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#1
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Monitoring Oxygen Uptake
I went through the AF high-altitude chamber several years ago. One of
the things they demonstrated was loss of color vision with oxygen deprivation. For those of you who are gurus, would it not be a useful indicator to have a small color wheel mounted on the panel near the ASI or Vario as something to scan for safety at high altitude? I'm a flatlander and don't usually fly above 7K msl. I'm headed for high country and I wonder about this device. My concern is whether color vision loss means one is too far gone for this to be a practical tool for monitoring. |
#2
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From years of high-altitude glider flying, I have found my first
symptom is spots and patterns in my vision. It used to occur above about 12,000 feet AGL, but now I'm older I see the symptoms at 10,000 or even below. I have never experienced loss of color vision. I suppose it's possible that symptoms vary between individuals. I routinely use oxygen above 10,000 feet these days. It's cheap enough. Mike Nyal Williams wrote: ...snip.. My concern is whether color vision loss means one is too far gone for this to be a practical tool for monitoring. |
#3
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I'll be on metered oxygen, beginning at 5000K with
the Mountain High metering device. It should cover most eventualities -- kinks in line, weak battery, mouth breathing (which I tend to do), etc. I'm just wondering if color vision is a useful indicator. Everyone in the chamber noted the color loss; they had a color wheel on the wall and called our attention to it. I just have no idea how far gone we were; half the class had masks off and the others were watching behavior, and then we reversed situations. At 19:00 13 June 2005, Mike The Strike wrote: From years of high-altitude glider flying, I have found my first symptom is spots and patterns in my vision. It used to occur above about 12,000 feet AGL, but now I'm older I see the symptoms at 10,000 or even below. I have never experienced loss of color vision. I suppose it's possible that symptoms vary between individuals. I routinely use oxygen above 10,000 feet these days. It's cheap enough. Mike Nyal Williams wrote: ...snip.. My concern is whether color vision loss means one is too far gone for this to be a practical tool for monitoring. |
#4
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When they demonstrated the color wheel to me it was under rather low
light conditions and it wasn't the loss of vision that was apparent but rather how much it improved when we started using the Oxygen. It was like someone had just turned up the lights when we turned on the Oxygen. I noticed my 1st symptom was the loss of my periphial(sp) vision. i.e. my vision narrowed. You probably saw the same or simlar video that they showed us of the guy reading cards off the top of the deck. After about a minute or less at 35K feet his mind sort of went into neutral and he correctly read the 2 of spades off the top of the deck but every card after that he called a 2 of spades no matter what it was. His motor skills were fine He could pick up the card and look at it but the only thing he saw was a 2 of spades. I noticed on the quiz they gave us at 25K feet that toward the end of the quiz my answers started repeating I had written down earlier in the quiz and the answers didn't really apply to the question I was answering. Brian |
#5
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NO, not useful. You will not notice your loss of accuity.
Key is to monitor O2 systems for proper functioning. If you feel better with an objective, third-party measure, buy a pulse oximeter. OC |
#6
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The only way to assure yourself of adequate oxygen delivery to your body is
to use a pulse oximeter as OC has pointed out. There is a large variability in how pilots react to hypoxemia. You may have color loss as a first sign but it is not reliable. You should also realize that even reading and interpreting the pulse ox results could be affected once you are hypoxemic so as Mike Stringfellow said it is cheap insurance and should be used if there is even a question. As I've stated before, if you plan to fly at high altitudes on a regular basis I would consider a pulse oximeter an instrument as necessary as an altimeter. It is not perfect though and so having and maintaining a quality oxygen system is another must. That would include some type of "bailout bottle" as a backup if you fly wave a lot. Casey Lenox, MD KC Phoenix |
#7
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At 03:12 14 June 2005, Kilo Charlie wrote:
The only way to assure yourself of adequate oxygen delivery to your body is to use a pulse oximeter as OC has pointed out. There is a large variability in how pilots react to hypoxemia. You may have color loss as a first sign but it is not reliable. You should also realize that even reading and interpreting the pulse ox results could be affected once you are hypoxemic so as Mike Stringfellow said it is cheap insurance and should be used if there is even a question. As I've stated before, if you plan to fly at high altitudes on a regular basis I would consider a pulse oximeter an instrument as necessary as an altimeter. It is not perfect though and so having and maintaining a quality oxygen system is another must. That would include some type of 'bailout bottle' as a backup if you fly wave a lot. Casey Lenox, MD KC Phoenix Thanks for the comments. I have an excellent system and an oximeter in hand. I will not go above 18K in any event, and in all probability won't reach that. |
#8
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On the other Hand ........I live and take off at 8000 ft. now also
going on OX at 14000 ft, used to fly without, at higher altitudes. The Rules, 12500 and 14000 ft are a good measure and most likely have some margin built in. I do have a pulse oximimeter, which I would recomend. For you as peace of mind. Otherwise one could worry so much about this OX thing that one gets into hyperventilating. I have seen that on ski slopes! Those people think they are ox starved and start breathing like crazy and get sick that way. Also going on ox at 5000 ft, you might be out of it when you really get up there and need it. BTW, I have taken the oximeter on high altitude hikes and stuck it on different older people. There I have seen guys with a 78% readout happiely hiking along. What I like to know is, what the low % limit is. When would one pass out? |
#9
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"soarski" wrote in message oups.com... On the other Hand ........I live and take off at 8000 ft. now also going on OX at 14000 ft, used to fly without, at higher altitudes. The Rules, 12500 and 14000 ft are a good measure and most likely have some margin built in. As near as I can determine, these altitudes were determined during WWII using very fit 18 year olds. Out of shape geezers should lower them considerably. Being in the later category, I set the EDS to start O2 flow at ground level especially with difficult to handle expensive gliders. With the EDS consumption isn't a problem. I do have a pulse oximimeter, which I would recomend. For you as peace of mind. Otherwise one could worry so much about this OX thing that one gets into hyperventilating. I have seen that on ski slopes! Those people think they are ox starved and start breathing like crazy and get sick that way. Also going on ox at 5000 ft, you might be out of it when you really get up there and need it. Hyperventilating is a real problem. A "set and forget" system like EDS helps. BTW, I have taken the oximeter on high altitude hikes and stuck it on different older people. There I have seen guys with a 78% readout happiely hiking along. What I like to know is, what the low % limit is. When would one pass out? I've seen pilots at 80% SpO2 who said they felt WONDERFUL. They kept repeating that over and over but they couldn't fly worth a damn. They would look at the oximeter and claim they felt better at 80% and ask to turn the O2 down. Is hypoxia addictive? There seems to be a consensus that cognitive abilities diminish measurably in the low 90's. O2 is cheap. Use it. Bill Daniels |
#10
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Bill Daniels wrote:
"soarski" wrote in message oups.com... On the other Hand ........I live and take off at 8000 ft. now also going on OX at 14000 ft, used to fly without, at higher altitudes. The Rules, 12500 and 14000 ft are a good measure and most likely have some margin built in. As near as I can determine, these altitudes were determined during WWII using very fit 18 year olds. Out of shape geezers should lower them considerably. Being in the later category, I set the EDS to start O2 flow at ground level especially with difficult to handle expensive gliders. With the EDS consumption isn't a problem. I do have a pulse oximimeter, which I would recomend. For you as peace of mind. Otherwise one could worry so much about this OX thing that one gets into hyperventilating. I have seen that on ski slopes! Those people think they are ox starved and start breathing like crazy and get sick that way. Also going on ox at 5000 ft, you might be out of it when you really get up there and need it. Hyperventilating is a real problem. A "set and forget" system like EDS helps. BTW, I have taken the oximeter on high altitude hikes and stuck it on different older people. There I have seen guys with a 78% readout happiely hiking along. What I like to know is, what the low % limit is. When would one pass out? I've seen pilots at 80% SpO2 who said they felt WONDERFUL. They kept repeating that over and over but they couldn't fly worth a damn. They would look at the oximeter and claim they felt better at 80% and ask to turn the O2 down. Is hypoxia addictive? There seems to be a consensus that cognitive abilities diminish measurably in the low 90's. O2 is cheap. Use it. Well that explains it. My normal saturation is about 96% (in Salida). If I type too fast my sat's gotta drop below 93. :-) Shawn |
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