interesting moment yesterday on final

So I went for a lovely flight yesterday, from Bedford (KBED) down to
Nantucket (KACK) for dinner. We flew down there in the last hour or so
of daylight with a smooth ride and great views, and then returned at
night with an even smoother ride and great night-time views, including
a few circles over Harvard, MIT and Back Bay on the way home. ATC were
very accommodating since it was fairly late.

Bedford tower was closed so I was on the CTAF frequency as I
approached the field. I was initially thinking of taking runway 24
since the winds were 190. When I announced my imminent arrival in the
vicinity of the field an aircraft informed me they were on final for
11. They also mentioned an aircraft in the area that was at 5,000 and
on an IFR flight plan but not talking to ATC, possibly inbound for
landing as well.

Armed with this information, I changed my plan and entered a downwind
leg for 11 (since the winds were not strong and that seemed to be the
established pattern). I announced my downwind leg, my base and my
final (looking out for traffic all the way). When I was at 1 mile
final, I hear

"Nxxxx, 3 mile final for 11, Bedford"
I respond with "I am 1 mile final for 11, Bedford"
He responds with "We'll slow it down"
This doesn't comfort me that much, since I'm only going 65 knots.
Maybe I should have said this to him at the time.
Then he comes in again with "We're going to break off our approach, do
a 360 and rejoin"
As I'm at 50ft, he says "Have you landed yet"
I reply with "Just about to touch down"

Then I land, clear the runway, inform him I am clear, and then he
lands. Everything works out fine although my landing isn't exactly a
greaser.

I didn't feel that great about the incident: did I do something wrong?
Why didn't I see him on final before I turned final (I specifically
remember looking in that direction before turning final)? What if the
timings had been slightly different?

And for his part, shouldn't he have been on the frequency and known I
was in the pattern? Shouldn't his first call have been a lot sooner
than 3 mile final? Shouldn't he have flown a circuit rather than come
straight in? I'm assuming he wasn't in any kind of emergency situation
as he would have asked me to go around.

Thoughts appreciated, especially from those with extensive flying
experience.

Tom

On Apr 27, 1:13 pm, Tom wrote:
[snippage of uncomfortably close call at non-towered field]
Tom

It doesn't sound to me like you did anything wrong. If he was only two
miles away and facing you I would think that you'd see his landing
light - assuming he has it on.

I fly out of a towered airport and did all my training out of there.
I'm still getting comfortable with non-towered. That said, it is not
at all uncommon for folks to do straight in approaches at non-towered
airports. I personally am at least listening on the CTAF 10 miles out
and announce at 5. I think that's prudent. I also have my landing
light on from 10 miles out. I've never done a straight in to a non-
towered airport, but I don't find them particularly dangerous to be
around _providing_ the other pilot is listening, talking and watching.
If he just switched to the freq at 3 miles, didn't have his landing
light on yet then that's dangerous.

IMHO,
John Stevens
PP-ASEL

wrote:
On Apr 27, 1:13 pm, Tom wrote:
[snippage of uncomfortably close call at non-towered field]

Tom


It doesn't sound to me like you did anything wrong. If he was only two
miles away and facing you I would think that you'd see his landing
light - assuming he has it on.

I fly out of a towered airport and did all my training out of there.
I'm still getting comfortable with non-towered. That said, it is not
at all uncommon for folks to do straight in approaches at non-towered
airports. I personally am at least listening on the CTAF 10 miles out
and announce at 5. I think that's prudent. I also have my landing
light on from 10 miles out. I've never done a straight in to a non-
towered airport, but I don't find them particularly dangerous to be
around _providing_ the other pilot is listening, talking and watching.
If he just switched to the freq at 3 miles, didn't have his landing
light on yet then that's dangerous.

IMHO,
John Stevens
PP-ASEL


At our uncontrolled airport there were three planes in the pattern for
landing. A plane calls out that he is 5 miles for the straight in. I
replied that with the traffic, traditional pattern may be appropriate.
He called that he would enter the correct pattern.

--

Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
KSWI

"Ross" wrote in message
...

At our uncontrolled airport there were three planes in the pattern for
landing. A plane calls out that he is 5 miles for the straight in. I
replied that with the traffic, traditional pattern may be appropriate.

Why?

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:

"Ross" wrote in message
...

At our uncontrolled airport there were three planes in the pattern for
landing. A plane calls out that he is 5 miles for the straight in. I
replied that with the traffic, traditional pattern may be appropriate.


Why?



Because straight in approaches at an uncontrolled airport
disrupt the pattern that everyone is using. Perhaps if there
were no other traffic at the time, it would be perfectly fine
but when everyone is in line and doing their thing, someone
cutting in sucks. There is a fairly large municipal airport
nearby that accommodates jets and sometimes, we single engine
folk have to anticipate them, but it still disrupts things.

Erik wrote:


Because straight in approaches at an uncontrolled airport
disrupt the pattern that everyone is using. Perhaps if there
were no other traffic at the time, it would be perfectly fine
but when everyone is in line and doing their thing, someone
cutting in sucks. There is a fairly large municipal airport
nearby that accommodates jets and sometimes, we single engine
folk have to anticipate them, but it still disrupts things.



So you'll gladly adjust the size of your pattern, maybe extend an upwind
or crosswind to fit somebody in the pattern because he enters it the
'right' way. But if he tries to enter on a straight in it's disrupting
the pattern?

Erik wrote:

Because straight in approaches at an uncontrolled airport
disrupt the pattern that everyone is using. Perhaps if there
were no other traffic at the time, it would be perfectly fine
but when everyone is in line and doing their thing, someone
cutting in sucks. There is a fairly large municipal airport
nearby that accommodates jets and sometimes, we single engine
folk have to anticipate them, but it still disrupts things.

I think you're taking a very narrow view of things. I often practice my
pattern work at a not-towered airport that has an ILS approach. This airport
is popular for instrument training and there are usually several planes
flying the ILS, which involves about a 5 mile straight-in. Fitting the
straight-in traffic into the pattern is not as difficult as you make it out
to be. All it takes is a little communication between the aircraft on
downwind and the aircraft on final. Sometimes it's easier for the downwind
traffic to fly a tighter pattern and land first, other times it's better to
have the downwind aircraft extend for an extra 30 seconds or so. Either way,
I can't see why this is such a big deal.

In the OP's case, the straight-in traffic appeared to be late getting on
the frequency. They coordinated a solution and everyone made it down in one
piece. Sounds like an average day at a non-towered airport to me.

John Galban=====N4BQ (PA28-180)

--
Message posted via http://www.aviationkb.com

"Erik" wrote in message
...

Because straight in approaches at an uncontrolled airport
disrupt the pattern that everyone is using.


No more so than entering on the downwind .



Perhaps if there
were no other traffic at the time, it would be perfectly fine
but when everyone is in line and doing their thing, someone
cutting in sucks.


A straight-in approach is not "cutting in". Too many pilots believe pattern
traffic has the right -of-way.



There is a fairly large municipal airport
nearby that accommodates jets and sometimes, we single engine
folk have to anticipate them, but it still disrupts things.


Right. It's far better to have the jet fly a full pattern and mix it up
with the single engine folks than to have the single engine folks extend
downwind to follow a jet on a straight in approach.

landing. A plane calls out that he is 5 miles for the straight in. I
replied that with the traffic, traditional pattern may be appropriate. He
called that he would enter the correct pattern.

--

Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
KSWI

Are you working on your junior "G" man controller badge? I'd have told you
to mind your own business!

Karl

karl gruber wrote:

landing. A plane calls out that he is 5 miles for the straight in. I
replied that with the traffic, traditional pattern may be appropriate. He
called that he would enter the correct pattern.

--

Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
KSWI


Are you working on your junior "G" man controller badge? I'd have told you
to mind your own business!

Karl


That is exactly what I was thinking. Who the hell is he to tell
someone that doesn't give a crap about the pattern what to do!

I hate the busy bodies that are always sticking their nose in there
trying to disrupt people that are doing their own thing regardless
of what everyone around them are doing. Why, just the other day
I was at Carl's Jr and there was a big line. I thought, "I don't
want to wait all this time!" and went right to the counter. Some
busy body behind me told me to get back in line. I told them where
they could stick it.