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#1
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Finish lines
Accidents have ocurred when a pilot performs a high speed, low level finish
along the centerline of the runway, or over the airport, then fails to control the aircraft properly and crashes. In some cases, these displays have influenced other pilots who do not have the experience or skills to perform a similar maneuver safely. To discourage unsafe finishes, would moving the finish line to the side of the runway so the finish occurs essentially on the downwind leg, so a pilot would then only need to make essentially a 180 degree turn onto final approach help? A contest site could have finish lines to accommodate tasks finishing from any direction - only one would be specified according to the wind direction of the day. In some cases, there may be reasons not to do this of course. Comments? -- Thomas Knauff Knauff & Grove Soaring Supplies www.eglider.org |
#2
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A rotating finish line would address the problem: it would be centered
on a point on or near the airport, and would rotate normal to the final leg of the declared task (assumes the use of a steering TP for MATs). If it were 1 sm in diameter, it would give ample space for separation as well as giving the CD and CM latitude in defining no fly zones on the airport such as the active runway and grandstands, tie downs, picnic areas, etc. Perhaps your experiences have been different, but the finish line accidents (as opposed to incidents) I've seen typically did not involve traffic. They were something closer to system shut down after crossing the line, as if stopping the task clock was a reason to stop piloting the aircraft. By and large, most pilots do not finish into oncoming traffic on final. We prefer one side or the other. But I suppose there's always the odd arrival... Another excercise, just as valuable, would be to better define the parameters of the rolling finish. We should reduce or eliminate penalties for good judgement. Any safe landing on the airport should always be considered a good finish. And most of all, we need to answer any pilot's request for information... the practice of admonishing pilots for asking what the finish direction is keeps those in ignorance from curing themselves before they cross the finish line... in the wrong direction! OC |
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#4
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Careful.... you'll start another finish line/cylinder
debate ;-) my 2c worth... This may work at sites where there is a large flat area round the runway(s), where it 'may' help (although surely if a pilot has the energy to do a 180 to land they have the energy to choose which side of the runway to land), you are asking for trouble if the land either side of the runway is unlandable. Finish lines have a certain minimum size (varying by country I think... 1k in the UK but I'm not sure about elsewhere), so it's probably worth having as much of the line avaliable to land ahead as possible (the thought of 5 gliders in a gaggle in a marginal final glide being forced to funnel themselves through a smaller portion of the avaliable landing area to avoid finish gate penalties doesn't appeal). I think the best way to use a finish line is to make as much of it avaliable to land straight ahead from as possible as the people that need most easy options are those on marginal final glides. Those that have the energy can choose their own landing area more freely. This can be improved by briefing pilots on a landing plan (e.g. slow finishers south of the runway, fast finishers north and landing to the north of the runway after a 180 degree turn at the end). In the situation that the entire finish gate can be accomodated without forcing people over unlandable terrain with low energy, then yes, it could theoretically help reduce conflicts as long as competitors are properly briefed. However I am not aware of any site where this would be possible without either shrinking the finish gate or placing the bulk of it over unlandable terrain. I think you'd lose a lot of safety for the slow finishers, whilst gaining very little for the fast finishers (I am aware of far more marginal final glide accidents than spin ins after a botched beatup). At 21:00 02 May 2005, Thomas Knauff wrote: Accidents have ocurred when a pilot performs a high speed, low level finish along the centerline of the runway, or over the airport, then fails to control the aircraft properly and crashes. In some cases, these displays have influenced other pilots who do not have the experience or skills to perform a similar maneuver safely. To discourage unsafe finishes, would moving the finish line to the side of the runway so the finish occurs essentially on the downwind leg, so a pilot would then only need to make essentially a 180 degree turn onto final approach help? A contest site could have finish lines to accommodate tasks finishing from any direction - only one would be specified according to the wind direction of the day. In some cases, there may be reasons not to do this of course. Comments? -- Thomas Knauff Knauff & Grove Soaring Supplies www.eglider.org |
#5
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The below is one solution however the concept of a
finish line was around long before loggers could accurately report height, time and position. We use the logger to check that the max start height is observed so why not a minimum finish height. People could still dash for the line at vne if that is what turns them on but by setting a minimum finish height at least the organisers could set a safety margin. The minimum height could be set to the ability of the least experienced pilot which would help to avoid the peer pressure aspect of very low finishes. You can only ever equal the low flying record. I do know that the above will be a very unpopular view with certain people and that I will be accused of taking the fun out of the sport, however if that saves just one life it will be worth it. At 21:00 02 May 2005, Thomas Knauff wrote: Accidents have ocurred when a pilot performs a high speed, low level finish along the centerline of the runway, or over the airport, then fails to control the aircraft properly and crashes. In some cases, these displays have influenced other pilots who do not have the experience or skills to perform a similar maneuver safely. To discourage unsafe finishes, would moving the finish line to the side of the runway so the finish occurs essentially on the downwind leg, so a pilot would then only need to make essentially a 180 degree turn onto final approach help? A contest site could have finish lines to accommodate tasks finishing from any direction - only one would be specified according to the wind direction of the day. In some cases, there may be reasons not to do this of course. Comments? -- Thomas Knauff Knauff & Grove Soaring Supplies www.eglider.org |
#6
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Thomas Knauff wrote: Accidents have ocurred when a pilot performs a high speed, low level finish along the centerline of the runway, or over the airport, then fails to control the aircraft properly and crashes. In some cases, these displays have influenced other pilots who do not have the experience or skills to perform a similar maneuver safely. To discourage unsafe finishes, would moving the finish line to the side of the runway so the finish occurs essentially on the downwind leg, so a pilot would then only need to make essentially a 180 degree turn onto final approach help? A contest site could have finish lines to accommodate tasks finishing from any direction - only one would be specified according to the wind direction of the day. In some cases, there may be reasons not to do this of course. Comments? -- Thomas Knauff Knauff & Grove Soaring Supplies www.eglider.org With all due respect to Tom's vast knowledge. 'Accidents have occurred when a pilot performs a high speed, low level finish' just does not hack it for me. Of all the landing/circuit accidents that we see, what real figures are there that substantiate the amount of effort that seems to be going in to solving a 'perceived problem'? How many accident reports here in the UK for example have the phrase 'following a competition finish' or 'after a practice competition finish' within them. I agree that a competition finish is a semi aerobatic maneuver and should be taught and approached correctly but is it really such a problem? Ian |
#7
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"nimbusgb" wrote in message ups.com... I agree that a competition finish is a semi aerobatic maneuver and should be taught and approached correctly but is it really such a problem? Ian NO! Once again......one cannot legislate good judgement......if we could there would have been a lot more than finish gates accidents solved. Casey Lenox KC Phoenix |
#8
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The finish line has served us well for many years, but technology (GPS)
has rendered it an obsolete system that carries with it significant risks. I know of 5 accidents associated with the finish gate and just came across a 6th. 01/01/86 Alamogordo Muni, NM Pilot attempted to make a low pass / practice finish. He remembers 120 knots at 50 feet. Has vague recollection of being pushed against the straps and objects floating in the cockpit. Then a spinning sensation followed by dirt in the cockpit. A borrowed Ventus destroyed, his ankle shattered and broken bone in other foot. Why was this pilot practicing this maneuver? Because we sanction it, its part of what we do. It's in the rules. There's a lot of monkey-see, monkey-do, going on here. This is what the big guys do, think I'll give it a try. A friend of mine was at 5 feet, landing at Estrella when suddenly he was looking in the cockpit of a 2-32 coming right down the runway. The local ride pilot was showing his "ride". what the gig guys do. The scoring program uses GPS data to score the finish gate, so what we're doing is nothing more than a "show & tell" exercise. I believe the continued use of the finish gate puts pilots and people on the ground at an unnecessary risk. One more personal liability law suite and we will be hard pressed to find an insurer that is willing to cover what we are doing. That means the end of racing. Time to clean up our act and eliminate a known hasard. The 500 foot / 1 mile cylinder has been 100% safe, so far. Time to make it mandatory and stop living in the past. JJ Sinclair |
#9
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Funny, I thought this discussion was about RACING finishes. JJ, if you
(or anyone else) feels uncomfortable finishing at 50 ft over the runway, then don't do it - nobody is forcing you and the rules don't have a max finish height. But this is racing, not Sunday afternoon boating around. As such, a certain level of competency is presumed, in order to enjoy the thrills of the race (yes thrills, admit it...). Why should soaring be any differerent than other high speed (and presumably dangerous?) sports? A rookie at Indy has to demonstrate his skill, in return he is allowed to drive in a very dangerous event - but no-one is forcing him to! OTOH, I totally agree that if "dangerous" flying is required in order to race successfully (gaggles, low saves, long low final glides, marginal weather, low finishes, etc.) then there should be training and some sort of documentation of it - just as auto racing does. Say a "practice regional" held to ractice and demonstrate necessary skills (or do it the week before the race. Or copy how airshow pilots get their low altitude waivers - get an experienced racing pilot to observe you and sign you off. No demonstrated ability, no race, or race with restrictions (no more than x gliders in a gaggle, no finishes below 500 ft, etc; although this would be a nighmare to enforce. So, JJ, please go ahead and finish up there at nosebleed altitudes, and I'll continue to practice and fly nice low altitude, high energy line finishes. Because I enjoy them. Just don't stall and spin down onto me as you are trying to ooch over that invisible 500' line in the sky! Kirk 66 It wouldnt hurt day to day flying, either; probably a lot more helpful than the pretty much useless Biannual. |
#10
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