Hi again Ed,

Thanks for your swift reply.
The book you mention isn't in my library, I'll try to get hold of a copy.
These however I *do* have, but while most of them mention CM, and some even
have pictures, none of them has a picture of that rear cockpit:

F-105 Thunderchief (Detail & Scale) Bert Kinzey
F-105 Thunderchief, Warbirds Illustrated 49, Robert F. Dorr
F-105 Thunderchief, Kev Darling
F-105 Thunderchief in action, Lou Drendel
F-105 Thunderchief in action, 2nd edition, Ken Neubeck
Republic F-105 Thunderchief, David Anderton
Thud, Lou Drendel
Walk Around F-105Thunderchief, Ken Neubeck
Century Series, Lou Drendel
Century series fighters, F-100 Super Sabre - F-106 Delta Dart, Peter R.
Foster
Wild Weasel, The SAM suppression story, Larry Davis
....and of course When thunder rolled.

As to why I would model a "fartin' Martin" : I'm currently modelling all
aircraft types that caried out the Wild Weasel mission.
Browsing through my documentation, I've found out that one of the aircraft
modified to CM was later converted to a G-model and survived the war.
In the 80ies Monogram made a kit of this particular G-type (nicknamed Mutley
the Flying Dog), which I bought during my military service some 20 years
ago.
I thought it would be neat to have the two of them next to eachother on the
shelf.
A Ryan's Raider is also on my list, provided I can find another of these
Monogram F-105F's.
The T-StickII is not very high on my list, as it was never used in SEA, and
the C&M conversion kit is more expensive than the kit itself.

Anyhow, once more my sincere gratitude for your answer.
Eventhough I'm not all that much the wiser, I think I now know enough to
tackle the matter.
After all: if *you* can't tell, who in IPMS Gent will be able to prove wrong
my efforts?

PS: take a look at my latest baby on:
http://users.pandora.be/IPMS.GENT/ee...hantom%20E.htm


Cheers,

Steven


"Ed Rasimus" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 30 Aug 2004 10:14:48 GMT, "ikke" wrote:

Ed,

As I'm planning to build a model of a Combat Martin F-105F, I was
wondering
if you could shed some light on a question I cannot seem to find an
answer
to, inspite of the dozen books on the F-105 in my library and the mass of
information on the Internet.
Here is what I already know: the F-105F's that were modified for the
Combat
Martin programme received a large blade areal behind the rear cockpit and
also had the rear ejection seat removed to make room for the electronics
associated with the programme.
What I don't know: was the rear cockpit also stripped of side consoles,
stick and instrument panel? What shape and size were the block boxes that
replaced the bang seat? Pictures availlable show nothing above the canopy
sills. Would the entire back tub been covered with a tarp, like the "hell
hole" behind the F-18 pilot?
Perhaps you can point met to some pictures that show the interior of the
rear cockpit?

You've probably already checked Dennis Jenkin's "F-105 Thunderchief",
pp 103-104 which offers a short description of the Combat Martin
program and a pair of pix of the airplane with the blade antenna.
That's all I know about the program as it was after my tenure in the
F-105 and by the time I returned to Korat in the F-4 all of the CM
aircraft had been modded to F-105G status.

The text from Jenkin's says only that the seat and instrument panel
were removed for the ALQ-59 comm jammer system. Certainly if the seat
had to be removed, it can be assumed that the stick would come out as
well--but, that's not a great mod. It's unlikely that the side
consoles would be removed, because the constraint of the fuselage
canopy rails would limit the size of the package that could be
inserted (unless the CM system was multiple boxes rather than a single
unit. I honestly don't know.

Jenkin's reports further that the CM system was never employed over
NVN and the airplanes were used as basic bomb-droppers, flown solo
from the front seat (no real problem here, since the F-model was
regularly flown that way in RTU by students). Because of the
sensitivity of the equipment, the airplane was restricted in bombing
parameters and target areas. (During the period in question, bombing
of NVN was halted.)

Why model a very minimal and apparently unsuccessful program? Why not
a T-stick II or Ryan's Raider F-model?


Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
"Phantom Flights, Bangkok Nights"
Both from Smithsonian Books
***www.thunderchief.org