Cleared for the ILS 16 or circle to land 34 question?

Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under visual
rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the clearance;
Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34 Hawkins.

Exactly what is expected for a circle to land? Should I jog over to the
right of the runway on my descent and enter downwind? At what altitude?
The airport terminal is immediately to the right as well as the tower.

Winds were 290 at 8 knots under VMC.

Allen

A Lieberma wrote:
Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under visual
rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the clearance;
Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34 Hawkins.

The clearance, as you state it, does not make sense.

Could it have been, "Cleared for the ILS 16 approach. Circle to land
Runway 34."

You could have then requested clearance to land Runway 16.

Or you could have circled-to-land following the normal VFR pattern for
the airport since the weather was VFR. Circle-to-land needs to be
modified to conform to local traffic expectations when the weather is good.

On 12/22/06 14:46, A Lieberma wrote:
Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under visual
rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the clearance;
Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34 Hawkins.

As Sam said, I don't know why they would have said this. Presumably, the
approach controller know whether you intended to terminate your approach
with a missed approach or landing - is that true?

If you intended to land, then the clearance would (should) have been given
as Sam said.


Exactly what is expected for a circle to land? Should I jog over to the
right of the runway on my descent and enter downwind? At what altitude?

The pattern you execute depends on a lot of factors, among them are the
geometry between the approach course and the designated landing runway
and the pattern in use or requested by the tower.

For training at the local towered airport here in Sacramento, they
expect the airplane to descend to circling minimums and fly a modified
pattern (at circling alt and closer in to the runway).

In our case, the approach and landing runways are opposite ends of
the same pavement, so we just turn 45 degrees toward the downwind leg,
and turn downwind once we get there. This way, we can keep the airport
in sight (practicing for low visibility).

When I've flown circle to land maneuvers at non-towered fields, I've
descended to the standard TPA and joined the pattern (this assumes
VMC, of course).

The airport terminal is immediately to the right as well as the tower.

Winds were 290 at 8 knots under VMC.

Allen



--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane
Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA

In article ,
A Lieberma wrote:

Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under visual
rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the clearance;
Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34 Hawkins.

Exactly what is expected for a circle to land? Should I jog over to the
right of the runway on my descent and enter downwind? At what altitude?
The airport terminal is immediately to the right as well as the tower.

Winds were 290 at 8 knots under VMC.

Allen

With winds 290 @ 8, landing 16 vs. landing 34 means taking a 5 kt tailwind
instead of a 5 kt headwind. It's a 5400 foot runway; you didn't say what
you were flying, but I'm guessing 5400 feet is about 3 times what you
really need. On a real approach in IMC (especially at night), I'd take the
5 kt tailwind over circling to land any day.

But, if it's day VFR and you want to practice the CTL maneuver, you need to
negotiate with the tower. If you're the only one around, they'll let you
do anything you want. You can come down to the circling MDA of 940 MSL
(598 AGL) on the ILS. Once you've got the runway in sight, you can
maneuver to enter a left or right downwind at your option. If you have the
runway in sight higher than the MDA, you can (and probably should) do your
circling at that higher altitude.

In reality, if there's any traffic at all, the tower will give you circling
instructions.

-----Original Message-----
From: A Lieberma ]
Posted At: Friday, December 22, 2006 4:46 PM
Posted To: rec.aviation.ifr
Conversation: Cleared for the ILS 16 or circle to land 34 question?
Subject: Cleared for the ILS 16 or circle to land 34 question?

Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under
visual
rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the
clearance;
Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34 Hawkins.

Exactly what is expected for a circle to land? Should I jog over to
the
right of the runway on my descent and enter downwind? At what
altitude?
The airport terminal is immediately to the right as well as the tower.

Winds were 290 at 8 knots under VMC.

Allen

Al,
Since your question seems to be more about the mechanics of the
process than the clearance terminology, my approach has always been to
circle such that I can keep a visual on the landing zone. That typically
means a left circle regardless of what the published traffic pattern
might be.

Since circle to land is published for a fixed altitude, I am
assured of obstacle clearance no matter which direction I turn. I just
prefer to keep the old Mk1 eyeball on the target throughout the
approach.

Circle to land at minimums is a very exciting end to a journey
and usually reminds me exactly how small my bladder happens to be. I
need all the advantage I can get so the left turns help out.

I'm not sure why JAN approach was giving you landing instructions.
Shouldn't that be left for the HKS tower, after approach control had
sequenced you in for the approach?




"A Lieberma" wrote in message
. 18...
Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under
visual
rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the clearance;
Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34 Hawkins.

Exactly what is expected for a circle to land? Should I jog over to the
right of the runway on my descent and enter downwind? At what altitude?
The airport terminal is immediately to the right as well as the tower.

Winds were 290 at 8 knots under VMC.

Allen

Sam Spade wrote in
:

Could it have been, "Cleared for the ILS 16 approach. Circle to land
Runway 34."

You are correct Sam, that was the clearance. The word or wasn't in the ATC
transmission.

You could have then requested clearance to land Runway 16.

I took it as a "choice" rather then a directive? If so, then I messed up
big time?

Tower cleared me to land 16 when I checked in.

Allen

Mark Hansen wrote in
:

On 12/22/06 14:46, A Lieberma wrote:
Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under
visual rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the
clearance; Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34
Hawkins.

As Sam said, I don't know why they would have said this. Presumably,
the approach controller know whether you intended to terminate your
approach with a missed approach or landing - is that true?

I had requested an ILS approach after the approach when I received the
clearance, so approach knew I wasn't doing a full stop.

When I've flown circle to land maneuvers at non-towered fields, I've
descended to the standard TPA and joined the pattern (this assumes
VMC, of course).

Before I got my Garmin 430, all I could do was circle to land at my home
airport KMBO. Even with my new addition, I request the VOR Alpha as it
makes it real easy to join the pattern when VFR traffic in the mix.

Allen

"Stan Prevost" wrote in news:eff0b$458c81cd$18d6a007
:

I'm not sure why JAN approach was giving you landing instructions.
Shouldn't that be left for the HKS tower, after approach control had
sequenced you in for the approach?

Dunno Jim,

In my short IFR career, JAN approach has always given me landing
instructions (letter of agreement?)

Anytime I talk with HKS, they clear me to land, option or low approach.

Allen

"Jim Carter" wrote in news:001701c7262a$f464b0f0
$4b01a8c0@omnibook6100:

Al,
Since your question seems to be more about the mechanics of the
process than the clearance terminology, my approach has always been to
circle such that I can keep a visual on the landing zone. That
typically
means a left circle regardless of what the published traffic pattern
might be.

Since circle to land is published for a fixed altitude, I am
assured of obstacle clearance no matter which direction I turn. I just
prefer to keep the old Mk1 eyeball on the target throughout the
approach.

Circle to land at minimums is a very exciting end to a journey
and usually reminds me exactly how small my bladder happens to be. I
need all the advantage I can get so the left turns help out.

Thanks Jim!

Yes, when it's a long trip, anything to shorten the approach phase is
always appreciated when "nature calls" *big smile*.

I am used to circle to approach landings at my own airport, just never
had one for opposite ends of the runway

Allen