF.
>> The rudders are just trying to keep the nose straight during high gross,
>> high thrust, low air speed during takeoff phase. Gotta do what you gotta do
>> when you don't have a tail.
>>
>> Bob
>>

Yeh...must be a bitch having no tail...
--

-Gord.

[Alan Minyard]

On Fri, 09 Apr 2004 15:17:20 GMT, "Gord Beaman" ) wrote:

>Steven James Forsberg > wrote:
>
>>: Allen Thomson wrote:
>>:> Caution: I *think* this is genuine, not Photoshopped, but these days
>>:> you can never tell. Anyway, genuine or fake, it's kind of neat.
>>:>
>>:> http://www.ammochiefs.com/Diego%20Garcia%204.jpg
>>
>
>Mean lookin' sumbitch aint it?

Yea, beautiful in a kinda kinky way.

Al Minyard

[Krztalizer]

My, how Dodge has changed...